There were warning signs for years!

[FirefightnRick]

Rick, not trying to get into this foray, but with regards to the win over SMU and future recruiting, I doubt that victory will make one iota of difference in DD's recruiting.  Heck, if four conference champions and four appearances in the NO Bowl on national TV didn't land us solid recruits like we thought, then that little win over SMU sure won't.

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That wasn't in regards to DD's recruiting but to NT's recruiting. The coaches from both schools will compete for recruits this next season regardless of who they are(Bennett or his replacement, DD or his replacement). And when that time comes NT will have the edge this next off season.

Rick

[Guest GrayEagleOne]

95 was a brutal year but this one could be worse. In 95 we scored more points at this juncture and didn't lose one by more than 41 points. We were also scoring at 50-75% more than we are this year. All that with a tougher schedule because we were an independent and did not have a soft part of the schedule.

To me, the year of comparison should be Dickey's first year....1998. Here's some of the players that Dickey inherited: Hut Allred, Phillip Armour, John Baker, Scott Blank, Lawrence Ellis, Brad Kassell, Phillip Littlejohn, Andy Lott, Jarrod Martin, Brod McGrew, Corbin Montgomery, Heath Moody, Ron Paris, Vince Patterson, the Pertile brothers, Andre Phillips, Jeff Rodgers, Brian Waters, Ja'Quay Welborn, Brad Winn and Detrion Woodson. Someone tell me that we are better now than that group. The biggest flaw was at quarterback where we used Jason Attaway, Richard Bridges and LaDarrin McLane. We have more potential now.

IMO, our worst team was Rod Rust's last year. They seemed to play with no emothion, much like last Saturday. Personally, I think I'd take the 95 team over this one. They might not be quite as talented but they played as hard as they could.

[PlummMeanGreen]

95 was a brutal year but this one could be worse.  In 95 we scored more points at this juncture and didn't lose one by more than 41 points.  We were also scoring at 50-75% more than we are this year.  All that with a tougher schedule because we were an independent and did not have a soft part of the schedule.

To me, the year of comparison should be Dickey's first year....1998.  Here's some of the players that Dickey inherited:  Hut Allred, Phillip Armour, John Baker, Scott Blank, Lawrence Ellis, Brad Kassell, Phillip Littlejohn, Andy Lott, Jarrod Martin, Brod McGrew, Corbin Montgomery, Heath Moody, Ron Paris, Vince Patterson, the Pertile brothers, Andre Phillips, Jeff Rodgers, Brian Waters, Ja'Quay Welborn, Brad Winn and Detrion Woodson.  Someone tell me that we are better now than that group.  The biggest flaw was at quarterback where we used Jason Attaway, Richard Bridges and LaDarrin McLane.  We have more potential now. 

IMO, our worst team was Rod Rust's last year. They seemed to play with no emothion, much like last Saturday.  Personally, I think I'd take the 95 team over this one.  They might not be quite as talented but they played as hard as they could.

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And didn't most every 1995 Mean Green football game (home and away) get televised here in the DFW Metroplex?

And GrayEagleOne, we all remember what new head football coach who came to Denton after Rust's disasterous year came in here like the Pied Piper, raised in 2 months what would be the equivalent of $1,000,000 today and we went from being a very bad Rod Rust football team to tying for the Missouri Valley Conference football championship under Coach Hayden Fry. Jeez! If we can only live long enough to see all this happen just one more time with a similar hire, Jack (and many of you others who were around back then, too).

Of course, the ol' Mo' Valley that Fry's team tied for its championship in 1973 had mostly schools now in the Big East and CUSA as I recall. It was a shame the MVC did not have a bowl tie-in or AD/Head Football Coach Fry would have never taken us out of that league.

Edited October 3, 2006 by PlummMeanGreen

[FirefightnRick]

95 was a brutal year but this one could be worse.  In 95 we scored more points at this juncture and didn't lose one by more than 41 points.  We were also scoring at 50-75% more than we are this year.  All that with a tougher schedule because we were an independent and did not have a soft part of the schedule.

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Schedule wise we had two 1-AA programs on our schedule(soft part of the schedule) back in '95 and lost to one of them. Currently the Belt is one of if not the only conference left that has not lost to a 1-AA team. Strength of Schedule wise it could be argued that this year going in was tougher as well. In '95 we didn't play three defending conference champions, including the defending national champions in 3 of the first 4 weeks. In considering the points of margins, losing/winning wise imagine what our margins of losses would be if DD faced 11 or 12 OOC games due to being an indy in a single season? Keep in mind Simon didn't have a philosophy that a 3 point win was enough. DD does.

As in '95 we could end up with only two wins this year but overall we are light years ahead as a program in '06 than in '95.

Rick

Edited October 3, 2006 by FirefightnRick

[GrandGreen]

In 1995, NT was 2-9 which was not bad imo based on it being the first year back in 1a and the vast majority of the squad was recruited when NT was 1aa. It was also the toughest schedule NT has ever played. DD would have fainted on the spot if he was handed the 1995 schedule. He thinks the 2006 schedule is tough.

I don't think I have ever been prounder of a NT team than in 1995. NT played 4 home games included one at Texas Stadium. They played Missouri, OKlahoma, Nevada, LSU, Alabama, UNLV and Louisville on the road. They did go 1-1 against 1aa schools but also beat Oregon State. Imo only the last game in 1995 a lopsided loss to Louisville can be compared to the beatings NT has suffered the last 3 weeks.

It is bad sign when we are comparing a relatively mature 1a program with their first year back in 1a. The major difference between the two years, was the 1995 team was building a program and played as hard as any team ever at NT versus the 2006 version which is at this point is lost.

[FirefightnRick]

The major difference between the two years, was the 1995 team was building a program and played as hard as any team ever at NT versus the 2006 version which is at this point is lost.

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The major difference was the guy's on the sidelines. One saw the '95 schedule as an opportunity. The other would have seen the '95 season as, well, you stated it just fine yourself.

And to keep this thread on track before it dies a much needed death, I didn't intend to compare the two teams but to compare the state of the program overall. It's a very tough thing to compare the teams when your talking about two complete different coaching styles. Simon's idea, much like 99% of football coaches I have watched over the years wanted to go out and score, as much as he could, as often, as early etc. DD would settle for a 1-0 win if he could figure out how.

Regardless of this year's team compared to the '95 team, we are not starting over from scratch now like we were in '95 which is the main thing I want to reiterate. And neither are we starting over talent wise. There is still some very good speed and talent on this team. The best QB in the group very well just might be redshirting this year. Our O line will only be losing one starter. At the end of this season the tank won't be on empty.

I just want everyone to look forward to the fact that if there is a change it will be a very exciting time for NT and we certainly will not be starting over. Idaho set a season ticket record for sales when Ericson was announced as their coach. You can simply look at what Stockstill did for MTSU in only 9 months with fewer scholarships and with only 14 recruits and all of McCollum's talent. Their fanbase was ready for a change and they showed it by showing up 22K strong on a Thursday night to see the BlueRaiders play FIU. Will we have 22K on saturday, homecoming to see us play FIU? Don't hold your breath on that.

Rick

[flyonthewall]

Just a coach who doesn't see this as a "difficult situation" but and opportunity would be a breath of fresh air. I can't wait to here what DD has to say if we have a poor performance on Saturday. It is too bad that we do not have a radio show so that we could look at him face to face like last year.