Allen Ward fires Murray State football coach

eulesseagle · November 18, 2005

None of us like our out of date facilities BUT they are being upgraded!! If I were DD I would show a little disgust to our facilities too. Granted, it is probably a little harder to recruit with these facilities. Look at Fouts Field!!! A track around it, aluminum seats in the endzone and the outside looks worse than many HS stadiums. Our apathetic Administration is lathargic in getting anything moving to upgrade. All we get are promises and blueprints.

The SBC was a step up from the BWC when we joined and the logistics best fit our needs. Now there is no BWC and the SBC is the worst D-1 conference in America. We know it, recruits know it, DD knows it and everyone in America knows it.

Our only resolve is to make the best out of a bad situation until something better comes along and as of today...........no invites from any other Mid-Majors, BCS conferences or no invites to join a new conference. Admit it .... we are in Dante's Inferno ..... but for how long??

Don't you think DD is as frustrated as we are??? Heck, I would be.

1. Worst D-1 Conference......

2. Turned down by C-USA

3. We refused WAC for obvious reasons

4. Poor facilities at UNT

5. All the fire DD retoric because we can't compete with other mid-majors in OOC.

6. The bad mouthing he gets from this board & the firedd.com crap.

7. The Admin's ineptness to get things moving on a new stadium.

8. Playing in a sub-par football stadium.

9. Finally, we don't know what sort of politics/restrictions he has to put up within the administration on a daily basis.

meangreen11 · November 18, 2005

Rv extended Darrels contract and gave him the guarantee because he was pressured by the board of regents (specifically Bobby Ray). By the way, the way the contract is structured we can afford to buy him out. The guarantee is not paid in a lump sum but is spread over time.
←

Wrong RV last year extended Dickey's contract through 2010. That's 5 years at 250 K which amounts to well 1.25 million. That's money that should go to the stadium in my opinion.

meangreen11 · November 18, 2005

Rv extended Darrels contract and gave him the guarantee because he was pressured by the board of regents (specifically Bobby Ray). By the way, the way the contract is structured we can afford to buy him out. The guarantee is not paid in a lump sum but is spread over time.
←

Wrong RV last year extended Dickey's contract through 2010. That's 5 years at 250 K which amounts to well 1.25 million. That's money that should go to the stadium in my opinion.

Coffee and TV · November 18, 2005

Look at Fouts Field!!! A track around it, aluminum seats in the endzone and the outside looks worse than many HS stadiums.
←

*cough* Texas Tech *cough*

meangreen11 · November 18, 2005

Rv extended Darrels contract and gave him the guarantee because he was pressured by the board of regents (specifically Bobby Ray). By the way, the way the contract is structured we can afford to buy him out. The guarantee is not paid in a lump sum but is spread over time.
←

Wrong RV last year extended Dickey's contract through 2010. That's 5 years at 250 K which amounts to well 1.25 million. That's money that should go to the stadium in my opinion.

FirefightnRick · November 18, 2005

None of us like our out of date facilities BUT they are being upgraded!! If I were DD I would show a little disgust to our facilities too. Granted, it is probably a little harder to recruit with these facilities. Look at Fouts Field!!! A track around it, aluminum seats in the endzone and the outside looks worse than many HS stadiums. Our apathetic Administration is lathargic in getting anything moving to upgrade. All we get are promises and blueprints.
The SBC was a step up from the BWC when we joined and the logistics best fit our needs. Now there is no BWC and the SBC is the worst D-1 conference in America. We know it, recruits know it, DD knows it and everyone in America knows it.
Our only resolve is to make the best out of a bad situation until something better comes along and as of today...........no invites from any other Mid-Majors, BCS conferences or no invites to join a new conference. Admit it .... we are in Dante's Inferno ..... but for how long??
Don't you think DD is as frustrated as we are??? Heck, I would be.
1. Worst D-1 Conference......
2. Turned down by C-USA
3. We refused WAC for obvious reasons
4. Poor facilities at UNT
5. All the fire DD retoric because we can't compete with other mid-majors in OOC.
6. The bad mouthing he gets from this board & the firedd.com crap.
7. The Admin's ineptness to get things moving on a new stadium.
8. Playing in a sub-par football stadium.
9. Finally, we don't know what sort of politics/restrictions he has to put up within the administration on a daily basis.
←

Is it just me or is the "FIRE DD retoric" only coming from the internet? Or is there a sign or billboard in Denton along one of the highway's, or has anyone seen a plane flying a banner over campus that I have not seen because I don't live there? Most of the sarcasm that comes from DD about "CRITICISMS" he takes(the article after the ULL game where he was qouted as saying "Everything is about statistics and everything is negative here") only comes from the internet as far as I have been able to tell. I know some people in the stands by the pressbox have voiced their displeasure, but I doubt he hears any details concerning the OOC record and all out on the field. So if it's all coming mostly from the internet, how does he hear about it in order to comment on it?

Damn internet!

Rick

Edited November 18, 2005 by FirefightnRick

NM Green · November 18, 2005

The sad thing is the "hope" factor.

