Question for Plum KingDL and others

meangreen11 · March 29, 2006

Does a win at home against SMU get you back on the bandwagon next year?

eulesseagle · March 29, 2006

win 2 OOC games, run the belt and beat the #4 CUSA team in the NO Bowl.

PlummMeanGreen · March 30, 2006

Does a win at home against SMU get you back on the bandwagon next year?
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OK, I take the bite...

What gets many on the bandwagon is a positive, winning direction for our football program that catapults it to Top 25. If Top 25 is not our goal, then what the hell are we doing trying to fit into a NCAA D1-A co-existance anyhow? NCAA D1-AA is not an option, either, so lets just aim for Top 25, eh? You need the hosses to do all that though. Just ask the Boise States or Bowling Greens and they'd tell us the same thing. YOU NEED THE HOSSES (and the right leadership who have a Top 25 mindset!

Attendance at Mean Green football games should be right up there with numbers of career wins over a period of years. IMHO, that should be the case no matter who the head football coach @ UNT is. A school that has over 32,000 students with over 100,000 alums within one hour of its campus football stadium just should not continue to be hovering at around 15,000 (+/-) fans per home game. Are NT leaders happy with 15K per home game averages, too? God help us all if the NCAA ever really gets serious about attendance criteria the way things have been of late in Denton and even during, uh, "4" bowl years?

OK, since some of you brought this subject up in other threads recently, well, uh...............SPEAKING OF HAYDEN FRY: "If "ifs and buts".......Many of us only wish ol' Hay' boy could have been in Mean Green Country when UNT had 32,000 students as it does now; when Denton had 100K+ citizens (as it does now) AND...............Denton County had well over 550,000 citizens as it also does now. We just can't seem to get things happening in syncopation in Mean Green Country. As they say, though, timing is everything and (unfortunately) our timing of late has not always been the best at dear ol' alma mater:(

BOWLING FOR DOLLARS? Just as strange up in "Little D" is how 4 bowl games in a row has yet to capture the fancy of the locals, ie, NT's annual missing links who as we all know by now are the casual or borderline fans; you know, the ones who keep Fouts Field half full (or if half empty is what you prefer).

Some blame it on Dickey Ball or an offensive play calling style that is not exciting those with the "take if or leave it" attitude. We all know them well, they are the ones we don't seem to see after the home season openers, right? But not just Dickey Ball, either? Others blame whatever our shade of green will be for that season, others blame our dis-lodged "NT" lettering set-up or just plain bad karma causing all our problems in Denton. (OK, I'm being a bit facetious with all of that).

Save the BU game a few years ago, it does seem we have had several very nice home season opening crowds at Fouts many of whom (unfortunately) seemed to leave at half time or sometimes in the 3'rd quarter due to lack of interest in Dickey Ball (or rather his style of offense).

BUT STILL...............IMO, there is nothing magical about the SMU game this Fall. How could one game be considered a "program-saver" or even a "job saver" for Darrell Dickey since we have known for 8 years what we can expect to get from a DD-led football program?

FWIW, this is the same man who still hung in there with Ramon Flanagan as the NT offensive coord. and he keeping the ex SMU QB on the NT payroll after almost every Mean Green fan vehemently protested such a continuance after RF's now infamous verbal bruhaha inside Fouts Field in full view and listening distance to many of our Mean Green fandom. It wasn't even so much that one specific event with Ramon Flanagan VERSUS Silver Eagle but what seemed to be an on-going "in your face" condescending attitude that seems to have developed from a hardy handful in recent years from our campus. With private school educated leadership at the top in the NT administration, I don't think those kind of attitudes will be ending anytime soon at our Denton-based Texas public university alma mater.

BACK TO SMuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuu? ? ? ? ? ? ?.....................IMO, winning one game against SMU will hardly take the spots off the hardy handful of leopards presently on the NT athletic staff.

One game versus the Mustangs (win or lose) will not have any affect on the obvious direction that have been set in place for years in our SBC/Bottom 10 level of expectation which our present UNT officials seem to have become quite comfortable and accustomed to the last 8 years. Proof? They just keep extending all this out with extended contracts for all of our watching enjoyment.

