What's the Deal with BYU?

UNTX · February 26, 2006

OK - did we really have the opportunity to have BYU come to Fouts in 2007, and turned it down, or is that message board B.S.?

If we did turn them down - then WTF!? Why? I don't buy the reason that it was more money for us to do so. Even if that is the case, it doesn't make any sense when you consider that I now hear we're adding a I-AA to the home schedule next year. How much are we going to make off of that when we draw 10K for it? How does that help us build a fan base for the future, garner media attention, etc.? It won't help like a home game against BYU would.

I also don't buy that the reason was because we already had our OOC schedule for 2007 set. This is for the 12th game that we may add. Did we really have a 12 game, and one against an OOC opponent scheduled for 2007? Who? If it was to be yet another I-AA, then we should've dumped them for BYU, the buyout would've been worth it.

As for the kind of crowd we'd have for BYU - 25K or more. Guaranteed.

NT91 · February 26, 2006

What is the benefit of haveing a 1-AA team come to Denton.

If we win no big deal. If we lose then it makes the program look bad.

MeanGreenBuzz · February 26, 2006

Is it possible that BYU decided it wasn't a good financial move? Maybe the travel expenses vs payday just didn't add up...

UNTLifer · February 26, 2006

Maybe this is all speculation and no one has the facts yet.

UNT_playmaker · February 26, 2006

i wouldnt be suprised of the UNT admin would schedule any 12th game with any I-AA team out there

UNT needs to save its money to continue our reputation as a music and art school.

buff64 · February 26, 2006

It seems some people are convinced that behind every move their is some sort of conspiracy. I am sure that RV had alot of input into whatever was decided and did what he thought was best for UNT.

the green rokemi · February 26, 2006

It seems some people are convinced that behind every move their is some sort of conspiracy.
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and it all involves SMU

NorthTexasFan · February 26, 2006

and it all involves SMU
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I like that.

LoveMG · February 26, 2006

Fouts is hurting this program more than fans want to believe.

emmitt01 · February 26, 2006

Maybe, just maybe, we hired a man to be our athletic director and we should let him do his job.

Monkeypox · February 26, 2006

Maybe, just maybe, we hired a man to be our athletic director and we should let him do his job.
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sorry, emmitt.

Metropolis777 · February 26, 2006

bYu probably decided it wasn't in their best interest, cost wise, to travel to the metroplex twice in 2006. They are coming to Amon Carter next season.

I'm wondering. I know y'all are looking for another home game for 2006. But, would there be any interest in a home & home with TCU? Play at Amon Carter on 10/14, 10/28, or 11/25 in 2006 and at Fouts in 2007. The going rumor used to be that we would have Grambling as the 12th game but that has fallen through.

Now it looks like our options are West Virginia, North Texas, Houston, a few WAC & MAC teams. West Virginia won't happen & Houston is on record as saying they'll never schedule us again (blah, blah, blah). I think UNT would be best for both of us. But, the question is would y'all play at Amon Carter next year?

P.S. - We would have no problem returning to Fouts in 2007 as we already have 7 home games for 2007. There should be no serious worry that we'd back out of a return.

Edited February 26, 2006 by Metropolis777

Zeke · February 26, 2006

bYu probably decided it wasn't in their best interest, cost wise, to travel to the metroplex twice in 2006. They are coming to Amon Carter next season.
I'm wondering. I know y'all are looking for another home game for 2006. But, would there be any interest in a home & home with TCU? Play at Amon Carter on 10/14, 10/28, or 11/25 in 2006 and at Fouts in 2007. The going rumor used to be that we would have Grambling as the 12th game but that has fallen through.
Now it looks like our options are West Virginia, North Texas, Houston, a few WAC & MAC teams. West Virginia won't happen & Houston is on record as saying they'll never schedule us again (blah, blah, blah). I think UNT would be best for both of us. But, the question is would y'all play at Amon Carter next year?
P.S. - We would have no problem returning to Fouts in 2007 as we already have 7 home games for 2007. There should be no serious worry that we'd back out of a return.
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Of course, and I hope this is something that is considered.

February 26, 2006

I hope that all of this speculation is wrong. Surely, we didn't turn down a home and home with BYU. Tell me that we only had this one window to do a home and home with Nortre Dame, Texas, or Texas A&M on that date. Just don't tell me that the cost was too much for us to gamble on. Because, it that was it, we might as well drop football now.

