I'm Fed Up At The Hits On Dodge And The Players

LittleMeanGreenMan · October 28, 2007

All you guys need to stop your whining. We are probably one of the worst 5 teams in all of Div 1A. With that being said we have a bright future. Give the coaches some time to adjust to the college game and get their talent grounded here. No need to lose the faith, but at the same time, don't ignore what we are right now, which is pretty damn bad.

GreenN'walinsVet · October 28, 2007

No one needs to do their homework when a defense goes from 64th to 117th-119th with basically the same players. But that's now in the past. Maybe we need to just write it up as what it is: A learning curve and leave it at that.
The difference between the level of offenses we have faced last year to this point in the season this year is around 12 points better, and that's only because Troy is doing so well offensively.
Of course the defense has played better the past three weeks, it's the Sunbelt? And I expect to see us get even better the rest of the way. With the next few weeks in mind I might add that Western Kentucky, a 1-AA transitional team beat MTSU.
Rick

Rick I dont usually disagree with you but Michigan lost to a 1-AA team as well, are you saying that we should be able to beat them? I think it was obvious that we had as much talent as MTSU does if not more, but when you give them just about everything they got, and you still have a chance to win, then it says something to what is happening.

Now I dont know for sure, but i would be willing to bet that if we would of had 4 tournovers and a blocked punt in a game last year, there would of been 0 percent chance of us even being close in the game.

Cooley · October 28, 2007

We certainly don't need another message board just for posters to feel that they can express their honest opinions (Albeit not positive) without being criticized. Coach Dodge should be able to handle such criticism; Otherwise, he should not have taken one of the worse D1 jobs in America. We are not Southlake Carroll where everyone worships and love you. (College ball is a totally different) Dodge, while an assistant here before, saw his former coach dismissed without the same support he currently enjoys.

Potential recruits and family members should rightfully do their due deligence in terms of fans interest. I wouldn't want my kid to attend a school where the fans didn't give a damn? I would appreciate the passion of the die hard fans and their desire to win.

I hear what Oldtimer and others are saying. I would, however, challenge my long term supporters/friends of the program to not be too critical of others whose opinions may differ. We are, in fact, a bad program. (based on our on the field performance). Of course, Dodge will be provided every opportunity to turn the program around. RV showed all the confidence in the word in him by compensating him 3 times as much as his last job. We all also know that RV will extend a coach when deserved.

IMHO, it's time to drop the program when fans don't support the program by their attendance (19,000 against SunBelt teams) or when they could care less or when the administration refuses to listen to its fan base. It is human nature to vent immediately after adversity. Oldtimer is correct in reminding us all to stay focused on the big picture.

I hope that some of our more seniored posters (time on board) not get too worked up over the thoughts of some of the newer and/or younger posters; they have taken the time to vent rather than go away like the vast majority of alums/students of North Texas in the metroplex. Let's thank them for their opinions without threats for them start their own "negative forums". You don't tell your patrons to go shop elsewhere when they complain about your product or services.

When I have interviewed in the past, I felt that I had the right to ask about the negatives of the position. What contributed to the opening? I also ask current employees their thoughts and how they feel. I know that an organization that has not performed well has had some issues. There are red flags with employee turnover and loss of customers.

I don't read everything on here and/or ignore those opinions I don't agree with. I am, however, thankful for the opportunity to keep abreast of the thoughts and opinions of the entire Mean Green family.

Just my 2 cents!

Go Mean Green

TheTastyGreek · October 28, 2007

Now I dont know for sure, but i would be willing to bet that if we would of had 4 tournovers and a blocked punt in a game last year, there would of been 0 percent chance of us even being close in the game.

I know for sure.

Louisiana Tech 34, North Texas 31

3 interceptions, 2 lost fumbles. No blocked punts, even though Denis Hopovac had to fill in for Truman Spencer.

FAU 17, North Texas 16

3 interceptions, 1 lost fumble. No blocked punts... but it's the only other game where we had 4 turnovers.

So there's your comparison to last year. Not trying to prove any point here, just eliminating the "don't know for sure".

