If C-usa Opened A Spot Or Two

El Paso Eagle · January 13, 2007

Let me say this, if as some are saying the MWC expands I will all but guarantee you that that the Big East would expand in an effort to stay ahead of the MWC. “Dodge-mania” aside how would you rank the current Sun Belt, and I guess MAC teams for 2 or 3 spots? From the Belt we would be competing against Troy, the Florida Schools, and Western Kentucky....

GreenEddieNT · January 13, 2007

Let me say this, if as some are saying the MWC expands I will all but guarantee you that that the Big East would expand in an effort to stay ahead of the MWC. “Dodge-mania” aside how would you rank the current Sun Belt, and I guess MAC teams for 2 or 3 spots? From the Belt we would be competing against Troy, the Florida Schools, and Western Kentucky....

This is how I think they'd rank in order of being preferred by CUSA.

1. Western Kentucky

2. UNT

3. Louisiana Tech

4. Troy

5. Arkansas State

6. FIU

7. FAU

8. NMSU

9. MTSU

10. ULL

11. ULM

So, basically the school that we have to beat out is Western Kentucky.

I took into consideration facilities, fan support, budgets, tradition, and name recognition in football and basketball as well as geography and personal biases CUSA schools might have against the candidates.

Edited January 13, 2007 by GreenEddieNT

Smitty · January 13, 2007

I don't think SMU would ever allow UNT to join Conference USA. And I'm not sure we should go there if we could.

We need to build continuity here. The Sun Belt is improving, and UNT's upgrade in facilities will help that growth. Troy is improving, MTSU is improving, Arkansas State is improving. I would like to see the SunBelt expand, perhaps add someone like Missouri State. Their enrollment is over 20,000, they have solid men's and women's basketball programs, and would just need to move from I-AA to I-A in football.

Plus, the SunBelt still has a great venue for its bowl game.

And with all the talk of tradition, we're starting to build that in the SunBelt. Forget the tortillas and Tim Crouch's "first down!" call. So what. THE best tradition in sports is rivalries, and UNT is starting to build some rivalries with other SunBelt schools. Rivalries bring fans to the game, rivalries get people to watch at home, and rivalries build a conference.

NTPhiKap99 · January 13, 2007

This is how I think they'd rank in order of being preferred by CUSA.
1. Western Kentucky
2. UNT
3. Louisiana Tech
4. Troy
5. Arkansas State
6. FIU
7. FAU
8. NMSU
9. MTSU
10. ULL
11. ULM
So, basically the school that we have to beat out is Western Kentucky.
I took into consideration facilities, fan support, budgets, tradition, and name recognition in football and basketball as well as geography and personal biases CUSA schools might have against the candidates.

Western Kentucky is the only school on that list with out D1 football and you have them listed #1. I understand they have been at the top of the SBC in basketball for years but I can't see them getting a conference invite over other teams who offer basketball and football to the conference.

GreenEddieNT · January 13, 2007

I don't think SMU would ever allow UNT to join Conference USA. And I'm not sure we should go there if we could.
We need to build continuity here. The Sun Belt is improving, and UNT's upgrade in facilities will help that growth. Troy is improving, MTSU is improving, Arkansas State is improving. I would like to see the SunBelt expand, perhaps add someone like Missouri State. Their enrollment is over 20,000, they have solid men's and women's basketball programs, and would just need to move from I-AA to I-A in football.
Plus, the SunBelt still has a great venue for its bowl game.
And with all the talk of tradition, we're starting to build that in the SunBelt. Forget the tortillas and Tim Crouch's "first down!" call. So what. THE best tradition in sports is rivalries, and UNT is starting to build some rivalries with other SunBelt schools. Rivalries bring fans to the game, rivalries get people to watch at home, and rivalries build a conference.

I think it would be much easier to convince people that they are better off in CUSA than in the Sun Belt if the Sun Belt gets all the bowl tie-ins, tv contracts, and basketball payouts that CUSA gets. Unfortunately, as long as the money and the post-season opportunities are greater in CUSA, any pleas that the Sun Belt is a better home will fall on deaf ears.

Edited January 13, 2007 by GreenEddieNT

Zeke · January 13, 2007

I don't think SMU would ever allow UNT to join Conference USA. And I'm not sure we should go there if we could.
We need to build continuity here. The Sun Belt is improving, and UNT's upgrade in facilities will help that growth. Troy is improving, MTSU is improving, Arkansas State is improving. I would like to see the SunBelt expand, perhaps add someone like Missouri State. Their enrollment is over 20,000, they have solid men's and women's basketball programs, and would just need to move from I-AA to I-A in football.
Plus, the SunBelt still has a great venue for its bowl game.
And with all the talk of tradition, we're starting to build that in the SunBelt. Forget the tortillas and Tim Crouch's "first down!" call. So what. THE best tradition in sports is rivalries, and UNT is starting to build some rivalries with other SunBelt schools. Rivalries bring fans to the game, rivalries get people to watch at home, and rivalries build a conference.