Let's look at the two scenarios:

BYU would come to Fouts but we didn't think that we could pay the guarantee. Put a surcharge on the game. If the tickets were $25 for that game and we sold out that would be more than $750,000. If $30 per ticket were charged, that would gross more than $900,000. If we can't do that for Brigham Young, with the large number of Mormons in the Metroplex, then forget getting any "name" to come to Denton.

BYU didn't want to come to Denton because our stadium wasn't large enough. I know that we are stubborn, adamant, bull-headed and all of the other adjectives that fit about this, but move the game about 45 minutes away to Texas Stadium. What is our largest home ever and at what stadium? The answer: nearly 50,000 at Texas Stadium. Would we rather play at Fouts? Absolutely. But, if it comes down to being able to attract a Texas, LSU, Army, etc. we'll never be able to do that in Denton with our present stadium. I hate to harp back on old successes, but Hayden Fry recognized that almost immediately. Texas Stadium has lured teams such as Texas A&M, Army, Texas Tech, Kansas, and Oklahoma State to a home and home series with us. Besides, it's only going to last for a couple of more years so take advantage while it's there. It may be a little distasteful but it's better than the alternative.

I realize that our home game with BYU would have to be in a year that they weren't scheduled to come to Fort Worth; in this case 2007. But, unless someone's sitting on a lot of information, the only known games for the two schools are BYU @ UCLA and North Texas @ SMU in 2007. It could (and should) be worked out.

MeanGreen61 · February 26, 2006

Rather than speculate on the UNT/BYU scenario, I'll opt to wait until all the info and facts are known. I doubt seriously that if a home-home with BYU were/would be turned down, it would be without very good reason.

calvin · February 27, 2006

maybe just maybe we hired a man to be our head coach and we should let him do his job ?

ntmeangreen11 · February 27, 2006

maybe just maybe we hired a man to be our head coach and we should let him do his job ?
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Bingo.

February 27, 2006

maybe just maybe we hired a man to be our head coach and we should let him do his job ?
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The head coach is responsible for scheduling?

SilverEagle · February 27, 2006

I hope that all of this speculation is wrong. Surely, we didn't turn down a home and home with BYU. Tell me that we only had this one window to do a home and home with Nortre Dame, Texas, or Texas A&M on that date. Just don't tell me that the cost was too much for us to gamble on. Because, it that was it, we might as well drop football now.
Let's look at the two scenarios:
BYU would come to Fouts but we didn't think that we could pay the guarantee. Put a surcharge on the game. If the tickets were $25 for that game and we sold out that would be more than $750,000. If $30 per ticket were charged, that would gross more than $900,000. If we can't do that for Brigham Young, with the large number of Mormons in the Metroplex, then forget getting any "name" to come to Denton.
BYU didn't want to come to Denton because our stadium wasn't large enough. I know that we are stubborn, adamant, bull-headed and all of the other adjectives that fit about this, but move the game about 45 minutes away to Texas Stadium. What is our largest home ever and at what stadium? The answer: nearly 50,000 at Texas Stadium. Would we rather play at Fouts? Absolutely. But, if it comes down to being able to attract a Texas, LSU, Army, etc. we'll never be able to do that in Denton with our present stadium. I hate to harp back on old successes, but Hayden Fry recognized that almost immediately. Texas Stadium has lured teams such as Texas A&M, Army, Texas Tech, Kansas, and Oklahoma State to a home and home series with us. Besides, it's only going to last for a couple of more years so take advantage while it's there. It may be a little distasteful but it's better than the alternative.
I realize that our home game with BYU would have to be in a year that they weren't scheduled to come to Fort Worth; in this case 2007. But, unless someone's sitting on a lot of information, the only known games for the two schools are BYU @ UCLA and North Texas @ SMU in 2007. It could (and should) be worked out.
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Jack, you address a potential long term issue in this post regarding scheduling "big-time" opponents coming to Fouts.

Your surcharge is the immediate (and potentially long term) solution to this issue. I firmly believe that if we are going to get "name" opponents to come to Denton then we are going to have to pay for the game. Jack's suggestion is $25 for the BYU game. Keeping in mind that students get in free, and allowing for 10K students, we would make $500,000 on ticket sales. If we bump it up to $30 per ticket, then the the gate is $600,000.

Two issues come to mind.

1. compared to going to Oklahoma, Texas and LSU and paying their prices, $25 & $30 per ticket is a bargain.

