The Curse Of The Branding Committee Continues

stebo · July 28, 2007

So I got really excited when Rick initally posted the interlinked NT hat, I can't lie. I thought that maybe this was the "big announcement" that had been discussed on the board (even if it was pure speculation). I thought that MAYBE just MAYBE the Exes had come to their senses and allowed the athletic department the rights to printing their precious logo without Exes across the bottom and that "possibly" the logo might even end up on a new helmet someday. Of course, lots of things have happened since then and my hopes and dreams have been snubbed out. But the hat was just god awful ugly, it had that "Nascar" look to it with splashes of crap on it. When Emmitt posted the second one, I decided - what the hell. You only live once and they are "buy one, get the second one half off". I ordered both from the Lids website and had them delivered to the Lids next to my house free of charge. At this point, I had found out that these two interlocked NT hats had been accidentally approved completely (by mistake?) and that the Exes were EXTREMELY concerned about when they would get their millions in royalty checks.

To me, an organization with less then 300 members and zero administration should be worried about a lot more then a silly logo that they came up with for next to nothing. If they want, I will send them the 22 cents that they would normally get off of a logo rights check. I am sure that my 22 cents would really be able to straighten things out. Heck - I bought two, Rick bought two, and I think that Emmitt might have bought one, too - that is like almost a buck. With that much money they could probably totally change the face of the organization! Of course, the "we need our cut" BS was just the "initial" reaction - then when reasoned with - about how the royalty might be recognition of their alma mater... some Exes agreed that the "pay off" would be DFW citizens actually wearing the logo someday...But tha wasn't the REAL problem - the REAL problem was that they had been THREATENED by our new Chancellor to NEVER PRINT THAT DAMN LOGO or else they would be THROWN OUT of heir new little visitors center and not have a home for free! I think that is Horse SHIT. First of all, the Universty gets a lot more out of the agreement then the Exes do... the Exes have to staff the thing. There are empty rooms all over campus that the University would LOVE to fill up with free labor. The Exes provide the College with a great welcome center or welcome back center and it doesn't cost the University anything more then the air that would be pumped into there anyways. I think that is a VERY poor excuse for yet another cockamamey story about the poor Exes getting THROWN OUT of their building if they were to print any merchandise (SOOOOOOOOOOO dramatic, geez) with their own logo on it. To me - this was just too much BS for me to digest. But I still ordered the hats, regardless of them being ugly; because I knew that they would probably become collectors items as the Exes/school would never allow this to happen again. Both can blame the other and nothing can continue to get done. Granted, this is the only logo that the fans have ever somewhat agreed upon, let's throw all of that logic out the window - the Exes simply cannot allow the AD to print this logo... and even if they decided to, then they would be left homeless because Chancellor Lee has threatened to throw them out of their home if they cotinue to disregard the branding committee!!!

Which brings me back to that SHITTY ASS BRANDING COMMITTEE. Yes, they were filled with the greaest minds that North Texas could gather. Yes, they spent hundreds of thousands of dollars on identifying a color scheme and "logo" that would stick with North Texas for the next 50 years. Yes, they had very talented people on the staff for the process. But the more and more that I learn about the parameters that they were given - the more that I see why North Texas is where we are today. What a complete waste of money. To spend all of that money for those creative minds, only to handcuff them with the task of making a "font" just boggles the mind. The University did get a spirit mark out of it - the son of the worm - but the problem is, our AD doesn't want to use it. We are the Mean Green. If you start throwing Eagles up then people wll continue to mock us by doing the whole "Caw, Caw!" crap at games and try to call us the Mean Green Eagles (when it is not our name). Then you get down to what they did give us - Mean Green (in their font)... well, it isn't so "mean" in this ugly ass green. I realize that they wanted a universal green that everyone could print and wear; but this new green on this new hat looks like something right out of the discoteque that Hayden Fry used to hang out at. It is not a cool color. There is nothing cool about it. There is no way that we can market this green and get college kids (or alumni) to wear it. There is NOTHING mean about the green on my hats.

