going to other conference boards?

[MeanGreen61]

The Sun Belt, does it have any hope?

Guys, I am a North Texas fan, I know many of you dont want to even say anything about the sun belt, but I need your opinion, does the sun belt have any future in 1A?

North Texas(the supposedly upper-teir team) has had three chances in the last year to prove they belong in 1A and have failed(54-2,40-14,31-10) to prove anything. This year, the sun belt has 1 1A win outside of the belt(MTSU over Vandy)

Our probable champion is going to be ULM(who lost to 1AA Northwestern), and they will get blasted by a CUSA team, making the belt look worse and worse.

We have, without a doubt regreseed considerably since last season, in your opinion, does the sun belt have any hope in competing outside of their own conference?

Did you expect UNT to lose 54-2?

Do we belong in 1A?

Thanks.

Thread started on CUSA board

http://www.ncaabbs.com/forums/confusa/invi...ST&f=22&t=32337

Edited November 24, 2005 by MeanGreen61

[VideoEagle]

Our probable champion is going to be ULM(who lost to 1AA Northwestern)

←

Stanford lost to Cal Davis this year. It is embarrassing, but certainly not the end of the world.

The bottom of the Mac is clearly worse than the bottom of the Sunbelt. Look at the Wacy conference where they have a number of teams that faired badly in the Sunbelt.

[PlummMeanGreen]

The Sun Belt, does it have any hope?

Guys, I am a North Texas fan, I know many of you dont want to even say anything about the sun belt, but I need your opinion, does the sun belt have any future in 1A?

North Texas(the supposedly upper-teir team) has had three chances in the last year to prove they belong in 1A and have failed(54-2,40-14,31-10) to prove anything. This year, the sun belt has 1 1A win outside of the belt(MTSU over Vandy)

Our probable champion is going to be ULM(who lost to 1AA Northwestern), and they will get blasted by a CUSA team, making the belt look worse and worse.

We have, without a doubt regreseed considerably since last season, in your opinion, does the sun belt have any hope in competing outside of their own conference?

Did you expect UNT to lose 54-2?

Do we belong in 1A?

Thanks.

Thread started on CUSA board

http://www.ncaabbs.com/forums/confusa/invi...ST&f=22&t=32337

←

Is it possible some of you who might be fortunate enough to have Bobby Ray's email address might email MG61's post (and others similar on GMG.com) to him with a cc to Chancellor Lee Jackson? Surely, both don't have their their heads buried in the sand at the same time with this most crucial problem we haved at UNT at a most crucial time that is only going to get worse (and expen$ive); especially at the Sun Belt Conference (or NCAA D1-A "Bottom 10" level).

For the life of me, in 30 plus years of my being a Mean Green football fan, I just don't understand the overall apathy, non-concern and just general acceptance of the direction of this spiraling southward football program under a man who has hit his talent plateau at UNT and even at the SBC level. Whats the deal here, the more you give to UNT the more accepting you are of DD mediocrity? This from a hardy handful of our best fans is almost as amazing to me as our NT leader's (apparent) hypnotism by DD; and this from a group on campus who must really think the SBC is right up there with the Big 12 or something. Simply amazing this is to many of us (but mostly sad from the standpoint of what the longterm results will be). We just don't seem to do well at all in the athletic hiring business at UNT from what I've seen in those 30 plus years, either. Proof of that? How many the last 30 years get better jobs after they leave UNT?

GOD BLESS TEXAS!

Edited November 24, 2005 by PlummMeanGreen

[GreenEddieNT]

Well, that's why I've stated that it was a mistake to turn down the WAC invitation. If we had accepted we'd be in the WAC this year and while we would be close to the bottom as we are in the 'Belt this year at least we'd be at the bottom of a better conference instead of being near the bottom of the conference that is the bottom of the barrel in Division 1-A. The thing is even being at the top of the Sun Belt will get us little or no respect(relatively speaking) with fans, recruits, coaches, media, conferences, etc...and the proof of that is that a LA Tech program that has for the most part been middle-of-the-pack in the WAC gets about as much or more respect than a North Texas team who up until this year pretty much owned the Sun Belt. Basically a 6-6 WAC team is regarded as well or better than a 9-2 Sun Belt team. On the other hand, if we had joined the WAC and replaced Dickey after this season with Neuheisel or someone like him that could get us to the upper echelon of the WAC we'd finally get the top 25 votes, media accolades, better recruits, better bowls, more fans, and better players that we all want. That can happen much faster in the WAC because the perception of the WAC is better than that of the 'Belt. Sure the Sun Belt might improve but it will continue to occur at a glacial pace and this season it seems to have even regressed. The WAC already has 4 bowl elegible teams whereas the 'Belt is looking at only one(with luck maybe two) bowl elegible 6-5 team. Now there are problems with the WAC(travel, potential instability, not as much revenue or bowls as CUSA and MWC) but it still is better than the Sun Belt and besides if we could get our act together over there and actually be a top WAC team we'd be on the short list for CUSA or maybe even the MWC. The WAC would have been a step closer to where we want to be instead of being 2 steps away.

