Don't Mess With Texas

[KingDL1]

It's been two weeks and no prosecution so far. I hope he is not!

Wow this guy was not screwing around!

Good for him!

[UNTflyer]

I'm all for the right to bear arms, but this guy was an idiot.

He was not in any danger and the police were on the way. It's almost as if he couldn't wait to kill somebody.

[UNTLifer]

I'm all for the right to bear arms, but this guy was an idiot.

He was not in any danger and the police were on the way. It's almost as if he couldn't wait to kill somebody.

The police weren't going to make it in time. He didn't shoot until they entered his yard.

[untbowler]

good for him defending his neighborhood from these thug thiefs.

Of course now watch the criminals families sue in Civil Court

[JesseMartin]

I caught this on the news. The thing is, if your neighbor is being robbed, you can only use deadly force in situations where the neighbor is a family member, asked you to watch their house, etc. there is a caveat, however; if they rob your neighbor, and your neighbor DOES NOT fit that legal model, and then they cross your property line, you are still allowed to use deadly force.

The neighbor wasn't family and didn't ask him to watch their house. He waited till they crossed over onto his property to shoot. Since he has a weapon to protect his property, I'm guessing this dude is WAY up on his Texas-specific 2nd Amendment Laws. He's gonna walk. Any attempt by the families will be thrown out. I heard the extended version of the phone call and an interview with the DA and 2 lawyers. Nobody can touch him because he followed Texas laws to the letter. The only hope the families have is to take it to court and then appeal it to have Texas laws overturned. With conservative Circuits and Supreme Court members, I don't see that happening any time soon!

[UNTflyer]

He shot them both in the back. The cops were on the way, in fact one pulled up and witnessed the shooting. His life was in no danger provided he kept his ass in his house.

Hell, he was practically giddy over the chance to kill somebody. This guy is the poster child for The Bad Gun Owner.

[JesseMartin]

Don't get me wrong, you're totally right, but according to the law, he was within his rights. Again, you might see a civil case filed that works its way up, but the letter of the law is such that his giddy ass was still following it, if just barely.

[Cr1028]

Wow, when I first heard about this, I thought they broke into his house and he shot them both. The fact that he was told over and over not to shoot anyone, they weren't burgularizing his home, and that as soon as they crossed his property line he shot them is just sad.

I could understand if he was standing on the other side of the door or window in his house as they were coming in. He would've shot the first one and the second would've run off. I just see this as a technicality to get away with murder. Self-defense and vengence are two different things. Last I checked, burglary wasn't punishible by death unless you walk onto this guy's property.

[GreenBat]

I'm sorry that they died, I wish death on no one but the MUTS (j/k). But they did break the law and I believe they vacated all of their rights, when they broke the window and entered the neighbors house. Again, I'm sorry that they are dead, but this guy should not be prosecuted for protecting his neighbors property.

[Coffee and TV]

He shot them both in the back. The cops were on the way, in fact one pulled up and witnessed the shooting. His life was in no danger provided he kept his ass in his house.

Hell, he was practically giddy over the chance to kill somebody. This guy is the poster child for The Bad Gun Owner.

Truths.

[KingDL1]

If my neighbor shot and killed someone robbing my house I would be thrilled.

DON"T BREAK INTO HOUSES AND COMMIT ROBBERY!!!!!

More power to Mr. Horn.

[Coffee and TV]

But they did break the law and I believe they vacated all of their rights, when they broke the window and entered the neighbors house. Again, I'm sorry that they are dead, but this guy should not be prosecuted for protecting his neighbors property.

Well be sure your taxes are accurate, or you don't turn right on red with a sign, or you forgot to pay for that 12 pack of Dr Pepper that you always forget to pay for because its on the bottom of the cart. If not then I'll waste you. I mean, you lost your right not to get wasted, right?

Edited December 9, 2007 by Coffee and TV

[ColoradoEagle]

Anyone who says the burglars deserved to die is straight up crazy.