UNT Mean Green · October 28, 2007

I agree with Old Timer!

God bless the Seniors...but I don't care what happens this year other than I'd like to see our squad improve from the first game to the last game in the 3 major areas, and I know we have accomplished that on the Offensive & Defensive sides...the verdict is still out on Special Teams.

Our defense has come a long ways from the first game until now!

Our offense has shown signs of greatness...we just have trouble with consistency.

I may be drinking some green-colored kool-aid, but I feel like we are going to have a legitimate team in 2009!

UNTflyer · October 28, 2007

I'm excited about the future with TD, but less than thrilled about the defensive coaching performance and the special teams performance.

What I couldn't understand is that after our defense gave up an easy TD when the backup QB came in, Mendoza walked away from his defense after they were on the bench.

WHY WASN'T HE COACHING THEM?? I watched Mendoza, he walked all the way up the field and left his defense sitting there on the bench.

Attention, Todd Dodge!! There is now a highly successful defensive coordinator available right here in the DFW area.

11-26-2006.NS_26Bennett.GGF21DDQ0.1.jpg

October 28, 2007

Let's look at the coaching and the three areas of the team.

Coaching = There is no doubt that mistakes are being made from the head coach on down. It's called a learning curve. That is why there are so few successful coaches that can jump from high school to a Division 1A coaching job. There is just as large a leaning curve for those who were former coordinators to their first college head coaching job. I firmly believe that Todd Dodge will have tremendous success but it will take a little time. We are going to have a little patience. As to the other coaches, I believe that some can quickly adapt to the 1A level. Others may not be able to within the amount of time that we need for success. We all seem to understand that the level of talent had dropped due to stealth recruiting. He had only a matter of weeks to put together a recruiting class and even less time to put together a coaching staff. Most of his contacts were at the high school level and he wanted to reward those that had help make him successful. Some of those have fit in pretty well and some haven't. Todd will have to do a lot of soul-searching at the end of this season. It is one of the most difficult parts of being a head coach. We all hope and pray that TD can and will make the right decisions. I believe that he will.

Offense - Due to the new system being installed and the majority of the returning players that were geared for antithesis of the spread offense we expected that it would take at least a season to show marked improvement. Surprisingly, that has gone rather well. Oh, coaches and players are making mistakes but they are also moving the chains and putting more points on the board than the previous seasons. They are far more entertaining than the boring offenses of the past. There are changes that I'd like to see and perhaps I will. For example, I'd like to see a tight end in the backfield to pick up blitzing linebackers and safeties. Then, if there's no blitz, he could become a safety valve receiver. But, if Dodge is successful with the one back offense (other than the qb) then I'll be just as happy. It's his offense and I enjoy it.

Defense - This has been a real letdown for me and probably for Coach Dodge as well. We took a defense that was moderately effective and, with what could have been at least as good, if not better, and made it far weaker. Since the players are essentially the same and the defense is playing with desire, it has to be schemes, which comes from coaching. It appears that the defense that we are playing relies on speed and we just don't have that kind of speed. Again, if you don't have the spped to match the runners and receivers that you are covering then you resort to providing help where it is needed or use tactics to thrown the opposing offense out of their rhythm. I don't know if we have the coaches that can do that but again, I believe that Todd will evaluate that at the end of the season.

Special Teams - This is an area of great concern for me. Truman Spencer had a very good year last year; good enough to be on the Ray Guy Watch List. This year, he has had three blocked and has to kick so quickly that he's not getting near the distance that he did last year. We have gone from first in net punting in the conference last year to seventh this year. We are allowing more yards on opponents returns than we are gaining on our returns. Our kickoffs don't reach the opponent's goal line. We have no confidence in any field goal attempt beyond thirty yards. Punt returns are even worse; the culmination being three downed inside the one yard line last game. Kickoff and punt return coverage is mediocre at best. This area needs a complete overwork.

I criticized but I tried not to demean any player (or coach) that we have. The players are doing the best that they can within their abilities. Coaches are a little more fair game since they are being well-paid for their efforts but they should still be treated with some respect. That should also apply to other posters.

