Responding to the fans

PHSCoach · January 25, 2006

3. Reduce Penalties. I haven't crunched the numbers on this one, but I'm pretty sure NT averages 2 Unsportsmanlike calls per game. If someone would like to review the stats and prove me wrong, I encourage them to do so. However, regardless of the type of penalty, we make way too many stupid penalties. I believe this is a result of the coaches not stressing thinking before acting. I think with the graduation of T.J. Covington and Ja'mel Branch, we'll see fewer penalties - as long as they don't have any clones waiting in the wings - but I'd like to see more on-field discipline reacting to these bonehead penalties.
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You have written about on field discipline many time and I have not responed but now you are calling out players so I must.

The team last year had a total of 10 personal and/or unsportsmanlike penalties for the year (not saying that is ok) but not close to your 2 per game. TJ and Branch had a total of 4 for the year. The teams we were playing had a total of 9 personal/unsportsmanlike penalties during the same games.

UNTBill · January 25, 2006

You have written about on field discipline many time and I have not responed but now you are calling out players so I must.
The team last year had a total of 10 personal and/or unsportsmanlike penalties for the year (not saying that is ok) but not close to your 2 per game. TJ and Branch had a total of 4 for the year. The teams we were playing had a total of 9 personal/unsportsmanlike penalties during the same games.
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That is true. However, they did seem to come at the most inopportune times. For example, I believe it was Johnny Quinn returning a punt for a TD that was called back due to one of those unsportsman like penalties. IMHO--A team without discipline is really not a team at all.

untgirl04 · January 25, 2006

You have written about on field discipline many time and I have not responed but now you are calling out players so I must.
The team last year had a total of 10 personal and/or unsportsmanlike penalties for the year (not saying that is ok) but not close to your 2 per game. TJ and Branch had a total of 4 for the year. The teams we were playing had a total of 9 personal/unsportsmanlike penalties during the same games.
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I appreciate your research into the issue. Perhaps, as UNTBill mentioned, it just seemed like more because of the inopportune times (not saying that any unsportsmanlike is warranted). Although our unsportsmanlike penalties are really not all that much higher than any other teams, apparently, I think those calls, when combined with the delay of game penalties and offsides calls, simply exacerbates the problem. However, you are right to call me out on naming players specifically. I respectfully apologize to any players and their families who I may have erroneously singled out.

pollock · January 25, 2006

RV, thanks for posting and for reading.

Next year is a one-game season. SMU must be destroyed.

PlummMeanGreen · January 25, 2006

LOL, I'll kick in my share for Jimbo.
Rick
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PlummMeanGreen · January 26, 2006

Now you think that subtleties escape me? I'm just sure you didn't mean that.
"no one but me seems to care about the future of this program"
I have never been that "Joan of Arc" in any of my postings. What would be more accurate would be "I reserve the right to say that "the King has no clothes".
Simple enough for you?
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Granted, Bill, but you have been "all of ours Joan of Arc" in Lower Section D during a most recent heated debate you had at one particular game. LOL! BTW, can't remember, but did you ever receive any semblance or hint of an apology from your debate opponent?

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Hey folks! Come on now, SMU is "NOT" a rival of UNT's. We play them about 1 or 2 times every 15 years so how can any school we'd play so few times ever be considered a rival? College football rivals usually play each other annually. (Sadly, our hottest and best rival of late joined the WAC).

