Proposing A Student Athletic Fee

UNTflyer · February 25, 2008

According to Article II, Section 1, Subsection A) of the Student Constituion, "Bills may be submitted to the Student Senate by the Student Body President, any seated Student Senator, or by any member of the Student Body, provided that the legislation is sponsored by a seated Student Senator."

Tonight, I emailed the following draft bill to the Student Senators of the COBA:

WHEREAS the University of North Texas currently funds all athletic programs through private donations and minimal student fees; and

WHEREAS the students of the University of North Texas wish to see an improved and competitive athletic teams; and

WHEREAS the value of a degree from the University of North Texas will increase with a nationally recognized athletic program; and

WHEREAS the students of the University of North Texas desire a new football stadium and other Athletic Department upgrades; and

WHEREAS the students of Texas State University overwhelmingly approved a new student athletic fee to improve the state of TSU athletic facilities and staff;

LET IT BE RESOLVED THAT the Student Government Association and the students of the University of North Texas formally request that the Board of Regents approve a new Student Athletic Fee.

LET IT FURTHER BE RESOLVED THAT the Student Athletic Fee be incrementally increased over a span of three years, at a rate of $3 per semester hour, reaching a maximum of $9 per semester hour in 2011.

LET IT FURTHER BE RESOLVED THAT the Student Government Association supports the vision of creating a top-tier Athletics Department that will allow the University of North Texas to compete for the best student athletes from across the nation.

LET IT FURTHER BE RESOLVED THAT the Student Government Association calls for a student referendum to approve this new athletic fee in order to meet legal requirements, and to demonstrate their support for the future of North Texas athletics.

If no Student Senator will sponsor my bill, there is another route to take:

Section 8: Ballot Referenda

"Ballot referenda for any legal purpose may be proposed by a two thirds (2/3) absolute majority vote of the Student Senate or by a verifiable petition of seven hundred and fifty (750) members of the Student Body."

Sometimes, you just have to take matters into your own hands. I for one refuse to sit around any longer waiting for the BOR to take the correct sourse of action.

Mean Green Matt · February 25, 2008

I'm up for getting a petition started. I'll talk to some of the senators I know as well. It is something that needs to happen. Go Mean Green.

NT80 · February 25, 2008

I'm up for getting a petition started. I'll talk to some of the senators I know as well. It is something that needs to happen. Go Mean Green.

You might want to talk to RV first, or have some senators talk to him first....Just to see if the timing is right, what is actually needed by athletics, and how to properly word it and/or go about it to insure it passes this time as opposed to last. Proposed athletic fees bring out all kinds of nasty opposition, just be prepared going into any proposal what to expect and how to counter any negativity. Many UNT students will want to know why they should pay for something they may not think they need, how this immediately benefits them. Even if Big 12 membership was the carrot, some would say no thanks.

UNTflyer · February 25, 2008

You might want to talk to RV first, or have some senators talk to him first....Just to see if the timing is right, what is actually needed by athletics, and how to properly word it and/or go about it to insure it passes this time as opposed to last. Proposed athletic fees bring out all kinds of nasty opposition, just be prepared going into any proposal what to expect and how to counter any negativity. Many UNT students will want to know why they should pay for something they may not think they need, how this immediately benefits them. Even if Big 12 membership was the carrot, some would say no thanks.

Good point, and already considered. I am emailing RV tonight. The Student Constitution allows for up to $1000 to be spent on campaigning for a referendum, and I will be seeking input on this. If I am succesful in getting this referendum on the ballot, I will be looking for funding to run a convincing campaign. I think doing it incrementally will lessen the pain. However, it will ultimately be up to the BOR.

JayDub · February 25, 2008

If I am succesful in getting this referendum on the ballot, I will be looking for funding to run a convincing campaign.

Please be careful in how you run the campaign if this referendum makes the ballot. I was active in campaigning for an athletics fee the last time we had a vote for one...and, in retrospect, I feel the campaigning we put out there might have done more harm than good. It stirred up the hornets nest that is the apathetic, anti-athletics students and got them out to the poll.