Chancellor Lee - you suck.

Branding Committee - your work sucks

Exes - you suck, grow a set of testicles.

RV - I feel for you and all the BS that you have to put up with at NT. I would be interviewing at every chance if I was handcuffed the way that you have been.

Ok - that is my rant for the year, 1990's style Stebo.

UNT_92_Fan · July 28, 2007

stebo...

i heart you

<3,

tunz

FirefightnRick · July 28, 2007

If I could hand you a Bacardi Coconut Rum Splash, I would.

Rick

UNTflyer · July 28, 2007

I guess I hadn't heard about this bruhaha...

Edited July 28, 2007 by UNTflyer

FirefightnRick · July 28, 2007

I guess I hadn't heard about this bruhaha...

Click Here.

Rick

meangreendork · July 28, 2007

Could our current stuff be better? Yes. Do I like the new font? No...heavens, no. Do I blame this on the creatives? Not as much as the admin. Frankly, I don't think some of the people there had any business in the committee. Had it been up to me, I would've asked for alumni from different decades for their input, different students, and NOT have the fiasco of the so-called "input surveys" they supposedly ran.

I love the new eagle. I really dig the new color. I can't stand that font...or the claw.

But seriously, let this go. I've seen the branding stuff that's for official use...that interlock ain't in there. All that's there is variations and combinations of what you've seen already.

FirefightnRick · July 28, 2007

that interlock ain't in there.

How many times are you going to post that? YOUR WRONG!!!!!!It is there. Why do you think the hat Stebo is posting about was produced? How did TOW get the image? It's there, in the licensed images, however, it's not allowed to be used without the word "Exes" under it. Any CLC licensee with North Texas can make that image, as long as it's approved, but the university won't allow it solely without the word, Exes on it, which is about as stupid as it comes.

Rick

NT80 · July 28, 2007

All we are talking about is using the initials "NT" for the school instead of UNT. There is precedence for dropping the "U" officially at NTSU/UNT. The NT Daily uses NT in all their articles, not UNT. Athletic letterjackets come with the letters "NT". We don't need the "U"....

http://www.library.unt.edu/rarebooks/newsl...orettes.tif.jpg

stebo · July 28, 2007

Dork, I get the feeling that you were either ON the branding committee OR know someone that was.... because I have never seen anybody else take up for this group of "image creators" like you always have. And you always say the same thing...

Is the look good? Nah...

Is the logo any good? Nah...

Do I like it? It's ok....

Did the committee do a heck of a job? ABSO-F-ING-LUTELY!

I mean come on man, they dropped the ball. It is time to scrap the crap that everyone hates. THREATEN TO KICK THE EXES OUT OF THEIR LITTLE HUT IF THEY DON"T GIVE UP THE LOGO - and move on. The shade needs to drop to a darker shade of Kelly because I think that these hats are glowing in the dark over there in the corner. That is how bright green that new toothpaste green is - it looks "glow in the dark"... Dork, I know that you are a Dork - thus, you have trouble telling what is cool and what sucks... but I am a 35 year old man and even I can tell you that color is only going to be used for safety cones, sno cone coloring, those glow sticks at Six Flags, and NORTH TEXAS F-ING GEAR. It sucks and we need to get it changed back damnit.

As for the hats with the interlocked NT - the guy at the store, along with the 7 or 8 guys standing around him all looked at the hats with me. They were like - that hat would pretty much be the best hat around without that gay ass green and grey. They kept asking me if the green had gone back to lime green, like in the 70's and early 80's. I will give you this, ONE person in the store liked it - but she was female. The hats do not say "MEAN GREEN" in spirit, color, or literally. Our University could have saved a TON of money and gotten MUCH better results by simply listening to the fans. The fans buy the merchandise, not the suits that run our Denton University from SOUTH DALLAS.