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PlummMeanGreen · January 26, 2006

I'm just gonna comment on football for now...
1) DD was never a hero to some of us, not 8 months ago or 8 years ago. Watching and listening to games since the dawn of the Dickey era, it's been fairly easy to notice things that weren't right, even when we won. And we'd get called out for it. Funny that the comments then were "WHO CARES? A WIN IS A WIN..." and now they've changed to "WHERE WERE THESE COMMENTS WHEN WE WERE WINNING?" They were there. They were dismissed.
Any decent coach should be able to SEE those things, account for those things, and fix those things. Some of us knew the moment that we did not have a distinct talent advantage over teams, that some of those little things (and not so little things) would come back to haunt us. After all, they were plain enough to see whenever we faced mid-major talent or better. Last year, they came back to bite. It wasn't entirely unexpected. If our goal is to frequently win the Sun Belt and lay eggs vs. most everyone else, then I understand sticking with DD. I'll believe he's capable of more the second I see it. He's at 39-55, or a .415 winning percentage. In other words, he's no Corky Nelson. That means something to some NT alums. Sure, most of us will still be around watching NT football when Dickey's gone. He'll either go the way of Corky Nelson or he'll stay around here long enough to actually start winning something of note. There's a certain chance last year was an aberration, but it would be easier to believe if the signs weren't already there. And accepting that as a possibility, one might also be reasonable to accept as a possibility that Dickey's success came off of one recruiting class, and that those 3 winning years were the aberration. Obviously some people feel it's worth the risk of having a poor football team now on the chance that he develops later as a coach. After all, isn't that the case with...
2)...Ramon Flanigan, conspicuously absent from your post, though I would say he's gotten a good bit more flogging on this board than just about anyone outside of DD. In fact, I would hasten to say that he's responsible for a good percentage of the flack that DD gets, as DD is to you. It trickles up... but I digress.
Any reason for his (RF's) absence from your coaching comments?
Now, I realize you're bound by diplomacy and good sense. Obviously, we aren't. That's the way of things. It's a message board. I've got people who work for me too, and I wouldn't make comments regarding their performance anywhere other than where it belongs, which certainly isn't a message board. But I'm a football fan, and IMO the football at NT is simply a bad on-field product. You can dress it up however you like, but in the end all you'll have is a gilded turd, or, as it's called in NCAA football, a Sun Belt title.
I can't much stand for defending the state of a bottom 20 football team. If people are content winning against only the worst competition, I do not understand our position in Div 1-A. However, I've not had any major problems with the job you've done (yet), and I was pleased with your hiring.
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Good post, Monkeypox

But if you will merely triple the number of inches of each of your posts, you might be up for the next "Art Bell Award!" You will have to fight me tooth and toe nail for that one, though.

You are right, though, RV could hardly post on an unofficial UNT forum and tell all of us "unrealistic" types that we are 100% correct with our astute ascertations of the situation at hand with some of his athletic personel. There is also something called damage control that sometimes a forum such as GMG.com can come in quite handy.

Just read on some other website today a rather lengthy "A" list of elgible NCAA D1-A (higher profile) head football coaches who would kill for a job like NORTH TEXAS; especially because of the location and the recruiting area that could (once again) be beneficial to us if one merely has a high enough self esteem to believe we can actually recruit quality football players in on own backyard.

JUST TODAY......I received a call from a fellow alum almost a state away and his comments were this: "We have not had a time in our athletic history (such as now) where so many mediocre performances (and staffers without any noticeable or significant results) have been allowed to stay on the NT athletics payroll for such a long time."

And FWIW, if the NT head football coaches job is handled professionally and diplomatically (with some most important strategic OOC wins in the mix) one can actually catapult themselves into a head football coaches in a league like the Big 10.

Have A Nice Evening.....time to go eat some Texas black angus steak.

SilverEagle · January 26, 2006

[ BTW, can't remember, but did you ever receive any semblance or hint of an apology from your debate opponent?

There wasn't a debate. Did you get my PM?

Monkeypox · January 26, 2006

Please stop this argument. It is tired and overused and flat out wrong. No one is content with our position, but most of us do understand that we are making progress, even if it isn't happening at the rate you'd like it to be.
Content with bottom 20? No. Happy with it? No. So stop saying that. No one is satisfied with where we are. But things are getting better. If you can't see that, then I don't know what do say. Keep the faith...
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No, I won't stop the argument, not until people stop considering losing to Troy, or F?U, or Baylor, or the 4th place CUSA team, or LA Tech (by a bunch) as successful seasons. If you brag about those years, you were content with them. Content isn't the same as happy. It simply means you're not looking for a change. You are satisfied. And many here ARE satisfied and by their posts WOULD be satisfied if all we did every year was beat SBC teams. We haven't progressed in the big picture. Our football product is not different than the first year Dickey came on board. The same old problems are still evident. And new problems have arisen. I am NOT satisfied.

