Vito

Dodge2007 · January 29, 2008

Tact is the nact of making a point without making an enemy.

Vito's reporting on the racism BS had to have pissed the entire Dodge staff off. I bet Dodge would like to kick Vito's ass over that crap.

His most recent blog about the UNT-LSU match-up.....making a comment like "the potential BEAT DOWN that UNT will be given by LSU" makes me and I guarantee has to make the players and coaches pissed off. BEAT DOWN, wow, how optomistic!

Why bring up the negative coverage of Keith Wooden at all? Was that really necessary?

Vito has to be a journalist but the dude has no tact and to me, jumps on crap too fast without thinking of the effect it has on the program (s).

Troy Phillips will get all the scoop that Dodge "wants" to get out, way before Vito.

The Keith Wooden deal pissed many people off including JJ and even though Vito did a blog about how well Wooden handled it, I don't believe that article was necessary, imo.

Edited January 29, 2008 by Dodge2007

SUMG · January 29, 2008

Tact is the nact of making a point without making an enemy.
Vito's reporting on the racism BS had to have pissed the entire Dodge staff off. I bet Dodge would like to kick Vito's ass over that crap.
His most recent blog about the UNT-LSU match-up.....making a comment like "the potential BEAT DOWN that UNT will be given by LSU" makes me and I guarantee has to make the players and coaches pissed off. BEAT DOWN, wow, how optomistic!
Why bring up the negative coverage of Keith Wooden at all? Was that really necessary?
Vito has to be a journalist but the dude has no tact and to me, jumps on crap too fast without thinking of the effect it has on the program (s).
Troy Phillips will get all the scoop that Dodge "wants" to get out, way before Vito.
The Keith Wooden deal pissed many people off including JJ and even though Vito did a blog about how well Wooden handled it, I don't believe that article was necessary, imo.

You act as if you want the man (Vito) to be non-objective. That's what our sports information department, is for.

And since you looked up the word "tact" in the dictionary...maybe gander over at the "p's" and check out the definition of the word "potential."

Trust me, the LSU game is a "potential" beat down.

SilverEagle · January 29, 2008

I want a journalist covering our sports program, not some homer that disguises him/herself as a journalist. Like the ones that cover UT, OU, TT, A$M etc.

I would have to say that the "potential beat down" comment was historically accurate. At least as it relates to our series with LSU.

I see the comment as being one of "concern" for our program, rather than as a comment that is lacking in tact.

UNTflyer · January 29, 2008

Are you suggesting he not report news? A football player going to the NAACP alleging racism is news...Keith Wooden getting his butt thrown in jail is news.

Every paper in the metroplex jumped on the "racism" story, not just Vito.

I believe Vito did piss off Dodge, but not for reporting news.

GoMeanGreen1999 · January 29, 2008

Tact is the nact of making a point without making an enemy.
Vito's reporting on the racism BS had to have pissed the entire Dodge staff off. I bet Dodge would like to kick Vito's ass over that crap.
His most recent blog about the UNT-LSU match-up.....making a comment like "the potential BEAT DOWN that UNT will be given by LSU" makes me and I guarantee has to make the players and coaches pissed off. BEAT DOWN, wow, how optomistic!
Why bring up the negative coverage of Keith Wooden at all? Was that really necessary?
Vito has to be a journalist but the dude has no tact and to me, jumps on crap too fast without thinking of the effect it has on the program (s).
Troy Phillips will get all the scoop that Dodge "wants" to get out, way before Vito.
The Keith Wooden deal pissed many people off including JJ and even though Vito did a blog about how well Wooden handled it, I don't believe that article was necessary, imo.

Seriously? You are serious? If Vito's reporting truely irritates Dodge and his staff as you suggest it does, then Dodge better just stay here at UNT, because he will never be able to handle the pressure at the top, but I seriously doubt it ticks him off that much.

Dodge2007 · January 29, 2008

Everyone is entitled to an opinion.

In my worthless opinion, Dodge (and the racial bs) was in poor taste and lacked fundamentally sound journalism. BUT IT SOLD NEWSPAPERS.

The comments about Keith? Why drag a kid in the news when its not really necessary? Why embarass him more than he already is about being arrested? If you call that good journalism, god bless you. I just happen to believe it wasn't necessary.

Why doesn't everyone's DUI or DWI or arrest be written in every paper?

I just feel like students should be not subjected to that kind of crap over something minor, but again, that just me.

Brett is the only source of UNT sports news, so he gets a free pass?? I get it.