[UNTflyer]

...this guy should not be prosecuted for protecting his neighbors property.

I agree. He should be prosecuted for murder. He wasn't trying to protect anybody, he walked out of his house with the INTENT to kill those guys. He said on the 911 call over and over that he was going to shoot them, and he was told NO that the police were on their way.

[KingDL1]

I agree. He should be prosecuted for murder. He wasn't trying to protect anybody, he walked out of his house with the INTENT to kill those guys. He said on the 911 call over and over that he was going to shoot them, and he was told NO that the police were on their way.

You can protect the criminal if you want, I say Mr. Horn is a hero!

They broke the law big time and I know plenty of people that would do the same thing. I damn sure would. He had no idea if they had guns on them or not. They were breaking into someone's house and stealing their property, they took the risk and paid for it.

Don't break into someone's home unless you are ready to die! IT IS SIMPLE.

And if you are ever in a situation that you feel you have to shoot, make damn sure you you shoot to kill. That in no way was murder. And I will bet that in the Great State of Texas he will be cleared by the Grand Jury like he should be.

Buy the way he stayed on the phone for over 8 minutes (which must have seemed like an eternity) until they started to leave. If he was murder happy he would have gone and shot them then called 911.

Edited December 9, 2007 by KingDL1

[Cr1028]

They weren't threatening his life, they were running away. If they had been coming at him that would've been different.

[UNTflyer]

Exactly... the coroner said yesterday that they were both shot in the back.

That's not the act of a hero... it's the act of a coward.

[ColoradoEagle]

Don't break into someone's home unless you are ready to die! IT IS SIMPLE.

And if you are ever in a situation that you feel you have to shoot, make damn sure you you shoot to kill. That in no way was murder. And I will bet that in the Great State of Texas he will be cleared by the Grand Jury like he should be.

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-4...349496686&q

[KingDL1]

Exactly... the coroner said yesterday that they were both shot in the back.

That's not the act of a hero... it's the act of a coward.

Shot in the back that means something to you, grow up this is not a duel in the old west he was protecting his neighborhood and private property.

Well enjoy protecting the criminal, but Mr. Horn is a hero in my and many other peoples books.

I stopped a guy breaking in to my car once right in my front yard I held a shotgun on him. He went to jail, but he stopped if not he would have been pushing daisies now. There is a lot of adrenaline, nerves that go on in that situation, and seeing these guys about to get away would really crank a guy up.

Also these burglars already had a criminal record and the majority of repeat criminals graduate to more and more violent crimes. Mr. Horn may have saved an innocent person's life down the road.

Edited December 9, 2007 by KingDL1

[greenminer]

You can protect the criminal if you want, I say Mr. Horn is a hero!

They broke the law big time and I know plenty of people that would do the same thing. I damn sure would. He had no idea if they had guns on them or not. They were breaking into someone's house and stealing their property, they took the risk and paid for it.

Don't break into someone's home unless you are ready to die! IT IS SIMPLE.

And if you are ever in a situation that you feel you have to shoot, make damn sure you you shoot to kill. That in no way was murder. And I will bet that in the Great State of Texas he will be cleared by the Grand Jury like he should be.

Buy the way he stayed on the phone for over 8 minutes (which must have seemed like an eternity) until they started to leave. If he was murder happy he would have gone and shot them then called 911.

Regardless of how you feel about the crime, the law has very specific guidelines about how we use our guns. And I believe there are situations where you don't shoot to kill, you shoot to immobilize.

I don't know all the details, but I gather a few things this guy has against him that you need to consider:

1) they were running away. He chased them to shoot...and kill

2) there was no evidence that they were a threat to his safety. I think the law says you can NOT shoot unless you know they are a threat? It might not matter if they're in your house, but this is different when on someone else's lawn.

The bolded statement is a blatant, knee-jerk over generalization. This guy was hoping to get these guys from the get-go.

I wonder if you'd be speaking differently if this situation played out exactly the same with a couple of 120 lb females instead.

