Dodge Pissed In Some Wheaties

[GreenBat]

Instead of worrying about practices, if you want a real story......Do your research about what the university did to go let Dodge break the UNT's commitment to players by taking away their fifth year of education. When players accept a scholarship to play for the university they are commiting, not only to the coach, but to the university. The university should back those players. Dodge has released many of our players that have played with us for four years. Those players were promised five years of education. They were fast tracked through the program to complete their bachelors degree in four years and promised a fifth to recieve their masters. Leaving them to foot the bill for the education they were promised. Some of these players, had they been able to get their medical redshirt, would still be playing and finishing out their fifth year. (i.e Willie, Zach, etc.)Many players fell through the cracks because coaches changed and UNT did nothing to make sure the education end of the deal was upheld.

Posted by: anonymous | August 16, 2007 10:42 AM

[Arkstfan]

I'm too lazy to look it up but off-hand I think if a player completes all of his playing eligibility they can only receive institutional aid based on:

1. Financial need the same as other students.

2. Academic merit the same as other students.

3. A degree COMPLETION program for student athletes which I don't think is available to a student-athlete who has completed his/her undergraduate degree.

If my memory is correct, then there isn't any NCAA sanctioned way for UNT to pay for a former athlete's college expenses for a post-graduate degree when there is no playing eligibility left.

[emmitt01]

Last I checked a scholarship was for a student-athlete to have his/her degree paid for while playing a sport.

Played sport- Check

Received Bachelor's on NT's dime- Check

Problem is where?

[eagle37]

Yes, that is bogus, but you have to understand that this is not just a sport it is a business as well. The university will support whatever athlete that is under scholarship until their time has come and then they are on their own.

If I am correct, I believe that scholarships are not 5 year commitments anymore, they are year by year. Coaches have the right to evaluate each player on scholarship at the end of every year to justify whether they have the motivation in not just athletics but academics as well to continue to represent the university as well as the team.

Its a hard lesson to learn, but I believe the guys are mature enough to understand.

[GMoney]

The ability to pay the 5th year is not a decision that is made by the football coach. The money would come from private donations and at the descretion of the athletic department. If the player has used his eligibility the TD did not let them go. They were already gone and the decision to pay for a 5th year would be based upon available dollars and the AD, not TD.

[UNTflyer]

BOO-FREAKIN'-HOO!

I'm a senior at NT and got a transfer scholarship. Once I finished that first year, the money dried up and I got no further scholarships despite maintaining a 3.67 average (while working full-time!).

I'm paying for my education and still have another 2 1/2 years to finish my Master's. And no offense, but I will probably contribute more to the U.S. economy than most UNT football players. And on top of that, I'll be contributing to scholarships for future working adults in order to give back to my school... not whine about how I didn't get my Master's for free.

Sorry... not sympathy here!

[GreenTiger_OriginalAcct]

I believe I am correct in stating that athletic scholarships cannot be distributed to players that have no remaining eligibility past the current school year, i.e. fall sports player can still receive funds in the spring, but not the next fall if they would have no eligibility remaining. A redshirt year and four years of play would provide 5 years of scholarship support. I am searching my NCAA compliance book at the moment for the exact rule and wording...

I may be thinking of something else however.

[NCMeanGreen]

BOO-FREAKIN'-HOO!

I'm a senior at NT and got a transfer scholarship. Once I finished that first year, the money dried up and I got no further scholarships despite maintaining a 3.67 average (while working full-time!).

I'm paying for my education and still have another 2 1/2 years to finish my Master's. And no offense, but I will probably contribute more to the U.S. economy than most UNT football players. And on top of that, I'll be contributing to scholarships for future working adults in order to give back to my school... not whine about how I didn't get my Master's for free.

Sorry... not sympathy here!

Enjoy it now...wait until you have a real job, a mortgage, and some kids. Same with the UNT football players, playing football and going to college is a PIECE OF CAKE compared to that!

Edited August 16, 2007 by NCMeanGreen

[UNTflyer]

Enjoy it now...wait until you have a real job, a mortgage, and some kids. Same with the UNT football players, playing football and going to college is a PIECE OF CAKE compared to that!

I got two out of three... the real job and mortgage. I went back to school after riding the Dot-Com wave, and I'm currently an IT manager.

But I do get married the day after graduation, so maybe kids aren't far away!

[SCREAMING EAGLE-66]

The world is about to end.... must be... Flyer asnd I agree on something..

Some people work at McDonalds and get through college... some people work on the athletic field.. Once you don't go to McDonalds anymore .. they don't pay you... same with athletics. At least at athletics you got a lot of attention from others and that can help you in the future... At McDonalds.. the public just says.. WHO??

Enjoy it and benefit from the scholorship while it lasts... when it is over it is over... hope you got an education or at least most if not all of a degree for when your playing days are over. All good things end. Hope another good thing can start then.. and it problably will if you learned anything.