Edited July 28, 2007 by stebo

Evan · July 28, 2007

....the season can't get here soon enough.....sheesh

meangreendork · July 28, 2007

How many times are you going to post that? YOUR WRONG!!!!!!It is there. Why do you think the hat Stebo is posting about was produced? How did TOW get the image? It's there, in the licensed images, however, it's not allowed to be used without the word "Exes" under it. Any CLC licensee with North Texas can make that image, as long as it's approved, but the university won't allow it solely without the word, Exes on it, which is about as stupid as it comes.
Rick

Whoa, slow down everyone. It's not gonna result in the end of humanity here. Grab a sandwich, maybe a beer (and just ONE beer) and read on when you have everything:

UNT has a branding manual. It's more expansive than what you see about the spirit marks and such, this thing is a book unto itself. In that manual are the logos, marks and whatnot that are approved by the university for use in general university publications to REPRESENT (in caps so you see this) the university as a whole or its athletic department. The NT Exes mark isn't there in that listing. I've even asked about it, and I've been told to the amount of, "It's really for the Exes only as it's their mark."

In short: That means the NT Exes can use it, it IS licensed for the NT Exes and probably NT as a whole...but the admin doesn't want that mark used to represent the school. Don't ask me why, I don't know, they probably don't even know.

So, unless something big changes with the NT Exes and the UNT admin, don't expect to see that NT Exes mark replacing any current UNT marks. It can be changed, but you'll need to convince both sides that it's a good idea to add it to the UNT-representative branding. And with a school that won't even cough up rights to give EA our bloody fight song, I'm not expecting much. Personally, I don't think the interlock is the right thing since so many schools have it, so UNT should try to make itself standout from them, not be "just another big school". I'll try not to take Stebo's "dork" comment too seriously, here. Final word: I haven't seen it approved for use to represent all of UNT as it's something for the NT Exes only. This can change, but I don't expect it.

And yeah, of course I know people in the branding committee- they taught me and some other really great people some of what we know. They taught AustinTalon as well. Now as good as they are at design and teaching, they can't convince the rest of a committee to accept something the rest of the committee doesn't want. Basically, you can be a hell of a salesperson, but if I don't want a Burberry Plaid car, I don't want it. Just like you guys already have an idea of what our new branding should have looked like, just like I had an idea on what the branding should've looked like, the rest of that committee had the same thing. Odds are, they probably "didn't know what they wanted, but know what they didn't want". Final word: They're good at what they do, but like you and I are hindered or helped by the people we work with, so were they.

About my giving the new branding great reviews- I balked big time at the font when I saw it at first reveal. Just like a lot of users here, I thought the USPS eagle or SOW was pretty cool, and I still do. Just like I did at the first revealing, I still think that eagle claw is ugly. It doesn't match the style of everything else (sharp angles, etc), and it just seems really odd looking. About the only things they did right were the color and the eagle. That's two A's and maybe two D's. That means it's just okay. It's like a B or C average. I don't think I've ever said that it was all really great. As a matter of fact, I think I was in the same camp as those of you who wanted new stuff when it came out. Come to think, I remember doing mock-ups of an "NT" combination myself. It was a logo that looked a lot like the Virginia Tech logo. I though it looked really good, but I wasn't that behind it when I realized "hey, maybe this is something too close to what someone else already has".

In short: I don't think I've ever said that I love all of the new branding. I couldn't have said it when my NT logo was on a petition to get more possibilities put out, and when during the first major "vote on your logos" session, I said some really bad things about that font.

Final word: SOW: A, SOW Head: A, Font: D (some people actually like it for some reason), Claw: D (again, some people actually like it for some reason.) Total Grade: C

On the hats: I've seen them in person. They're not that light minty green. I've seen bad product photography take something brown and make it red. Odds are, the photo is too light or the lights are too bright in the room they took that photo in.

On the color of the kelly green on clothing: I'm actually with Stebo here, and I have been since I saw some of the giveaway shirts at a summer orientation session way back when. It is an awfully bright green. If the cloth vendors for the hats and clothing can find something maybe a few numbers darker, it'd still be a vivid green, but not something you can see in the dark. I'm betting the cause of this either a price or an actual dye problem...or because no one wants to go through the hassle.

