Fouts Field - Officials Argue For New Stadium

MeanGreen61 · July 29, 2007

Mean Green's Fouts Field

Officials argue case for new field

11:06 PM CDT on Saturday, July 28, 2007

By Brett Vito / Staff Writer

EDITOR’S NOTE: The following is the first of a three-part series on University of North Texas’ Fouts Field — its history, its current-day status and the possibility of it being replaced in the future. Today’s story focuses on why UNT officials and fans believe Fouts Field needs to be replaced.

From the window of his office in the Mean Green Athletic Center, Rick Villarreal can see the land where he hopes the crown jewel of his tenure at the University of North Texas will someday sit in the Mean Green Athletic Village.

The former University of Southern Mississippi official put a new football stadium in his long-term plans the moment he took over as the athletic director at UNT in 2001. After what has transpired over the last few months, those plans seem closer to reality.

Villarreal has overseen the completion of a few other facilities, which were included in the initial plans for his tenure at UNT and in November, accepted the largest donation in athletic department history. Those events were a prelude to what many believe will be the most important move of all in making a new stadium a reality — hiring former Southlake Carroll head coach Todd Dodge to take over the football program.

The former Mean Green passing game coordinator won four Class 5A state titles in five years using a wide-open spread offense at Carroll before taking over at UNT in December. Since hiring their new coach, UNT officials have been far more open about their desire to replace Fouts Field — a facility built in 1952 — with a 30,000-seat stadium that could be expanded in the future.

“A stadium has always been a part of our master plan,” Villarreal said. “It was phase two or three of the process. If you look around today, most of the first two phases are complete, which has allowed us in the last six months to turn our attention to building a new stadium.”

Villarreal and UNT president Gretchen Bataille both have stated publicly that the school is raising money for a new football stadium and that the early stages of a capital campaign are underway.

The challenge now for UNT is determining how it can raise the money to complete what would be the biggest — not to mention most expensive — project in athletic department history. Villarreal estimated the facility UNT wants to build to replace Fouts would cost about $52 million.

Both Villarreal and Bataille said the university has yet to commit to a timetable for breaking ground on a new facility.

Villarreal raised $12.3 million in the first five years of his six-year tenure at UNT and set the high-water mark for fundraising in athletic department history in November, when local businessman Al Goldfield and his wife, Shirley, gave $1.5 million to develop a plan for a new stadium.

UNT is in the process of determining if officials can quickly raise the money it needs to make a new stadium a reality through selling the naming rights to various parts of the stadium, landing high-dollar donations and getting more from the average fan.

UNT provided a figure of $1.5 million in response to a Freedom of Information Act request asking for the amount of money pledged by UNT boosters and businesses for a new stadium but did not provide a sum set aside for a stadium by the university.

“There is a real desire to replace Fouts Field and it’s in the long-range plan,” Bataille said. “What we are doing now is assessing the possibility of undertaking the project.”

UNT’s most ardent supporters believe that a closer examination will show the school is in position to replace a facility that opened when Harry Truman was president, Rocky Marciano was the world heavy-weight boxing champion and Mr. Potato Head was a new brand of toy.

“Having Coach Dodge here increases my confidence that we can get a stadium built,” UNT fan and 1997 graduate Evan Dolezal said. “Everyone seems willing to follow him almost blindly. People showed up at the spring game who have not been there before, and we haven’t even played a game yet. I think that can translate into getting more donors.”

Why replace Fouts now?

Over the course of Fouts Field’s lifetime, UNT has increased the facility’s seating to 30,500, replaced the playing surface twice, installed a scoreboard with a replay screen and spruced up the venue countless times.

And yet, one fact remains the same: UNT officials believe they would be better off replacing Fouts Field than continuing to renovate it.

The original concrete stands on either side of the field seat a total of 20,000 and a track circles the field, putting fans farther away from the action.

“We all know that Fouts is outdated,” Villarreal said. “We are doing a lot of work this summer and will redo our restrooms and concourses, but the reality is that Fouts does not have the amenities that lend itself to being the kind of venue we would like to have for our fans.”