I think things are a little different now...but still...careful if this comes to a vote.

jaycutler · February 25, 2008

This is a bad idea because the students at UNT get better facilities than the athletic department. The athletic department gives them the old football practice fields and the fields next to the beer barn because the new athletic center is built and what do they get? They get intramural fields next to the football practice fields and they get lights and better upkeep. If the students get an increase in tuition they are going to bitch and get more stuff, might as well leave it at that.

LAZER · February 25, 2008

talk to adler for some convincing ideas. On the PV board he proposes a strong argument.

untgeorge · February 25, 2008

"

WHEREAS the University of North Texas currently funds all athletic programs through private donations and minimal student fees; and

"

This is not a true statement. The information reported by UNT to the NCAA database shows student fees going to athletics in the amount of $4.3 million, an amount which is more than 10 times the amount of ticket sales and more than the total of ticket sales and donations.

Source is: http://www2.indystar.com/NCAA_financial_re...venue_stat/show

Keep in mind the amounts in this data base are as reported by the member institutions. The numbers came from UNT.

February 25, 2008

Please be careful in how you run the campaign if this referendum makes the ballot. I was active in campaigning for an athletics fee the last time we had a vote for one...and, in retrospect, I feel the campaigning we put out there might have done more harm than good. It stirred up the hornets nest that is the apathetic, anti-athletics students and got them out to the poll.
I think things are a little different now...but still...careful if this comes to a vote.

You are absolutely correct. The last time, the PR athletics put out there actually made students upset. I know one complaint was that there was a PR campaign at all, thinking that athletics shouldn't be actively campaigning for itself for an increase. (As in athletics is spending student money to try to raise more student money.)

And I agree that you need to speak to Rick V before you go forward with anything like this. There is a plan for the timing of things like student fees. If you jump the gun, it could mess up alot of things.

Edited February 25, 2008 by 97and03

FirefightnRick · February 25, 2008

Also keep in mind that even though UTA, UTSA, Lamar and TxSt all have passed student referendum votes for increase, they were voting to either start up football or move up in divisions. Those are vast differences in building a new stadium. To me this proposal needs to be made to the BOR and not to the students. Everyone at North Texas, including administrators are in their comfort zone. Dr. Battaille is surounded by people who DO NOT WANT CHANGE and just like last time campaigning to the masses is only going to stir up a mess that will turn out negative. You couldn't get the students at Texas a&m to increase their own fees for a new facility and that's the land of school spirit. The BOR needs to recognize THE PROBLEM and CORRECT THE PROBLEM immediately. No more of this "I'm going to North Texas because it's the cheapest, most affordable and most easily accessable place to go to school".

Rick

Mean Green Matt · February 25, 2008

All good points. For the students to fight for this, we should definitely get Rick V's proposal first. As far as going to the BOR, I've been told that they are unlikely to do anything about this, leaving the next best alternative being the SGA.

GreenBlooded1 · February 25, 2008

No more of this "I'm going to North Texas because it's the cheapest, most affordable and most easily accessable place to go to school".

But isn't that why so many current and former students selected UNT? I wish I could say otherwise but unless you are a music student... Rarely if ever is UNT a High School Senior's first thought. Especially if they are out of state to begin with (aside from Southern OK maybe.)

February 25, 2008

Also keep in mind that even though UTA, UTSA, Lamar and TxSt all have passed student referendum votes for increase, they were voting to either start up football or move up in divisions. Those are vast differences in building a new stadium. To me this proposal needs to be made to the BOR and not to the students. Everyone at North Texas, including administrators are in their comfort zone. Dr. Battaille is surounded by people who DO NOT WANT CHANGE and just like last time campaigning to the masses is only going to stir up a mess that will turn out negative. You couldn't get the students at Texas a&m to increase their own fees for a new facility and that's the land of school spirit. The BOR needs to recognize THE PROBLEM and CORRECT THE PROBLEM immediately. No more of this "I'm going to North Texas because it's the cheapest, most affordable and most easily accessable place to go to school".
Rick

I think that you are absolutely right. We have a previous (recent) history in that regard and as you say, if the Aggies can't get their student body to raise fees, then who can?

One other point. I believe that there is a limit on the student fee amount and care should be taken that the request does not exceed that amount. In fact, I think that it would be wiser to find the amount necessary to fund the bond package and make it for the minimum amount.