[PlummMeanGreen]

Well, that's why I've stated that it was a mistake to turn down the WAC invitation.  If we had accepted we'd be in the WAC this year and while we would be close to the bottom as we are in the 'Belt this year at least we'd be at the bottom of a better conference instead of being near the bottom of the conference that is the bottom of the barrel in Division 1-A.  The thing is even being at the top of the Sun Belt will get us little or no respect(relatively speaking) with fans, recruits, coaches, media, conferences, etc...and the proof of that is that a LA Tech program that has for the most part been middle-of-the-pack in the WAC gets about as much or more respect than a North Texas team who up until this year pretty much owned the Sun Belt.  Basically a 6-6 WAC team is regarded as well or better than a 9-2 Sun Belt team.  On the other hand, if we had joined the WAC and replaced Dickey after this season with Neuheisel or someone like him that could get us to the upper echelon of the WAC we'd finally get the top 25 votes, media accolades, better recruits, better bowls, more fans, and better players that we all want.  That can happen much faster in the WAC because the perception of the WAC is better than that of the 'Belt.  Sure the Sun Belt might improve but it will continue to occur at a glacial pace and this season it seems to have even regressed.  The WAC already has 4 bowl elegible teams whereas the 'Belt is looking at only one(with luck maybe two) bowl elegible 6-5 team.  Now there are problems with the WAC(travel, potential instability, not as much revenue or bowls as CUSA and MWC) but it still is better than the Sun Belt and besides if we could get our act together over there and actually be a top WAC team we'd be on the short list for CUSA or maybe even the MWC.  The WAC would have been a step closer to where we want to be instead of being 2 steps away.

←

Interesting post with some good points IMO...I do wish more fans/alums seemed a bit more concerned and bothered with where all this is going to take this football program if we don't cut all this off at the pass soon. That past confuses me almost as UNT keeping an 8 year football coach as far as under .500 as he is and now toward the bottom of NCAA D1-A, which most college football fans in America would subtely suggest to our powers that be: You happy with Bottom 10 now?

Remove the facade & veil of SBC success, NT Administrators..........Your Texas taxpayers and MG Club donor$ are watching your $tewardship of Their Monies.

Edited November 24, 2005 by PlummMeanGreen

[Rudy]

I think the SBC has a chance, as it appeared to be moving upward for a while. However, I think the AD's (minus RV) and Coaches of the 'Belt need to pull their heads out and start making the minor changes to lead to a big difference.

[PlummMeanGreen]

We will be in the SBC in the foresee-able future much longer than we will want to be, folks. There is nothing else shaking out there now and if there was, who would want a football program that has lost to 5 year old FAU 2 X's in a row as it is? Again, the first time we lost to Schnellenberger's FAU we were even a.........(cough, cough)..............bowl team. You remember, the one that played CUSA's 4'th place USM Golden Eagles in the NO's Bowl?!?!?

This thing has bottomed out, folks, has been spiraling that direction for the last 3 year and we have some very smart people on campus who can't see it. Sadly, it could get even worse next Fall for the Mean Green in light of recent trends; and FWIW, what else do we really have to go by than trends and past bad habits?

Even more the reason we have to do more than just dominate the SBC "every" year, but we need leadership that will do that PLUS beat OOC schools like, well, you know all the ones we should have beaten in the past (including 2 of those this year)?

GOD BLESS TEXAS!

Edited November 24, 2005 by PlummMeanGreen

[jjpfootball]

Plumm

You love to rant on DD and his staff but lets look at the facts:

In 2003 the team was 9 and 4 the football budget was cut by 11% the recuiting budget was cut by 18%.