One common complaint about Fouts Field is that the stands are set so far back from the field that the fans do not feel as involved in the action as they do at other stadiums.

“It’s the absolutely the worst place I have been to see a game,” UNT fan Rick McKinney said. “I have been to places where I had an obstructed view, and I still could yell and cheer and feel like I am helping to give the players a home-field advantage.”

The facility also leaves a lot to be desired for UNT’s players and coaches, despite all the time and money the school has put into it. The locker rooms are small and cramped, and the stadium shows its age.

Texas and Texas A&M have been able to keep Darrell K. Royal-Texas Memorial Stadium and Kyle Field, which were built in 1924 and 1927, respectively, viable through extensive renovations. Even with the work that has been done at Fouts Field, there is little doubt that UNT is at a disadvantage when compared to the Texas teams it competes against for recruits and recognition.

Southern Methodist University built Gerald J. Ford Stadium in 2000, and high school stadiums that rival Fouts in terms of their amenities and atmosphere are also being built at a rapid rate. The Denton school district opened C.H. Collins Athletic Complex, a 12,000-seat facility that cost $21 million, before the 2004 season.

For programs like SMU, their home stadium can be a selling point in recruiting. UNT is in a situation where it must overcome playing in Fouts Field while trying to build for the future.

“Facilities are a recruiting tool; there is no other way to put it,” said Jeremy Crabtree, a recruiting analyst for Rivals.com. “When you go out and recruit against your peers like SMU, which has a nice stadium, it makes it tough. It’s not the only thing kids look at, but it is a factor. North Texas is talking a lot about what could be there in the future from talking with the players they have recruited. That is a big positive for them.”

Making it happen

Over the last few years, Villarreal has examined just about every possible way to finance building a new stadium and has come to one conclusion.

The project will take the involvement of more than just a few UNT fans. “The stadium is something everyone wants, but you have to make sure that it is something that everyone will support to offset the cost,” Villarreal said. “You have to do some studies and look at some issues before you commit to a project of this size. This is not something we can do on limited funds.”

UNT is examining a number of ways to raise funds, including selling the naming rights for the stadium. The fact the proposed stadium would sit on the juncture of the east and west branches of Interstate 35 could make the naming rights enticing enough to bring UNT several million dollars.

The university is also courting boosters who could give the large donations that could push the project forward more rapidly.

“We have the ability to get larger donations for a stadium than we have in the past,” Bataille said. “But we also want to keep the project in perspective in terms of the overall university and its needs.”

Last year T. Boone Pickens gave $165 million to the athletic department at Oklahoma State University, his alma mater. Gerald J. Ford gave SMU $20 million toward the construction of the stadium that bears his name in Dallas.

UNT is known more for its music and arts programs than its business college — the school that most often produces the biggest donors to universities’ athletic departments. The lack of high-dollar donors is just one of a few obstacles for UNT. The universities’ efforts could also be hurt by an inconsistent athletic history that includes some lost years along with a few great moments.

NFL legend “Mean” Joe Greene played for the Mean Green in the 1960s, Hall of Fame coach Hayden Fry stalked the sideline at UNT in the mid-1970s and former head football coach Darrell Dickey led UNT to four consecutive Sun Belt Conference titles from 2001-04.

Those good times were spread around a stay in Division I-AA from 1983-94 and several long stretches of consecutive losing seasons. UNT lost entire generations of potential fans during seasons when Mean Green football was viewed as a second-tier program.

The school also won’t be able to use taxpayer money to build a stadium like some Texas high schools have during the past few years.

All the money UNT needs will have to come from corporate partnerships, naming rights deals and a fundraising campaign that UNT will eventually push aggressively after a silent phase.

UNT officials believe the time for pushing a new stadium is drawing closer now that Dodge has arrived to drive interest in the program. Several UNT fans said they have faith that Villarreal’s vision will soon become a reality.

“North Texas will be able to do it,” fan Jeff Roeling said. “It might take a few years, but Rick has been able to put together packages in the past to get things done. I have faith that it will happen.”

