Poll: Best Stadium In The Belt

FirefightnRick · May 10, 2007

Just in case those of you who have not yet visited Fouts, this pretty much sums it up in one photo, although a view from the front row towards the field of play would back it up.

The supposed "best seat in the house", front row, 50 yard line is exactly 33 1/2 yards from the field of play. If you'll look at the next photo you'll see that Fouts is nearly equidistant to the stands, meaning you could basically spin the field east-west and it would still fit between the seats.

That's how far the viewer is from the playing surface. I challenge anyone to find me another football stadium that places the fan further away on a front row seat. Then, what's worse, and what the above photo's don't show is that not only is the "best seat in the house" 33 1/2 yards from the field, but anyone who sits there is looking at the backs of the players on the sidelines, preventing you from being able to see most of the field in front of you. Your actually sitting below the players standing on the sidelines. In order to see anything from that vantage point you must stand on your seat and hope someone on the sideline moves. Reason? All or most playing surfaces have a crown for water runoff. But the dumbass that designed Fouts 55 years ago started the crown at the seats rather than simply at the field. From the seats on out you have an incline, then around the 12th yard in from the seats the track lies on a level plane, then after that the crown begins again all the way out to the center of the field. So when you attempt to sit down front, your looking at the numbers on the backs of the players standing on the sidelines. Most people sit back and scrunch up 10 to 15 rows so they can see. In fact you can see in many of the photos of our better attended games that there is a space of several empty rows down front where the crowd has moved back up higher so they can see over the players. So now, these same fans, and I'm one of them, are about 40 yards back from the playing surface. It's the most stupid set up to have to watch a football game I've ever seen. In fact, I was very glad I was on Boomer the Cannon's crew when we were behind the endzone back when I was in school because you could just see better from there. Other than the fact that you can drink from there the Deck in the southwest corner is possibly the best advantage to watch the game from.

Rick

Edited May 10, 2007 by FirefightnRick

May 10, 2007

I agree with all that you said, Rick, but I want you to know that Fouts is not alone with its front row seats being a poor place to watch a game. The absolute worst seating that I have ever had at a game was at Tiger Stadium in Baton Rouge. I was on the 50 yard line, second row, which happened to be right behind our players' bench. The only plays that I was able to see were from the Jumbotron and that seemed a light-year away. I did have a great view of the players jerseys, however.

I hope that the front row of the new stadium is higher than the player's heads because I would like for there to be no empty seats within the end zones.

NT91 · May 10, 2007

Is Fouts the oldest in the SBC?

NT80 · May 10, 2007

I challenge anyone to find me another football stadium that places the fan further away on a front row seat.

http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.com/~n...ttston%20PA.jpg

RaiderInTheZone · May 10, 2007

I would love to have a box just like this at Fouts with the sightlines and beer!

Shhhh! People aren't supposed to know about the alcohol. It's not allowed in Floyd Stadium.

DeepGreen · May 10, 2007

Is Fouts the oldest in the SBC?

Probably. In the "world of stadiums", only the Coliseum in Rome is older than Fouts.

Edited May 10, 2007 by DeepGreen

Green92 · May 10, 2007

Probably. In the "world of stadiums", on the Coliseum in Rome is older than Fouts.

The Coliseum has much better sight lines.

PHSCoach · May 10, 2007

Cal's stadium was opened in 1923

USC's was opened in 1942

These are some of the older ones

Edited May 10, 2007 by PHSCoach

May 10, 2007

This may come as a shock to you but of the ten Division 1-A universities in Texas only SMU has a newer stadium than North Texas. Tech, Baylor and Rice were built in pretty much the same era but the other five were all pre-World War II. UT was originally built in 1924 and it had a track as well but had far fewer complications than we would have had trying to remove the track.

So age is not our worst factor. Location and the manner of construction (i.e. sight lines) were. When I-35 was cut through the campus it took away some options for remodeling and expansion. We could still close it in and make it a bowl but it would still be a horrible place to watch a football game. And, the cost might be just as great as a new stadium, especially one that could take advantage of the surrounding terrain.

By the way, Lafayette gets my vote. I like Middle and Troy and Arky State is okay. The rest are down in the Fouts category (needs a doover) IMO.

SCREAMING EAGLE-66 · May 10, 2007

--My comment on FIU.

---They appear to have a track around the stadium BUT it appears that the end stands have been moved in for football game... If not they just built a stadium over what had been a track.. Vision their on the sidelines could be no better than ours.

---Muts looks nice.