Don't kid yourself Smitty, we would take Conf USA thisquick. The lure of Texas schools in conference play would really go a long way for butts in seats. Your point on SMU blocking our entry is probably correct though. I would have to wonder why it is that the conference as a whole would listen to them though.

GreenEddieNT · January 13, 2007

Western Kentucky is the only school on that list with out D1 football and you have them listed #1. I understand they have been at the top of the SBC in basketball for years but I can't see them getting a conference invite over other teams who offer basketball and football to the conference.

I do, for one thing WKU is the one school that would not automatically get vetoed by anyone in the league the way Memphis would veto MTSU, SMU vetoes UNT, and UAB vetoes Troy for instance. Also WKU has the largest budget and already have or will have the best football/basketball facilities. Their fan base is also already the largest in the Sun Belt and that's even with 1-AA football. Finally, what will get them in is that their basketball program is the single most highly regarded athletics program amongst all the football or basketball programs in the Sun Belt. Oh, and CUSA loves hoops.

NT80 · January 13, 2007

Another trip to Texas/DFW (UNT) to recruit is always a plus to many conference schools. Accessibility of travel (DFW Airport) is also a perk. UNT got beat out last time by UTEP's attendance and football facility. If we replace Fouts, get baseball, and bump up attendance you'll see us way ahead of La Tech and any SBC school for the next CUSA opening.

NT80 · January 13, 2007

I do, for one thing WKU is the one school that would not automatically get vetoed by anyone in the league the way Memphis would veto MTSU, SMU vetoes UNT, and UAB vetoes Troy for instance. Also WKU has the largest budget and already have or will have the best football/basketball facilities. Their fan base is also already the largest in the Sun Belt and that's even with 1-AA football. Finally, what will get them in is that their basketball program is the single most highly regarded athletics program amongst all the football or basketball programs in the Sun Belt. Oh, and CUSA loves hoops.

WKU fans do not travel well for football (see 1-AA playoffs). Nor do they even have 1-A football yet, nor a 1-A facility.

GreenEddieNT · January 13, 2007

Don't kid yourself Smitty, we would take Conf USA thisquick. The lure of Texas schools in conference play would really go a long way for butts in seats. Your point on SMU blocking our entry is probably correct though. I would have to wonder why it is that the conference as a whole would listen to them though.

SMU would veto us but Memphis would veto MTSU, UAB would veto Troy, etc...

The idea is to get vetoed by the fewest number of schools possible. That's why Western Kentucky is in the driver's seat. No one really has a built-in bias against them.

Edited January 13, 2007 by GreenEddieNT

Texas Stranger · January 14, 2007

SMU is in no position to veto anything in CUSA. If the other CUSA schools decided on NT after an evaluation process, any Pony bitching would be answered with a "STFU....you should be nice to your new travel partner."

ltudchi72 · January 14, 2007

SMU is in no position to veto anything in CUSA. If the other CUSA schools decided on NT after an evaluation process, any Pony bitching would be answered with a "STFU....you should be nice to your new travel partner."

You might be suprised what SMU could do. They tend to have support from Tulsa and Rice.

If two or three spots opened up, I think UNT and La Tech are definitely on the short list.

Memphis would not be thrilled with Ark State. SMU would not be thrilled with UNT. Southern Mississippi would not be thrilled with Tech. There is no clear cut answer, but I think UNT and Tech are one and two on the list.

NT80 · January 14, 2007

You might be suprised what SMU could do. They tend to have support from Tulsa and Rice.
If two or three spots opened up, I think UNT and La Tech are definitely on the short list.
Memphis would not be thrilled with Ark State. SMU would not be thrilled with UNT. Southern Mississippi would not be thrilled with Tech. There is no clear cut answer, but I think UNT and Tech are one and two on the list.

Close rivalries are good for attendance; SMUt football game this season as example. You think SMUt, or any CUSA school, really enjoys trips to Ruston? <_<

ltudchi72 · January 14, 2007

Close rivalries are good for attendance; SMUt football game this season as example. You think SMUt, or any CUSA school, really enjoys trips to Ruston?