I think I need a beer and the start of bloody football season. I'm with you here, Evan.

Edited July 28, 2007 by meangreendork

stebo · July 28, 2007

The ONLY reason I said dork is because your name is MeanGreenDork - you dork, lol. As for the hats - you may have seen them - But I have the two sitting in my house right in front of me right now. They are puke green. The way that they got "accidentally" made is simple - it is summertime. The hats from TOW were sent for approval and someone with a lazy eye (or possibly his own beliefs) ok'd them. They ARE in the marks that CLC and TOW has to choose from. The baseball team has the hat with the interlocked NT. The lettermans jackets were funded by a private person, not because of the lack of funds but because of the stupid interlocked NT that is on them. Time and time again, we all disagree - but for the most part, 90% of the fans would prefer the interlocked NT to spelling out the words. In fact, it is the ONLY logo that we all seem to like and would be proud to wear. I will wear these ugly hats most likely, just to prove a point. That the ugliest damn "mistake" hats in the world still look better then the other crap out there legitimately. By the way, I made some basic interlocked NT has on Cafe Press and they are my two favorite hats now. The guy at lids looked me right inthe eye and told me that if that logo was on a solid green hat, he would sell the hell out of them. They carried ZERO Mean Green hats at this Lids, I had to special order them. I looked through all of the other schools that they did have - the only longhorn hat that was not plain orange with the emblem on it was a camoflauge hat for their true redneck fans.

The thing is, the University that I work for - University of Phoenix... has done a better job marketing itself in the last 7 months then NT has in the last 70 years. That is sad.

UNT_playmaker · July 28, 2007

Man that is fraekin pathetic

JayDub · July 28, 2007

Stebo...I owe you a drink. Well put.

This toothpaste/minty/baby shit green makes me sick.

Edited July 28, 2007 by JayDub

NT91 · July 28, 2007

I juts purchased one of the NT hats as well.

Edited July 28, 2007 by NT91

GreenMachine · July 28, 2007

after all these years of existence and they still only have 300 members, why don't they just give it up, disband, and put more time and energy into the Mean Green Club or something else. If they still want to be an organization, tell Lee to f**k off and meet somewhere else then start pumping out the NT hats like crazy.

ntsumck · July 28, 2007

Like I have said many times before, the Exes copied the athletic department. They just added the star. The athletic department has used a form of the interlocking NT for at least 50 years. Just drop the star and go forward. However, if the Exes fight the athletic department on this one. I will never give them another dollar.

drex · July 28, 2007

Just two things amid the madness that you people are displaying. One, the membership of the Exes is around 5.000 and SECONDLY the athletic department HAS NEVER REQUESTED the use of the Exes logo for athletic department items, helmets, etc. Probably what needs to happen, since there is so much turmoil over this, is for a group of you people to present your views to Dr. Batille and to Rick Villareal. Batille was not here for the new 'branding' and might just agree with you all that the the interlocking NT needs to be used by the entire university.

stebo · July 28, 2007

Just two things amid the madness that you people are displaying. One, the membership of the Exes is around 5.000 and SECONDLY the athletic department HAS NEVER REQUESTED the use of the Exes logo for athletic department items, helmets, etc. Probably what needs to happen, since there is so much turmoil over this, is for a group of you people to present your views to Dr. Batille and to Rick Villareal. Batille was not here for the new 'branding' and might just agree with you all that the the interlocking NT needs to be used by the entire university.