2. Early speculation about our new stadium was that the capacity would be anywhere from 28K to 32K. So, unless we build a new stadium with at least a capacity of 45 to 50K, we are always going to have to look at the issue of raising the price of tickets in order to get "name" opponents to Fouts. And IMHO, even if we do build a stadium with a 45 to 50K capacity we will still be looking at raising the ticket prices....so we might as well start now.

Again, $25 to $30 per ticket to get a "BYU" to Fouts is a bargain.

Edited February 27, 2006 by SilverEagle

eulesseagle · February 27, 2006

Personally, I would rather have a (probable) win against a D-1AA program than get 30-50+ hung on us against BYU.

The "positive" side of this:

1. It is a bandage approach for a win....something that everyone wants even against a lesser opponent.

2. Let someone else be our cannon fodder, for a short time, while we climb out of the bottom 100 of D-1A football.

3. Other major BCS schools play D1-AA programs without reservation....so why should not UNT??

The "negative" side of this:

1. There is no negative side unless we get beat by a D-1AA program at home.

2. Scathing posts by those who feel UNT should "only" play D-1A schools.

A win against Grambling, SFA etc (you name a D-1AA team) is better than a 30 - 50 point loss against BYU......think about it.

untgirl04 · February 27, 2006

Personally, I would rather have a (probable) win against a D-1AA program than get 30-50+ hung on us against BYU.
The "positive" side of this:
1. It is a bandage approach for a win....something that everyone wants even against a lesser opponent.
2. Let someone else be our cannon fodder, for a short time, while we climb out of the bottom 100 of D-1A football.
3. Other major BCS schools play D1-AA programs without reservation....so why should not UNT??
The "negative" side of this:
1. There is no negative side unless we get beat by a D-1AA program at home.
2. Scathing posts by those who feel UNT should "only" play D-1A schools.
A win against Grambling, SFA etc (you name a D-1AA team) is better than a 30 - 50 point loss against BYU......think about it.
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While I agree that winning the game is paramount, I don't think winning against a I-AA school is necessarily better.

Think in terms of attendance. Even if we manage to get a home game with Texas State, would they be able to provide the attendance boost that a BYU, Oklahoma, OSU, or even TCU and SMUt could provide? Plus, the many other DI-A programs who play DI-AA schools usually have much larger athletic budgets (there are exceptions I'm sure.) As the larger school, we'd most likely have to provide either some sort of payout, or split some of the ticket sales.

But what if something happens and we have to back out of the deal? There's always a payoff for that as well. Since our budget is very modest, we don't really have the $$$ in the bank to deal with contingencies such as cancelled games or smaller profit margins because of poor attendance. We're better off, at the moment, scheduling another DI-A team who can at the least give us some sort of payout or attendance compensation.

I still think our best option is to play both TCU and SMU every year, and develop at Metroplex championship game similar to the Red River Shootout or the TAMU/Texas game. The media love to hype those games up, and throw in a "Golden Triangle" trophy, and you've got a major marketing opportunity for all three schools.

Eagle-96 · February 27, 2006

The only two people that really know anything about this are RV and Tom Holmoe. It is ALL speculation as to what was or is being offered to play BYU. Some are slamming RV without knowing anything about the situation.

eulesseagle · February 27, 2006

UNTGirl04--

While I agree with you in principal please do not make this complicated.

All this boils down to is: "W" vs. "L"

I am not opposed to playing 2 D-1AA teams a year to increasse our "W's". It is "W's" that attract players to programs not "L's". Now I could be wrong so take your shot.

untgirl04 · February 27, 2006

UNTGirl04--
While I agree with you in principal please do not make this complicated.
All this boils down to is: "W" vs. "L"
I am not opposed to playing 2 D-1AA teams a year to increasse our "W's". It is "W's" that attract players to programs not "L's". Now I could be wrong so take your shot.
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In principle, I agree with you as well.

The question, however, is when looking at all aspects of a game - attendance, payout, and W vs. L - is playing a D1-AA school more advantageous than playing a "body bag" game. Now, I don't like playing these body bag games, and I think that embarassing losses do take their toll on the program.

That being said, as I'm sure you agree, we can't count on W's even against a D1-AA program. If we could guarantee a win, I think it would be very difficult to decide which game is better in the long run. But I think the focus of the AD right now is to put money into our athletic coffers so that we can build facilities and reduce our dependence on those body bag games. Then, I think we'd be free to schedule more D1-AA schools, and I agree with you that these would be more beneficial in terms of wins.

However, it all boils down to the fact that we must produce on the field - whether we're playing a D1-AA, Sun Belt, or BCS opponent.