BRETT VITO can be reached at 940-566-6870. His e-mail address is bvito@dentonrc.com.

TEXAS COLLEGE FOOTBALL STADIUMS

The following is a list of the venues for the 10 Division I-A college football teams in Texas, the teams that play in them and the year they were built.

Ford Field (SMU) — 2000

Sun Bowl (UTEP) — 1963

Fouts Field (UNT) — 1952

Floyd Casey Stadium (Baylor) — 1950

Rice Stadium (Rice) — 1950

Jones AT&T Stadium (Texas Tech) — 1947

Robertson Stadium (Houston) — 1941

Kyle Field (Texas A&M) — 1927

Amon Carter Stadium (TCU) —1929

Texas Memorial Stadium (Texas) — 1924

FOUTS FIELD UPGRADES

The following is a brief list of some of the major Fouts Field improvements.

1986 — A $2 million project was completed to replace the grass field with Astroturf and put an artificial surface on what was a cinder track.

1994 — A $1 million project to add 10,000 seats is completed, expanding the capacity of the field to 30,500.

2005 — UNT spends $665,000 to replace the Astroturf surface with a Sportexe turf that closely resembles grass.

NT80 · July 29, 2007

Nice article. I love Stadium Talk!

I do wonder why nobody seems to consider combining a dorm or academic building into the structure of a new stadium to use possible higher ed funding? At least we're now getting some public talking going about the "possibility" of a new stadium; no more behind walls gossip!

KingDL1 · July 29, 2007

“It’s the absolutely the worst place I have been to see a game,” UNT fan Rick McKinney said. “I have been to places where I had an obstructed view, and I still could yell and cheer and feel like I am helping to give the players a home-field advantage.”

Man, so who is this Rick guy anyway?

I will be interested to see the the two other pieces!

UNT_playmaker · July 29, 2007

Great quote Rick.....This is from a guy who has seen his fair share of college football stadiums

FirefightnRick · July 29, 2007

Great quote Rick.....This is from a guy who has seen his fair share of college football stadiums

Thank you.

33 1/2 yards between the two points: The front-row seat at the 50 yard line and the nearest point of the

playing surface.

I was suppose to send this picture King took for us to Brett but time got away from me. During our discussion I spoke of the distance and the angle of the sightlines fans deal with while attending games at Fouts, which IMO both combine to create the majority of the problems. Plus, the crown of the entire surface that starts below the railing walls and increases in height to the center point of the crown at midfield. Result? If sitting down front your eye level is at the middle of the backs of players standing on the sidelines. Thus your forced to move back up several rows in order to see over the players. Now your 40 to 50 yards away from the playing surface?

Rick

Green Mean · July 29, 2007

UNT’s most ardent supporters believe that a closer examination will show the school is in position to replace a facility that opened when Harry Truman was president, Rocky Marciano was the world heavy-weight boxing champion and Mr. Potato Head was a new brand of toy.

Hey now....what happen to that saying "old is gold"??

FirefightnRick · July 29, 2007

Look how far back the majority of the seat backs of season ticket holders are in this photo?

The few people who did attend this game that day, look how far back up they sat to see over the NMSU players? This

photo was taken from ground level, opposite side line and you can easily see how many rows are obstructed from view behind the NMSU players standing on the sideline.

2007 Spring game in which you could sit anywhere you wanted. Look how far back the majority of people chose to sit from the front railing?

Rick

UNT_playmaker · July 29, 2007

The worst are the end zone seats, especially the east side end zone seats.....

The track just seems to make an already bad situation worst.

Cooley · July 29, 2007

I'm ecstatic that this has finally been thrown out here for public consumption. We need money from all sources, plain and simple!!! When the President of the university & AD are unified in stating this to be a high priority, it can only help. Now, let just hope that many alums and deep pockets residents of all of North Texas (without UNT ties) step up and adopt UNT as their local school. Additionally, a major corporation or two step up and realize the marketing opportunities for their firm in terms of naming rights (in the ever growing Denton County).

