Conference Question

[MeanGreen61]

Just to stir the pot. If an future CUSA invite is out. Stay in the Sun Belt or opt for a 12 team East-West WAC if offered ? Fire when ready

[SCREAMING EAGLE-66]

Just to stir the pot. If an future CUSA invite is out. Stay in the Sun Belt or opt for a 12 team East-West WAC if offered ? Fire when ready

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Stay in the Belt......

1. WAC is little better if any plus the travel expense is awful.

2. Except for LaTech no close rivals.

3. Bad time zones, Mountain and Pacific Zones get little press space or media attention until late at night when the rest of the games are over.

4. There are other sports besides football and midweek trips would be difficult in the west for athletes who are trying to be students.... after all few college athletes ever become professional athletes.

4. We would be back with some of the teams we complained about (NMSU the exception).

5. Too many people always think the grass is green on the other side of the fence. LaTech may be one that wishes they were back on our side of the fence since they are so remote from the remainder of their conference. Fans cannot really travel to games much at all, neither could ours if we were in WAC..... and our home attendence would get few visitors either, probably less than we do with the Belt. This could cause attendence to drop... not increase. No one has any real interest in those colleges or friends that attended those either --which helps fuel interest.

[MeanGreen61]

Stay in the Belt......

1. WAC is little better if any plus the travel expense is awful.

2. Except for LaTech no close rivals.

3. Bad time zones,  Mountain and Pacific Zones get little press space or media attention until late at night when the rest of the games are over.

4. There are other sports besides football and midweek trips would be difficult in the west for athletes who are trying to be students.... after all few college athletes ever become professional athletes.

4. We would be back with some of the teams we complained about (NMSU the exception).

5.  Too many people always think the grass is green on the other side of the fence.   LaTech may be one that wishes they were back on our side of the fence since they are so remote from the remainder of their conference.  Fans cannot really travel to games much at all, neither could ours if we were in WAC..... and our home attendence would get few visitors either, probably less than we do with the Belt.  This could cause attendence to drop... not increase.  No one has any real interest in those colleges or friends that attended those either --which helps fuel interest.

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1. If the WAC were a 12-team East-West division conference, other schools in our general area would also involved to create the EAST DIVISION

2. 12 team East-West format would have some cross over games, but travel would not be as extensive as the WAC now requires.

3. To the current WAC set-up I would definately say NO, but an East-West conference (and picking up an closer bowl) may be worth consideration.

Edited February 20, 2006 by MeanGreen61

[LoveMG]

an east-west wac would be much better than what we have now. a conference where allmembers play 1-A football and with some names fans have heard of.

[LongJim]

The Belt.

UNT needs to be in a conference with other Texas schools. UNT NEEDS to play the SMU's, Rice's, Houston, UTEP's, and Tulsa's of the world, in order to keep building fan interest.

[LongJim]

  a conference where allmembers play 1-A football and with some names fans have heard of.

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Not for me. It may be just me, but the Texas names in the CUSA are far more recognizable to the average fan, as far as I'm concerned.

Lots of Texans remember the old SWC days, and those schools are far more recognized than schools like Hawaii and San Jose St. UNT could be in a "mini-SWC" with Rice/Houston/UTEP/SMU/Tulsa. I think it'd be an awesome step up for UNT athletics.

[H-towngreen]

  UNT could be in a "mini-SWC" with Rice/Houston/UTEP/SMU/Tulsa.  I think it'd be an awesome step up for UNT athletics. 

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Throw in La. Tech and one other school, possibly a Tulane or Ark. St. or one of the LA. Belt schools and you have yourself a good 8 member league.

[MeanGreen61]

The Belt.

UNT needs to be in a conference with other Texas schools.  UNT NEEDS to play the SMU's, Rice's, Houston, UTEP's, and Tulsa's of the world, in order to keep building fan interest.

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Other Texas schools?That would be CUSA (I wish). Sun Belt? There are NO OTHER Texas schools in the Belt

[Guest GrayEagleOne]

In the spirit of your question, which is there is NO chance of membership in CUSA, I would choose a 12-team, East/West WAC with the following teams:

East

New Mexico State

North Texas

Louisiana (Lafayette)

Louisiana Tech

Arkansas State

Troy

West

Idaho

Boise State

Utah State

Nevada

Fresno State

Hawaii

The teams that I omitted have had serious attendance problems with the possible exception of Middle. If they were included and Idaho eliminated, I'd be all for it. In fact, before the Vandals hired Dennis Erickson they were on my elimination list.

Under an East/West setup, we would only have to visit and individual West Division team every fourth year, thereby lowering travel expenses considerably. Of course, any conference that contains Hawaii is going to have huge travel expenses but once every four years with an additional game for compensation would make it far more palatable.