You can say "no one is satisfied with where we are" right now because we just went 2-9 last year. Would you have posted that a year ago? I would've, but people would've jumped on me for being "negative." We go 2-9 and now it's using a "tired" argument.

Funny, too, that I see people say things like they're tempering their expectations to be more realistic based on the fact that we don't have the athletes in place, when it falls under the same person's responsibilit. It's like saying "sorry, boss, I know I've failed to develop a coherent policy structure for my department, but really, how can you expect me to when I don't know how to type."

January 26, 2006

Thanks to RV for all you have done. Lots of work to do. FB obviously REALLY lost ground last year. Progress in BB so far this year though.

Since this thread has devolved into some expectations, I will take this opportunity to express my expectations for next year's FB:

+Beat SMU

+Overall winning record

+Lose NO game by more than 32. That means the team must be READY for the first game. Lots and lots of work to do. Must have starters with INTENSITY. National champions or not, I can't stand another trip to Austin like that last one.

Miss any of these milestones, and it's adios, amigo. Cause really, if we can't do these, why bother?

Quoner · January 26, 2006

Looks like a lot of you lost your puffed out mansacks when Rick showed up - that's funny. Funnier than the fact that Johnny brought a date to the banquet when I told him I was busy....

KingDL1 · January 26, 2006

Thanks to RV for all you have done. Lots of work to do. FB obviously REALLY lost ground last year. Progress in BB so far this year though.
Since this thread has devolved into some expectations, I will take this opportunity to express my expectations for next year's FB:
+Beat SMU
+Overall winning record
+Lose NO game by more than 32. That means the team must be READY for the first game. Lots and lots of work to do. Must have starters with INTENSITY. National champions or not, I can't stand another trip to Austin like that last one.
Miss any of these milestones, and it's adios, amigo. Cause really, if we can't do these, why bother?
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I could live with that, but I think the chances of DD pulling it off are as likely as us getting a new stadium next year.

In all fairness Dickey has never been anywhere near "Hero" status to me, I have always thought he had glaring problems.

January 26, 2006

They are modest expectations, but I do have some doubts about whether they will be realized. I will be supportive until any of them are not realized, and after they are realized I will continue to be supportive but the next year's expectations will be higher.

North Texas to me looks like a place that for some reason can't get everyone on the same page to the same extent as more successful-appearing institutions. Though in some areas we have improved appearances. There is just so much more potential that is not achieved, and should have been achieved by now.

PlummMeanGreen · January 26, 2006

No, I won't stop the argument, not until people stop considering losing to Troy, or F?U, or Baylor, or the 4th place CUSA team, or LA Tech (by a bunch) as successful seasons. If you brag about those years, you were content with them. Content isn't the same as happy. It simply means you're not looking for a change. You are satisfied. And many here ARE satisfied and by their posts WOULD be satisfied if all we did every year was beat SBC teams. We haven't progressed in the big picture. Our football product is not different than the first year Dickey came on board. The same old problems are still evident. And new problems have arisen. I am NOT satisfied.
You can say "no one is satisfied with where we are" right now because we just went 2-9 last year. Would you have posted that a year ago? I would've, but people would've jumped on me for being "negative." We go 2-9 and now it's using a "tired" argument.
Funny, too, that I see people say things like they're tempering their expectations to be more realistic based on the fact that we don't have the athletes in place, when it falls under the same person's responsibilit. It's like saying "sorry, boss, I know I've failed to develop a coherent policy structure for my department, but really, how can you expect me to when I don't know how to type."
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Monkeypox, I have to ask the question: What brand of truth serum are you using these days?