FirefightnRick · February 25, 2008

But isn't that why so many current and former students selected UNT? I wish I could say otherwise but unless you are a music student... Rarely if ever is UNT a High School Senior's first thought. Especially if they are out of state to begin with (aside from Southern OK maybe.)

Yes, and that's the perception that needs to change. That is precisely THE PROBLEM!!!

My kids, your kids and several of our kids...ADLER, GMoney, Emmitt, Evan etc etc and all the rest of the green bloods who are raising their kids at North Texas to be Mean Green fans from the beginning, we are teaching our kids to be fans and many of them will look forward to going to school there like the alumni's children of say Texas Tech, OU, Texas etc do. Their parents are donating, supportive alumni and they will become so as well. THE PROBLEM with North Texas is we have spent years and years and years sellilng this rediculous image that we are the Cheap way out. That is so very bad I can't even begin to describe how bad that is. And then when we get our people here we do not cultivate them to have pride in their school and to grow heartfelt ties to it. They come, they graduate and they walk away FOREVER, never to return and never to donate another dime. Don't believe me, then work a phone-a-thon to help raise money from them. You'll be shocked at the answers you'll get from our own alumni. SHOCKED!!! We are cutting our throats and bleeding ourselves as a university with this approach. This is why our endowment sucks to the very core. No one in any amount of great numbers wants to give back to this university. A winning athletic program helps correct this. Texas Tech holds an alumni football game as well like we do, accept their university promotes it and they have raised over $20,000 before during ONE WEEKEND. We haven't raised more than $1,200 with any of ours, and thats mostly because we sold some items before hand to get to that amount? This cheap ass image and zero pride thing has got to stop if we ever intend on moving up. The university is losing great opportunities in cultivating a return by allowing it to continue. It's just stupid and mindblowing all the same.

Rick

island eagle · February 25, 2008

But isn't that why so many current and former students selected UNT? I wish I could say otherwise but unless you are a music student... Rarely if ever is UNT a High School Senior's first thought. Especially if they are out of state to begin with (aside from Southern OK maybe.)

That may be, but it wasn't true in my case. I looked at UT-Austin, SWT (as it was called in those days), Texas Tech and North Texas. I ruled out UT, because I didn't want to go to college in my home town, SWT seemed too "small time" in those days, and Tech (ugh!). The only logical choice seemed to be North Texas, which seemed to have more of what I was looking for in a university. I never regretted the choice.

Mean Green 93-98 · February 25, 2008

I don't know if Flyer's timing is right or not, but I appreciate someone doing something pro-active about the situation. It's clear that RV and the BOR are not going to initiate anything in the way of student fees at this time. And he's not taking it by means of referendum before the whole student body--so I'm not that worried about a huge "hornet's nest" being stirred up by this. If nothing comes of it, so be it. But at least he's giving it a chance.

FirefightnRick · February 25, 2008

I don't know if Flyer's timing is right or not, but I appreciate someone doing something pro-active about the situation. It's clear that RV and the BOR are not going to initiate anything in the way of student fees at this time. And he's not taking it by means of referendum before the whole student body--so I'm not that worried about a huge "hornet's nest" being stirred up by this. If nothing comes of it, so be it. But at least he's giving it a chance.

Yes, I too appreciate Flyer stepping up. If we only had about 20,000 more students like him????

Rick

GreenBlooded1 · February 25, 2008

This cheap ass image and zero pride thing has got to stop if we ever intend on moving up. The university is losing great opportunities in cultivating a return by allowing it to continue. It's just stupid and mindblowing all the same.
Rick

I agree completely! UNT should be where students WANT to go... not HAVE to go because it is closer or cheaper or whatever. Successful athletics will go a VERY long way to improving our image and getting our name "out there". I want a future for the University that has us becoming a destination... not just a dot north of D/FW on the map. Who's with me... jump up on this soap box right now!!!

UNTflyer · February 25, 2008

This is what I stayed up late last night doing:

I wrote an email Chancellor Lee Jackson (and received a reply this morning, which was CC:'d to Rick V and Dr. B )

Drafted that student senate bill, and forward it to my COBA senators

Wrote an article to NT Daily calling for a student fee

Emailed Rick V and asked for his thoughts on a student fee

It may very well be that we need to get a buzz going first, or perhaps even wait for definitive plans on a stadim before moving forward on a student referendum. Perhaps just introducing a bill in the Senate will do just that. I looked into running this semester, but daggummitt, the required meetng to run was last Thursday so I missed out. Maybe in the fall when I'm in grad school.

