Fw*telegram On New Stadium Status Link

Stan R · July 26, 2007

The problem is that the top won't start the process of courting folks until the feasibility study says it's a go...and the BOR agrees. That is just the way it is done.

But isn't that a chicken/egg situation? Wouldn't the pres/chancellor be beating the bushes as a part of the feasibility study? Just curious.

the real grad88 · July 26, 2007

And one more thing, and this is my last post on this subject. I think the recommendation from the feasibility study will be to wait 2 to 3 years in order to give the momentum that we are seeing right now reach a higher level. If we can get back into the mode of winning championships and maybe break into the top 25, AND get around 10,000 season ticket holders, then I think there will be enough new donors on board and potential big donors to make it happen. I think a lot of big money people that are being interviewed in this study are saying they want to wait and see what happens in the coming 2 or 3 years. Wouldn't you? Big donors want to jump on a rising ship not a sinking one. It looks promising at this point, but the proof is not yet in the pudding. Time will tell. That's my take.

greenminer · July 26, 2007

I just want our version TB Pickens. now please.

untgirl04 · July 26, 2007

But isn't that a chicken/egg situation? Wouldn't the pres/chancellor be beating the bushes as a part of the feasibility study? Just curious.

This is just my theory on the subject, but when Dr. Bataille did her tour around the world, I doubt she was just selling North Texas academics.

stebo · July 26, 2007

"You're exactly right in that no corporation is ever going to commit to a naming rights sponsorship for a stadium in which the ground has yet to be broken"
I'm sorry Gangrene, but this statement tells me that you know nothing about big-time fundraising. There is always a kick-off/flagship donor. There maybe other donors who jump on board along the way, but there has got to be the big seed gift to start the project. And another thing, it should be the campus president and chancellor who are courting this kind of donor, with the Advancement Office's assistance and support. These kinds of donors don't want to talk to an Advancement Associate with the AD office, they want to talk to the top. The problem is that the top won't start the process of courting folks until the feasibility study says it's a go...and the BOR agrees. That is just the way it is done.

Name one stadium that was built that way. With the money ahead of time from a corporation. Even Gerald Ford hopped onto the project after the school had committed to fund the project. At that point, he just added his name to the project that already existed. Papa John's Stadium was simply added AFTER the renovations/expansions had begun at the Louisville stadium. Movie Gallery hopped onto the Troy stadium well after it was built. I can't think of one single college team that has built a new stadium or done serious renovations to their existing stadium by not going it alone first and then have donors hope on board sans Boone Pickens...

The only way to really get this done in North Texas is with a student service fee being raised (the way that it should have been raised properly the first time around). We have a waiting list and if students don't want to pay the fees then they can go to UTA. Nobody is forcing them to go to school here. I think that if Dickey had continued to win that the BOR would have eventually upped the fee again but the losses just did not justify a new stadium. A winning team and a friendly BOR will get this done. We have also caught up with our equity gender stuff (so much that we are ranked #2 in the nation) and we can start using those extra fees that we have been collecting to renovate womens' sports facilities to start putting some aside for the guys.

But I respect that you know a lot about fund raising and more importantly, fund raising at North Texas. You seem to really know your stuff. You just don't seem to understand the funding of athletic facilities in the state of Texas... more importantly - North Texas. We have to pay for it and then hope for a sponsor, there is no mystery silver bullet donor that will get us to our stadium.

Edited July 26, 2007 by stebo

FirefightnRick · July 26, 2007

My University is too far away for me to be a season ticket holder. So I try to support UNT athletics (football and basketball). And in doing that I frequent this board. But I have to tell you that all of the constant complaining is driving me crazy.

So, the school is too far away for you to donate as a season ticket holder, therefore you support (football and basketball) by frequenting this board instead, which is full of complainers?

Rick

gangrene · July 26, 2007

"You're exactly right in that no corporation is ever going to commit to a naming rights sponsorship for a stadium in which the ground has yet to be broken"
I'm sorry Gangrene, but this statement tells me that you know nothing about big-time fundraising. There is always a kick-off/flagship donor. There maybe other donors who jump on board along the way, but there has got to be the big seed gift to start the project. And another thing, it should be the campus president and chancellor who are courting this kind of donor, with the Advancement Office's assistance and support. These kinds of donors don't want to talk to an Advancement Associate with the AD office, they want to talk to the top. The problem is that the top won't start the process of courting folks until the feasibility study says it's a go...and the BOR agrees. That is just the way it is done.

