New Qb?

hickoryhouse · September 2, 2007

At first, I thought our offensive line significantly struggled to keep OU away from Meager. However, after Vizza came in the O-line looked pretty good. I think Meager's problem is that he scrambles wide and outside at the first sign of an OU player seemingly breaking through... Vizza stays in the pocket and looks very comfortable, confident, and strong doing so. his ability to stay in the pocket and trust offensive line actually made the O-line look much improved. I think this is b/c even if the defense starts to break through, the O-line can deflect the defense away from Vizza knowing that Vizza wouldn't take off running. With Meager, he made it impossible for the O-line to block b/c he takes off running in weird, wide angles at the first sign of trouble. Granted - Vizza made ugly mistakes, like the safety, but overall I think that Vizza will eventually take the job from Meager.

Vizza's ability to stay in the pocket was a relief for me. I was getting really frustrated watching Meager run wide and throw the ball at the guys on the bench.

buff64 · September 2, 2007

Did anyone else notice that Nathan Tune finished the game, not mentioned in any of the newspaper articles. Since he did not throw a pass he had no stats.

mad dog · September 2, 2007

My initial point that I was going to make when I came on here this morning was to not just be in love with what the QB puts on the scoreboard for his team. I'd also be concerned with what he puts on the scoreboard for the other team.

In terms of raw number of made plays, Vizza pretty much took the cake last night. I'm not sure if it was really against the first team defense, as Emmitt told me on the bus (although I wouldn't be surprised the way OU did their best to run up the score last night), but you have to acknowledge that even OU's scrubs are likely going to be better than any defense we're going to see this side of Arkansas for the rest of the year.

What muddied the water for me was the pick-6 and the safety. One way of looking at it was that Vizza was responsible for 10 points for his team and 9 points for the other guys.

However, I was at the concession stand for the Meager pick to start the 3rd quarter. That kinda shifted the bottom line to me. My previous line of thinking was that Meager didn't do much to help, but not much to hurt either. With that interception, the net effect of his play shifted just under Vizza, who threw a touchdown and orcestrated a FG drive, but also was picked off twice, once for a touchdown, and was sacked for a safety. If you are going to be the guy who doesn't hurt your team, then fine. But if you're going to throw picks, you better be the guy who puts it in the end zone.

If you want to say Vizza's the next coming, you might very well be right. But remember that the most popular guy on the team is always the backup quarterback. I know it is an unpopular standpoint on Sunday morning, but let's not call for the QBs head just yet. Give him more than one game against a ridiculously talented defense before you make up your mind.

TIgreen01 · September 2, 2007

My initial point that I was going to make when I came on here this morning was to not just be in love with what the QB puts on the scoreboard for his team. I'd also be concerned with what he puts on the scoreboard for the other team.
In terms of raw number of made plays, Vizza pretty much took the cake last night. I'm not sure if it was really against the first team defense, as Emmitt told me on the bus (although I wouldn't be surprised the way OU did their best to run up the score last night), but you have to acknowledge that even OU's scrubs are likely going to be better than any defense we're going to see this side of Arkansas for the rest of the year.
What muddied the water for me was the pick-6 and the safety. One way of looking at it was that Vizza was responsible for 10 points for his team and 9 points for the other guys.
However, I was at the concession stand for the Meager pick to start the 3rd quarter. That kinda shifted the bottom line to me. My previous line of thinking was that Meager didn't do much to help, but not much to hurt either. With that interception, the net effect of his play shifted just under Vizza, who threw a touchdown and orcestrated a FG drive, but also was picked off twice, once for a touchdown, and was sacked for a safety. If you are going to be the guy who doesn't hurt your team, then fine. But if you're going to throw picks, you better be the guy who puts it in the end zone.
If you want to say Vizza's the next coming, you might very well be right. But remember that the most popular guy on the team is always the backup quarterback. I know it is an unpopular standpoint on Sunday morning, but let's not call for the QBs head just yet. Give him more than one game against a ridiculously talented defense before you make up your mind.