Good football is great for the entire metroplex. Here's hoping that additional financial sources are identified as a result of this article. Great PR for our stadium needs.

Thanks Vito for the first of your 3 part series.

JayDub · July 29, 2007

“It’s the absolutely the worst place I have been to see a game,” UNT fan Rick McKinney said. “I have been to places where I had an obstructed view, and I still could yell and cheer and feel like I am helping to give the players a home-field advantage.”

“North Texas will be able to do it,” fan Jeff Roeling said. “It might take a few years, but Rick has been able to put together packages in the past to get things done. I have faith that it will happen.”

Ol' Vito finally figured it out and went straight to the source...the posters of GoMeanGreen.com...

July 29, 2007

Villarreal raised $12.3 million in the first five years of his six-year tenure at UNT and set the high-water mark for fundraising in athletic department history in November, when local businessman Al Goldfield and his wife, Shirley, gave $1.5 million to develop a plan for a new stadium.

Can someone explain this statement for me?

On the tour of the new Athletic Center it was stated that plans for a new stadium had been developed and that tose plans were in the Athletic Director's office. A video was produced supposedly to distribute to possible donors. That video showed the AC under construction at that time. To me, that video substantiates that we had some pretty elaborate plans two years ago. What has happened that we are seemingly starting over again?

PlummMeanGreen · July 29, 2007

Ol' Vito finally figured it out and went straight to the source...the posters of GoMeanGreen.com...

Why not, many of us know UNT's history moreso than many of those getting paid nice salaries to have already learned it in order for them to promote it successfully but even moreso............not repeat the negative aspects of our history.

This board is (most times) always a good source of the last 60 plus years of Mean Green athletics. Last time I got interviewed by a newspaper, though, (& not the DRC, either, although they got a few quotes from yours truly in the past); anyway, a football coach got fired (and a few of you know about that particular article, too). Last time I wrote a very pointed letter to a UNT president with cc's to each and every member of the UNT Board of Regents, another football coach got fired. No, I don't take full credit for either firings (who would ever want full credit for that kind of thing, anyway) and don't do that kind of thing for sport, I did my part of it (since others were writing letters, also) because I thought UNT could do better than what most of us have seen post-Hayden Fry's dramatic raising of the bar in Denton.

When any of us stop caring enough to to see our school improve and advance itself with what we feel would be the right personnel (and their actions over a period of time shows us if they're the right personnel), then thats when the UNT BOR's will start closing down a few programs (of which most of would probably like to hang on to some of them).

FWIW, it really doesn't matter to me who gets the job done at our alma mater just so it gets done &..............at a higher profile (especially for a school our size and, uh, potential). :rolleyes:

This 30,000 seat stadium idea rankles me almost as much as Lee Jackson's inability to secure for our school a, uh.......UNT Law School; BTW, the very thing that was supposed to have been what Bobby Ray hired him to do as chancellor of the UNT System.

Edited July 29, 2007 by PlummMeanGreen

rcade · July 29, 2007

I feel like UNT's going to baby-step its way towards a new stadium for years, hoping that our own T. Boone Pickens shows up someday to write a big check.

Does anyone know if there's ever been a concentrated effort by UNT fans to raise money for a stadium? If we could get 1,000 fans to give $1 a day to a stadium fund, we'd be $365,000 closer each year. That's not enough to build a $50 million facility like the one that UCF is opening this season in Orlando, of course, but it's better than sitting around hoping for somebody else to make this happen. And those fans could bang on the state lege and Board of Regents.

DeepGreen · July 29, 2007

Not a bad idea since that would equate to $4,380,000, plus interest or some other form of investment, over a 12 year period.

NT80 · July 29, 2007

Can someone explain this statement for me?
On the tour of the new Athletic Center it was stated that plans for a new stadium had been developed and that tose plans were in the Athletic Director's office. A video was produced supposedly to distribute to possible donors. That video showed the AC under construction at that time. To me, that video substantiates that we had some pretty elaborate plans two years ago. What has happened that we are seemingly starting over again?

Yes, and it was a nice virtual presentation; it just sorta vanished off the athletics site for some reason.