---The LaLa one appears to have a lot of seats very far from the field (very flat looking). ASU as well (in the picture). Haven't been to either place.

________________

--- Old

--UT opened in 1923 and held 27,000 .... has undergone many enlargements since but some of the original stadium still exists I think. It was enlarged to 40,000 in 1926, 60,000 in 1948 and now with the upper decks and track removed it holds 85,000. Current plans call for more improvement to 90,000.

---- http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Darrell_K._Ro...emorial_Stadium

---Kyle Field was started in 1927 and until 1968 it held only 35,000. I remember it looking much like Fouts with concrete endzone seats when I attended a game there in 1965. It now holds 82,000.

---TCU opened in 1930 with 22,000 It now holds 44,000.

---SMU claims to have just enough seats for all their multitude of fans and is a sell out every week. The size varies from week to week.

SCREAMING EAGLE-66 · May 10, 2007

The Coliseum has much better sight lines.

--The Coliseum had big LIONS.... and their winning percentage was very good.

SCREAMING EAGLE-66 · May 10, 2007

---This may not popular here ..BUT.. ..couldn't Fouts be done like UT.... the track removed, the fields lowered 15-20 feet and seating constructed below bringing those seats near and just above the field with good vision. It would be a lot less expensive that a total new stadium so not as money would need to be raised.. Restrooms, etc. could just be junked and reconstructed. I think TxTech did the same thing because I seem to remember a track there during the 60's and now it seems much lower and closer to the field that it was then. I realize this does not answer parking problems. Also with the track gone permanent concrete stands could constructed in the end zone areas much closer to the field. With all that done seating could be 40,000 or more.

--- It we do build a totally new one it should constructed in such a manner that upper decks could be constructed at some point in the future. You never know what will be needed then. I am sure in the mid 60's that Kyle Field (which had about 35,000) never expected to ever need 80,000-90,000 seats but they do now.

---Additional problem for us is I-35 and land it needs..... but UT sort of has the same problem.... I-35 right behind it.

____________________

Grey-Eagle-One posted while I was typing.... very similiar comments. I had not read them before this post.

Edited May 10, 2007 by SCREAMING EAGLE-66

UNTLifer · May 10, 2007

---This may not popular here ..BUT.. ..couldn't Fouts be done like UT.... the track removed, the fields lowered 15-20 feet and seating constructed below bringing those seats near and just above the field with good vision. It would be a lot less expensive that a total new stadium so not as money would need to be raised.. Restrooms, etc. could just be junked and reconstructed. I think TxTech did the same thing because I seem to remember a track there during the 60's and now it seems much lower and closer to the field that it was then. I realize this does not answer parking problems. Also with the track gone permanent concrete stands could constructed in the end zone areas much closer to the field. With all that done seating could be 40,000 or more.

This has been discussed before and is not feasible for various reasons.

DallasGreen · May 10, 2007

This has been discussed before and is not feasible for various reasons.

We may as well quit bitchin' about Fouts. It's all we got and no big donor with $40 million is on the horizon although there is a $135 million capital campaign that has already started behind the scenes that includes $60 million for a new 31K stadium easily expandable to 50K when we show that we can make the 31K a "tough ticket", but that has NEVER happened consistently and won't until fans come to see the Mean Green play irregardless of who we play. There is a way to get started yesterday but the A.D. shys away from it.

All these can get us going and the capital campaign now scheduled to last at least 5 years will bail it all out by completion: 1) Raise student fees by at least $20. per semester hour and designate it specifically for stadium ( don't let it be voted on, just do it, and if they don't like it they can leave but they still won't find as good a deal for the $$$ they pay anywhere else--it just takes some gonads like A$M & UT to lump "fees" into one figure no matter what they are for). 2) Sell revenue bonds like everyone else does and don't be paranoid that WSU defaulted on an issue. It's much easier to sell bonds than naming rights which are somewhat out of vogue right now 3) Put classrooms or sports medicine in the stadium and secure state funds for that part--UT is doing that on the north end addition as we speak and as I recall LSU and A$M have about as much space state funded as a dorm would get. Finally until this is done don't be so stubborn about playing high profile teams o/s Fouts. The Cotton Bowl will need another weekend game for the State Fair and a Big 10 or better would always like the Dallas exposure. Excess guarantee $$ are now freed by the CB game going to Jerry's World.

Edited May 10, 2007 by DallasGreen

Greenblood94 · May 10, 2007

---Additional problem for us is I-35 and land it needs..... but UT sort of has the same problem.... I-35 right behind it.