In 2004 the team was 7 and 5 so we cut the budget another 9% and the recuiting budget by another 6%.

The teams that you love to make fun of FAU, MTSU and FIU have recuiting budgets over $200,000 UNT is $88,000

Next year the FIU athletic budget will be over $22,000,000 with a football budget over $6,000,000 while FAU will stay at about $16,000,000 over all and a football budget of $4,500,000.

How about last years budget we were 4th in the SBC with $2,976,279 (FIU at $3,892,475, FAU $3,895,829, MTSU $3,892,130)

The two Florida schools have started raising money for the new stadiums what has University of North Texas done???

Yea they got a new athletic complex on your 200 acre golf course. What about the other things that are need to bring this program up to standards.

Then you wander why DD says "this is the most....."

You love RV lets see the money.............

[GrandGreen]

[

You love to rant on DD and his staff but lets look at the facts:

In 2003 the team was 9 and 4 the football budget was cut by 11% the recuiting budget was cut by 18%.

In 2004 the team was 7 and 5 so we cut the budget another 9% and the recuiting budget by another 6%.

The teams that you love to make fun of FAU, MTSU and FIU have recuiting budgets over $200,000 UNT is $88,000

Next year the FIU athletic budget will be over $22,000,000 with a football budget over $6,000,000 while FAU will stay at about $16,000,000 over all and a football budget of $4,500,000.

How about last years budget we were 4th in the SBC with $2,976,279 (FIU at $3,892,475, FAU $3,895,829, MTSU $3,892,130)

The two Florida schools have started raising money for the new stadiums what has University of North Texas done???

Yea they got a new athletic complex on your 200 acre golf course. What about the other things that are need to bring this program up to standards.

Then you wander why DD says "this is the most....."

You love RV lets see the money.............

←

[PlummMeanGreen]

Such budget records and numbers are supposed to be a matter of public record, but after LogoGate, who the hell knows anymore.

'Twasn't that long ago that we were told we had equal or better budgets than anyone in the SBC. And not for one minute do I think FIU and FAU will suddenly out of nowhere have budgets larger than most schools in CUSA.

On this particular matter comparing our budget to others in the SBC, most of us would still need to see some (what should) be available documented facts on all that.

One fact still looms quite large: A 5 year old NCAA D1-AA football team, ie, FAU, beat a UNT bowl team last year and did it.............in our house.

Like many (who still haven't come out of their closet concerning DD's inefficiencies and his having a job way over his abilities); anyway, what many thought before the "Big 4" games this Fall, ie, TU, LTU, FAU and FIU while among those 4 came 3 losses and "way too narrow of a win for a team that turned the ball over 8 time"; anyway, all of this pretty well substantiated many of our worst fears that we've really been fartin' in the wind with (overall) recruiting the last 3 years, comparatively to most who we played this Fall. The proof is in our performances against "5 year old Florida schools now in the SBC, and (what has become annual happenings the 8 years DD has been at UNT) non-stop OUT OF CONFERENCE losses, jjpfootball.

I am sure DD comes back next Fall due to the fact that we continuously kept tagging on extra years to his contract. Yet most could predict UNT can't (or just won't) choose to buy out his contract, causing us to lose one pretty important year for a school with what we now have going with venue's construction could now do just like UTEP, that is, go out and get a higher profile head football coach. UNT has done this before & we can do it again.

Yet for a school that says it would like to raise significant monies to build a new football stadium all this with DD will cause a most un-timely delay. You see, a football program that has spiraled toward last place in the SBC (and thus toward the "Bottom Ten" of NCAA D1-A) will not be perceived as a good investment from fans (or would-be donors) all the way from the most wealthy to those like many of us on GoMeanGreen.com that are limited with our cash gifts.

But its not only NT Athletics who will bite the Big One over an extra year with DD as NT's donations will probably dip across the board with every organization on campus (except the College of Music, of course). This is what happens at most NCAA D1-A schools once their athletic support is split right down the midde over if they think their present head football coach should be here or not an additional football season..

Yet still strange as all get-out that the UNT short list of new head football coaching candidates when DD was hired had only one name on it---namely his. Who in the UNT adminstration or BOR's droppped the ball over that? His NT hiring 100% influenced by the KSU connection even came after DD's one year as SMU offensive coordinator for crissakes'. Before his one year at SMU, DD was merely a journeyman assistant football coach at numerous NCAA outposts. (Just check your media guide for proof).

