Defensive Schemed Lauged At By Ou Coaches?

[Got5onIt]

And I dont want to hear about APP State as well, becuase if you watched that game (like I did) you could see that they had the team speed to compete with Michigan and I think that we will have that same kind of speed in a couple of years, but until then we just have to take our lumps against the big boys and go out and beat the small schools until our team speed will allow us to play the big boys with the same kind of fever that App State and Boise State can.

How small of a school are we talking here? I hope you're not referring to the Arkansas St.'s & Idaho's of the world. Both looked worlds better than NT did Saturday night.

[greenminer]

GREAT TAKE GREENNAWLINS.....I HOPE YOUR RIGHT....WE'LL FIND OUT IN 3 DAYS IF WE HAVE A FEW MORE TRICKS AND ADJUSTMENTS UP OUR SLEEVE. IF NOT, WE'LL HAVE 2 WEEKS TO FUME.

THE SAME THING WAS SAID AFTER JIMMY JOHNSON'S DEBUT WITH THE COWBOYS AND LOOK

WHO HAD THE LAST LAUGH!!! SOME NFL COACH SAID JIMMY WASN'T PLAYING EAST CAROLINA

GET A GRIP PEOPLE.

If we throw you two into a private thread, would we be able to hear the yelling?

[Quoner]

WHEN DID THIS THREAD BECOME CAPS ONLY?

I already stated that I think UNT held back the schemes and tricks they are bound to use moving forward. If we see no wrinkles in the defense during the SMU game, then we can hit the panic button.

OU had every right to laugh at us, but hopefully the real joke was on SMU.

[Eagle1855]

I already stated that I think UNT held back the schemes and tricks they are bound to use moving forward. If we see no wrinkles in the defense during the SMU game, then we can hit the panic button.

can someone explain to me why we would mail it in up at OU by not adjusting the defense nor come up with different blitz packages?

Then explain how that fits into Dodge's philosophy of playing every game to win (that everyone, myself included, had a mega-hard on over the weeks leading up to last weekends donkey-punching).

Seems incongruent.

[Quoner]

can someone explain to me why we would mail it in up at OU by not adjusting the defense nor come up with different blitz packages?

Then explain how that fits into Dodge's philosophy of playing every game to win (that everyone, myself included, had a mega-hard on over the weeks leading up to last weekends donkey-punching).

Seems incongruent.

Because if I don't hold on to a personal belief that it was a preseason type affair where he was assessing what he had, then I have to face the hard reality that he might not be the Second Coming and I invested too much in pumping myself up for him to even think that's a possibility.

And he never said win today, he just said win all ambiguous-like - like maybe someday.

[chrisfisher]

ah ha! instead of stealth recruiting, we now have stealth offensive/defensive schemes...

[Quoner]

ah ha! instead of stealth recruiting, we now have stealth offensive/defensive schemes...

That's how bad week one was - chrisfisher can take potshots at Dodge and be justified.

Time to move on.

[MeanMag]

WHEN DID THIS THREAD BECOME CAPS ONLY?

I already stated that I think UNT held back the schemes and tricks they are bound to use moving forward. If we see no wrinkles in the defense during the SMU game, then we can hit the panic button.

OU had every right to laugh at us, but hopefully the real joke was on SMU.

I will have a hard on for you if you are right. God, I hope you are too. Not because I want a hard on, but because I want to see another few UNT wins before this season is over.

[MeanMag]

And he never said win today, he just said win all ambiguous-like - like maybe someday.

Oh no, Phil Bennett talks like that too...

[Stan R]

WHEN DID THIS THREAD BECOME CAPS ONLY?

I already stated that I think UNT held back the schemes and tricks they are bound to use moving forward. If we see no wrinkles in the defense during the SMU game, then we can hit the panic button.

OU had every right to laugh at us, but hopefully the real joke was on SMU.

Even though you are dead wrong about holding back... I wish it were true and if we were holding back to unleash this SECRET WEAPON on SMU then great so be it. Maybe next time we could just unleash a bit of the secret to keep us under 60 point margin of loss next time? pretty please, that would be great.

[Quoner]

Even though you are dead wrong about holding back... I wish it were true and if we were holding back to unleash this SECRET WEAPON on SMU then great so be it. Maybe next time we could just unleash a bit of the secret to keep us under 60 point margin of loss next time? pretty please, that would be great.

I watched Texas and had friends at Texas A&M watch them hold back their schemes and playbooks this week on both sides of the ball.

I am pulling this out of my butt for slef-preservation, but it is not an unheard of practice. That's why most schools just try to get through week one and then have their biggest leaps between weeks 1 and 2.