Edited January 29, 2008 by Dodge2007

UNTLifer · January 29, 2008

The Wooden article is just a sign of the times where player news, especially bad, makes the news. I think the Wooden incident turned out very positive of Wooden in how he handled himself and took responsibility for his mistake. I respect him more now than I did before the problem.

But, I do see you point regarding the coaching staff's issue with the Vito coverage. I like Bret and think he does a good job, but the DRC editor not putting the racism claims to bed with front page coverage like the allegations received put Vito in a bad position with the team.

Edited January 29, 2008 by UNTLifer

Dodge2007 · January 29, 2008

Seriously? You are serious? If Vito's reporting truely irritates Dodge and his staff as you suggest it does, then Dodge better just stay here at UNT, because he will never be able to handle the pressure at the top, but I seriously doubt it ticks him off that much.

If someone called and reported me a racist, Yeah, regardless of my position, I would be pissed off. Now does it keep Dodge from doing his job? NO

But do those comments and the way the DRC and Vito covered the ending piss Dodge off? You bet your J LO ass that it did.

DRC would do well to get another sports reporter to cover UNT football, at a minimum.

January 29, 2008

Everytime a student athlete gets in trouble it makes the news. Why should ours be any different? These young men are young, but they are adults. As adults, they are subject to the same laws as the rest of us. Why does their trouble hit the newspapers and ours do not? Simple. It is for the same reason that everytime I complete an accurate report at work that it does not make the paper, yet everytime Wooden makes a jump shot it is. They are held to a different standard. Otherwise, we wouldn't have this message board...

Reporters report. It is in the job description. You can look it up.

UNTLifer · January 29, 2008

If someone called and reported me a racist, Yeah, regardless of my position, I would be pissed off. Now does it keep Dodge from doing his job? NO
But do those comments and the way the DRC and Vito covered the ending piss Dodge off? You bet your J LO ass that it did.
DRC would do well to get another sports reporter to cover UNT football, at a minimum.

I think the reporter is fine, but a new editor would do wonders. Vito reported the CLAIM by the players. He never said he agreed.

emmitt01 · January 29, 2008

The comments about Keith? Why drag a kid in the news when its not really necessary? Why embarass him more than he already is about being arrested? If you call that good journalism, god bless you. I just happen to believe it wasn't necessary.
Why doesn't everyone's DUI or DWI or arrest be written in every paper?

Uhhhh...have you picked up a newspaper in the last year? How many UT players had their arrests splashed all over the DMN and FWST sports pages. And we're talking about this state's sacred cow (pun intended) when it comes to UT.

Racims allegations are news. Player arrests are news. If you want to fault him for anything it's that he didn't write about how the racism allegations turned out to be unfounded...which is news as well.

Quoner · January 29, 2008

What's with the dodge-named posters always bringing God into their post? I think He would prefer to be left out.

Monkeypox · January 29, 2008

You act as if you want the man (Vito) to be non-objective. That's what our sports information department, is for.

Vito actually lacks objectivity. He editorializes way too often for people to seriously defend him as a "newshound" journalist. I'm not saying it's a bad thing, or that it's not his job to editorialize. In fact, it IS his job, since he's a columnist. The problem is that he's also somehow a beat reporter, and those two jobs don't generally work out, because beat reporters can't sacrifice their inside knowledge for the sake of editorializing. Vito's already done that, and it's compromised his ability to actually be a useful reporter.

SUMG · January 29, 2008

Vito actually lacks objectivity. He editorializes way too often for people to seriously defend him as a "newshound" journalist. I'm not saying it's a bad thing, or that it's not his job to editorialize. In fact, it IS his job, since he's a columnist. The problem is that he's also somehow a beat reporter, and those two jobs don't generally work out, because beat reporters can't sacrifice their inside knowledge for the sake of editorializing. Vito's already done that, and it's compromised his ability to actually be a useful reporter.

I think part of the problem is this. While we're in a big market (D-FW) and are used to top notch journalists (TV and papers)....the D-RC is still the minor leagues.

So, whatever we get there....as the D-RC beat reporter...is going to be someone who is just starting out in their careers.

I think Brett does a pretty good job. He's no Timmy MacMahon...but, he's not bad.

Edited January 29, 2008 by SUMG

Green Lantern · January 29, 2008

What's with the dodge-named posters always bringing God into their post? I think He would prefer to be left out.

"Like anyone could even know that"

Monkeypox · January 29, 2008

I think part of the problem is this. While we're in a big market (D-FW) and are used to top notch journalists (TV and papers)....the D-RC is still the minor leagues.
So, whatever we get there....as the D-RC beat reporter...is going to be someone who is just starting out in their careers.
I think Brett does a pretty good job. He's no Timmy MacMahon...but, he's not bad.