Most don't get to be head football coach in NCAA D1-A under such circumstances unless you have a family member (his dad) pulling strings and that done with (then) NT AD Craig Helwig, a Kansas State alumnus. North Texas officials allowed this hiring coup before anyone on campus or Denton could ask: NOW WHEN IS A SELECTION COMMITTEE FROM THE UNT COMMUNITY GOING TO BE FORMED?

So now we are all paying for this "the fastest hire in NCAA football history" with (basically) a college assistant football coach who has a head football coaching job and one who has operated under the disguised successes that playing SBC football teams under .500 the last few years has given him.

Most of the same people who were livid with DD's radio bashing the last few years have (seemedly) suddenly taken on a, "oh well this is just what we do at North Texas" attitude now. You see, apathy and bad SBC teams have been DD's main allies for 8 years and now he probably has only one of those left since the SBC is passing us by. I still just don't get it with all this. If this weren't so counter-productive and sad for those of us who've been around a few decades--it would somehow make for a good comedy movie (I guess)?

Hanging on to DD one more year will be quite expensive, but even moreso public relations-wise with fans and alums once this season is over and they all sit down, get their thought processes together and begin putting the pencil to the paper with all this that some already have done. Yet why have so many already (and suddenly) forgotten all the radio broadcasted NT Employer Bashing, NT Fans & Exes Bashing and the public broadcasted shaming of UNT by DD on the radio airwaves making it look like our school was on its last dime?

THIS ONE RADIO BROADCAST TOOK THE CAKE: Remember the nationally broadcasted ESPN radio interview when DD chose to "talk down" with the his broken record jumble of "we have our backs against the wall in Denton" rather than "talk up" the $40 million that was at the very moment of that national broadcast being spent at our Eagle Point Campus? Yet another radio broadcasted golden moment that turned into a lost opportunity by DD--but, he (once again) chose to go with the Negative Ned side instead. . What part of any of this is incorrect to all of you who think we need to give this man more time to make us even more mediocre (and a mediocrity that is now rearing its ugly head in the lowly SBC)?

Our recruiting the next few weeks will die a slow, painful, natural death with DD in his upcoming 9'th year since the veil of the SBC's (most always) under .500 competition the last few years has now been lifted--a disguised charade that (basically) had us backing into 4 bowl games because no one else would have been over .500 to do so those 4 years. Another who posts on this board is now direly concerned with our recruiting the next few weeks as well. Why? SBC schools from out of state (including non SBC schools Tulsa and La Tech) are showing up on Metroplex area newpapers DFW area top 100 lists except one: The University of North Texas.

<><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>

AGAIN, SOMEONE PLEASE TELL ME & OTHERS WHO HAVE POSTED SIMILAR THOUGHTS, WHAT PART OF ANY OF THIS IS INCORRECT? I STAND TO BE CORRECTED ON ANY OF MY POSTS & WILL ADMIT TO BEING WRONG (if someone/anyone can prove that I and others on this subject are "in deed" wrong).

GOD BLESS TEXAS!

Edited November 24, 2005 by PlummMeanGreen

[Monkeypox]

I really think it would be better for BOTH schools if they just went with "Monroe" and "Lafayette*" for branding purposes. Their official school name can remain UL-Whatever, but I wouldn't want anyone using that. It sounds Div1-AA.

*This is assuming that they have the school currently known as Lafayette murdered.

Edited November 25, 2005 by Monkeypox

[UNTFan23]

Both schools think they're entitled to be called the University of Louisiana.

Frankly, I could care less about this issue, so long as they don't draw other schools into the mess.

[Guest JohnDenver]

After years of achievement and leadership in higher education and five years of planning and lobbying, UL President Dr. Ray Authement was rewarded for his determination on April 27, 1984 as the Board of Trustees for State Colleges and Universities voted by a 17-1 margin to drop the “Southwestern” from USL’s name. On that date, the University of Southwestern Louisiana became THE University of Louisiana.

By that time, USL’s name had become a hindrance to further advancement and improvement among universities. UL had outgrown its double-directional name. UL’s enrollment was at 16,000 students, which made it one of the two largest schools in the three-state region of Louisiana, Mississippi, and Arkansas. It was a comprehensive university and had students from all 50 states and 100 countries enrolled. UL lead the state in professional and certification exams in many fields including engineering, nursing, and education. The University of Louisiana had received national recognition for their computer science program and was a charter member of NCAA Division I-A Football.