You're right, fund-raising is not my business but...I do know a thing or two about corporate sponsorships as I've been pitched many different opportunities (and approved several) over the last 15 years of my career. Never, as in not once...have I ever been asked to evaluate a proposal that includes naming rights, before construction had started on a facility. That just doesn't happen...and if it did...I'd laugh them out of my office. Corporate sponsors are not in the banking business. Your thinking otherwise tells me you know nothing about corporate sponsorships.

the real grad88 · July 26, 2007

You're right, fund-raising is not my business but...I do know a thing or two about corporate sponsorships as I've been pitched many different opportunities (and approved several) over the last 15 years of my career. Never, as in not once...have I ever been asked to evaluate a proposal that includes naming rights, before construction had started on a facility. That just doesn't happen...and if it did...I'd laugh them out of my office. Corporate sponsors are not in the banking business. Your thinking otherwise tells me you know nothing about corporate sponsorships.

There is a big difference in getting a donor to pay for a building and getting a corportate sponsor. We need a donor to jump start this so that we can then start going after corporate sponsors. So I guess we are saying that we are both right.

DeepGreen · July 26, 2007

And one more thing, and this is my last post on this subject. I think the recommendation from the feasibility study will be to wait 2 to 3 years in order to give the momentum that we are seeing right now reach a higher level. If we can get back into the mode of winning championships and maybe break into the top 25, AND get around 10,000 season ticket holders, then I think there will be enough new donors on board and potential big donors to make it happen. I think a lot of big money people that are being interviewed in this study are saying they want to wait and see what happens in the coming 2 or 3 years. Wouldn't you? Big donors want to jump on a rising ship not a sinking one. It looks promising at this point, but the proof is not yet in the pudding. Time will tell. That's my take.

I tend to agree. How far and how fast, if at all, will Todd Dodge take North Texas. If TD is successful over the next two or three years, building a momentum never seen at NT since Fry, and the fan base responds in turnout, contributions and season tickets, then we could see a stadium. In addition, during this "window of opportunity", the university will see where it sits with TxDot and Fouts Field.

I think this university will not commit to a new stadium until they see a return on their investment from Todd Dodge and the fan base. If Dodge gets the program back on track, makes some bowl appearances and still does not get 25,000+ fans at Fouts at any given home game, then NT will be looking at the program's existance. The next few years could be the beginning or end of North Texas' committment to big time football as we know it. How can the university commit to a new stadium for $40+ million when the whole university endowment is not much more than that?

Edited July 26, 2007 by DeepGreen

the real grad88 · July 26, 2007

Name one stadium that was built that way. With the money ahead of time from a corporation. Even Gerald Ford hopped onto the project after the school had committed to fund the project. At that point, he just added his name to the project that already existed. Papa John's Stadium was simply added AFTER the renovations/expansions had begun at the Louisville stadium. Movie Gallery hopped onto the Troy stadium well after it was built. I can't think of one single college team that has built a new stadium or done serious renovations to their existing stadium by not going it alone first and then have donors hope on board sans Boone Pickens...
The only way to really get this done in North Texas is with a student service fee being raised (the way that it should have been raised properly the first time around). We have a waiting list and if students don't want to pay the fees then they can go to UTA. Nobody is forcing them to go to school here. I think that if Dickey had continued to win that the BOR would have eventually upped the fee again but the losses just did not justify a new stadium. A winning team and a friendly BOR will get this done. We have also caught up with our equity gender stuff (so much that we are ranked #2 in the nation) and we can start using those extra fees that we have been collecting to renovate womens' sports facilities to start putting some aside for the guys.
But I respect that you know a lot about fund raising and more importantly, fund raising at North Texas. You seem to really know your stuff. You just don't seem to understand the funding of athletic facilities in the state of Texas... more importantly - North Texas. We have to pay for it and then hope for a sponsor, there is no mystery silver bullet donor that will get us to our stadium.