Sorry, but there is no comparison between the distance of I-35 from Fouts and from DKR. UT has a entire track and field stadium between DKR and I-35 (which they use now that the track at DKR is no more), not to mention Robert Dedman Drive and Red River St. between the two, feeding both stadiums.

A decent heave of a rock from the top row of Fouts could hit the windshield of a car on I-35. Barry Bonds couldn't hit a baseball far enough to sniff I-35 from DKR's closest point to the Interstate.

If you map the two locations out on Microsoft's Live Search, you'll see what I mean.

NT80 · May 10, 2007

We may as well quit bitchin' about Fouts. It's all we got and no big donor with $40 million is on the horizon although there is a $135 million capital campaign that has already started behind the scenes that includes $60 million for a new 31K stadium easily expandable to 50K when we show that we can make the 31K a "tough ticket", but that has NEVER happened consistently and won't until fans come to see the Mean Green play irregardless of who we play. There is a way to get started yesterday but the A.D. shys away from it.
All these can get us going and the capital campaign now scheduled to last at least 5 years will bail it all out by completion: 1) Raise student fees by at least $20. per semester hour and designate it specifically for stadium ( don't let it be voted on, just do it, and if they don't like it they can leave but they still won't find as good a deal for the $$$ they pay anywhere else--it just takes some gonads like A$M & UT to lump "fees" into one figure no matter what they are for). 2) Sell revenue bonds like everyone else does and don't be paranoid that WSU defaulted on an issue. It's much easier to sell bonds than naming rights which are somewhat out of vogue right now 3) Put classrooms or sports medicine in the stadium and secure state funds for that part--UT is doing that on the north end addition as we speak and as I recall LSU and A$M have about as much space state funded as a dorm would get. Finally until this is done don't be so stubborn about playing high profile teams o/s Fouts. The Cotton Bowl will need another weekend game for the State Fair and a Big 10 or better would always like the Dallas exposure. Excess guarantee $$ are now freed by the CB game going to Jerry's World.

Some excellent ideas Jim, too bad they mostly fall on deaf ears. I am excited about the "mystery" Capital Campaign, the one that nobody seems to want to talk about in public. If recruits can hear about it why can't fans? Start selling seat licenses in it like Southlake does, or something to get funding kickstarted; let's get this thing going!

DallasGreen · May 11, 2007

Some excellent ideas Jim, too bad they mostly fall on deaf ears. I am excited about the "mystery" Capital Campaign, the one that nobody seems to want to talk about in public. If recruits can hear about it why can't fans? Start selling seat licenses in it like Southlake does, or something to get funding kickstarted; let's get this thing going!

The idea is to have the campaign at least one-half funded before it's publicly announced. The way we approach this, at 60, I still hope to see a completed stadium in my lifetime. The seat options as was done with Texas Stadium is also an excellent idea. It could be started today with just a little creative thinking and some guts. Neither seem to abound on our campus. I'd bank on FIU and maybe FAU having new stadiums long before NT. Neither of them feels the need to have to vote on student fees and that alone puts them far ahead of us!!!!

Edited May 11, 2007 by DallasGreen

NT80 · May 11, 2007

when we show that we can make the 31K a "tough ticket", but that has NEVER happened consistently and won't until fans come to see the Mean Green play irregardless of who we play.

It will take entry into CUSA for that to happen consistently...and that, CUSA, should be the goal. Which home schedule is more attractive to entice 31K?:

FAU

ULM

MTSU

Navy

WKU

or

Houston

UTEP

Rice

Navy

Marshall

Southern Miss

ParksAndRecRick · May 11, 2007

Some stadium thoughts....

There were a few clever things about ASUs stadium. Especially the restrooms which also served the tailgate area. The trees and shade make it a grand place for tailgating. I thought the fans were into the action. I had a good experience their. I have never thought LaLa or ULM were all that hot.

Akron is an absolute dump! The only neat thing it adjoins the home of the Soap Box Derby. Terrible.

I didn't care for Tulsa. I know their doing some work. But, they did give us GRAND seats!

I hate to say this again...but, the best small stadium I have been in is SMU. And, one neat thing they do is open their dressing room before the team gets there to kids. Everything is layed out...it is a good branding thing. However, they don't get many folks there. They have some nice suites (which is a must these days...I don't like that the glass don't open though). And, the seats are on the field.