We also hired a donation marketing company last year and I think an asst AD just to work on the big donor/stadium issue. Perhaps these funds are to help pay for those expenses? Who knows? But I would like to be on the final stadium seating/design committee and give my two cents!

UNTflyer · July 29, 2007

I feel like UNT's going to baby-step its way towards a new stadium for years, hoping that our own T. Boone Pickens shows up someday to write a big check.
Does anyone know if there's ever been a concentrated effort by UNT fans to raise money for a stadium? If we could get 1,000 fans to give $1 a day to a stadium fund, we'd be $365,000 closer each year. That's not enough to build a $50 million facility like the one that UCF is opening this season in Orlando, of course, but it's better than sitting around hoping for somebody else to make this happen. And those fans could bang on the state lege and Board of Regents.

Apparently there is no need for this... a capital project managed by the AD will be more efficient.

rcade · July 29, 2007

Apparently there is no need for this... a capital project managed by the AD will be more efficient.

The donation page for UNT athletics "Victory Capital campaign" encourages a donation for capital improvements to athletics, but it seems to me like they're going for everything -- soccer stadium, baseball stadium, etc. -- rather than focusing on a new football stadium. I wish their plan was to focus on a stadium for football in the expectation that it will help everything else get funded. UCF season tickets jumped from 9,000 to 20,000 for the upcoming season. How much better would UNT athletic fundraising be if the fan base doubled in one year?

http://www.nmnathletics.com/ViewArticle.db...mp;ATCLID=67033

Edited July 29, 2007 by rcade

DallasGreen · July 29, 2007

The donation page for UNT athletics "Victory Capital campaign" encourages a donation for capital improvements to athletics, but it seems to me like they're going for everything -- soccer stadium, baseball stadium, etc. -- rather than focusing on a new football stadium. I wish their plan was to focus on a stadium for football in the expectation that it will help everything else get funded. UCF season tickets jumped from 9,000 to 20,000 for the upcoming season. How much better would UNT athletic fundraising be if the fan base doubled in one year?
http://www.nmnathletics.com/ViewArticle.db...mp;ATCLID=67033

There is a mechanism now to designate this money through Development. I have used it for the last four years to channel my President's Council donation directly into the stadium fund. You just designate your $$ to go to athletic dept. facilities " Soaring to Victory" capital campaign stadium fund project. T.J. Leon contacted me from athletics just to confirm that the money was put where I had directed. Mean Green Club moneys go to supplement day to day operations and some extras but mostly fund scholarships. If you truly want our football program to operate on its own, push to get fully endowed scholarships for the players. The Zeke Martin fund is one of the first to strive toward this goal. Others can follow to honor other FB and BB greats at North Texas. This type thing is something the normal, working fans can do by banding together, and it will free up $$ previously allocated to scholarships to be used for special projects. None of us can give a million $, but we can suggest plans for approaching those that can give such sums. Coach Blakeley coached Ray Hunt's son at St. Marks, Mrs. Lamar Hunt is a former president of the alumni association. When Lamar Hunt first founded the AFL and brought pro football to Dallas with his Dallas Texans ( K.C. Chiefs) his first superstar was Abner Haynes who carried the franchise for several years. You can't tell me this can't be parlayed into some type of memorial for Lamar that the entire Hunt family would support. Yes I know SMU is the big Hunt benefactor, but look at Bob Dedman. He has buildings named after him at SMU, but his own street at UT. Wealthy families can support more than one institution. You just have to think outside the box as to what benefits, many of which are self agrandizing, that these people get from having their loved one memorialized in perpetuity and pull those strings. Development did a recent survey that of the top fortune 500 companies there are more than 300 highly placed executives that are UNT grads. They also surveyed the giving capacity of the 180K names of alumni they had and as I recall it translates into in the neighborhood of $9 BILLION. This is not to say NT would get all of that but just 1% could have a profound effect on the university.

Edited July 29, 2007 by DallasGreen

NT91 · July 29, 2007

By chance, were those the pants UNT sported during TD's first stint at North Texas? Seems like the timeline is pretty close if I remember correctly.