Oh, I like him okay, I just think this year he's taken a step backwards. Whether or not it was the racism story or any number of other things, I can't say, but at some point it appeared he torpedoed his own ability to get out stories. If all he's good for now is talking about how our defense stinks or a top prospect probably isn't gonna come here or we're likely to get the beatdown from LSU, then he might as well just be one of any number of posters here. I mean, who doesn't know this stuff?

Eagle1855 · January 29, 2008

I want a journalist covering our sports program, not some homer that disguises him/herself as a journalist. Like the ones that cover UT, OU, TT, A$M etc.

Why does it matter?

I mean, he's not a war correspondent- it's college athletics.

Edited January 29, 2008 by Eagle1855

GMoney · January 29, 2008

But, I do see you point regarding the coaching staff's issue with the Vito coverage. I like Bret and think he does a good job, but the DRC editor not putting the racism claims to bed with front page coverage like the allegations received put Vito in a bad position with the team.

Bingo! I also believe it was the one-sided nature of the report. Reporting an allegation is understandable. Reporting an allegation as serious as racism without character witnesses in TD defense and couple that with no front page retraction as promised and you will have an upset person. It's one thing to attack a player's/coach's play or decisions relative to job performance, but when you report on man's character (even if it is a story), you better cover all sides are be prepared for results that come from it.

I think one issue that many people are missing here has nothing to do with, "TD has a high profile job and he should be able to deal with it. Or, if he was at UT or A&M it would be worse." Most coaches can deal with criticism relative to their coaching and team preparation. Coaches and players are 10 times harder on themselves than fans are. They carry this stuff with them to sleep, to class, on the road - everywhere (at least the ones who care)! But, how do you defend your character? How do you defend you character when you can't speak about a situation because there is a potential lawsuit threat? When one article spreads to a national story and you can't comment of course you're going to be upset.

In this day and age this will never die. It will never go away. Ten years from now someone will google the story. Ten years from now, when we've all forgotten it, TD may have to explain it again (and by the way, there isn't a retraction to google). Who knows, it could prevent him from getting a job. With this kind of stuff, you just don't know. That's why you get upset and don't easily forget - I wouldn't and haven't. TD is a friend and I know how hurt he was by this situation and it's why I came to his defense, because he couldn't.

Edited January 29, 2008 by GMoney

SilverEagle · January 29, 2008

Bingo! I also believe it was the one-sided nature of the report. Reporting an allegation is understandable. Reporting an allegation as serious as racism without character witnesses in TD defense and couple that with no front page retraction as promised and you will have an upset person. It's one thing to attack a player's/coach's play or decisions relative to job performance, but when you report on man's character (even if it is a story), you better cover all sides are be prepared for results that come from it.
I think one issue that many people are missing here has nothing to do with, "TD has a high profile job and he should be able to deal with it. Or, if he was at UT or A&M it would be worse." Most coaches can deal with criticism relative to their coaching and team preparation. Coaches and players are 10 times harder on themselves than fans are. They carry this stuff with them to sleep, to class, on the road - everywhere (at least the ones who care)! But, how do you defend your character? How do you defend you character when you can't speak about a situation because there is a potential lawsuit threat? When one article spreads to a national story and you can't comment of course you're going to be upset.
In this day and age this will never die. It will never go away. Ten years from now someone will google the story. Ten years from now, when we've all forgotten it, TD may have to explain it again (and by the way, there isn't a retraction to google). Who knows, it could prevent him from getting a job. With this kind of stuff, you just don't know. That's why you get upset and don't easily forget - I wouldn't and haven't. TD is a friend and I know how hurt he was by this situation and it's why I came to his defense, because he couldn't.

Well in this article, there were two character witnesses that were quoted. And Dodge was allowed to defend himself.

http://www.dallasnews.com/sharedcontent/dw...ow.332a83d.html

The allegations came as a shock to UNT junior defensive lineman Joseph Miller, who is black, and several area coaches and athletic directors who have worked with Dodge over the years. Dodge spent the 2000-06 seasons at Southlake Carroll and won four state titles in his last five years at the school.

"I heard about it this morning and was shocked," Miller said. "I have not been a victim of anything like that. Hopefully this will pass over."

Southlake Carroll athletic director Ronnie Tipps said Dodge never had problems with minority athletes during his tenure at the school.

"I am very surprised," Tipps said. "Coach Dodge and that staff are kid-centered. They care not just about winning, but making winners out of kids in life. That would be totally out of character for anyone on that staff, and I know most of them."

Did you ignore that?