The other drawbacks to me are negligible. Time is a small factor but in this day of air travel there's little more than an hour or two difference to anywhere in the continental U.S. Most newspapers don't go to press until midnight or later so game scores will usually be included. There probably aren't many alumni of the West Division schools but then how many FAU and FIU alums do you know? Almost none of the distant school alums travel with their team, regardless of conference. We will pick up an old nemesis (a team that we very seldom beat) in Nevada, but we need to learn to overcome those situations anyway.

The conference should command better bowl selections and a bigger piece of the NCAA pie. Better teams attract better players and coaches (or at least the current ones must rise to the occasion). Moving up is better, and this would definitely be a move up.

[buff64]

In the spirit of your question, which is there is NO chance of membership in CUSA, I would choose a 12-team, East/West WAC with the following teams:

East

New Mexico State

North Texas

Louisiana (Lafayette)

Louisiana Tech

Arkansas State

Troy

West

Idaho

Boise State

Utah State

Nevada

Fresno State

Hawaii

The teams that I omitted have had serious attendance problems with the possible exception of Middle.  If they were included and Idaho eliminated, I'd be all for it.  In fact, before the Vandals hired Dennis Erickson they were on my elimination list.

Under an East/West setup, we would only have to visit and individual West Division team every fourth year, thereby lowering travel expenses considerably.  Of course, any conference that contains Hawaii is going to have huge travel expenses but once every four years with an additional game for compensation would make it far more palatable.

The other drawbacks to me are negligible.  Time is a small factor but in this day of air travel there's little more than an hour or two difference to anywhere in the continental U.S.  Most newspapers don't go to press until midnight or later so game scores will usually be included.  There probably aren't many alumni of the West Division schools but then how many FAU and FIU alums do you know?  Almost none of the distant school alums travel with their team, regardless of conference.  We will pick up an old nemesis (a team that we very seldom beat) in Nevada, but we need to learn to overcome those situations anyway.

The conference should command better bowl selections and a bigger piece of the NCAA pie.  Better teams attract better players and coaches (or at least the current ones must rise to the occasion).  Moving up is better, and this would definitely be a move up.

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Would be a long stretch for Troy ( Ala.) ,how about subbing UTEP or Tulsa for Troy ?

[TIgreen01]

I'm surprised by the numbers....the WAC got more votes?!?!? WTF?! I guess people are just impatient, or I'm way off-base....but I just see the Sun Belt having a MUCH brighter future than the WAC....both for us, and as a complete conference. It may take a few more years to get some teams up to the caliber of a Fresno or a Boise, but I think it will happen. Troy is a definite up and comer and the Florida schools look to be coming on fast. I'm more worried about us keeping up with those schools than trying to jump to a west coast conference---where we would most likely fail to gain much fan interest.

The WAC is currently a 2 team conference, with the rest of the league in the same class as the Sun Belt. If playing those 2 schools every year gauranteed us more growth as a program, I'd take it...but it doesn't. Has everyone forgotten the Big West?! That was an AWFUL conference for NT....wake up, people.

Here's a question to ponder....in all the years that we played in the Big West, how many times did an opponent bring their band to Fouts field? Or better yet, how many times did an opponent bring more than 50 fans?

[Guest GrayEagleOne]

I'm surprised by the numbers....the WAC got more votes?!?!?  WTF?!  I guess people are just impatient, or I'm way off-base....but I just see the Sun Belt having a MUCH brighter future than the WAC....both for us, and as a complete conference.  It may take a few more years to get some teams up to the caliber of a Fresno or a Boise, but I think it will happen.  Troy is a definite up and comer and the Florida schools look to be coming on fast.  I'm more worried about us keeping up with those schools than trying to jump to a west coast conference---where we would most likely fail to gain much fan interest.

The WAC is currently a 2 team conference, with the rest of the league in the same class as the Sun Belt.  If playing those 2 schools every year gauranteed us more growth as a program, I'd take it...but it doesn't.  Has everyone forgotten the Big West?!  That was an AWFUL conference for NT....wake up, people.

Here's a question to ponder....in all the years that we played in the Big West, how many times did an opponent bring their band to Fouts field?  Or better yet, how many times did an opponent bring more than 50 fans?

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[Got5onIt]

I'd vote the Western Athletic Conference but only if it had two divisions.

Now, a "West" and "East" division seems awkward for a conference named the Western Athletic Conference.

The Wesetern Athletic Conference West and Western Athletic Conference East???