Who pissed in your Cheerios this morning?

runt96 · January 14, 2007

SMU is a bunch of punks. We need to play them(and beat them) every tear. I would happily drive to Ruston every two years. I would drive to Tulsa(albeit not happily) every two years. Memphis has good BBQ. Isn't UAB close to the ocean.

NT80 · January 14, 2007

Who pissed in your Cheerios this morning?

We're fightin' for a CUSA spot here in this thread, we can be friends later....

ltudchi72 · January 14, 2007

We're fightin' for a CUSA spot here in this thread, we can be friends later....

Based upon the records from this years football games, the Belt is better than CUSA.

Besides, its not like they are interviewing candidates right now.

January 14, 2007

Don't we need a baseball team before we carry this much further?

ColoradoEagle · January 14, 2007

CUSA was in five bowls this year, SBC was in two. CUSA is ranked at #10 currently in RPI, while SBC is ranked #21. CUSA has the preseason pick for #1 baseball team in the nation. Moving to CUSA is definitely an upgrade, even if you leave out the fact that we'd be playing against teams with much greater draw than any SBC team.

Edited January 14, 2007 by ColoradoEagle

January 14, 2007

If SMU can somehow drum up enough support to keep us out of CUSA then we'll probably get what we deserve. I have yet to hear a kind remark about SMU from this board. Au contraire, we seem to bad-mouth them on every occasion. Yet, we expect them to support us with open arms on CUSA membership?

Maybe it's because I'm a Methodist but I know several dozen SMU grads and not one is a snob nor considers North Texas grads as white trash. Every school has its share of snobs; it's just more prevalent in the private schools that have inflated tuition. Baylor, TCU, Rice, Duke, Vanderbilt, Ivy leaguers are all full of themselves and SMU is no different.

Don't get me wrong, I'd like to play and beat them every year in every sport. It should be a fairly even competition now so we don't have to be envious of them. Because I'd like to play them every year, I'd like it to be a friendly rivalry and not get into name-calling except before games.

Now back to the original thread. If we are where I think we'll be within three years, I think that we are the prime candidate for CUSA. Those improvements would be a new stadium, improved basketball, 25,000 attendance average, and a conference championship or two. Had we continued as we were under DD then I think that Troy would be the leading choice. Louisiana Tech has a chance to make a statement but they would have to elevate their financial commitment to make much of an impact. Arkansas State would likely be next in the mix. It's a shame but my second favorite team in the SBC, the University of Louisiana at Lafayette, would probably be out in the cold primarily due to state funds.

CaribbeanGreen · January 14, 2007

If SMU can somehow drum up enough support to keep us out of CUSA then we'll probably get what we deserve. I have yet to hear a kind remark about SMU from this board. Au contraire, we seem to bad-mouth them on every occasion. Yet, we expect them to support us with open arms on CUSA membership?
Maybe it's because I'm a Methodist but I know several dozen SMU grads and not one is a snob nor considers North Texas grads as white trash. Every school has its share of snobs; it's just more prevalent in the private schools that have inflated tuition. Baylor, TCU, Rice, Duke, Vanderbilt, Ivy leaguers are all full of themselves and SMU is no different.

Oh, you did NOT go there, girlfriend.

statefanatic · January 14, 2007

UNT might want to watch out for ASU. We are trying to get in CUSA too. We have 3 CUSA teams on our schedule for 2007. 2 of them are at home and 1 away. We played Memphis in football and basketball in 2006 and are playing them twice in baseball and at home in football in 2007. USM has been very friendly to us since the 2005 NO bowl game and is playing a home and home with us in football starting this year. We upgraded our stadium by adding new turf last year. By the end of 2007 we will have played 6 CUSA football games and 3 of them were home and home games.

JayDub · January 14, 2007

Don't we need a baseball team before we carry this much further?

That would be nice...but shouldn't we put something into developing a semi-successful basketball team first? We won't be going anywhere, C-USA or otherwise, without showing we have plans for success in basketball.

Grow what you already have...

emmitt01 · January 14, 2007

That would be nice...but shouldn't we put something into developing a semi-successful basketball team first? We won't be going anywhere, C-USA or otherwise, without showing we have plans for success in basketball.
Grow what you already have...

Last I checked 12-5 qualified as "semi-successful." Any conjecture about whether that record will stay looking pretty is just that, conjecture.

JayDub · January 14, 2007

Last I checked 12-5 qualified as "semi-successful." Any conjecture about whether that record will stay looking pretty is just that, conjecture.

12-5 does qualify...but getting there consistently would be nice. Some promotion to get people out to the games would be nice (I know, I haven't been there lately...but I have an excuse). And some sort of success in the conference tourney would help, too.