Fact still remains that there is still a track record in place. After all, in 8 years one has sorta' already made his or her bed whether they've made that bed most uncomfortably hard (or soft with downey feathers).

Corky Nelson's last NT football team beat SMU back in 1990 at Fouts Field. During that final season Coach Nelson's team finished 6 Wins & 5 Losses but was still fired following his 9'th year at NT. Corky had a career W/L record of 48-52-1 at UNT. His records against OOC (specifically SWC schools) was somewhat impressive inasmuch as he had much less in the areas of facilities and athletic budgets.

ANOTHER MEAN GREEN FOOTBALL COACHING CAREER AFTER 9 YEARS IN DENTON: Corky Neslon was fired as I recall because (basically) NT leadership saw no steady or positive direction in his football programs overall direction. Corky had a 9 year career at UNT. The "Corky Years" were tantamount to a roller coaster ride in many ways, yet in some ways even today, some of you I've heard vent via email or telephone conversation would even welcome back something like the "Corky Years" because at least there were some OOC wins against schools most of our people (and beyond) had heard of.

Yet in the annals of our athletic history at UNT it was (once again) our (then) NT leadership who dropped the ball after the dismissal of Corky Nelson as they continued their ongoing NT legacy of what we seem to specialize in quite well in Denton and that is of not having a clue as to who to hire to be our next head football coach who would come in on the run, advance Mean Green football to a higher level of co-existance while also finding the right hire of one who would be "public relations" minded and one who would mesh well with the entire UNT community.

ANYONE FOR SOME SUDS? SORRY, I MEAN'T, SPUDS? Seems the Idaho U Vandals (remember the Vandals--our former SBC foe?); well, it seems Idaho U just hired one to be their head football coach who is meeting all th criteria that many of you desire for any NT coach to have. If those Idahoan spud-eaters can do something like that with their program, can't a bunch of North Texans pull off something similar when such a time arrives to do so?