As a Mean Green fan I have 000000000000000000000000 X 000000000000000000

hope of going into an OCC and coming out with a win. This is so freaking strange, considering I never had that feeling when we were D1AA. I had my concerns that we could win in the 1AA playoffs, but NEVER in an OCC game. In fact, I looked forward to them and thougth "wow! Our shot at the big boys! Give'em he*ll"

Today I can't see us beating SMU, La Tech or Tulsa next year. This isn't just because of our current state. It is because of our approach and fear factor that now controls our players, coaching staff and a large part of the fanbase.

Its really dark in Denton right now, and I am not convinced this leadership can get us to the light.

gmg

NT80 · November 18, 2005

There is some good debate in this thread.

This is not about firing DD and not about just this season. DD is a class guy that runs a clean program and is a player's coach. I could live with DD if he can take us up. Is he motivated enough to still do it? Does he have enough ability to adapt to changes to move us up?

This season has brought out the reality about where are we. We have some young players, but we have many experienced players...either way it's just an excuse, good or bad. We have been consistant about one thing...losing to OOC teams and beating SBC teams, until this year and now we lose also to SBC teams, granted by only 9 points.

The disturbing trends I see are the continued large losses to the UT's, Tulsa, La techs. The 0-for-OOC every season. We did better with less in the 1-AA days in OOC. They used to be inspiration games for fans, now they are just given body-bag games and a check.

The Bowls were great. They are over. What's the next step and who takes us there and how? Can DD rebuild and get better than we were the past 4 years and up to a Boise or Fresno level. I hope so if he's here for 5 more seasons, but if he can't we lose all we've gained in fan base and repsect over those 5 long years.

How long do we have and what's the goal?

untbowler · November 18, 2005

Don't you think DD is as frustrated as we are??? Heck, I would be.
1. Worst D-1 Conference......
2. Turned down by C-USA
3. We refused WAC for obvious reasons
4. Poor facilities at UNT
5. All the fire DD retoric because we can't compete with other mid-majors in OOC.
6. The bad mouthing he gets from this board & the firedd.com crap.
7. The Admin's ineptness to get things moving on a new stadium.
8. Playing in a sub-par football stadium.
9. Finally, we don't know what sort of politics/restrictions he has to put up within the administration on a daily basis.
←

Wow I can just imagine DD sitting in front of his computer checking us out.

Give me a break.

DD's allegiance only lies with his players/coaches (which is fine and admirable) and his paychecks not the school. He has basically said FU to the fans and school with his wimpering about facilties and how tough his job is.

Imagine if Mack Brown, Stoops, or other real coaches bitched about that, they would take a ton more heat than what DD has felt in his 8 years combined.

He has it relatively easy here.

Edited November 18, 2005 by untbowler

eulesseagle · November 18, 2005

Coffee and TV---

As a high school recruit looking at playing in front of a packed Jones Stadium or a semi packed Fouts??? no comparison....you answered my question. I appreciate it and you have a good weekend.

meangreen11 · November 18, 2005

There is some good debate in this thread.
This is not about firing DD and not about just this season. DD is a class guy that runs a clean program and is a player's coach. I could live with DD if he can take us up. Is he motivated enough to still do it? Does he have enough ability to adapt to changes to move us up?
This season has brought out the reality about where are we. We have some young players, but we have many experienced players...either way it's just an excuse, good or bad. We have been consistant about one thing...losing to OOC teams and beating SBC teams, until this year and now we lose also to SBC teams, granted by only 9 points.
The disturbing trends I see are the continued large losses to the UT's, Tulsa, La techs. The 0-for-OOC every season. We did better with less in the 1-AA days in OOC. They used to be inspiration games for fans, now they are just given body-bag games and a check.
The Bowls were great. They are over. What's the next step and who takes us there and how? Can DD rebuild and get better than we were the past 4 years and up to a Boise or Fresno level. I hope so if he's here for 5 more seasons, but if he can't we lose all we've gained in fan base and repsect over those 5 long years.
How long do we have and what's the goal?
←

I agree very good debate here and very solid and fair post by NT80. I know that RV is doing everything he can to prepare us for the future.

Coffee and TV · November 18, 2005

Coffee and TV---
As a high school recruit looking at playing in front of a packed Jones Stadium or a semi packed Fouts??? no comparison....you answered my question. I appreciate it and you have a good weekend.
←

let me ask you this though, was Jones ever full before this season? I remember hearing from a Tech grad that these I-AA games have increased season tickets, so they didn't exactly have a waiting list for them. And a packed Fouts Field isn't too bad either, no matter how bad you guys want to hate it. Shoot, 23k for the Tulsa game looked good too.

eulesseagle · November 18, 2005

Coffee and TV--

Before we go running down the bunny trail together.....my point was that Fouts Field looks high schoolish. I know there are other college stadiums that have tracks around them and I could probably rattle off a few and so can you and many other posters.