The name didn’t last long, however, as some administrators at other state schools worried that UL’s new name would diminish their image. In May of 1984, the Board Regents, with the strong support of powerful LSU backers on and off the Board, took the issue to district court, asserting that only the Louisiana Legislature could rename state universities. They won and District Judge William H. Brown stripped the University of Louisiana of its new name. UL was ordered to revert to USL on May 22, 1984. Soon after and in specific response to this case, the state legislature changed state law to require that only the legislature could change the name of state colleges and universities.

But the fight was not over for a name that was more reflective of the University’s accomplishments, achievements, and stature. In 1995, the Louisiana State Legislature to agree to allow the change. However, Act 45 required a compromise that has become known as the “LSU Rule.” The LSU Rule required that at least two state universities change their name at the same time. It required that all universities who change their name change it to “University of Louisiana at [city designation].”

Northeast Louisiana University hesitated and stalled but in 1999 Northeast’s Lawson Swearingen finally agreed to the name change. The Board of Regents and the UL Board of Supervisors finally approved the name change in late August 1999. USL became UL Lafayette and NLU became UL Monroe. USL officials decided to make it official at the Centennial Spectacular kicking off the yearlong celebration of the university’s 100th birthday. University of Louisiana was now a reality.

Fortunately, the legislative law regarding the name change only applies to university and state employees. This state policy does not govern UL alumni, supporters, other universities, and certainly not the autonomy of the press. This leaves the door open for UL Lafayette to be commonly and popularly known as LOUISIANA, while maintaining the official name.

That last paragraph is the DRAMA. Ulala calls themselves LOUISIANA. Monroe also tries to call themselves LOUISIANA.

The real problem is there isn't a UL flagship.

UTSW will have this same problem if a schol like Paul Quinn College ever decides to change their name to TSU@Dallas. Then who is the real TSU?

[VideoEagle]

UTSW will have this same problem if a schol like Paul Quinn College ever decides to change their name to TSU@Dallas. Then who is the real TSU?

←

Texas Southern?

Good summary!

[CajunNation]

Edited November 25, 2005 by CajunNation

[calvin]

Plum,

I think you need a hug............Can you say a little over-reaction..............I am not going to come on here and say that Dickey is the hottest coach in America, but I have respect for what he has done here, and I appreciate him for that. I knew nothing about UNT until I came here which was Dickey's first year, and I grew up in Gainesville 25 minutes up the road. I think a lot of people are like me, as far as keeping up and really caring about Mean Green football and it has a lot to do with the success the last 4 years. While reading this year's Dave Cambell's i read again where we had the 2nd best recruiting class (as far as their grading scale), in 2000 and that resulted in a 32-29 record in that span, 4 conf. titles and a 1-3 record in the NOB. You know in that same stretch A&M was 32-28? And I believe UT, Tech, and TCU were the only ones with a better record than us during that stretch, out of colleges in the state of Texas. And guess what, that was all under Dickey.

The biggest concern still is the OOC games, I am not making excuses, I am just being real. Out of all the OOC games that we have played over the years, how many games were on the road and how many were we favored in ? Also how many of those games were against teams that were in better conferences and had a better stadium than us. People like to mention the FAU game from last year, we should have won that game but once again it was not like it wasnt against a good football team, they went what 9-2, 8-3 and had 65 seniors ? And they beat a bowl winning team on the road the week before they played us. Also this goes for all the SBC teams, the record is so bad b/c look who we play every week, Georgia, Bama, LSU, Ark, Texas, so on and so on. How are we going to win games like that ? I think most of us were naive to think that we could never have a rebuilding year of just a down year. I think a good sign is, we have been in every conference game, so I expect us to be back in the mix next year. To say this thing has been spiraling, to me is an overreaction. Wait and see what the new recruits and guys like JaMario and Brandon Jackson and Aaron Weathers do next year. Chill out..............

[UNTFan23]

That's awesome CN ... if the people here at gmg.com really cared what name you two schools go by.