Edited February 25, 2008 by UNTflyer

GreenBlooded1 · February 25, 2008

flyer... all your efforts are not going unnoticed. Hopefully this good deed WILL go unpunished!! Thank you from the bottom of this appreciative alumni's heart!

Edited February 25, 2008 by GreenBlooded1

TIgreen01 · February 25, 2008

This is what I stayed up late last night doing:
I wrote an email Chancellor Lee Jackson (and received a reply this morning, which was CC:'d to Rick V and Dr. B )
Drafted that student senate bill, and forward it to my COBA senators
Wrote an article to NT Daily calling for a student fee
Emailed Rick V and asked for his thoughts on a student fee
It may very well be that we need to get a buzz going first, or perhaps even wait for definitive plans on a stadim before moving forward on a student referendum. Perhaps just introducing a bill in the Senate will do just that. I looked into running this semester, but daggummitt, the required meetng to run was last Thursday so I missed out. Maybe in the fall when I'm in grad school.

Outstanding work, sir!

Let me add that you already have a group at your disposal that wasn't in existence the last time the students voted on this---The Pit Crew. You really only need 2-3k votes to pass your referendum....so direct your campaigning efforts right at the people who have proven to show up in big numbers for all the bball games and you have a fighting chance.

If it was me, I would stay away from doing a campus wide campaign for this to avoid stirring up too much crap and JUST focus on the GREEKS, the Pit Crew and all current student athletes. With that base, you should be able to win. Just the 2 cents of a former SA exec......

untgirl04 · February 25, 2008

Outstanding work, sir!
Let me add that you already have a group at your disposal that wasn't in existence the last time the students voted on this---The Pit Crew. You really only need 2-3k votes to pass your referendum....so direct your campaigning efforts right at the people who have proven to show up in big numbers for all the bball games and you have a fighting chance.
If it was me, I would stay away from doing a campus wide campaign for this to avoid stirring up too much crap and JUST focus on the GREEKS, the Pit Crew and all current student athletes. With that base, you should be able to win. Just the 2 cents of a former SA exec......

I disagree with only targeting Pit Crew and Greeks. That leaves out a very important, and very vocal/involved group of students - the residents. UNT Housing is historically behind athletics, and residents (at least when I was there in the early 2000s) actually get out and vote. Get the Hall Associations involved, and you can get some real good campaigning.

Another thing, for the proposed bill, I think that the Where As statement about Texas State is ambiguous. When you introduce the bill, and in your campaigning efforts, I would focus on why it is significant that Texas State has a proposed athletic fee. Actually, I would do some research and find examples of larger, and more prestigious institutions whose students have self-imposed athletic fees. The most important selling factor in all this, and probably the most difficult, is the tangible benefits that the students will realize (aside from a shiny new stadium) if they help pass this bill.

I was around for the last attempt at an athletic fee (and voted for it), so I've seen how nasty this thing can get. Best of luck with your efforts.

Eagle1855 · February 25, 2008

If it was me, I would stay away from doing a campus wide campaign for this to avoid stirring up too much crap and JUST focus on the GREEKS, the Pit Crew and all current student athletes. With that base, you should be able to win. Just the 2 cents of a former SA exec......

Bingo... seriously, go by chapter meetings for both the fraternities and sororities as well as IFC/Panhellenic. Like them or not, most greeks (sorry TTG, not talking ethnicity here) share a similar vision for UNT's athletics. Of course, that was my experience. I certainly can't speak on behalf of everyone. But they can mobilize masses if need be (please spare us the athletics attendance jabs, no need to derail a good thread)

UNTflyer · February 25, 2008

Excellent points, I appreciate all the input.

I have exchanged emails with Chancellor Jackson, and he had some good advice as well. I will not post the details of our email exchange because he is not involved in day-to-day administration.

UNTFan23 · February 25, 2008

I know people will make the argument that we don't need a new stadium since we don't fill the one we have. I'd make the counter argument that Fouts sits on land that could be used for parking/academic buildings. The administration and athletics leadership need to stress that Fouts is sitting on land near the nucleus of the campus.