Agree totally. I wish that we could get a student services fee to get this thing started. Then we could get the corporate sponsorships and all of the smaller donors and such to jump on the bandwagon and push this thing over the top. Big donor or fee money...it doesn't matter...we just have got to have about 1/2 of the money in the piggy bank in order to get started on a real campaign.

Quoner · July 26, 2007

Marshall, Central Florida, South Florida, Troy, UAB to name a few off of the top of my head. But the point is that This board does more complaining then any board that I visit. Look I am a football fan. My University is too far away for me to be a season ticket holder. So I try to support UNT athletics (football and basketball). And in doing that I frequent this board. But I have to tell you that all of the constant complaining is driving me crazy.
Maybe it is best that I support another team locally. I actually work with a UNT Alum who supports OU. Not because they are a BSC team but bucause they dont have to deal with the UNT fans. I'm not an OU kind of guy, but I could support SMU or Baylor easily.

Really - they turned around magically because of fans? That's awesome that the fans made those new stadiums and OOC wins happen.

If hearing a group of fans complain on a message board turns you off, you should probably just give up on all sports altogether or turn off the computer. This whole interweb has really changed things. But, frequenting a board is not really supporting a program, its just indulging an existing passion that helps us stay sane between events.

Good luck with Baylor and SMU! Good investments!

Eagle-96 · July 26, 2007

Marshall, Central Florida, South Florida, Troy, UAB to name a few off of the top of my head. But the point is that This board does more complaining then any board that I visit. Look I am a football fan. My University is too far away for me to be a season ticket holder. So I try to support UNT athletics (football and basketball). And in doing that I frequent this board. But I have to tell you that all of the constant complaining is driving me crazy.
Maybe it is best that I support another team locally. I actually work with a UNT Alum who supports OU. Not because they are a BSC team but bucause they dont have to deal with the UNT fans. I'm not an OU kind of guy, but I could support SMU or Baylor easily.

They all repackaged themselves by moving from 1-AA to 1A. No magic there.

Eagle1855 · July 26, 2007

So, the school is too far away for you to donate as a season ticket holder, therefore you support (football and basketball) by frequenting this board instead, which is full of complainers?
Rick

Give the guy a break, he frequents the board and often offers his own opinions from a different perspective. You'd think for a program that is pining for bandwagon fans such as ours, we wouldn't give our "secondary" fans a hard time for offering up their thoughts and would gladly welcome anyone who wishes success for our program.

And yes, 8 pages of bitching about Stadium Status with almost ZERO factual information is quite exhausting- no matter your primary allegiance.

TIgreen01 · July 26, 2007

I tend to agree. How far and how fast, if at all, will Todd Dodge take North Texas. If TD is successful over the next two or three years, building a momentum never seen at NT since Fry, and the fan base responds in turnout, contributions and season tickets, then we could see a stadium. In addition, during this "window of opportunity", the university will see where it sits with TxDot and Fouts Field.
I think this university will not commit to a new stadium until they see a return on their investment from Todd Dodge and the fan base. If Dodge gets the program back on track, makes some bowl appearances and still does not get 25,000+ fans at Fouts at any given home game, then NT will be looking at the program's existance. The next few years could be the beginning or end of North Texas' committment to big time football as we know it. How can the university commit to a new stadium for $40+ million when the whole university endowment is not much more than that?

If this is really what the university is doing then I say kiss the program goodbye. Playing wait and see is what losers do. Winners go home with the Prom Queen....or something like that.

Seriously, though. What kind of an investment has the university REALLY made with the hiring of Todd Dodge? I'm not trying to belittle him, b/c I think Dodge was a great hire. But we hired him for $185k (or less?) base salary a year. Yes he's got incentives over that, but we sure as heck didn't go out and match what the schools that we(fans anyway) aspire to be associated with pay their head coaches (SMU, Tulsa, Utep, etc). Have we improved over what we paid DD? Yes....barely.

I think that the FIRST thing that needs to happen is that the school decides that we are going to be a player at some level of collegiate athletics. Fans and donors respond to action and committment by the school, not the other way around.

As a hopeful alum, I see RV working his tail off to try to get that committment from the school. Most of the facilities he's built have been paid for by the school, so there is a level of committment there. The question is what level is UNT committed to being?