And come on, folks, even during those bowl appearances everyone in the Mean Green Nation knew which (lightweight SBC/Bottom 10 teams) we had to beat to get those 4 bowl games. Laughingly, Dickey apparently thought those bowl games (with even 3 out of 4 losses) made it carte blanche for him to be able to kick his employer at every turn as well as we NT Exes on the radio (with both his radio buds) for about 5 years running. Of course, the other Dickey Ball supporter, one Mr. Bobby Ray had to approve or sanction most every one of those broadcasted insults to the NT constituency because...................HE DIDN'T STOP IT ONE BLANKETY BLANKED TIME! (sorry about the volume of that last phrase).

So now DD because of his (general) poor tacticianal skills (just wait till FAU's Howard Schnellenberger schools him for a 3'rd straight season, folks), DD's lack of discipline under his watch, being a bit aloof with a (sometimes) condescending attitude which all culminates with even him making the disovery now that he has almost zero capital in with many in Mean Green Country.

THINK UPON THESE THINGS: Most in MG Country (and I'd even guess with those who sympathize for his style of leadership at a lower profile); ANYWAY, most I'd really guess from reading most of the posters of GMG.com really do have a "take it or leave it" attitude with DD as our head football coach. Now think about that, fellow Exes and MG fans:

Is such an attitude of "take it or leave it" with one of the most high profile employees on the NT payroll one that will create a groundswell of growth and support that we really need to start seeing (yesterday) in Denton with this football program and during this most important era because of the the level of the NCAA we compete?

AND................such a "take it or leave it" mode of thinking toward DD that will hardly make for a very positive sales environment come this summer when NT athletic officials try to market someone and someone's football program that many now think is virtually 'un-marketable;" when NT athletic officials try to improve (already low) football season ticket sales and many can already start counting mounting thou$and$ that will no longer be earmarked for NT athletics; that is, until most of the under-acheivers in the NT athletic department have been asked to take their "special" skills to some other school and to stay a decade or more at those new surroundings.

I know, not a healthy scenario for campus fundraisers, but because their bosses insist on perserving all this disguised and veiled success business which (even worse and almost insulting) is the blatant cold fact that (still) too many of our present NT leadership actually think many will continue to buy into all this.

It's like a fellow alum said just yesterday as to what the main cause of much of this mounting frustration with North Texas Exes and Mean Green fans is pretty well about and is represented with the following quote from him:

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"In our athletic history, we haven't kept so many under-achievers and low (under. 500) performers on the NT athletic payroll for as long a time as we are doing now."

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IMO, that NT Ex has hit the nail on the head because in the past, most of our "under-achieving" at UNT would have the intelligence to find another job when they saw the MG Nation were not responding to either them or their performance OR................back in the day when we actually had UNT leaders who knew what the words "released said NT athletic employee from their contracts" mean't and what that could actually mean for the longterm welfare of NT athletics (operating at a higher profile in the NCAA D1-A mainstream).

Who is this program for anyway? Don't NT leaders understand that our NT Exes constituency sorta' outnumbers their paid staff by many, many thousands? Are they seriously trying to reduce those thousands with what seems to be their tunnel-visioned self-serving decision-making skills that is not exciting the a large majority of the masses any longer? Do 15K per game home football averages after 4 bowl games sorta' give some on our campus a hint of all this?

Today, because of this "private school" led elitist style attitude from the top, it just seems obvious to many that they couldn't give a shi& what NT Exes or Mean Greens fans do think or do, but now some are going to show them they they really do need to give a shi& with all this because those big 15K per home game averages (after 4 big bowl games) might be less starting this next football season. Losing (unimaginative) football will only hasten all of that.

For certain not any kind of silly threat with any of that, but merely a statement that many now want to make to those at UNT who have their heads buried (wherever) and a statement from many who really do feel our present NT leadership needs to start opening their eyes and ears as to all the things being said from a (growing) portion of Mean Green Nation.