The donation page for UNT athletics "Victory Capital campaign" encourages a donation for capital improvements to athletics, but it seems to me like they're going for everything -- soccer stadium, baseball stadium, etc. -- rather than focusing on a new football stadium. I wish their plan was to focus on a stadium for football in the expectation that it will help everything else get funded. UCF season tickets jumped from 9,000 to 20,000 for the upcoming season. How much better would UNT athletic fundraising be if the fan base doubled in one year?
http://www.nmnathletics.com/ViewArticle.db...mp;ATCLID=67033

If you mark your money to go to the stadium fund it should go toward that goal.

rcade · July 29, 2007

If you mark your money to go to the stadium fund it should go toward that goal.

Anyone know if UNT has released the figures for how much is currently in the fund or how many people have contributed to it? There's a public component to stadium fundraising that encourages people to join the effort, and I'm not seeing it. (Doesn't mean it's not there, but I'm an interested alum and new Mean Green Club booster, so I'm in a decent position to get the info.)

UNTflyer · July 29, 2007

Anyone know if UNT has released the figures for how much is currently in the fund or how many people have contributed to it? There's a public component to stadium fundraising that encourages people to join the effort, and I'm not seeing it. (Doesn't mean it's not there, but I'm an interested alum and new Mean Green Club booster, so I'm in a decent position to get the info.)

It's in the article

UNT provided a figure of $1.5 million in response to a Freedom of Information Act request asking for the amount of money pledged by UNT boosters and businesses for a new stadium but did not provide a sum set aside for a stadium by the university.

Our big donation for the stadium was 1.5 mil, and we currently have.... 1.5 mil in the kitty.

:blink:

Edited July 29, 2007 by UNTflyer

H-towngreen · July 29, 2007

It would seem to me that this article here is the first step in bringing the stadium fundraising from the "silent" phase to the "public" phase.

PlummMeanGreen · July 29, 2007

It would seem to me that this article here is the first step in bringing the stadium fundraising from the "silent" phase to the "public" phase.

It really should do just that, H-towngreen. I think we have a Big Donor on the near horizon--just a gut feeling.

Newly revised signature below.

UNTflyer · July 29, 2007

This 30,000 seat stadium idea rankles me almost as much as Lee Jackson's inability to secure for our school a, uh.......UNT Law School; BTW, the very thing that was supposed to have been what Bobby Ray hired him to do as chancellor of the UNT System.

30,000 is ample for our needs. And it's not a set in stone number, it could be 31k or 32k. But we don't need a 45,000 seat stadium and we probably wouldn't get the financial support for one. Building a 2nd tier to accomodate those extra seats raises the costs significantly. Minnesota is looking at a 50,000 seat stadium and the estimated cost is in the neighborhood of $280 million. Utah tried to get a 45,000 seat stadium for under $50m and they couldn't get a contractor to bid that low. UCF's 45,000 seat stadium is running over budget and is now projected at $65m.

The fact is that a 30k seat expandable stadium meets our needs for now and the future, and I'll be happy with it.

UNTflyer · July 29, 2007

Additionally, a major corporation or two step up and realize the marketing opportunities for their firm in terms of naming rights (in the ever growing Denton County).

The following corporate execs are UNT alum:

Byron Baird, CEO of Mrs. Baird's Bakeries (now owned by Grupo Bimbo)
Rhys Best, president of Lone Star Steel Company
Mike R. Bowlin, chairman of ARCO
Frank D. Bracken, president of Haggar Company
Norm Miller, president of Interstate Batteries; co-founder of the Great Race
Linda Hefner Woltz, president/CEO of Sara Lee Hosiery
Wende Zomnir, founding partner and executive creative director of Urban Decay Cosmetics

Others who should be able to contribute significant donations:

Dr. Phil

Don Henley

Norah Jones

BTW... Interstate Batteries would be my target for stadium naming rights. They are based in Dallas and their branding is green.

"Interstate Battery Stadium"

Not bad.

Edited July 29, 2007 by UNTflyer