I say the WAC should go with two divisions:

Tortilla Division:

New Mexico State

North Texas

Louisiana (Lafayette)

Louisiana Tech

Arkansas State

Troy

Crabcake Divison:

Idaho

Boise State

Utah State

Nevada

Fresno State

Hawaii

Our rival NMSU comes back into the division along with LaTech.

[LongJim]

Other Texas schools?That would be CUSA (I wish). Sun Belt? There are NO OTHER Texas schools in the Belt

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Yeah, you're right. Wishful thinking got me rolling. As it stands now, I still say Belt. Playing the "if the WAC goes East/West" can also be played with the Belt.

Heh. I guess I prefer to not think about CUSA NOT being an option.

[PlummMeanGreen]

I'm surprised by the numbers....the WAC got more votes?!?!?  WTF?!  I guess people are just impatient, or I'm way off-base....but I just see the Sun Belt having a MUCH brighter future than the WAC....both for us, and as a complete conference.  It may take a few more years to get some teams up to the caliber of a Fresno or a Boise, but I think it will happen.  Troy is a definite up and comer and the Florida schools look to be coming on fast.  I'm more worried about us keeping up with those schools than trying to jump to a west coast conference---where we would most likely fail to gain much fan interest.

The WAC is currently a 2 team conference, with the rest of the league in the same class as the Sun Belt.  If playing those 2 schools every year gauranteed us more growth as a program, I'd take it...but it doesn't.  Has everyone forgotten the Big West?!  That was an AWFUL conference for NT....wake up, people.

Here's a question to ponder....in all the years that we played in the Big West, how many times did an opponent bring their band to Fouts field?  Or better yet, how many times did an opponent bring more than 50 fans?

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Most of us are steeped in the traditions and memories of the leftover SWC schools that had such opponents like UT, Arkansas and TAMU for their opponents for most of the last century. It was against such schools as those that the leftover SWC had their best gate receipts for most of the history of the SWC.

Right now, CUSA is (basically) a handful of SWC "has beens/used to be's" who (and if you dare look at box scores, ie, low attendance figures with their games against each other) which show one of the prime reasons there was such an easy split of the SWC as far as those going to the Big 12 were concerned.

The 4 schools who left for the Big 12 took about one minute to mourn their SWC tradition and all the nostalgia that went with it while most all the ex SWC schools are still in mourning over the split with what was a pretty nice cash cow for their schools. You know, like when you play most of the SWC schools now in the Big 12 you could count on anywhere from 10K-15K visiting fans going to SWC leftover schools in Houston, Dallas and Fort Worth? TCU has done the best recovery job of all this post SWC divorce or split scenario.

As as been posted many times, the main advantage of a CUSA membership would be proximity to schools we would like to think would be our natural rivals; only thing is, most of that group still think of UNT as an "un-natural" rival for each of their schools. Rivalry you say? We play SMU about once or twice every decade or so, so is that really, truly a rival? It may take another half century (or more) to change all that "non-rivalry" attitude we get from all the SWC leftovers, too.

UNT'S FLY IN THE OINTMENT WITH CUSA? For starters (and most likely enders)----Southern Methodist University. Does the Texas contingency of CUSA really want another Texas schools whose entire athletic program is in a down cycle (save women's soccer and on again/but mostly off for most of 17 years Lady Eagles BB program? When women's basketball at UNT can win a league title and actually get past the first round in post season play, then you have something you can hang your hats on for a change.

Also, we still don't measure up with our overall football facilities and that was (apparently) pointed out to us by CUSA rep Chcuk Neinas when he was making his tour of "would be" new CUSA schools for membership 2 or 3 years ago now. Nothing has changed with a new stadium because whether we are all cylinders go with Mean Green football or even at the bottom of the SBC/Bottom 10, UNT will still need.............the Big Donor (and that has been the case from Day One when all the new stadium talk began).

When UH football was at its worst (as I recall the scenario) was when the John J. Moores family of Houston gave UH $50 million to the school located off Cullen Blvd. in the Bayou City with about half of that ear-marked for Cougar athletics. It was a record for public universities at that time.

The Moores have given more to UH athletics since is what I've also read. But at UNT---its still about getting that Big Donor and (especially now) I don't think we are a marketbable commodity for CUSA until we get their attention with a new football stadium and Mean Green football starts out-performing all their schools (especially the ones in Texas) with (most likely) our being in the Top 25 frequently which would get most any non BCS league's attention. Being at the top of the SBC/Bottom 10 is impressing fewer and fewer except those at UNT who hope that will keep them on the payroll with more extended contracts.

Mean Green football must aim higher than what I feel too many seem to be satisified to accept with this present football program (of which meeting those low profile goals will interest few leagues that most on this board would like to see UNT elevate itself).