I am not very young and have seen a lot including a few athletes who felt the world owed them because of what they did for a few years in college. They need to forget about it and get busy and get on with life.

----------------

For some getting through college is tougher than the life they face afterward with a mortgage and kids..... it was for my wife.. who lost her father as a result of WWII.

Edited August 16, 2007 by SCREAMING EAGLE-66

[Guest GrayEagleOne]

I can see some disparity in this scholarship funding. A player who redshirts and then plays the following four years has all five years paid as I understand it. One who plays as a true freshman and the three remaining years does not get the fifth year paid. Am I correct? Now, if the one that redshirted is smart enough to get his degree in four years, his fifth year would be in graduate school since he could no longer play without being enrolled. The one who played as a freshman and also finished in four years would not receive a fifth year; hence no grad school.

The fair and equitable way as I see it would be to pay for all five years. That would mean that the money for the fifth year would have to come from the MGC, a corporate sponsor or some special funding. Perhaps a separate foundation could be established for this purpose.

Otherwise, who would want to play as a true freshman, knowing that his scholarship might run out before he finished his education?

[Arkstfan]

I believe I am correct in stating that athletic scholarships cannot be distributed to players that have no remaining eligibility past the current school year, i.e. fall sports player can still receive funds in the spring, but not the next fall if they would have no eligibility remaining. A redshirt year and four years of play would provide 5 years of scholarship support. I am searching my NCAA compliance book at the moment for the exact rule and wording...

I may be thinking of something else however.

Green Tiger I think what you will find is that if a player has exhausted eligibility but hasn't completed a degree that the school can give them aid for one or two years to complete the undergrad degree.

[ntsumck]

You only get a 5th year if you redshirted anytime during your first four years. Whoever posted that does not know what they are talking about. You cannot receive money once your eligibilty is over.

[Cr1028]

Otherwise, who would want to play as a true freshman, knowing that his scholarship might run out before he finished his education?

People like Calivin Johnson, Jamarcus Russell, Adrian Peterson, Darren McFadden....shall I go on?

[centex eagle]

My daughter got a semester of aid in the fall to finish her degree when her fourth year was up. She coaches now and had a player playing for her that got 5th year aid last year and will have one get it this year. Each case involved working in the athletic department part-time. Graduation rates are important now. I realize grad school means different questions for the department to answer. Each athlete IS on a one year scholarship. With so much coaching turnover in colleges today, there are lots of players told to go away and those that fall through the cracks with no one there to know what a previous coaching staff PROMISED the player. Do not know what the correct way to handle all the situations that come up is. I do know they pay a great price physically and mentally whether male or female while competing.

[flyeater]

Some of these players, had they been able to get their medical redshirt, would still be playing and finishing out their fifth year. (i.e Willie, Zach, etc.)Many players fell through the cracks because coaches changed and UNT did nothing to make sure the education end of the deal was upheld.

Posted by: anonymous | August 16, 2007 10:42 AM

This is goofy. If he's talking about Willie Ransom, then he's talking about a guy who was a senior in 2006. His eligibility had ended. I'm assuming Muzzy is the Zach he's referring to, and the NCAA denied ZM a waiver request to grant a fifth year of eligibility based on losing most of a season to injury a few years ago. Muzzy's situation had nothing to do with what is alleged here. Dodge actually did everything he could on Muzzy's behalf, but NCAA said no.

Edited August 17, 2007 by flyeater

[GreenGramma]

With so much coaching turnover in colleges today, there are lots of players told to go away and those that fall through the cracks with no one there to know what a previous coaching staff PROMISED the player

Good point. New questions.

Do players sign to play for the coach or the university?

Who should be responsible for academic promises made to athletes.....the coach or the university?

[SCREAMING EAGLE-66]

---To me when the schloarship runs out.. it runs out.... Then they get to pay for their education like the rest of us do.... and in most of our cases by working and/or parental help.

---Being an athlete is hard work... so is working at McDonalds or where-ever for minimum wage at often bad hours. A lot of kids put theirselves through college by working..... and can't take full loads just as some athletes find difficult to do as well.. I have a great deal of respect for both groups. Too bad a few of the athletic group thinks the world owes them... the McDonald group never does.

--Changing coaches is a risk to the student-athlete.... just as after college when your company changes management or is brought out. Life can be tough and sometimes doesn't seem fair.

Edited August 17, 2007 by SCREAMING EAGLE-66

[GreenBat]

Good point. New questions.

Do players sign to play for the coach or the university?

Who should be responsible for academic promises made to athletes.....the coach or the university?

Some sign to play for a certain coach, others sign because they like the school. Ultimately they represent the University, so I guess the University.

The only academic promise that should be made is that you can major in X and you will get a quality education paid for while you are eligible to play. Anything else is on the coach and should come out of his pocket.

I'm tired of NT paying for kids schooling for 2 years when they've got nothing out of them on the field (ex: TJ Raymond).

Edited August 17, 2007 by GreenBat