[PlummMeanGreen]

Plum,

I think you need a hug............Can you say a little over-reaction..............I am not going to come on here and say that Dickey is the hottest coach in America, but I have respect for what he has done here, and I appreciate him for that.  I knew nothing about UNT until I came here which was Dickey's first year, and I grew up in Gainesville 25 minutes up the road.  I think a lot of people are like me, as far as keeping up and really caring about Mean Green football and it has a lot to do with the success the last 4 years.  While reading this year's Dave Cambell's i read again where we had the 2nd best recruiting class (as far as their grading scale), in 2000 and that resulted in a 32-29 record in that span, 4 conf. titles and a 1-3 record in the NOB.  You know in that same stretch A&M was 32-28?  And I believe UT, Tech,  and TCU were the only ones with a better record than us during that stretch, out of colleges in the state of Texas.  And guess what, that was all under Dickey.  

The biggest concern still is the OOC games, I am not making excuses, I am just being real.  Out of all the OOC games that we have played over the years, how many games were on the road and how many were we favored in ?  Also how many of those games were against teams that were in better conferences and had a better stadium than us.  People like to mention the FAU game from last year, we should have won that game but once again it was not like it wasnt against a good football team, they went what 9-2, 8-3 and had 65 seniors ?  And they beat a bowl winning team on the road the week before they played us.  Also this goes for all the SBC teams, the record is so bad b/c look who we play every week, Georgia, Bama, LSU, Ark, Texas, so on and so on.  How are we going to win games like that ?  I think most of us were naive to think that we could never have a rebuilding year of just a down year.  I think a good sign is, we have been in every conference game, so I expect us to be back in the mix next year.  To say this thing has been spiraling, to me is an overreaction.  Wait and see what the new recruits and guys like JaMario and Brandon Jackson and Aaron Weathers do next year.  Chill out..............

←

Calvin, I will be the first to admit that I have (in deed) over-reacted almost to the point of embarrassing myself, although I am not that easily embarrassed. In fact, like one other posted, it wasn't that long ago that I was buying into all this DD business myself (or was doing my best to act like it). It just took some key losses (mostly during the 2'nd half of this football season) that woke me up about where I feel our recruiting has really been (or not been) the last 3-4 years. Yet there were 4 games this season (and their results) that was like my sitting down in a bath tub full of ice water that woke me up to things that many had been trying to tell me all the time in the last few years on what many of them felt (back then) were veiled successes.

One fellow NT Ex and GMG.com (occassional poster) will tell you that the last 2 X's I became this concerned with our NORTH TEXAS head football coaching situation was in 1990 and 1993. Of course, there were many others concerned those 2 years as well when coaching changes were made at the end of the football seasons of those 2 aforementioned years, too. It was just time for both Nelson and Parker to move on in the opinion of many alums/fans back in those 2 years, probably moreso for Parker since the next year we were going to shoot for the moon and try to reach NCAA D1-A numbers to get the reclassification and many of us felt a Dennis Parker-led UNT football team would not sell many football tickets as to meet the minimum 17,500 per home game average. With a new football coach and face, we averaged almost 20,000 per home game the season after Dennis Parker was fired.

I am not worried about attendance as much as I am with future recruiting with Dickey back in charge. IMHO, that will be his eventual Waterloo in light of the fact that all the regional SBC schools who beat us this year (including non SBC'ers Tulsa U and La Tech) are the very ones we have to recruit against every year. They have much ammo to use against us now (with our SBC membership with many of our membership most always in or near the Bottom 10); anyway, our recruiting opponents will lean heavy on UNT's "low profile" SBC membership during the recruiting wars we are even now in the midst of.

I fear the attendance thing will (soon enough) happen with DD in charge because we all know just how fast the bottom can fall out of all this at the turnstiles in MG Country (and that takes into effect that we over 15,000 per game average now). We have all seen our fans not show up en mass (suddenly) when things get out of kelter with this football program. I do think we have made some attendance strides (finally) because of the Denton areas tremendous surge of growth AND our last 5-6 NT freshmen classes have been record-setting classes each of those years. This (IMO) is showing up in a positive way at the Fouts Field turnstiles even now and even with what they are seeing. Lest we forget, many long time losing NCAA D1-A football programs still have sellouts of 50,000 or more so lets not get too "slap happy" content with this 15,000 number, either.

I just feel NT football is at a crossroads inasmuch as do we want SBC/Bottom 10 domination OR do we want to go to the next level (that some of us have actually seen in our football history)?

I think we ALL want the next level, its just that for now there are disagreements with just how we are going to get there?

Edited November 26, 2005 by PlummMeanGreen

[ipEAGLE]

The question everyone should be asking is: Can DD take this program to the next level?

