Here is a look at the OOC games

calvin · September 25, 2006

1998: OU, Texas Tech, Arizona St., Texas A&M, Houston, Kansas

1999: UNLV, LSU, Tech, Baylor, TCU

2000: Baylor, Tech, UNLV, K-St., Samford, UL-Lafayette

2001: TCU, OU, Tech, SOuth Florida, Troy St, Colorado State

2002: Texas, Nicholls St., Alabama, TCU, Arizona, South Florida, Cincy

2003: OU, Baylor, Air Force, Arkansas, Troy St., Memphis

2004: Texas, Florida Atl., Colorado, Baylor, Southern Miss.

2005: Tulsa, K-St., LSU, La Tech

2006: Texas, SMU, Tulsa, AKron

Here are the 49 games in the Dickey era............by looking and thinking back, we should have been the favorite in 10 of those games, and by going back and looking we should have had a realistic shot at winning 20 of those games..........So by my logic we could have won 20 out of 49, but of the 20 we were only favored or should have been favored in 10..................................I cant stand it when all people do is write down 8-41 in big bold letters.........tell me what coach in America would have 25-24 record in that OOC schedule ? There is no doubt we have got to be more competitive but just to put down 8-41 doesnt tell the whole story...............

GoMeanGreen1999 · September 25, 2006

1998: OU, Texas Tech, Arizona St., Texas A&M, Houston, Kansas
1999: UNLV, LSU, Tech, Baylor, TCU
2000: Baylor, Tech, UNLV, K-St., Samford, UL-Lafayette
2001: TCU, OU, Tech, SOuth Florida, Troy St, Colorado State
2002: Texas, Nicholls St., Alabama, TCU, Arizona, South Florida, Cincy
2003: OU, Baylor, Air Force, Arkansas, Troy St., Memphis
2004: Texas, Florida Atl., Colorado, Baylor, Southern Miss.
2005: Tulsa, K-St., LSU, La Tech
2006: Texas, SMU, Tulsa, AKron
Here are the 49 games in the Dickey era............by looking and thinking back, we should have been the favorite in 10 of those games, and by going back and looking we should have had a realistic shot at winning 20 of those games..........So by my logic we could have won 20 out of 49, but of the 20 we were only favored or should have been favored in 10..................................I cant stand it when all people do is write down 8-41 in big bold letters.........tell me what coach in America would have 25-24 record in that OOC schedule ? There is no doubt we have got to be more competitive but just to put down 8-41 doesnt tell the whole story...............
←

Your right it does not, but in the last 3 years, we are what 1 -11 in OOC games (can't remember if we won in 2004 vs. FA). And that is after what should have been great recruiting as the result of our conf titles. So looking at it from that stand point, we going down, not up.

September 25, 2006

I count 35 that we should have been competitive enough to win..

8-35 should be the stat people should quote?

1998: Tech, Houston, Kansas

1999: UNLV, Tech, Baylor, TCU

2000: Baylor, Tech, UNLV, Samford, UL-Lafayette

2001: TCU, Tech, SOuth Florida, Troy St, Colorado State

2002: Nicholls St., Alabama, TCU, Arizona, South Florida, Cincy

2003: Baylor, Air Force, Troy St., Memphis

2004: Florida Atl., Baylor, Southern Miss.

2005: Tulsa, La Tech

2006: SMU, Tulsa, AKron

There is no team on this list that we SHOULDN'T have the talent to compete with..

CaribbeanGreen · September 25, 2006

I count 35 that we should have been competitive enough to win..
8-35 should be the stat people should quote?
1998: Tech, Houston, Kansas
1999: UNLV, Tech, Baylor, TCU
2000: Baylor, Tech, UNLV, Samford, UL-Lafayette
2001: TCU, Tech, SOuth Florida, Troy St, Colorado State
2002: Nicholls St., Alabama, TCU, Arizona, South Florida, Cincy
2003: Baylor, Air Force, Troy St., Memphis
2004: Florida Atl., Baylor, Southern Miss.
2005: Tulsa, La Tech
2006: SMU, Tulsa, AKron
There is no team on this list that we SHOULDN'T have the talent to compete with..
←

Do you really think we are on par talent wise with:

Alabama, Texas Tech, Kansas, TCU, Colorado State, Arizona, Southern Miss?

Not flaming by any means, legitimately asking. I think you know a lot more about the ins and outs of this team than I do -- just asking based on a pretty confident view that nationally we'd be viewed as at a severe talent disadvantage against any of these schools -- hell, we were viewed by everyone outside of Denton as having a severe talent deficiency to SMU.

shaft · September 25, 2006

This just goes to show how the program has improved letting us move away from 2-3 body bag games per season to 1 money game & a bunch of regional rivals.