There may be 5000 on the books but when I was asked to sit on the Tarrant Exes BOARD (without even being a member anymore), we discussed the membershp of the CHAPTERS - Denton, Dallas, etc... At the time, the University Rep said that there were approximately 300 people that were actually involved, showed up to meetings, served the Exes in some sort of capacity, etc.. There were never more then 10-12 people at our meetings even though we were trying very hard to get more people involved. The Dallas Chapter had gone awash during that time because the Exes had "absorbed" their burden of a large bank account. You see folks, the Dallas Exes had a pretty good thing going for about 2 years - then the Exes found out that that Dallas Exes were building up a nice sized bank account and decided that for the betterment of the entire organization, that money was best in the hands of the professionals in Denton - not the folks that had raised it and invested it wisely. At the time my buddy Adam was serving about 11 positions with this Dallas chapter, including President - because all of the other ACTIVE members had thrown their arms up in disgust and left. It was him and like 2 other people, all serving many positions. Sure, they wanted help, but they sure as heck didn't get it. Why? Because there are approximagely 300 ACTIVE members of the Exes. Drex is obviously one of them. My great friends (hopefully still after this tirade) Jim and Brad and Vickie are also some very involved alumni. But then you look at guys like Stephen West... once the poster boy for the Exes and now wanting nothing to do with them. The Exes need to be exposed. They also need to be completely overhauled. Hopefully that dude from San Jose State will know what to do - but how many active members could they possibly have?

So my wording was a bit off Drex... the Exes have about 300 active members (and that is being VERY generous). I have been to mixers/happy hours at the Denton, Dallas, and Fort Worth chapters and there were never more then 30 actual members in the event with the normal amount being about 12. They needed people on the board of the Tarrant Exes so bad that they had me appointed to a spot, even though I openly admitted that I was not a FAN of the Exes and that I had not renewed my Exes membership for several years. The organization is in terrible shape. And like I said before, the University that I work for holds events for our alumni all the time - this last week we held one for our ribbon cutting at the new Resource Center in Plano... we had about 200 on hand, all Exes and Students - coming to an event simply because an e-mail blast was sent out and a few hundred phone calls were made. Think about that - I mean REALLY think about that - The marketing at an online school from Arizona has proven to be more effective than our school that has been in Texas for a century. That is pathetic. Thow in all of the logo stuff and you understand why guys like me (who love to volunteer for pretty much anything) will not have anything to do with the Exes anymore.

Drex, I would like to hear your thoughts on the logo. I don't want to argue members with you. You know it and I know it. We have both sat through those meetings talking about it. Let's talk about the Exes and the interlocked NT. What was the First thing that you thought of when Rick posted that hat? Was it - "AWESOME! Now my school might get some of those interlocked NT logo people to get involved?" or was it - angry, that should not have happened, we didn't give them permission for that, we haven't discussed royalties for that logo yet, followed up by - OH, and they might throw us out on the streets because of this! I saw that you responded to the membership portion of the post but pushed all talk about logo BACK onto the University and now Gretchen Bataile. Do you have ANY opinions on this subject? Don't you see that if neither side is pro-active, nothing will ever get done? The Exes should be the ones fghting to get this logo adopted as a spirt mark. That is YOUR PURPOSE! What else is your purpose? That is it! You fight for the alumni. You have read it on this board and heard it from everyone - we want the interlocked NT to be at least INCLUDED in the long list of branding items. Now, the job of the Exes is to make that happen... not point fingers and talk about joint summits to get all parties together (that is a weak point of the organization,lol) - you guys - all 10 of you, whoever is running things right now - should be fighting for the alumni and our right to have a good spirit mark. But then again, how can you do that when you are worried about the $1.11 that you were screwed out of in royalties from the hat purchases by Steve, Rick, and Emmitt?

Edited July 28, 2007 by stebo

GoMeanGreen1999 · July 28, 2007

Which brings me back to that SHITTY ASS BRANDING COMMITTEE. Yes, they were filled with the greaest minds that North Texas could gather. Yes, they spent hundreds of thousands of dollars on identifying a color scheme and "logo" that would stick with North Texas for the next 50 years. Yes, they had very talented people on the staff for the process. But the more and more that I learn about the parameters that they were given - the more that I see why North Texas is where we are today. What a complete waste of money. To spend all of that money for those creative minds, only to handcuff them with the task of making a "font" just boggles the mind. The University did get a spirit mark out of it - the son of the worm - but the problem is, our AD doesn't want to use it. We are the Mean Green. If you start throwing Eagles up then people wll continue to mock us by doing the whole "Caw, Caw!" crap at games and try to call us the Mean Green Eagles (when it is not our name). Then you get down to what they did give us - Mean Green (in their font)... well, it isn't so "mean" in this ugly ass green. I realize that they wanted a universal green that everyone could print and wear; but this new green on this new hat looks like something right out of the discoteque that Hayden Fry used to hang out at. It is not a cool color. There is nothing cool about it. There is no way that we can market this green and get college kids (or alumni) to wear it. There is NOTHING mean about the green on my hats.