Edited July 26, 2007 by TIgreen01

Daddy Dumpsalot · July 26, 2007

Agree totally. I wish that we could get a student services fee to get this thing started. Then we could get the corporate sponsorships and all of the smaller donors and such to jump on the bandwagon and push this thing over the top. Big donor or fee money...it doesn't matter...we just have got to have about 1/2 of the money in the piggy bank in order to get started on a real campaign.

Universities in Texas cannot adopt a student fee to pay for anything unrelated to athletics without a vote from the students. Would the university try this? I think so, but I doubt that the student body would support an increase in their tuition to pay for a stadium which the majority will never attend. Rumor has it that the Health Center was voted on and originally voted down by the students, but the BOR overturned that somehow.

MeanGreen61 · July 26, 2007

Universities in Texas cannot adopt a student fee to pay for anything unrelated to athletics without a vote from the students. Would the university try this? I think so, but I doubt that the student body would support an increase in their tuition to pay for a stadium which the majority will never attend. Rumor has it that the Health Center was voted on and originally voted down by the students, but the BOR overturned that somehow.

Isn't a stadium part of athletics ? BOR can increase student fees for athletics without their approval.

Censored by Laurie · July 26, 2007

Rumor has it that the Health Center was voted on and originally voted down by the students, but the BOR overturned that somehow.

It was...the student referendum vote is essentially for the Board of Regents to guage the opinion of the student body...its not a binding agreement. I think more students would be on board with tuition increases if the Master Plan was better publicized...and they had a visual representation as to where their additional fees were going.

meangreenfreak · July 26, 2007

It was...the student referendum vote is essentially for the Board of Regents to guage the opinion of the student body...its not a binding agreement. I think more students would be on board with tuition increases if the Master Plan was better publicized...and they had a visual representation as to where their additional fees were going.

I think that the students want to pay as little as possible each semester. College students are not know for being the weathiest citizens in town. Now if the have a rich set of parents, then who cares what school costs.

Censored by Laurie · July 26, 2007

I tend to agree. How far and how fast, if at all, will Todd Dodge take North Texas. If TD is successful over the next two or three years, building a momentum never seen at NT since Fry, and the fan base responds in turnout, contributions and season tickets, then we could see a stadium. In addition, during this "window of opportunity", the university will see where it sits with TxDot and Fouts Field.
I think this university will not commit to a new stadium until they see a return on their investment from Todd Dodge and the fan base. If Dodge gets the program back on track, makes some bowl appearances and still does not get 25,000+ fans at Fouts at any given home game, then NT will be looking at the program's existance. The next few years could be the beginning or end of North Texas' committment to big time football as we know it. How can the university commit to a new stadium for $40+ million when the whole university endowment is not much more than that?

I disagree. Eagle Point and Liberty Christian lands were acquired almost exclusivly for athletics...and no matter how bad, football is almost always going to be the most profitable sport. I think construction of the new athletic center cements the schools commitment. Winning may influence only the way the school prioritizes the way in which they go after the Master Plan. A football stadium will come...winning now may mean its not the last piece of the Master Plan to be completed. Our reverse Field of Dreams situation is frusterating and may just require some patience

Daddy Dumpsalot · July 26, 2007

Isn't a stadium part of athletics ? BOR can increase student fees for athletics without their approval.

Silly me, I didn't type that correctly. Athletics = Academics.

DeepGreen · July 26, 2007

If this is really what the university is doing then I say kiss the program goodbye. Playing wait and see is what losers do. Winners go home with the Prom Queen....or something like that.
Seriously, though. What kind of an investment has the university REALLY made with the hiring of Todd Dodge? I'm not trying to belittle him, b/c I think Dodge was a great hire. But we hired him for $185k (or less?) base salary a year. Yes he's got incentives over that, but we sure as heck didn't go out and match what the schools that we(fans anyway) aspire to be associated with pay their head coaches (SMU, Tulsa, Utep, etc). Have we improved over what we paid DD? Yes....barely.
I think that the FIRST thing that needs to happen is that the school decides that we are going to be a player at some level of collegiate athletics. Fans and donors respond to action and committment by the school, not the other way around.
As a hopeful alum, I see RV working his tail off to try to get that committment from the school. Most of the facilities he's built have been paid for by the school, so there is a level of committment there. The question is what level is UNT committed to being?

This is just my theory which I hope is wrong. Unfortunately, NT has always done it bassackwards and on the cheap.