Edited March 30, 2006 by PlummMeanGreen

Baby Arm! · March 30, 2006

OK, I take the bite...
Attendance at Mean Green football games should be right up there with numbers of career wins over a period of years. IMHO, that should be the case no matter who the head football coach @ UNT is. A school that has over 32,000 students with over 100,000 alums within one hour of its campus football stadium just should not continue to be hovering at around 15,000 (+/-) fans per home game. Are NT leaders happy with 15K per home game averages, too? God help us all if the NCAA ever really gets serious about attendance criteria the way things have been of late in Denton and even during, uh, "4" bowl years?
OK, since some of you brought this subject up in other threads recently, well, uh...............SPEAKING OF HAYDEN FRY: "If "ifs and buts".......Many of us only wish ol' Hay' boy could have been in Mean Green Country when UNT had 32,000 students as it does now; when Denton had 100K+ citizens (as it does now) AND...............Denton County had well over 550,000 citizens as it also does now. We just can't seem to get things happening in syncopation in Mean Green Country. As they say, though, timing is everything and (unfortunately) our timing of late has not always been the best at dear ol' alma mater:(
BOWLING FOR DOLLARS? Just as strange up in "Little D" is how 4 bowl games in a row has yet to capture the fancy of the locals, ie, NT's annual missing links who as we all know by now are the casual or borderline fans; you know, the ones who keep Fouts Field half full (or if half empty is what you prefer). Some blame it on Dickey Ball or an offensive play calling style that is not exciting the "take if or leave it" MG fans to the extent as to where they want to come to more than just home season openers; others blame our shade of green, our dis-lodged "NT" lettering set-up or just plain bad karma causing all our problems in Denton (OK, I'm being a bit facetious with all that). Save the BU game a few years ago, it does seem we have had several very nice home season opening crowds at Fouts many of whom (unfortunately) seemed to leave at half time or in the 3'rd quarter due to lack of interest in Dickey Ball (or rather his style of offense).
BUT STILL...............IMO, there is nothing magical about the SMU game this Fall. How could one game be considered a "program-saver" or even a "job saver" for Darrell Dickey since we have known for 8 years what we can expect to get from a DD-led football program?
FWIW, this is the same man who still hung in there with Ramon Flanagan as the NT offensive coord. and he keeping the ex SMU QB on the NT payroll after almost every Mean Green fan vehemently protested such a continuance after RF's now infamous verbal bruhaha inside Fouts Field in full view and listening distance to many of our Mean Green fandom. It wasn't even so much that one specific event with Ramon Flanagan VERSUS Silver Eagle but what seemed to be an on-going "in your face" condescending attitude that seems to have developed from a hardy handful in recent years from our campus. With private school educated leadership at the top in the NT administration, I don't think those such attitudes will be ending anytime soon at our Texas public university alma mater.
BACK TO SMuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuu? ? ? ? ? ? ?.....................IMO, winning one game against SMU will hardly take the spots off the hardy handful of leopards presently on the NT athletic staff.
One game versus the Mustangs (win or lose) will not have any affect on the obvious direction that have been set in place for years in our SBC/Bottom 10 level of expectation which our present UNT officials seem to have become quite comfortable and accustomed to the last 8 years. Proof? They just keep extending all this out with extended contracts for all of our watching enjoyment.
Fact still remains that there is still a track record in place. After all, in 8 years one has sorta' already made his or her bed whether they've made that bed most uncomfortably hard (or soft with downey feathers).
Corky Nelson's last NT football team beat SMU back in 1990 at Fouts Field. During that final season Coach Nelson's team finished 6 Wins & 5 Losses but was still fired following his 9'th year at NT. Corky had a career W/L record of 48-52-1 at UNT. His records against OOC (specifically SWC schools) was somewhat impressive inasmuch as he had much less in the areas of facilities and athletic budgets.
ANOTHER MEAN GREEN FOOTBALL COACHING CAREER AFTER 9 YEARS IN DENTON: Corky Neslon was fired as I recall because (basically) NT leadership saw no steady or positive direction in his football programs overall direction. Corky had a 9 year career at UNT. The "Corky Years" were tantamount to a roller coaster ride in many ways, yet in some ways even today, some of you I've heard vent via email or telephone conversation would even welcome back something like the "Corky Years" because at least there were some OOC wins against schools most of our people (and beyond) had heard of.
Yet in the annals of our athletic history at UNT it was (once again) our (then) NT leadership who dropped the ball after the dismissal of Corky Nelson as they continued their ongoing NT legacy of what we seem to specialize in quite well in Denton and that is of not having a clue as to who to hire to be our next head football coach who would come in on the run, advance Mean Green football to a higher level of co-existance while also finding the right hire of one who would be "public relations" minded and one who would mesh well with the entire UNT community.
ANYONE FOR SOME SUDS? SORRY, I MEAN'T, SPUDS? Seems the Idaho U Vandals (remember the Vandals--our former SBC foe?); well, it seems Idaho U just hired one to be their head football coach who is meeting all th criteria that many of you desire for any NT coach to have. If those Idahoan spud-eaters can do something like that with their program, can't a bunch of North Texans pull off something similar when such a time arrives to do so?
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Funny, after all of that and PMG still manages NOT to answer the question

PlummMeanGreen · March 30, 2006

Funny, after all of that and PMG still manages NOT to answer the question
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And that the very reason I added a new 1'st paragraph. Hey! I haven't been taking my ginkho biloba!

KingDL1 · March 30, 2006

No it is going to take much more than just a win against SMU.

In fact a couple of years ago I was hoping DD would really mature and bring our team up the ladder where SMU would be a joke. But just that we are discussing this game the way we are proves DD has not come close to my expectations. I think a loss to SMU will be the same as a termination notice for DD, and if it is not we then know for sure that the BOR, RV and the Admin are completely unconcerned about building a strong football program.

I mean DD will have to have three winning seasons in a row and a total time of 11 years just to break .500 in wining seasons, and I really doubt that is going to happen. For the last five years I have been waiting for DD to get it together and start winning against some solid OOC teams but that came up a big zilch. I was also hoping for better discipline, but nada. I was hoping that DD would pull his head out and really start actively selling UNT sports, I was way off on that one. I was expecting us to continue to improve but in my option the end of the 2002 season was when UNT was at its best in recent times. Did we really see any OOC wins to help legitimize us or our conference, let alone our Sun Belt championships? IF anything DD got complacent.

I don't really know if DD has Greatness in him or not, if he does I doubt we will see it at North Texas. He should move on and get a fresh start and so should we fresh blood is good.