Nope. Meager will probably get the starts for the next couple of games, but he won't be winning any games with the super-conservative way he runs the offense. Vizza came in and RAN the Dodge spread. He threw the ball down the field and ran with authority when called for. Meager went through all the reads but he never threw it deep. I would be curious to hear what Dodge thought of that as well....I also thought that Vizza seemed to be quicker with his decision making--which helped the Oline out....you're not supposed to sit in the pocket forever in the Dodge spread. Either way, I think Vizza is your starter by October.

Edited September 3, 2007 by TIgreen01

the green rokemi · September 2, 2007

Nope. Meager will probably get the starts for the next couple of games, but he won't be winning any games with the super-conservative way he runs the offense. Vizza came in and RAN the Dodge spread. He threw the ball down the field and ran with authority when called for. Meager went through all the reads but he never threw it deep. I would be curious to hear what Dodge thought of that as well....I also thought that Vizza seemed to be quicker with his decision making--which helped the Oline out....you're not supposed to sit in the pocket in the Dodge spread. Either way, I think Vizza is your starter by October.

Yep, couldn't agree more. Plus I will take my lumps if it is a true freshman like Vizza. I am tired of seeing Mayday play like Mayday...

emmitt01 · September 2, 2007

All I hope is that we don't see a repeat of what we saw against Texas Tech the last time we played at Texas Stadium. Those of you who were there will know what I'm talking about. Dickey started Richard Bridges when we all knew Scott Hall should get the PT (Dickey cited some never disclosed team rule violation or some such). Tech begins to throttle us so Dickey finally puts Scott Hall out there. What happens? Scott leads the team and we begin to make the game look competitive. But, alas, too little too late.

LittleMeanGreenMan · September 2, 2007

Are most of you blind? Did you not see how BAD Meager was yesterday? Were we all watching the same game? He averaged like 4 yards a completion. Do you know why that is? Because he is not capable of throwing the ball down field. Yes...NOT CAPABLE. He has a weak arm, he won't stay in the pocket, and he throws behind the recievers on half the throws he makes.

On the other hand, Vizza stays in the pocket, he is capable of making a big play because of his arm, and he made some quality throws yesterday. Yeah, he threw a couple of dumb picks, but when you get thrown into a game down by 8 TD's, you kinda are forced to make something happen. Also, because he stays in the pocket, he got a roughing the QB on his first drive, one sign of pressure and Meager's first reaction was to tuck and scramble, and then be forced to make some terrible throw.

I think the talent level between these two guys should not even be in question. Meager is starting only becasue he is older. That is it.

In my opinion, it doesn't matter if Meager is throwing against the #1 secondary in the country, or the #100 secondary in the country, he just doesn't have the tools to get it done.

GoMeanGreen1999 · September 2, 2007

In my opinion, it doesn't matter if Meager is throwing against the #1 secondary in the country, or the #100 secondary in the country, he just doesn't have the tools to get it done.

Those are my thoughts to a T, but what do I know.

Dodge2007 · September 2, 2007

I like Meager but you must admit that at 18 yrs. old and a true frosh, not too many kids can show that kind of "game" and composure. He looked like a play maker. I like what Casey had to say about him "he competed, he showed the will and made plays." You can tell by his running style that he is a freakin cimpetitor. I must admit also that he made quicker reads than Daniel. Vizza will learn from those linebacker int's. They were dropping seven on a lot of plays and Vizza lost the LB. Those are freshman mistakes, just ask Matt Stafford he threw 8 td and 16 picks as a true freshman.

TD is going with Meager as long as possible to spoon feed Giovanni along. Talent, heart, and playmaking abilities you go with Vizza but Daniel will get his chance to tear up SMU.

Let's give DM his chance and then we'll see what TD does with Vizza.

JayDub · September 2, 2007

I finally got the stomach to watch the recording of the game...

I think now is the time for Vizza. Time for new blood altogether...

DeepGreen · September 2, 2007

Vizza was fun to watch. Sure he threw two picks, but from my vantage point one of the picks was due to crappy blocking by the line. Meager played like Meager. Sorry guys.