Obviously the next step is to become competitive in those OOC games.

Green Jackal · September 25, 2006

Out of all of these teams, which ones don't have better facilities, bigger budgets, higher paid coaches and better recruits?

Samford - no brainer

ULL - I would consider them our peer, but their head coach is paid more than DD

Troy - Same conference makes them our peer, but their current stadium is awesome

Nicholls State - no brainer

Florida Atlantic - no brainer

That comes to 5. All of the other teams are in better conferences with bigger athletic budgets. So we did more with less on three of those wins (Baylor, SMU, Memphis). Now conference wise last year, we had several losses to our peers, but prior to that we were beating them consistantly.

eulesseagle · September 25, 2006

Green Jackel---

This is just "simple math."

DD as OC at UTEP and SMU .........................13-31-1 (29%)

DD as HC....................................................40-58 (40%)

DD in OOC games.........................................8-41 (16%)

When you ONLY have "one" and I repeat "one" SBC team after the end of the year with a winning record who are you going to give Coach of the Year to???

Sure we won the last 4 out of 5 SBC titles and won "one" N.O. Bowl (25%)

These are sub-standard figures in any accountant's books.

Like I said Green Jackel.....this is just "simple math."

CaribbeanGreen · September 25, 2006

Sure we won the last 4 out of 5 SBC titles and won "one" N.O. Bowl (25%)
These are sub-standard figures in any accountant's books.
←

I want your accountant.

meanrob · September 25, 2006

Do you really think we are on par talent wise with:
Alabama, Texas Tech, Kansas, TCU, Colorado State, Arizona, Southern Miss?
Not flaming by any means, legitimately asking. I think you know a lot more about the ins and outs of this team than I do -- just asking based on a pretty confident view that nationally we'd be viewed as at a severe talent disadvantage against any of these schools -- hell, we were viewed by everyone outside of Denton as having a severe talent deficiency to SMU.
←

Alabama, Tech, CSU? No. When we played those teams they had an distinct talent advantage.

Did we have the talent to beat Kansas, TCU, Arizona, and USM when we played them? Yes.

By using that standard, the victories over Tech shouldn't count.

1998 Houston, Kansas

1999: UNLV, Baylor, TCU

2000: Baylor, UNLV, Samford, UL-Lafayette

2001: TCU, SOuth Florida, Troy St,

2002: Nicholls St., TCU, Arizona, South Florida, Cincy

2003: Baylor, Air Force, Troy St., Memphis

2004: Florida Atl., Baylor, Southern Miss.

2005: Tulsa, La Tech

2006: SMU, Tulsa, AKro

Unless I'm wrong, in games we could've won we are 7-22.

And 16 of those losses were by double digits.

Again my math may be slightly off.

Out of those games I think 9 teams had winning records. 9 out of 29.

Hell just use the years we were conference champs 2001-2004, Dickey's best teams.

We were 4-11 with one win against Nichols State.

and 2-9 against non-BCS schools.

yeah, i know too much info but the point is we should've won some of those games.

September 25, 2006

Do you really think we are on par talent wise with:
Alabama, Texas Tech, Kansas, TCU, Colorado State, Arizona, Southern Miss?
Not flaming by any means, legitimately asking. I think you know a lot more about the ins and outs of this team than I do -- just asking based on a pretty confident view that nationally we'd be viewed as at a severe talent disadvantage against any of these schools -- hell, we were viewed by everyone outside of Denton as having a severe talent deficiency to SMU.
←

I didn't leave in Alabama did I? I didn't mean to.

Yes.. When Kansas was listed.. THEY SUCKED big time. We should have hung with them. Middle schools were srimmaging about them and sometimes winning.

TCU? Yes.. we have played them closely (13-10 the last time).

Colorado State? Oh yes. I am from Colorado. All my family has gone to CSU .. They are VERY similar to us. They have recruiting troubles. They don't have student support. They aren't well funded. We should compete with them.

Texas Tech? That is a maybe. As of late, I say no .. they have better offensive coaching. But when we played them? Yes.. we should have been competitive.

Arizona? Good lord.. .at the time they were TERRIBLE.

Southern Miss? I really hoped we were approaching their level. They get the scraps of the recruiting battles.. they aren't a big time program.. but they are light years ahead of us.

eulesseagle · September 25, 2006

Caribbean--

You can not be serious can you????

When your total OUTPUT is 29%(wins as oc), 40%(total wins at UNT), 16%(win in ooc games) and 25%(NO Bowl wins) that is, in your humble opinion, acceptable......????

Dude, this is just "simple math." Do you see any figures that resemble an overall winning record??

In your heart you know that I am right!

CaribbeanGreen · September 25, 2006

Caribbean--
You can not be serious can you????
When your total OUTPUT is 29%(wins as oc), 40%(total wins at UNT), 16%(win in ooc games) and 25%(NO Bowl wins) that is, in your humble opinion, acceptable......????
Dude, this is just "simple math." Do you see any figures that resemble an overall winning record??
In your heart you know that I am right!
←

4 conference titles in 5 years, and pretty much across-the-board recognized WIDESPREAD improvement in the program as a whole (see the poll, LongJim's post, etc.).

I honestly don't think this is even DEBATABLE, is it?!? Did I miss something in the Big West years???

Do you really believe what you are saying, that the DD era is unacceptable? I mean, I understand if people think that we need to go another direction to get to that "next level" -- may not agree just yet, but understand -- but do you really think that what was accomplished here over DD's tenure was unacceptable???

Say what you want about our conference -- but it is our conference, and I still don't see one reason we should be placed on some pedestal above our conference mates -- but there is not ONE program ANYWHERE on ANY level in ANY conference that would deem FOUR CHAMPIONSHIPS IN FIVE YEARS unacceptable. Period. End of story. End of debate.

If you want to say that DD isn't the future of this program and you want a change for the future, that's your opinion and i'm sure you can argue that. But I have to believe the crazy "DD's career is unacceptable" is just passionate knee-jerk -- and hey, if so, that's great - that kind of passion just means you care.

El Paso Eagle · September 25, 2006

4 conference titles in 5 years, and pretty much across-the-board recognized WIDESPREAD improvement in the program as a whole (see the poll, LongJim's post, etc.).
I honestly don't think this is even DEBATABLE, is it?!? Did I miss something in the Big West years???
←

Another way to ask this question - Would we have won "4 in 5" if we were in the Big West - As much as my heart says maybe, the rest of me says no-way. The Sun Belt did help UNT fill good about ourselves and did offer a spring board to bigger and better things. However our lack of OOC competitiveness and they cold hard fact that for the most part the rest of the Sun Belt teams sucked for the most part did not help us. The “4 in 5” did give us the window to make something happen but my fear is that we let the window close. It looks like the rest of the Belt is catching up to us (or my bigger nightmare – we're dropping down to their levels). Don’t get me wrong, as much as I have bitched about Dickey Ball I would love for him to turn around things and have myself and others say “wow, we almost screwed-up and ran him out”. But I don’t think that will happen.

untbowler · September 25, 2006

so juding by some of the theories here, we are better off playing, San Jose State, Idaho, Buffalo, E Michigan, and Utah state becaue we would be favord to win those. Geez this is college footbal and upsets do happen everywhere but at UNT apparently. We upset SMU then forgot what we did to win. SMU took their ass-kicking and blew out Arky state. Do you think DD and RF are smart enough to scout that tape so we can beat ASU??

It is a joke to think we should not win any game we are not favored in. Guess we can expect maybe 1-2 more wins these year because we will not be the favorite in 75% of our remaining games. Maybe MTSU and ASU and that is it.

Raise the expectations a little bit and not be satisfied with New Orleans or bust, whether it is with DD or someone else.

CaribbeanGreen · September 25, 2006

so juding by some of the theories here, we are better off playing, San Jose State, Idaho, Buffalo, E Michigan, and Utah state becaue we would be favord to win those. Geez this is college footbal and upsets do happen everywhere but at UNT apparently. We upset SMU then forgot what we did to win. SMU took their ass-kicking and blew out Arky state. Do you think DD and RF are smart enough to scout that tape so we can beat ASU??
It is a joke to think we should not win any game we are not favored in. Guess we can expect maybe 1-2 more wins these year because we will not be the favorite in 75% of our remaining games. Maybe MTSU and ASU and that is it.
Raise the expectations a little bit and not be satisfied with New Orleans or bust, whether it is with DD or someone else.
←

I disagree on where we'll be the favorite - even as someone who is not on the Fire DD/Abandon Ship! bandwagon just yet, I feel we should expect to win each SBC game on our schedule. There isn't an excuse for being whipped in conference - after 2-9, if that happens again, then I'll be in the executioner's line with you all. I feel like more than 1 SBC loss is enough just cause to make a move, though I'm not sure what it would take in reality given DD's contract status. That being said, I feel like MTSU and ASU will still be a couple of the tougher teams in the Belt. FAU and La-Mo should be the weak sisters, though we can't take anyone for granted.

Look, I'm not saying I wouldn't love to be more competitive in non-con games. Hell yes i would be. I just know where we were when i was at NT in the late 90's, and I can see how far we've come. All I'm defending is the contrary of the ludicrous (to me) thought that DD's tenure has been a substandard failure given the results. That doesn't mean for one second I want to win OOC games any less than any of the rest of you.