Edited December 9, 2007 by greenminer

[Cr1028]

Well enjoy protecting the criminal, but Mr. Horn is a hero in my and many other peoples books.

I stopped a guy breaking in to my car once right in my front yard I held a shotgun on him. He went to jail, but he stopped if not he would have been pushing daisies now. There is a lot of adrenaline, nerves that go on in that situation, and seeing these guys about to get away would really crank a guy up.

Also these burglars already had a criminal record and the majority of repeat criminals graduate to more and more violent crimes. Mr. Horn may have saved an innocent person's life down the road.

These guys had minor drug offenses, they were not murderers or rapists. You can tell on the 911 call that he was wanting the operator to dare him to shoot. He wanted to kill these guys. They didn't enter his home at all, he went outside of his home after repeated requests that he not and went after these criminals. He could see them out the window, he should have just followed them with his eyes and told the 911 operator so the REAL police could handle it. He did NOT have to exit his home. These guys would be in prison instead of the morgue. The punishment did not fit the crime.

I guess you're right though, every neighborhood is safer with a half-cocked old man running around chasing people with a shotgun, especially one that can hit a moving target in the back.

[Cr1028]

Regardless of how you feel about the crime, the law has very specific guidelines about how we use our guns. And I believe there are situations where you don't shoot to kill, you shoot to immobilize.

I don't know all the details, but I gather a few things this guy has against him that you need to consider:

1) they were running away. He chased them to shoot...and kill

2) there was no evidence that they were a threat to his safety. I think the law says you can NOT shoot unless you know they are a threat? It might not matter if they're in your house, but this is different when on someone else's lawn.

The bolded statement is a blatant, knee-jerk over generalization. This guy was hoping to get these guys from the get-go.

I wonder if you'd be speaking differently if this situation played out exactly the same with a couple of 120 lb females instead.

Precisely, he didn't say, I'm scared they are going to come over here and kill me, he said, "I can't let them get away with this". What robbery? Isn't that what insurance is for? The only time he sounded fearful on the phone is when he would confront them that they might kill him, then DON'T CONFRONT THEM!! Leave that to the people that are trained and have the authority to handle this. I can't believe this man will get away with this over a legal loophole. If he had heard gunshots next door or seen his neighbor killed by these people I would have a different opinion but last I checked we don't give lethal injections to burglars.

[UNTflyer]

What's key here is that he told the 911 operator "I'm going to kill them." That is intent to kill, not intent to protect life or property. Horn saw this as a great opportunity to kill people and get away with it, and that is what disgusts me so much about this. After listening to the 911 call a couple times, it seems to me that Horn called 911 for acquiessence to murder.

I'm not advocating we protect a criminal, I'm trying to protect the rights of law-abiding gun owners... like me. This guy is a complete idiot who has reinforced the stereotype of the Texan with the itchy trigger finger. Because of this, people are now going to question the new law protecting citizens from civil liabilities when they protect their property.

They weren't going to get away. The cops were pulling up as Horn shot these guys in the back. And he was TOLD the cops were coming.

And your logic that he "may" have saved someone's life down the road wouldn't hold up in any other situation either. One is only justified in shooting someone if their life is in IMMINENT danger.

[UNTflyer]

And I believe there are situations where you don't shoot to kill, you shoot to immobilize.

I agree with every thing you said except this. The law does not permit citizens to "shoot to wound".

[greenminer]

I agree with every thing you said except this. The law does not permit citizens to "shoot to wound".

I was actually thinking of cops in that situation. Maybe Emmit can elaborate on that (or maybe not...I don't know).

What a hazy line we debate! Defending your life and the person next to you is one thing, taking the life of another in the name of property seems different.

What he did might seem honorable and the right thing to do, but IMO this honor will be a fad and someone will be left wondering why their loved ones were taken from them.

I wouldn't be thrilled if my neighbor did this for me, I'd be upset. Say they (robbers) WERE armed and he missed, these thieves would probably turn and shoot. I certainly don't want my neighbor dead on account of my property.