If the seats at Fouts were not a mile away...it wouldn't be half as bad. But, lord the noise is gone and the views and excitement are very poor. Tailgaiting is nice though at Fouts thanks to the Athletic Staff. They have done a nice job. And, parking sucks at almost every campus stadium.

ParksAndRecRick · May 11, 2007

Some stadium thoughts....

There were a few clever things about ASUs stadium. Especially the restrooms which also served the tailgate area. The trees and shade make it a grand place for tailgating. I thought the fans were into the action. I had a good experience their. I have never thought LaLa or ULM were all that hot.

Akron is an absolute dump! The only neat thing it adjoins the home of the Soap Box Derby. Terrible.

I didn't care for Tulsa. I know their doing some work. But, they did give us GRAND seats!

I hate to say this again...but, the best small stadium I have been in is SMU. And, one neat thing they do is open their dressing room before the team gets there to kids. Everything is layed out...it is a good branding thing. However, they don't get many folks there. They have some nice suites (which is a must these days...I don't like that the glass don't open though). And, the seats are on the field.

If the seats at Fouts were not a mile away...it wouldn't be half as bad. But, lord the noise is gone and the views and excitement are very poor. Tailgaiting is nice though at Fouts thanks to the Athletic Staff. They have done a nice job. And, parking sucks at almost every campus stadium.

Edited May 11, 2007 by ParksAndRecRick

FirefightnRick · May 11, 2007

The absolute worst seating that I have ever had at a game was at Tiger Stadium in Baton Rouge. I was on the 50 yard line, second row, which happened to be right behind our players' bench. The only plays that I was able to see were from the Jumbotron and that seemed a light-year away. I did have a great view of the players jerseys, however.

Wow, when was that?

This is me at the '05 Katrina Make-Up game at LSU, standing right up from my seat to take this photo with a LSU fan and you can see to our right how close to the field we were. However, we were on the 3rd row, 50 yard line. Best seats I've ever had next to any at Amon Carter. We spoke to the folks in front of us and I don't recall anyone even having to stand to see? Maybe they have changed something now to address the problem you were having then?

Rick

Mean'n'Green07 · May 11, 2007

All these can get us going and the capital campaign now scheduled to last at least 5 years will bail it all out by completion: 1) Raise student fees by at least $20. per semester hour and designate it specifically for stadium ( don't let it be voted on, just do it, and if they don't like it they can leave but they still won't find as good a deal for the $$$ they pay anywhere else--it just takes some gonads like A$M & UT to lump "fees" into one figure no matter what they are for).

You're right on the money with the student fees. My g/f is in the SGA and has talked to other senators about creating a fee for it. Sadly, she said 90% of the senators disagreed and thought it was a stupid idea... and this is coming from people who are INVOLVED with the university, not just the typical apathetic student.

But don't worry, I'll work hard at getting that 40M so I can put the new stadium in my name =P

DallasGreen · May 14, 2007

You're right on the money with the student fees. My g/f is in the SGA and has talked to other senators about creating a fee for it. Sadly, she said 90% of the senators disagreed and thought it was a stupid idea... and this is coming from people who are INVOLVED with the university, not just the typical apathetic student.
But don't worry, I'll work hard at getting that 40M so I can put the new stadium in my name =P

Maybe they should get out of Denton a little more and see how it's done at other universities or maybe they just love to continue to Po Boy it and say o woe is me !!!

AJR2010OX · May 14, 2007

Not gonna lie last years senators were a bunch of anti athletic nuts. They didnt do jack. Next year's senators have a few people that are pro-athletic and willing to do some stuff.... if some of yall can help us with some bills. I'm down for raising student services fees quietly, as long as we show a purpose. But let's put a winning program on the field... maybe then people will be more reciprocative. Remember the average UNT student isnt like us on the boards.... they dont care. Give em a reason. Yall have resources in me and other SGA people... but help us out. Somehow...

Maybe they should get out of Denton a little more and see how it's done at other universities or maybe they just love to continue to Po Boy it and say o woe is me !!!

UNTFan23 · May 14, 2007

Not gonna lie last years senators were a bunch of anti athletic nuts. They didnt do jack. Next year's senators have a few people that are pro-athletic and willing to do some stuff.... if some of yall can help us with some bills. I'm down for raising student services fees quietly, as long as we show a purpose. But let's put a winning program on the field... maybe then people will be more reciprocative. Remember the average UNT student isnt like us on the boards.... they dont care. Give em a reason. Yall have resources in me and other SGA people... but help us out. Somehow...

Just remember it's better to ask for forgiveness than to ask for permission.