OldTimer · October 28, 2007

Let's look at the coaching and the three areas of the team.
Coaching = There is no doubt that mistakes are being made from the head coach on down. It's called a learning curve. That is why there are so few successful coaches that can jump from high school to a Division 1A coaching job. There is just as large a leaning curve for those who were former coordinators to their first college head coaching job. I firmly believe that Todd Dodge will have tremendous success but it will take a little time. We are going to have a little patience. As to the other coaches, I believe that some can quickly adapt to the 1A level. Others may not be able to within the amount of time that we need for success. We all seem to understand that the level of talent had dropped due to stealth recruiting. He had only a matter of weeks to put together a recruiting class and even less time to put together a coaching staff. Most of his contacts were at the high school level and he wanted to reward those that had help make him successful. Some of those have fit in pretty well and some haven't. Todd will have to do a lot of soul-searching at the end of this season. It is one of the most difficult parts of being a head coach. We all hope and pray that TD can and will make the right decisions. I believe that he will.
Offense - Due to the new system being installed and the majority of the returning players that were geared for antithesis of the spread offense we expected that it would take at least a season to show marked improvement. Surprisingly, that has gone rather well. Oh, coaches and players are making mistakes but they are also moving the chains and putting more points on the board than the previous seasons. They are far more entertaining than the boring offenses of the past. There are changes that I'd like to see and perhaps I will. For example, I'd like to see a tight end in the backfield to pick up blitzing linebackers and safeties. Then, if there's no blitz, he could become a safety valve receiver. But, if Dodge is successful with the one back offense (other than the qb) then I'll be just as happy. It's his offense and I enjoy it.
Defense - This has been a real letdown for me and probably for Coach Dodge as well. We took a defense that was moderately effective and, with what could have been at least as good, if not better, and made it far weaker. Since the players are essentially the same and the defense is playing with desire, it has to be schemes, which comes from coaching. It appears that the defense that we are playing relies on speed and we just don't have that kind of speed. Again, if you don't have the spped to match the runners and receivers that you are covering then you resort to providing help where it is needed or use tactics to thrown the opposing offense out of their rhythm. I don't know if we have the coaches that can do that but again, I believe that Todd will evaluate that at the end of the season.
Special Teams - This is an area of great concern for me. Truman Spencer had a very good year last year; good enough to be on the Ray Guy Watch List. This year, he has had three blocked and has to kick so quickly that he's not getting near the distance that he did last year. We have gone from first in net punting in the conference last year to seventh this year. We are allowing more yards on opponents returns than we are gaining on our returns. Our kickoffs don't reach the opponent's goal line. We have no confidence in any field goal attempt beyond thirty yards. Punt returns are even worse; the culmination being three downed inside the one yard line last game. Kickoff and punt return coverage is mediocre at best. This area needs a complete overwork.
I criticized but I tried not to demean any player (or coach) that we have. The players are doing the best that they can within their abilities. Coaches are a little more fair game since they are being well-paid for their efforts but they should still be treated with some respect. That should also apply to other posters.

A fair analysis....we're not as good as I had hoped we would be...it seems like we solve one problem area and another pops us. But the offense when functioning is really exciting and fun to watch....vs a draw play between tackles in long yardage situations. Positive points...within the players we have...when a problem comes up it gets attention....ie see defense...yesterday OL was better than last week...until we lost our 2nd starter to injury. center Kelvin Drake .Tyler, a starting OL didn't play either, because of an auto accident...concussion...I heard. The players and coaches haven't given up and neither have I. I didn't expect multiple wins this year...hopefully we will get another win or two this season. I would bet we get a ship kicker recruit this year...Coach Dodge didn't have a chance when our kicker quit just before the season...and was lucky to get even a couple of possibly kickers to try out with Moreland the best of the non ship players...

shaft · October 29, 2007

The biggest quesiton about brining in Dodge was if he could bring in good assistants. If were 1-7 at the end of Next October we'll be shopping for a new coach.