UNT leaderrs will (soon enought) $tart $eeing a difference and $eeing that very soon and only because of many of our's general unhappiness with their choices; with their obvious lack of decision-making skills which is keeping the overall UNT athletic program (on an annual basis) aimed southward toward the Bottom 10 of an NCAA D1-A co-existance.

YET..............who in their sober-thinking minds (when they sit back, think hard and look at all this) would ever want to see such a mode of operation continuing within the University of North Texas athletic department? Which one of you wants to rubber-stamp (right along with some key NT leaders) a continued philosophy of setting low goals (reaching a few) while we most obviously seem to be set on a collision course (2 and 9 in the SBC/Bottom 10 after 4 bowl appearances for crisakes'?); anyway, who really wants to approve all of this while at the same time maintaining our extremely low standing in NCAA D-A athletics?

IRONICALLY YET AT THE SAME TIME KINDA' SAD BUT:

SMU has (basically) given UNT 2+ decades for us to move light years ahead of most every area of the Mustang athetic program, but the question remains---did we of UNT take advantage of SMU's generosity of having given us all that time to make our move in Denton?

Edited January 26, 2006 by PlummMeanGreen

Eagle1855 · January 26, 2006

SMU has (basically) given UNT 2+ decades for us to move light years ahead of most every area of the Mustang athetic program, but the question remains---did we of UNT take advantage of SMU's generosity of having given us all that time to make our move in Denton?
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I dont think SMU is or ever should be the benchmark by which we measure any of our success. Its apples and oranges comparing NT and SMU. The only thing we have in common with them is that we are in the same part of Texas.

In other words, who cares what SMU does?

Edited January 26, 2006 by Eagle1855

calvin · January 26, 2006

Has anyone ever read one of Plum's post ? Gosh dang them suckers are long

NT91 · January 26, 2006

I dont think SMU is or ever should be the benchmark by which we measure any of our success. Its apples and oranges comparing NT and SMU. The only thing we have in common with them is that we are in the same part of Texas.
In other words, who cares what SMU does?
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Thanks RV for all that you do for NT.

Lets all give what we can!!

Lets get Texas and SMU in 06!!!!!!!!!!!!!

HoustonEagle · January 26, 2006

Has anyone ever read one of Plum's post ? Gosh dang them suckers are long
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NO!

MeanGreen61 · January 26, 2006

NO!
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Plumm doesn't post, he filibusters and if you've read one, you've basically read 'um all

PlummMeanGreen · January 26, 2006

Jim. (and I say this as a friend) Honest to God, I'm going to take up a collection so that you can get better drugs.........and get laid while you're at it.

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Now we are finally getting somewhere with all this! LOL!

But thanks for the most benevolent and gracious offer, Bill, but for the life of me, some of the other posters on GMG.com need to tell me which part of what I have posted "non stop" is incorrrect?

You know, though, last Fall if Dickey beats Tulsa, La Tech (and Schnellenberger's FAU for the first time), I might very well be out there helping to raise money so we could have someone comissioned to build a statue of the coach; except DD stilll has that glaring ominous dark cloud of his 8 year under .500 W/L at UNT standing out like a pimple on the butt of Britney Spears. (Can I say that on this forum)?

Anyway, if those 3 losses would have merely been wins (with maybe a more convincing win over Florida International, too), it would have made many think that our last 3 recruiting classes had (in deed) been competitive, on a par with or even ahead of those kind of schools (which would hardly be confused with any of the NCAA D1-A's Top 80 schools.

This whole thing could very well go into the crapper for the next half decade (or more) if we don't start recruiting more "recognized" quality athletes than all of the aforementioned schools who all schooled us pretty well last Fall. I am trying to understand how our DL is going to improve so dramatically next Fall as to stop schools such as a "light-weight" FAU who ran the ball at will as they soared to their 2'nd win over UNT in as many years.

Edited January 26, 2006 by PlummMeanGreen