It's been mentioned before, but let me remind everyone. Retractions are the Editors call, (I checked with a very reliable source on this) not the reporters. A reporter can write a follow-up story that completely exonerates and/or explains the situation, but it's the Editors call where to put it.....or even to write it at all!

To suggest that this unfortunate situation will somehow hinder Todd Dodge's career is a bit......drama queenish. The only people I ever hear talking about it are people on this board who don't like Bret Vito, and will drum up anything to rationalize their irrational dislike for him.

If you're so pissed about it, why don't you take Bret Vito aside and talk with him about it. A good time might be while you're walking out of the practice area (where you've been given full access to the coaches and players) and Bret (and maybe me) will be standing outside the practice area under the shade of some scrawny tree.

GrandGreen · January 29, 2008

I think the problem may be more with DRC management than Vito. Several from the DRC have hinted that they are almost doing a favor for NT by covering athletics, which IMO is total BS; that is the type of thing small community newspaper's cover. One of the problems is that Vito and the DRC also because of the ownership of the papers end up providing almost the total NT sports coverage through the DMN.

Vito/DRC, I think should be commended for expanded coverage through blogs and Vito's willingness to add his thoughts on the GMG pod casts. However, I think Vito/DRC's handling of the racial allegation was abhorrent. I don't blame them for reporting the incidents, because it could have become a major incident. After breaking the story, they should have been responsible enough to conduct an investigation and report the truth. The whole incident was the result of some disgruntled young men making unfounded allegations, this should have been covered with the same fervor as the allegation. There was no reason to report on a player getting locked up for traffic violations, this did not effect the team and served no purpose other than needlessly embarrass someone.

TD's, IMO irrational, stance of making beat writers stand outside the fence at practice probably doesn't help the situation.

Bryan316 · January 29, 2008

gray%20alien.gif

Maybe Dodge is speciesist.

The Fake Lonnie Finch · January 29, 2008

Tact is the nact of making a point without making an enemy.
Vito's reporting on the racism BS had to have pissed the entire Dodge staff off. I bet Dodge would like to kick Vito's ass over that crap.
His most recent blog about the UNT-LSU match-up.....making a comment like "the potential BEAT DOWN that UNT will be given by LSU" makes me and I guarantee has to make the players and coaches pissed off. BEAT DOWN, wow, how optomistic!
Why bring up the negative coverage of Keith Wooden at all? Was that really necessary?
Vito has to be a journalist but the dude has no tact and to me, jumps on crap too fast without thinking of the effect it has on the program (s).
Troy Phillips will get all the scoop that Dodge "wants" to get out, way before Vito.
The Keith Wooden deal pissed many people off including JJ and even though Vito did a blog about how well Wooden handled it, I don't believe that article was necessary, imo.

We're all real sorry that Vito isn't a bootlicker for Dodge, but give it a rest. If you want homer journalism go to Austin or Norman and read those guys gloss over all of the criminals in the UT and OU programs. Dodge had a chance to be civil to Vito and shut him out of practices. So, he'll suck it coverage-wise until he puts a winning product on the field.

This isn't Southlake High School, and apparently the Denton Record Chronicle understands that. And, thankfully, they report the good and the bad. If Dodge and his merry band of high school coaches can't handle a few scraps of bad news from a penny-ante outfit like the DRC, they ought to pack up and go back to high school where they can put the fear of God into the journalism class nerds who write for the high school rag.

Stick it.

January 29, 2008

Just to clarify, a retraction is printed when something is misreported by a newspaper. The DRC correctly reported that there were racism allegations. The fact that the allegations did not bear fruit does not make the story incorrect. Therefore, the DRC would not print a retraction of the racism story because the story was accurate - there were allegations.

The decision to publish a follow-up article about the staff being cleared by the university would be an editorial decision.

Edited January 29, 2008 by 97and03

SilverEagle · January 29, 2008

Just to clarify, a retraction is printed when something is misreported by a newspaper. The DRC correctly reported that there were racism allegations. The fact that the allegations did not bear fruit does not make the story incorrect. Therefore, the DRC would not print a retraction of the racism story because the story was accurate - there were allegations.
The decision to publish a follow-up article about the staff being cleared by the university would be an editorial decision.

Just a bit of advise. You'll never be liked here for introducing logic............. :rolleyes:

January 29, 2008

Just a bit of advise. You'll never be liked here for introducing logic.............

I am sure I can find many, many ways to accomplish that. Logic is just the tip of the iceberg! For example, I could join the spelling and grammar nazis here and point out that you meant to say "advice." Now hopefully you won't like me either.