MeanGreengdub · September 2, 2007

No way. I thought Meager looked pretty good considering we played OU. From what I've seen in him the past few years, last night he did a great job. He had good pocket presence and didn't get in a hurry. Vizza is good, don't get me wrong but I think it's too early to try and count Meager out. TD knows football and TD especially knows QB's. I trust his decision and think after one game, against OU, we can't be calling for TD to put in Vizza.

Censored by Laurie · September 3, 2007

Meager is starting only becasue he is older. That is it.

BINGO...and that frusterates me about Papa Todd.

Vizza was fun to watch. Sure he threw two picks, but from my vantage point one of the picks was due to crappy blocking by the line. Meager played like Meager. Sorry guys.

Seen it for two years...something about a leopard and spots...I can't take two more years of panic

No way. I thought Meager looked pretty good considering we played OU. From what I've seen in him the past few years, last night he did a great job. He had good pocket presence and didn't get in a hurry. Vizza is good, don't get me wrong but I think it's too early to try and count Meager out. TD knows football and TD especially knows QB's. I trust his decision and think after one game, against OU, we can't be calling for TD to put in Vizza.

I'm sorry...were you watching the same game? Meager played scared...plain and simple. If you want to make a "considering OU" excuse...make it for the Offensive Line, I thought they played well, considering they played OU...and considering Danny Meager was not quick with the ball and rolled out 17 different times instead of staying in the pocket and making a throw...like Gio did and for the majority of the time, against first team OU defense (take a look at who Casey Fitzgerald beat on the touchdown...DJ Wolfe...thats first team.)

Gio wasn't perfect...but he made confident throws, he ran with authority, and he hung in the pocket. As I told Green Lantern during the game...I wouldn't have cared if Giovanni came in and played the exact same way as Danny Meager...I would've been happy because it would've been a different name and a different number...I've seen too much of a Meager led offense.

Gio is both our future at QB...and the player who gives us the best chance to beat SMU...there is no feasible logic that I can think of that should make Papa Todd start Daniel Meager again.

UNTBill · September 3, 2007

No way. I thought Meager looked pretty good considering we played OU. From what I've seen in him the past few years, last night he did a great job. He had good pocket presence and didn't get in a hurry. Vizza is good, don't get me wrong but I think it's too early to try and count Meager out. TD knows football and TD especially knows QB's. I trust his decision and think after one game, against OU, we can't be calling for TD to put in Vizza.

From reading this thread it seems that yours is not a popular opinion. Hovever, I completely agree with you.

GMG Beat SMU

FirefightnRick · September 3, 2007

I felt DM looked very comfortable in the pocket and looked much better than in the past as I expected he would. The delay handoff to Jamario in the first quarter faked the LB pretty good. That showed a lot of maturity and experience. On other ocassions he had some completions on some nice throws, he also had some drops when the ball was delivered on the money and other times he threw the ball away when there wasn't anyone to throw to which again showed me why he's starting. His worst play was the overthrow to Stickler in the endzone. If he makes that throw and drew us within 21-7, this thread wouldn't even exist.

Passing

Meager,Daniel 27-15-1 108 0 15 5

Vizza,Giovanni 11-4-2 124 1 69 1

Rushing

Meager,Daniel 10 29 48 -19 0 16 -1.9

Vizza,Giovanni 7 17 10 7 0 9 1.0

Rick

football fan · September 3, 2007

Did anyone else notice that Nathan Tune finished the game, not mentioned in any of the newspaper articles. Since he did not throw a pass he had no stats.

Yes. He was not announced upon his entrance into the game. Too late, it did not matter. He ran three running plays to run clock out. He is still the unknown factor in the QB race.

NTPhiKap99 · September 3, 2007

Rushing
Meager,Daniel 10 29 48 -19 0 16 -1.9
Vizza,Giovanni 7 17 10 7 0 9 1.0

Ok your stats are confusing me but I with your point.

NT80 · September 3, 2007

Vizza reminds me of Scott Hall.