SAGreenFan · July 26, 2007

Universities in Texas cannot adopt a student fee to pay for anything unrelated to athletics without a vote from the students. Would the university try this? I think so, but I doubt that the student body would support an increase in their tuition to pay for a stadium which the majority will never attend. Rumor has it that the Health Center was voted on and originally voted down by the students, but the BOR overturned that somehow.

I voted for the Health Center, and if I remember correctly it was approved by the students who voted without a hitch. Its not just getting the students to vote for approval of an increased athletics fee, its getting the students THAT vote to approve that increase. When you have a student body of almost 34,000 and only 2,000 - 3,000 bother to vote its not exactly an average voice of student opinion. We've seen what the student section at games is like when they come out in force, its getting those students to vote that is important. Lay everything out to them, spell out the benefits of a new stadium, and promote it beyond yard signs placed here and there around campus and an article and editorial in the Daily speaking out against it.

The support is there, I just don't think its being tapped in the right way, if at all.

Having the Master Plan accessible would be a great start, I had to dig for it, and I loved what I read. When i started telling people about it, they went looking for it to and what they saw impressed them. Every single one of them said "Damn, right as I'm about to graduate, UNT becomes the university I always wanted to go to."

And yes, 8 pages of bitching about Stadium Status with almost ZERO factual information is quite exhausting- no matter your primary allegiance.

Agreed. The sky isn't falling, NT has already invested too many of its sources into Eagle Point to let it die now.

Edited July 26, 2007 by SAGreenFan

GrandGreen · July 26, 2007

If this is really what the university is doing then I say kiss the program goodbye. Playing wait and see is what losers do. Winners go home with the Prom Queen....or something like that.
Seriously, though. What kind of an investment has the university REALLY made with the hiring of Todd Dodge? I'm not trying to belittle him, b/c I think Dodge was a great hire. But we hired him for $185k (or less?) base salary a year. Yes he's got incentives over that, but we sure as heck didn't go out and match what the schools that we(fans anyway) aspire to be associated with pay their head coaches (SMU, Tulsa, Utep, etc). Have we improved over what we paid DD? Yes....barely.
I think that the FIRST thing that needs to happen is that the school decides that we are going to be a player at some level of collegiate athletics. Fans and donors respond to action and committment by the school, not the other way around.
As a hopeful alum, I see RV working his tail off to try to get that committment from the school. Most of the facilities he's built have been paid for by the school, so there is a level of committment there. The question is what level is UNT committed to being?

I agree to some extent with your points, however the coach's pay is not one of them. After incentives, I think you will find that TD is at the top of the Belt pay not the bottom. If TD is the coach that you want, why would you want to pay him more than necessary just to keep up with the Jones's. Is he going to be a better coach at $500k a year versus the $300 he will most likely make at NT in his first year. If TD is the success most of us think he will be, there will ample opportunity to complain about NT not being salary competitive.

PlummMeanGreen · July 27, 2007

First of all, baseball utility players are getting contracts with what we have been saying we need to build a new football stadium; which seems to have been that magic number of $40 million, right?

With Jerry Jones building a billion dollar stadium over in Arlington, it might be an easy bet now that UNT might need to even spend $75-$100 million to get something similar to the stadium that most of us have seen in that virtual tour video made from the company up in Tulsa.

So with all the aforementioned in mind, see how $40 million should not be so much the mountain we seem to have made it in Denton? :blink: :rolleyes:

YET..............Are some saying if this present staff at UNT cannot raise the monies for a 35-40,000 seat football stadium that it can never be done period? I would hardly think not.

We stand to lose too much (like in losing face for starters) by not building a true NCAA D1-A football stadium at UNT now. UNT's top brass may even need to spend more time researching all the ramification of not building such a stadium at this juncture. Not sure that would be the kind of legacy any of them would want to leave UNT while under their watch.

Wouldn't we all love to see this headline?

UNT ANNOUNCES DONOR WHO WILL UNDER-WRITE MEAN GREEN'S NEW FOOTBALL STADIUM. (HE NEVER EVEN TOOK ONE CREDIT HOUR AT UNT)

(Never say never, because stranger things such as this have happened at the intercollegiate level).

Edited July 27, 2007 by PlummMeanGreen