DD would have been fired at the end of his third year if we weren't about to make the jump the SBC. Dodge isn't going to be given the luxury of 3 free years to get something in place, he's going to get 1 free year and 1 year to show improvement to even get to that 3rd year.

GoMeanGreen1999 · October 29, 2007

What I couldn't understand is that after our defense gave up an easy TD when the backup QB came in, Mendoza walked away from his defense after they were on the bench.
WHY WASN'T HE COACHING THEM?? I watched Mendoza, he walked all the way up the field and left his defense sitting there on the bench.
Attention, Todd Dodge!! There is now a highly successful defensive coordinator available right here in the DFW area.

Hmmmm, I seem to remember bringing this up about Mendoza about a month ago in another thread....for whatever reason he seems to be distant from his team when they do bad things.

the real grad88 · October 29, 2007

The biggest quesiton about brining in Dodge was if he could bring in good assistants. If were 1-7 at the end of Next October we'll be shopping for a new coach.
DD would have been fired at the end of his third year if we weren't about to make the jump the SBC. Dodge isn't going to be given the luxury of 3 free years to get something in place, he's going to get 1 free year and 1 year to show improvement to even get to that 3rd year.

Give me a break. Let's quit talking about how much time Dodge has...like any of us really know. The man has a contract, and UNT will abide by it. No one is giving Dodge any timelines as of yet. It's just ridiculous to be thinking in such terms at this point. It's the man's first year.

UNTflyer · October 29, 2007

The biggest quesiton about brining in Dodge was if he could bring in good assistants. If were 1-7 at the end of Next October we'll be shopping for a new coach.

MMM, nope. Given the hand Dodge was dealt, I'm certain he will have a minimum of 4 years before he starts to feel pressure. It's not like he's taking a good team and turning it to rubbish.

Dodge2007 · October 29, 2007

I think the people that are saying that firing Dodge or ANY of his staff are PATHETIC and completely UNREALISTIC. Dan Hawkins at CU last year won 2 games, did they fire him?? I don't know why people think that the hiring of Dodge would turn the season around in 1 season. We are still playing with the same declining players and talent that we had with Dickey's losing seasons. Yes TD had a nice recruiting class, well lets let them get acclomated to the more seasoned players and have them get acclomated to the new offense and defense. And I'm sorry to say to the unrealistic few this is going to take more than a few months of practice and scrimmages.
I will personally say I am glad that we are having such a bad season because when we eventually start winning we will know it was because our head coach TD had a losing and terrible season and the victories will taste so much sweeter.
So if you dont like the way things are going this season take your hiatus and report back in 2 years. Otherwise support, stop complaining, and stop trying to rally up troops to get on the "Fire the coaches" badwagon.
If there is one thing that we CAN complain about its watching Vizza get pounded because our tackles cant protect anything. But other than that these football games are entertaining.

Great post. We have some first timers playing at the collegiate level on offense who are doing pretty damn well. Hell no body even heard of Fitz last season, or Mosely or Vizza or Dibrell or most of the entire starting OL. We are making mistakes and still in games. This will turn. Mendoza ,hopefully, is able to give all those the middle finger when he gets the job done. Leave Roman alone, he is a good kid.

DB29 · October 29, 2007

The ONLYconcern I have about TD is that he may hesitate to make coaching changes, if needed, because of individual loyalty. I'm excited about the future with TD, but less than thrilled about the defensive coaching performance and the special teams performance. Basically the same defensive players performed much better last year and special teams have gone to heck. We've gotta have a college level DC and special teams coaching to be successful.

Is it just me or has anyone else noticed defensively we do not have a nickel package or a goal line D...first year or not that is ridiculous. This DC will not improve when my grandson starts playing football...and my daughter is only three years old. I just hate that our senior D-players have to play their last year under this guy. If the defense is ranked last in DI football, Mendoza should be ranked the worse DC in college, HS, and little league. He is not even giving the D a fighting chance. When the D makes a stop it is bc of the players...not the coaching! For the players sake it is really hard to watch.