Edited September 3, 2007 by NT80

GrandGreen · September 3, 2007

I want NT to start the best QB for the program. Meager, Vizza or anyone else Dodge comes up with. There are many that interpret the game play to fit their own preconceived notions. There is no way in hell for anyone that watched the game on tv to be able to effectively rate the QB's and I doubt if many who attended the game could see any better. Was there an open receiver that could have been picked up by the QB with the time he had to pass?

This is what I saw with only a tv view. Meager didn't make many major mistakes and I thought considering the competition had one of his better games. Meager played against the OU first team, Vizza did not. Vizza had two interceptions and was caught for a safety. His TD pass was under thrown and Fitzgerald make a great play to come back for the ball. I am not down on Vizza at all and he very well maybe the starting Qb soon, but to make the case that he out played Meager in this game is a real stretch. If the stats were reversed and Meager had the two interceptions and the safety there would be no end to the howling for a QB change.

Based on one game and I use the term lightly, there are a lot more problems at NT than the QB decision. I though Meager played OK, he didn't make many major errors but didn't come up with any big plays either. Vizza played with enthusiasm, showed good athleticism but make the mistakes that almost any freshman is going to make in his first game against an overwhelming superior team.

Edited September 3, 2007 by GrandGreen

El Paso Eagle · September 3, 2007

Vizza reminds me of Scott Hall.

When Hall was in the game it was easy to believe that something good could happen on any play. With GV I get that same feeling, but not with DM.

Dodge2007 · September 3, 2007

You can twist and turn the QB situation anyway you want. I taped the game and watched it over and over.

For example, Meager had one pick but had one pick dropped that would have been an easy return for a touchdown on a stop route. If Meager would have stepped up in the pocket on several occasions-----open receivers in crossing routes were available. On the positive side, he threaded the needle on several throws on out routes, if those throws were not perfect, they would have been picked.

He had several balls dropped in his defense. Threw the ball away on a couple of plays that warranted it.

Vizza, he threw his first pick and was hit as he threw and never got anything on the ball, probably should have taken a sack or thrown it away earlier. 2nd pick was text book int by the LB coming under the curl route, freshman mistake, he NEVER saw the LB. He also had some drops and if you go back and look at the film he wasn't playing against the scrubs, it was the first team Db's all the way.

So if all things are equal which they are not (true freshman in first game vs. a veteran) what do we have now?

Meager will get the start, that is an easy choice by Dodge. He is going to give Meager every opportunity to show his capabilities. We burned Vizza's shirt so if Dodge does not keep developing the freshman in games then I believe that will be a mistake. He must prove out Meager but keep Vizza's development going forward. Is that valid?

Now come the intangibles, Vizza for a true freshman has unbelievable poise and toughness. I can see why his teamates rally around a kid who tries to run over an OU linebacker and gets killed but gets up quick (and on TV he is smiling) and continues to run the ball like a Full back on his next carries.

I think Dodge is trying to prove out Meager and I am all for that. Meager deserves his chance in this system. I just hope Dodge finds a way to keep Vizza on the field some because he needs to make his mistakes early on and then get ready for conference play.

You cannot compare Meager to Vizza, your talking about apples and oranges. Let's rally behind them both and see what happens.

Edited September 3, 2007 by Dodge2007

adman · September 3, 2007

We burned Vizza's shirt so if Dodge does not keep developing me in games then I believe that will be a mistake.

Freudian slip?

Dodge2007 · September 3, 2007

My bad, i need to proof read my own BS.

Dodge2007 · September 3, 2007

Forgot to add that Meager was a completely different player under Dodge's watch.

I just wish he would have tried to make some more plays and wished he would stay and step up in the pocket. I think Vizza is the best thing that happened to Daniel. The competition and the coaching have made Daniel a better player than ever before.

I thought DM would really do well in this system. The next 2 or 3 games will tell us a lot.

houstonmeangreen · September 3, 2007

Both QB's played well. Time will tell who should be the starter for the long haul. Vizza is inspiring, just needs to make better decisions (ie interceptions). However, I see big time quarterbacking in both of these guys in just a short time. Both have great arms....impressed.