Now, we are not that good a team yet, but we are building. Anyone who expected more than 5 wins (and maybe even 3) is very optimistic.

1-11 or 2-10 might happen. And, sticking with the Jesus analogy, it took him about 30 years to really get going... (tongue in cheek)

[Got5onIt]

And he never said win today, he just said win all ambiguous-like - like maybe someday.

LOL!!!

[greenminer]

Oh no, Phil Bennett talks like that too...

Bennett never said it was a journey.

Don't stop believin'

Crap on this idea however you want, but I think Quoner is spot on: this was an evaluation. I'm going to trust that Dodge is doing what he thinks is right so that - as soon as we can - we have a top-25 team. I think eventually Dodge will play every game to win and honestly hope that that was not the case in Norman. If so, we're in deep trouble.

Where are the people that said they give Todge a free pass through a possible 0-12 rookie year? It would be refreshing to hear from them again.

Nebraska and Callahan just came up in the ESPN podcast. I looked them up just out of curiosity to see how they did in his first year (2004). Some ups and downs: loss to Southern Miss, Kansas State, and three straight losses to close the season (ISU, OU, Colorado). They had some decent wins in there too: Baylor, Pitt, Kansas, Mizz.

They did give up a 70-10 loss to TTech.

I'm not sure if this proves a point. I'm just trying to find some perspective. It's too early to tell.

[Green Lantern]

Where are the people that said they give Todge a free pass through a possible 0-12 rookie year? It would be refreshing to hear from them again.

This is probably the best question posed after the OU loss. Everyone was dissapointed with the lopsided loss, but did everyone on here not think that it was within the realm of possibility? At least it wasn't a 54-2 loss to Tulsa at home or a 65-0 Loss to UT. Think about those atrocities and then put the OU game in perspective.

Seems like there was quite a bit of venom being spewed after last Saturday. What happened to all of those patient Mean Green fans?

[GoMeanGreen1999]

Because if I don't hold on to a personal belief that it was a preseason type affair where he was assessing what he had, then I have to face the hard reality that he might not be the Second Coming and I invested too much in pumping myself up for him to even think that's a possibility.

And he never said win today, he just said win all ambiguous-like - like maybe someday.

I don't think anyone is questioning whether or not Dodge will win here after one game, I think we are just wondering why there seemed to be any changes on the Defensive side of the ball. I still believe as much today as I did before saturday that Dodge will win, but I do have to question the defense. I am sorry, but when you give up 400 yards of offense and 49 points in the FIRST half of a game, and make NO changes, or none that any of us really noticed, at the half and come out with the same thing in the second half, you have to question that defense. Were we talent wise way under OU, sure, but you can't convince me that we are that much different from Idaho and they sure didn't give up close to what we did playing a Heisman QB candidate.

Edited September 5, 2007 by GoMeanGreen1999

[GoMeanGreen1999]

This is probably the best question posed after the OU loss. Everyone was dissapointed with the lopsided loss, but did everyone on here not think that it was within the realm of possibility? At least it wasn't a 54-2 loss to Tulsa at home or a 65-0 Loss to UT. Think about those atrocities and then put the OU game in perspective.

Seems like there was quite a bit of venom being spewed after last Saturday. What happened to all of those patient Mean Green fans?

So for those of us that are willing to give him an 0-12 season (which I am one of them), does that mean that we can't have questions about certain things in the games on this message board?

[Eagle1855]

So for those of us that are willing to give him an 0-12 season (which I am one of them), does that mean that we can't have questions about certain things in the games on this message board?

precisely, now get back to work!

[CaribbeanGreen]

I'd agree with most of what's been said here, on both sides.

I don't think supporting a coaching staff and being positive about the future is mutually exclusive from criticizing play and asking questions. Frankly, with literally one famously outrageous, lovable exception, I didn't see ANYONE call for any heads or go off the deep end predicting a winless season or calling the TD experiment a failure.

It's okay to hypothesize, it's okay to Monday morning quarterback, it's okay to ask questions. What else is the point of this board? We all want the best for this program, and by and large I think we're excited about the future. The problem comes when, as MGE said, some people consider the new regime beyond reproach and make irrational, immature attacks and arguments towards anyone who dares state a contrary view. I experienced this myself when referring to a quote from the week prior to last week's game when an OU player described exactly what Mendoza's defense was at SLC and how we did nothing but exactly what he said. It was quickly announced I pulled that quote out of my a** and essentially that it didn't exist. This, despite the fact that it was all over this board in days prior and not a few posts later in the same thread was reproduced again, making a particular poster look awfully foolish (he never returned to acknowledge his error). This is the kind of silliness that is as counterproductive as those jumping off the building after week one.