Very well put. Good job. This color of green is why I will not purchase any merchandise that doesn't have the "older" shade or "darker" shade of green. Currently Voertman's has been told by their supplier that if they sell any of the "older" color, they will not be allowed to sell ANY merchandise. They have one pullover shirt that they claim is a "darker kelley green" but I swear it is the older color they are just trying to sell them out - I will be buying one today, as this color is getting harder to find. The UNT Booksore in the Union somehow has managed to keep a significant amount of the "darker" shade color/merchandise in their store and as for North Texas Book & Supply, their manager told me they can't GIVE the new color away - that virtually no one wants to buy it.

CHANGE IT NOW ADMINISTRATION

"

chrisfisher · July 28, 2007

Very well put. Good job. This color of green is why I will not purchase any merchandise that doesn't have the "older" shade or "darker" shade of green. Currently Voertman's has been told by their supplier that if they sell any of the "older" color, they will not be allowed to sell ANY merchandise. They have one pullover shirt that they claim is a "darker kelley green" but I swear it is the older color they are just trying to sell them out - I will be buying one today, as this color is getting harder to find. The UNT Booksore in the Union somehow has managed to keep a significant amount of the "darker" shade color/merchandise in their store and as for North Texas Book & Supply, their manager told me they can't GIVE the new color away - that virtually no one wants to buy it.
CHANGE IT NOW ADMINISTRATION
"

weird...the North Texas Bookstore has been close for months...

Edited July 28, 2007 by chrisfisher

keith · July 28, 2007

Not really a fan of the Exes logo (with or without the word Exes) - seems like I'm in the minority. Maybe if you remove the star. It has too much going on for my eyes.

Keith

MGW · July 28, 2007

Chancellor Lee - you suck.
Branding Committee - your work sucks
Exes - you suck, grow a set of testicles.
RV - I feel for you and all the BS that you have to put up with at NT. I would be interviewing at every chance if I was handcuffed the way that you have been.
Ok - that is my rant for the year, 1990's style Stebo.

Welcome back to UNT football, Scottie! I'll buy you a beer before the SMU game.

Wait a minute...

Oh.

I mean Stebo.

In any event, I look forward to seeing you this upcoming season, brother!

Edited July 28, 2007 by MGW

DallasGreen · July 28, 2007

Welcome back to UNT football, Scottie! I'll buy you a beer before the SMU game.
Wait a minute...
Oh.
I mean Stebo.
In any event, I look forward to seeing you this upcoming season, brother!

Anyone can criticize, bitch, whine , and moan. It takes a bit more to work through the process and make something happen. BTW that's what I get from RV's message as well.

stebo · July 28, 2007

lol, I told you it was a 1990's Stebo rant. It just pissed me off. I am still kind of pissed about it. Then I see Drex post that we have 5000 members. Well, that is just horse hockey. We have over 100,000 alumni in the DFW area and we only have 5,000 members? And of those 5,000 - only about 300 are active alumni? 300? Jeez. It doesn't do us any good to claim that we have 100K alumni in the Dallas/Ft Worth area if only 300 of them care. I would guess that SMU has about 10K alumni in the DFW area (just a complete guess) and that at least 25% of them are active in some way (go to games, join the alumni association, etc...). If we had a 25% involvement - we would have 25K at football games and then another 5K students. We wouldn't have any problem selling out games and building new stadiums. The truth is - we have a bunch of people that have gotten sick of the process and the BS and moved on.

Ok - end of rant - back to non-judgemental, calm - year 2004 and forward Stebo.