I'm going to have to say no... look at his record.

If DD stays we will always be the best of the worst.

[NM Green]

Brothers, we are not the best of the worst anymore. We are very close to the worst of the worst and I see a dogfight in the coming years for another bowl berth.

That is why you ride the wave as long as you can and I hope everyone enjoyed New Orleans as much as I did. We will be lucky to go bowling again this decade.

Seize the moment because this day is not a dress rehearsal!

Take November 25th!

GMG

[PlummMeanGreen]

Brothers, we are not the best of the worst anymore.  We are very close to the worst of the worst and I see a dogfight in the coming years for another bowl berth.

That is why you ride the wave as long as you can and I hope everyone enjoyed New Orleans as much as I did.  We will be lucky to go bowling again this decade. 

Seize the moment because this day is not a dress rehearsal!

Take November 25th!

GMG

←

NM Green, many of us have considerred you one of this board's most positive posters even in past down times, so this post coming from you is a surprise, although you are just one more in a growing number who are beginning to feel the same way.

[MeanMag]

Do you think by not making the jump to the WAC and getting rejected for CUSA membership, that we may have shot ourselves in the foot recruiting wise?

Did DD promise a jump in conferences to some of the recruits that left?

And what does it say to a recruit when we in effect, "want to stay in the sunbelt", over jumping at a WAC invite?

I'll be the 1st to admit that I don't want to be in the WAC either, but are we showing that we would like to move up eventually?

Is the WAC really the next step in the ladder? Should it be considered a necessary evil to play western teams in order to move?

It's really no wonder LA. Tech didn't accept a SB invite.

Edited November 26, 2005 by MeanMag

[VideoEagle]

Do you think by not making the jump to the WAC and getting rejected for CUSA membership, that we may have shot ourselves in the foot recruiting wise?

Did DD promise a jump in conferences to some of the recruits that left? 

And what does it say to a recruit when we in effect, "want to stay in the sunbelt", over jumping at a WAC invite?

I'll be the 1st to admit that I don't want to be in the WAC either, but are we showing that we would like to move up eventually?

Is the WAC really the next step in the ladder?  Should it be considered a necessary evil to play western teams in order to move?

It's really no wonder LA. Tech didn't accept a SB invite.

←

Going Wacy is certainly NOT the answer. Just look at La Tech, who's most ardent supporters are acknowledging the school can't continue in the financial Black Hole they are in. However, their administration convinced their fans that going Wacy was going to be their route to salvation and now they can't go back without a huge hit in the fan base.

La Tech's finances are fine this year and perhaps next, but then they start to run out of money and most either get into CUSA or the Sunbelt or drop to 1AA or just drop football soon.

[CajunNation]

Going Wacy is certainly NOT the answer. Just look at La Tech, who's most ardent supporters are acknowledging the school can't continue in the financial Black Hole they are in. However, their administration convinced their fans that going Wacy was going to be their route to salvation and now they can't go back without a huge hit in the fan base.

La Tech's finances are fine this year and perhaps next, but then they start to run out of money and most either get into CUSA or the Sunbelt or drop to 1AA or just drop football soon.

←

From what I read on their board from their "people in the know", 2007 is the year they will have to:

A)Join the SBC

B)Go Indy

C)Go 1-AA

I'll give you a hint. B and C ain't happening.

Something like this is inevitable:

CONFERENCE A

UTEP(If not picked up by MWC)

Rice

Houston

Louisiana

Louisiana Tech

SMU

North Texas

Tulsa

Arkansas State

Tulane**

Possible later additions -- TCU/New Mexico State/Missouri State/Texas State

CONFERENCE B

Southern Miss

Memphis

UAB

Troy

Marshall

East Carolina

Middle Tennessee

Western Kentucky(will be 1-A by this time)

Central Florida

Tulane**

FAU/FIU/ULM/South Florida could end up here, longshot at best. FAU has a good chance.

**If UCF leaves to the Big East, Tulane is the swing school. Wherever they decide to go will determine which conference is called CUSA and retains all CUSA credits.

The only other possible scenario would be a planned split where CUSA remains in the West, and the eastern CUSA schools are absorbed into the 6 easternmost SBC schools. So that no conference has to start over. I doubt this will prevail. The MWC has shown that it is worth it to thin the herd, and schools that want to associate should be allowed to do so. Any money lost due to starting over would be recouped and then some in a few years.