I owe, I owe its off to work I go............Have A Nice Day!

Edited February 21, 2006 by PlummMeanGreen

[CajunNation]

My crystral ball says:

around 2010

insert conference name here:

UTEP

Houston

Rice

SMU

North Texas

Tulsa

Louisiana Tech

Louisiana

Tulane

[NT80]

My crystral ball says:

around 2010

insert conference name here:

UTEP

Houston

Rice

SMU

North Texas

Tulsa

Louisiana Tech

Louisiana

Tulane

←

Nice conference.

[Got5onIt]

Most of us are steeped in the traditions and memories of the leftover SWC schools that had such opponents like UT, Arkansas and TAMU for their opponents for most of the last century.  It was against such schools as those that the leftover SWC had their best gate receipts for most of the history of the SWC. 

Right now, CUSA is (basically) a handful of SWC "has beens/used to be's" who (and if you dare look at box scores, ie, low attendance figures with their games against each other) which show one of the prime reasons there was such an easy split of the SWC as far as those going to the Big 12 were concerned. 

The 4 schools who left for the Big 12 took about one minute to mourn their SWC tradition and all the nostalgia that went with it while most all the ex SWC schools are still in mourning over the split with what was a pretty nice cash cow for their schools.  You know, like when you play most of the SWC schools now in the Big 12 you could count on anywhere from 10K-15K visiting fans going to SWC leftover schools in Houston, Dallas and Fort Worth?  TCU has done the best recovery job of all this post SWC divorce or split scenario. 

As as been posted many times, the main advantage of a CUSA membership would be proximity to schools we would like to think would be our natural rivals;  only thing is, most of that group still think of UNT as an "un-natural" rival for each of their schools.  Rivalry you say?  We play SMU about once or twice every decade or so, so is that really, truly a rival?  It may take another half century (or more) to change all that "non-rivalry" attitude we get from all the SWC leftovers, too.

UNT'S FLY IN THE OINTMENT WITH CUSA?  For starters (and most likely enders)----Southern Methodist University.  Does the Texas contingency of CUSA really want another Texas schools whose entire athletic program is in a down cycle (save women's soccer and on again/but mostly off for most of 17 years Lady Eagles BB program?  When women's basketball at UNT can win a league title and actually get past the first round in post season play, then you have something you can hang your hats on for a change.

Also, we still don't measure up with our overall football facilities and that was (apparently) pointed out to us by CUSA rep Chcuk Neinas when he was making his tour of "would be" new CUSA schools for membership 2 or 3 years ago now.  Nothing has changed with a new stadium because whether we are all cylinders go with Mean Green football or even at the bottom of the SBC/Bottom 10, UNT will still need.............the Big Donor (and that has been the case from Day One when all the new stadium talk began). 

When UH football was at its worst (as I recall the scenario) was when the John J. Moores family of Houston gave UH $50 million to the school located off Cullen Blvd. in the Bayou City with about half of that ear-marked for Cougar athletics.  It was a record for public universities at that time. 

The Moores have given more to UH athletics since is what I've also read.  But at UNT---its still about getting that Big Donor and (especially now) I don't think we are a marketbable commodity for CUSA until we get their attention with a new football stadium and Mean Green football starts out-performing all their schools (especially the ones in Texas) with (most likely) our being in the Top 25 frequently which would get most any non BCS league's attention.  Being at the top of the SBC/Bottom 10 is impressing fewer and fewer except those at UNT who hope that will keep them on the payroll with more extended contracts. 

Mean Green football must aim higher than what I feel too many seem to be satisified to accept with this present football program (of which meeting those low profile goals will interest few leagues that most on this board would like to see UNT elevate itself).

I owe, I owe its off to work I go............Have A Nice Day!

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I thought one of the main issues with NT's leap into CUSA involved the lack of a baseball program and mediocre basketball team (when compared to UTEP).

[SCREAMING EAGLE-66]

Other Texas schools?That would be CUSA (I wish). Sun Belt? There are NO OTHER Texas schools in the Belt

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---No Texas schools in the WAC either... The closest would be LaTech and NMSU which is over 600 miles away. Who would the other three be in the "Eastern" part?? NEVADA, UTAH STATE AND IDAHO.....??? I would rather go to Middle Tenn and the Florida colleges over those places....

---At least three, maybe four, Belt teams are closer than NMSU... and it is the second closest of the WAC.. I would prefer CUSA but other than that ---stay in the Belt. The WAC is a wacky option. Nothing good about that conference..

[VideoEagle]

It's an old line, but I still like it:

Let's not go WACy.

(But if we can entice New Mexico State to join us some place else, that would be great!)