Basically, this week is a huge game as far as this season goes. I stand by my opinion as far as week one goes -- either Quoner is right, and this was treated as a glorified practice, getting guys game experience, with winning being far from the main objective, OR, we gave up 350 passing yards and half a hundred points by halftime, all the while not adjusting one single thing on defense, which is just the way Mendoza's defense is and what we should expect vs. FAU as much as OU. Believing the latter represents a huge mountain to climb (barring an epic infusion of raw talent, and even then to an extent), so I choose to believe the former.

Bottom line is, we'll all know a lot more after this week. We'll know even more after FAU. This week, we see Dodge coach against a winnable opponent, an opponent these same players beat by 18 last season, and an opponent who will be up for us big time. They know the importance of this game - on both sides. Bennett is effectively coaching for his job this week. Fair or not, Dodge is coaching to set the tone for the beginning of his tenure and I feel that, again, fair or not, the result of this game will point the "general" fan base strongly in one direction or another. I know a lot of folks on this board hate to hear it, but given the situation, the opponent, the timing, etc., it really wasn't the least bit important to try and win last week in the grand scheme of things. This week, it is. I believe we'll see that, and we'll see both teams fight like hell.

[El Paso Eagle]

Just a guess here but don’t be too surprised if a lot of College assistant coaches would love to see coaches being promoted up from High Schools fail. There are some who believe there is a hierarchy to follow and while they might be willing to give TD a pass on some issues, they are going to be ruthless on his Coordinators.

[Green Lantern]

So for those of us that are willing to give him an 0-12 season (which I am one of them), does that mean that we can't have questions about certain things in the games on this message board?

No, surely not. I was just pointing out the typical over-reactions that get thrown out here on a yearly basis. GoMeanGreen1999, you personally bring up very good points and offer insightful discussion. That can not be said for all. There's always a glut of new posters (and some old fav's) that pop up to try and kick the program in the groin when something doesn't go as expected and offer nothing constructive. Questioning coaching decisions, evaluating game preparation as well as player execution is what should be expected on message boards.

What GreenMiner was saying...and I find it amusing, is that all of the Dodge lovefest in the offseason seemed to end very abruptly after Sat. Many people that claimed they would be patient and not "expect too much" in TD's first season sure turned around on that stance at the first sign of adversity.

For the record GMG 1999, I am not one of those people who will be happy with a 3 win season. I expect us to beat SMU this Saturday and to compete for the Sunbelt Conference championship this year. It can be done.

[GoMeanGreen1999]

For the record GMG 1999, I am not one of those people who will be happy with a 3 win season. I expect us to beat SMU this Saturday and to compete for the Sunbelt Conference championship this year. It can be done.

I would love to win the SBC this year as well as win this weekend (which I think we will), but I am also not going to jump ship if they go 0 - 12.

[GrandGreen]

Anyone trying to justify NT awful defensive showing IMO is wasting time, there is no way. First year coaching staff, new schemes, other staff players , etc, nothing justifies another team scoring 79 points . Bringing up other lopsided scores does nothing to hide the fact that NT was very poorly prepared for the game. Very few if any expected NT to do much more than play close to the point spread, but the fact is NT was never in the game and OU could have set the all time modern scoring record if they wanted to.

I assume most all fans are still elated to have TD at the helm and willing to accept almost any record in his first year, but that does not mean that TD is not open to criticism or that we have given up on this year's team.

I do wonder what has happened to the defensive backfield. Fred Bleil, who I thought was the best of the old staff, had heaped praise on his young cbs. I began to wonder when a walk on little used transfer from Baylor goes to top of NT's depth chart. Washington and Chatman have moved to other positions. Green has apparently slipped to non-playing status. Bush is the only returning player still in the rotation. Stating the obvious, it is going to be a very long year; if TD doesn't alter his defense or quickly develop some CB's that can effectively play in his scheme.

[GreenSquared]

There simply is not much new in terms of schemes that coaches don't know about, even in high school. Now talent, that's a different story. OU would have won Saturday even if they had never thrown a pass, ran the wishbone or the wing T.

[ParksAndRecRick]

The Journey is JUST beginning....

[SCREAMING EAGLE-66]

I remember hearing a similiar comment from an opposing coach about Jimmy Johnson when he took over the Cowboys.... about how simple his offense and defense was compared to most NFL teams... He won two Super Bowls about 3-4 years later.

The talant and especially the speed and quickness (not same) of the receivers killed us.