KingDL1 · October 29, 2007

Kudo's for aceing Excuses 101 !
Last year's defense played in a new system & may not have been stellar, but they did perform well enough to ranked in the mid 60's. They ALSO had to deal with "problems" such as poor field position, turnovers, etc because of the offense. We really didn't have a big impact player last year either. TD even said, probably to his regret, that the D would be the strength of this year's team and it sure AIN'T HAPPENED.

I am not trying to make excuses, this is the staffs first year. F I R S T .. Y E A R! After a couple years if we are still doing this poor I will be mad as hell.

There are a lot of assumptions in that statement not to mention that the average of the total offenses we have faced is now 27 places better this than last, that troy finished the season last year with a total offense of 77 while this year they are at 21. Yeah we lost some guys and have a totally new staff, several freshman playing, but we are basically the same that means we should be just as good? Sure, but I guess that depends on the details. Not that anyone wants to pay attention to the details. But you guys just want to vent negativity so go ahead not sure what that gets you. I am just gald if you still come to the games.

I am pretty sure it does not help any other then to form a the coaches suck bandwagon, whether that is your intention or not.

UNT Mean Green · October 29, 2007

This is the first and last time I will address Todd Dodge's job status.

He is in EXCELLENT standing with UNT. He has boosted ticket sales tremendously. Mean Green Club memberships are at an all time high. Letterman's Association memberships...same deal. Attendance is up. 5K for the spring game helped. Best recruiting class in years that he accomplished in a little over a month. Outstanding class of EARLY COMMITMENTS which puts us on a pedastool over the rest of the Sun Belt. Lets face it, the guy is a kid magnet. Not to mention, he is an outstanding man of character who is teaching our players more than the game of football. He is the face of this university right now...like it or not...and personally I am very comfortable with that.

He's in good standing and is doing GREAT things for our university. Yeah, its an uphill battle and we all know that. But everyone who makes the decisions on coaches really likes Todd Dodge and the things he's doing.

GreenAlums · October 29, 2007

This is the first and last time I will address Todd Dodge's job status.
He is in EXCELLENT standing with UNT. He has boosted ticket sales tremendously. Mean Green Club memberships are at an all time high. Letterman's Association memberships...same deal. Attendance is up. 5K for the spring game helped. Best recruiting class in years that he accomplished in a little over a month. Outstanding class of EARLY COMMITMENTS which puts us on a pedastool over the rest of the Sun Belt. Lets face it, the guy is a kid magnet. Not to mention, he is an outstanding man of character who is teaching our players more than the game of football. He is the face of this university right now...like it or not...and personally I am very comfortable with that.
He's in good standing and is doing GREAT things for our university. Yeah, its an uphill battle and we all know that. But everyone who makes the decisions on coaches really likes Todd Dodge and the things he's doing.

Great post! I too get discourage when I don't get overight success. I have not been on the board long, but believe me, I've been a UNT fan since the Fry era and it has been a rocky road with lots of ups and downs. We are definitely in an "up" right now with what looks like the best potential for a true level change for UNT football.

I really enjoy all the posts on this board because good or bad, I really see the enthusiasm and desire for UNT to be showcased by an excellent athletic program. We old guys on the board can really learn a lot from the youngsters. But the youngsters need to realize this is not our first rodeo and we can tell when something special has come along. TD and his troops are that "something special" we have needed for a long time. Keep the spirit!

PlummMeanGreen · October 29, 2007

Great post! I too get discourage when I don't get overight success. I have not been on the board long, but believe me, I've been a UNT fan since the Fry era and it has been a rocky road with lots of ups and downs. We are definitely in an "up" right now with what looks like the best potential for a true level change for UNT football.
I really enjoy all the posts on this board because good or bad, I really see the enthusiasm and desire for UNT to be showcased by an excellent athletic program. We old guys on the board can really learn a lot from the youngsters. But the youngsters need to realize this is not our first rodeo and we can tell when something special has come along. TD and his troops are that "something special" we have needed for a long time. Keep the spirit!

A post that pretty well sizes things up for very many of us and as for as Vito's DRC column talking about someone shouting that TDodge go back to Southlake Carroll well, uh.................... :rolleyes: