Developer Plans 50,000 SF at UNT's Gate

Microxot · May 21, 2006

I was just watching TV when Channel 4 news had a quick report on this subject. They said a Houston company was buying up property on Fry street for an 8 story building, but Nobody at the company would make any comments other than a nationwide pharmacy has commited to one of the spots.

Zeke · May 21, 2006

thought I would pass this on to people worried about the new Fry Street being a run down strip center. Hermes Architects has been hired as the company to help design the new Fry Street, they have a portfolio up of previous work.
http://www.hermesarchitects.com/homepage.html
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adman · May 21, 2006

I was just watching TV when Channel 4 news had a quick report on this subject. They said a Houston company was buying up property on Fry street for an 8 story building, but Nobody at the company would make any comments other than a nationwide pharmacy has commited to one of the spots.
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8 Stories? I know they're planning mixed use but I thought multi-family dwellings were limited to 3 or 4 stories in Denton.? Retail will be ground floor of course but 7 stories of multi family? Sure they could potentially get a variance but that opens the barn door for other developers in other areas of Denton to do/ask for the same. Not to mention 8 stories might be a bit excessive considering the area etc.

stebo · May 23, 2006

8 Stories? I know they're planning mixed use but I thought multi-family dwellings were limited to 3 or 4 stories in Denton.? Retail will be ground floor of course but 7 stories of multi family? Sure they could potentially get a variance but that opens the barn door for other developers in other areas of Denton to do/ask for the same. Not to mention 8 stories might be a bit excessive considering the area etc.
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It will be 8 stories high, not actually eight stories. I have been finding out more and more about what is planned (rumours at least from the guys down there)... What they are hearing is a Walgreens or CVS in the spot where the Tomato is with apartments on that. The Drugstore would be the center focus building. It would also be the gateway to the elevators and stairs for the private dorms upstairs. So look at a normal Walgreens, it is at least 3 stories high. Then add a few apartments on top of it (which are taller then the average story) and you have a net of about 8 stories.

The business owners I have talked to are very sad for their neighbors but very excited about the development. All those kids living that close will be good for business and they won't have to worriy about drinking and driving. The old nestors should be happy, too - the drugstore is supposedly gonna have a retro theme and even a soda fountain - much like the drugstores that used to populate the Fry Street area before the bars came around.

notahippie · June 1, 2006

Just to be a voice of reason here, not all of us against this are hippies. The idea that we all are is laughable at best. I am a public school teacher who graduated from UNT in 2000. I *still* live in Denton. I chose to live here. I am married, older, and a professional who doesn't want to see historic buildings destroyed.

The people organizing the fight against this aren't against improvement. Let's face it--even to the hardest of Fry Street fans it looks in need of repair. But it hasn't always. We have our hands on pictures from the 1920's--these buildings are THAT old. They are part of this city--much like the historic buildings on and around the square.

Those organizing this movement aren't all college students. In fact, most aren't. We have historians, political leaders, community business owners and leaders, alumni, and more.

Local business is part of Denton. Anyone can be Plano. But we're Denton. Home to small and wonderful places--many of which, like Mr. Chopsticks, have been in the area 20+ years. The demolishment of Fry Street could mean the destruction of most of what Denton is--small establishments in a historic environment.

Seriously, if you haven't looked, go to the site. Read up on what we're planning. We're not against development or improvement--just against destruction of historical and cultural icons. Read up on the history of Denton's Fry Street.

http://www.savefrystreet.com and http://www.centraldentonpreservation.org

UNTFan23 · June 1, 2006

The buildings on Fry/Oak Street are indeed old, but I'd say they are far from historic. The court house in the Square has far more historic relevance then a couple buildings that have had seen many different businesses over the change of time. The architecture isn't anything special as well. If you're going to say Fry St is also the center of the music scene in Denton, then I'd say you're about 10 years too late. When Rick's burned down, and the other music clubs (like the Argo) in that area closed, the music scene moved away. About the only real thing that Fry St is now is a couple bars and some "hole-in-the-wall" eateries, but nothing significant.

If the businesses on Fry St had done what the businesses around the Square had done, and worked real hard to clean up the area, then they'd have a good case at not having those buildings razed.

Face it, Fry St used to be what Deep Ellum is now at a fraction of the size.

MeanGreenNation · June 1, 2006

The buildings on Fry/Oak Street are indeed old, but I'd say they are far from historic.

Far from historic eh? I guess 1920 isn't historic enough for you then. You really should check out the sites "notahippie" posted

http://www.savefrystreet.com and http://www.centraldentonpreservation.org

The Central Denton Preservation site has a bunch of old photos of the Fry St. area and the collection is growing rapidly. We even found one with troops out in front of the buildings celebrating "getting back from the trenches."

Also check out the public meeting tonight at Dans Silver Leaf, it will be from 7-9 p.m.

It will be very informative; the group has made civic contact with the developer so we now have an open dialogue with him. Come tonight for more information.

UNTFan23 · June 2, 2006

Downtown Fort Worth is loaded with "historic buildings", many of which have been very well maintained. However, you'll also notice that some of the buildings have been razed in the name of progress.

You don't get a sense of historic grandeur while walking down Fry/Oak street (especially at night). Much of the brick has been painted over. To me, the entire area looks "tired" and "worn". Something can be built in the place of those buildings that has a retro feel to it without looking like it was a transplant from Plano.

If I want to get a real sense of history, New Orleans is perhaps the best place I've ever been to with the French Quarter and Bourbon St.

THOR · June 2, 2006

Just because a building is old, doesn't mean it has historic value and shouldn't be torn down. I'm for making things better. If Fry street needs to be changed, so be it. The people will still visit.

NTEagle08 · June 2, 2006

Just because something is old doesn't just give it historic value. Using that theory that means dilapidated buildings could claim historical value just because they had been there a while.

I may have only lived in Denton for 3 years, but it's not like I can say, "Oh this happened here X years ago" and impress someone with Fry Street.

Edited June 2, 2006 by NTEagle08

adman · June 2, 2006

Just because something is old doesn't just give it historic value. Using that theory that means dilapidated buildings could claim historical value just because they had been there a while.
I may have only lived in Denton for 3 years, but it's not like I can say, "Oh this happened here X years ago" and impress someone with Fry Street.
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I agree. The Coliseum in Rome looks like total ass. Part of it isn't even there. I heard back in the day they used to have some pretty awesome shows there but its time has come and gone. Tear that shit down. Nothing should stand in the way of progress.

NTEagle08 · June 2, 2006

I agree. The Coliseum in Rome looks like total ass. Part of it isn't even there. I heard back in the day they used to have some pretty awesome shows there but its time has come and gone. Tear that shit down. Nothing should stand in the way of progress.
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Putting words into my mouth, I never said it like that. To compare Fry Street to the Roman Coliseum is a crazy jump. I meant that Fry Street can't be claimed as historical because other than buildings dating back from the 20's, what claim to history does it really have?

MeanGreenNation · June 2, 2006

Just because a building is old, doesn't mean it has historic value and shouldn't be torn down. I'm for making things better. If Fry street needs to be changed, so be it. The people will still visit.
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You may me surprised at some of the things that happened....

- Norah Jones used to play shows back when Baghari's was Jims Diner

- Charles "Tex" Watson of the Manson family used to live in the Fry. St. Apartments

- Fry. St was actually named after a Sheriff William S. Fry who was respected for cleaning up crime in Denton.

- The Argo is the main reason places like Hailey's and Rubber Gloves exist, they where one of the first places to bring in national acts, I'm not sure but Rick's may have been a first.

- In that parking lot behind all the buildings there used to be bungalow style housing that students would hide out in to avoid the draft.

We are finding out more and more about this area the more research we are doing.

You do have a point about the way the buildings look. Many of the tenants have not kept the buildings up as they should have. Notice the side of the tomato graphite is covered up with white paint rather than the same color used on the wall. We are trying to change things like this as well.

Our goal is to at least save that "L" of buildings along Hickory and Fry. The insides may end up being gutted, but the outer structure would still stand. Granted we lose local businesses but we feel national chains won't survive there and local flavor will eventually return.

Look at the Gap in Austin on Guadalupe (spelling?) that store did not survive. If we are able to save the existing structure you will at least have a cultural and historic icon still remaining. Face it Fry St. makes Denton what it is, or at least part of it and I feel that is a fairly large part of it. Let all these developers put up their stores on the Loop and I-35, take down that damn Desert Sands motel and build something there, but keep out of historic districts. If this keeps going on there will be no flavor left in Denton and we will be another cookie cutter town like Frisco or Flower Mound.

Edited June 2, 2006 by MeanGreenNation

June 2, 2006

> Norah Jones used to play shows back when Baghari's was Jims Diner

Jim's Diner wasn't around when Norah Jones went to UNT. I am older than Norah and Jim's was only open for one year while I was UNT before it turned into Bagharis. I knew a chick named Molly that LOOKED justed like Norah Jones and sang like a bird .. she and Rob G and the Latin Pimps used to play at Bageris. She, too, left UNT early and moved to NYC to persue a career in music.

> Charles "Tex" Watson of the Manson family used to live in the Fry. St. Apartments

No one is tearing down apartments.

> Fry. St was actually named after a Sheriff William S. Fry who was respected for cleaning up crime in Denton.

Then he would be proud of his namesake street being cleaned up again.

> The Argo is the main reason places like Hailey's and Rubber Gloves exist, they where one of the first places to bring in national acts, I'm not sure but Rick's may have been a first.

No way. The Argo was a good place and all, but certianly didn't lead to Haileys. If anything Rubber Gloves has brought in more "national" talent that spurred on the growth of Haileys.

> In that parking lot behind all the buildings there used to be bungalow style housing that students would hide out in to avoid the draft.

The house is gone? So it is already torn down?

>... but we feel national chains won't survive there and local flavor will eventually return.

Local flavor will always be around. Once all the Piggly Wigglys were out of business around town and the Albertson's and Kroger took over, did all the local flair go with it? There is still tons of "Denton" stuff around the campus.

>but keep out of historic districts.

Fry St isn't historic though. Why isn't that area already marked "historic?" I bet it is because the business owners didn't want to put up with all the paperwork involved... that really came aroung to bite them in the ass.

June 2, 2006

I definitely think keeping the facade of the old L shaped buildings would be great.

I am not torn up about losing the local business though. They can move, find cheaper rent around campus and continue to serve the beloved pizza.

I love the Fry area. I still go to Riprocks for the Shiner pitchers and Cool Beans for their Veggie Tacos. I don't need to be sitting in a dump for it to have "local flair."

Build a Jazz lounge. Build a drugstore so students don't need cars to go grocery shopping. Build an all UNT football bar ... There are tons of things that area can support and still have their local flair.

Most of that block is a parking lot anyhow.

NTEagle08 · June 5, 2006

Interesting article from the DRC: http://www.dentonrc.com/sharedcontent/dws/...h.51f2415a.html

Interesting part of the article is that Joe Normile was offered 1.2 million for that closed, run down gas station, and he turned it down, how crazy can you be?

MeanGreenNation · June 5, 2006

Interesting article from the DRC: http://www.dentonrc.com/sharedcontent/dws/...h.51f2415a.html
Interesting part of the article is that Joe Normile was offered 1.2 million for that closed, run down gas station, and he turned it down, how crazy can you be?
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You may have also noticed Gene at Campus Barber has not yet sold, the owner of Rip Rocks and Lou's was also offered money for those properties and they turned it down. That was actually new news. There had been no previous mention of United Equities being interested in those properties. I have to wonder if that information is substantiated or not though.

The DRC did misquote Buster Freedman as saying he wanted to bring in CVS and Starbucks. He never said such thing. I don't think Buster is the monster some people are making him out to be. He seems willing to listen to the Save Fry St. group and some compromise may be reached.

June 5, 2006

You may have also noticed Gene at Campus Barber has not yet sold, the owner of Rip Rocks and Lou's was also offered money for those properties and they turned it down. That was actually new news. There had been no previous mention of United Equities being interested in those properties. I have to wonder if that information is substantiated or not though.
The DRC did misquote Buster Freedman as saying he wanted to bring in CVS and Starbucks. He never said such thing. I don't think Buster is the monster some people are making him out to be. He seems willing to listen to the Save Fry St. group and some compromise may be reached.
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DMN has an article saying the Barber sold for a million bucks. It was enough to change his mind.

NTEagle08 · June 5, 2006

You have to believe if Freedman is paying a million bucks for one building, that he is not looking at keeping most of the area up since it doesn't make economical sense for him to leave all the current structures up. All he is concerned with is rent money, he doesn't care how finacially successful the businesses are, all he cares about is getting that rent check in the mail.