The important point to consider is that DD is, probably, just as frustrated as we are under the conditions that he has to work. There is no telling what he has been promised (and we may never know) and what HAS NOT been delivered. He may have been promised a new stadium by 2004 when he first arrived - who knows what was said to him by who or whom. Now the "word" is that the stadium will be in place by 2008????

Just like you I want to see a new stadium!!

PlummMeanGreen · November 18, 2005

Rv extended Darrels contract and gave him the guarantee because he was pressured by the board of regents (specifically Bobby Ray). By the way, the way the contract is structured we can afford to buy him out. The guarantee is not paid in a lump sum but is spread over time.
←

..............................................................................

Dammit'! Why Can't I Post Shorter Posts!?!!?!?

Like many of us are now saying, this is just not totally about DD at all, although that really almost sounds silly to say that since he is the head football coach, but its really about many various circumstances and situations that our having a terrifically bad season in the low profile SBC in 2005 seems to have lifted the veil and brought to focus. On the other hand, he is the one that all of this has happened under this watch.

I am a romantic, many of you (I believe) are too as I read your posts; that is, my definition of romantic used in this particular subject meaning we like having happy endings to life's stories out there, but in my heart of hearts (and having observed the NT community for going on 4 decades now) this thing with NT football has yet to completely bottom out, but we at NORTH TEXAS just cannot afford for it to do that as a member of our low profile Sun Belt Conference.

You just cannot afford to have 2 or 4 win seasons in the Sun Belt Conference in any year because that puts you further down the food chain than you are already by even being a member of the SBC. And we cannot afford to be at the bottom of the SBC's bottom in any football season because of what it can do against us as we try to recruit against other SBC schools who visit Texas quite frequently not to mention schools like Tulsa U and Louisiana Tech University of Ruston, LA.

AN ILLUSTRATION, PROBABLY A POOR ONE, BUT ONE I THINK MOST WILL GET THE JIST OF ANYWAY...................

I once heard of some West Texans years ago that had a large amount of acreage fenced in where they raised wild turkeys from their infancy to maturity but once these wild turkeys became adults, they still could not fly out of that property due to the fencing; well, these west Texans spent a lot of out of season time feeding those wild turkeys and then during hunting season, they would go into the fenced in areas and have a good ol' fashioned turkey shoot. Some might call that kind of wild turkey hunting as tantamount to shooting fish in a barrell; you know, no real challenge with what those hunters were doing? NOTE: In a similar way, too many in the college sports world don't think we have had to do much to get to New Orleans.

Well, the SBC for NT has been a fenced in area, ie, a conference in its first few years of operation whereas in those first few years, NT has been shooting our opponents down left and right. Now since all the fences are down those wild turkeys (SBC opponents) are on equal footing with some of them even flying completely over us and our efforts to contain them; that is, the ones who have been doing the fenced in hunting the SBC's first few years are now being the hunted since things have changed.

Certainly, the trophies in those first few years of the SBC's existence were real nice (such as bowl games) but still many of our fans deep down felt we were kinda' hunting wild turkeys in a fenced in area. Seems too many of the regional and national sports media think the same thing. We know all those we recruit against sure as hell have used it against us (and from some OOC game results in recent years, have been successful doing so).

You know, it's most difficult to criticize your head football coach's leadership and seemed lack of a positive and forward direction w/o it sounding like we are coming down on our Mean Green football players, too; but we aren't and I hope our guys who wear the green and white know it. We just want them to have every possible advantage and chance to win against schools other than those in the SBC (but now the SBC, too); yet many of the things that have prevented that from happening the last 8 years in Denton have just been completely out of our football player's control or areas of responsibility.

GOD BLESS TEXAS...

Edited November 18, 2005 by PlummMeanGreen

Coffee and TV · November 18, 2005

Well ok, if that's the point you were making I agree. But I don't think a track and aluminum bleachers really stops anyone from coming here. Lack of facilities certainly isn't anything keeping USF from being BCS.

eulesseagle · November 18, 2005

Plum--

I almost heard the same story on Turkeys. Someone had the idea to do the humanitarian thing and pass out turkeys from a helocopter, Herb, I think was his name and worked for WKRP in Cincinati. Thought that turkeys could fly. This has NO relation to your post and no relation, by any means to UNT, staff, students, posters etc.... It was just a funny episode.

I think we all agree that having a 26 game winning streak against the other SBC teams was nice. IMHO this is an off year and DD has the personnel to start the streak again where we can win the SBC again. We HAVE to be dominant in our conference in FB, BB and all other sports (along with the butts in the stands and hopefully a new stadium to put our butts in).

ipEAGLE · November 18, 2005

Lets just be competitive out of the the SunBelt... I am getting fed up with losing all of the out of conference games. Beating Colorado or Kansas St would generate more fans than winning the Sun Belt.

We need a coach who knows he can build the North Texas Mean Green into a top 25 program. Dickey doesn't think that... woe is me.

PlummMeanGreen · November 18, 2005

Plum--
I almost heard the same story on Turkeys. Someone had the idea to do the humanitarian thing and pass out turkeys from a helocopter, Herb, I think was his name and worked for WKRP in Cincinati. Thought that turkeys could fly. This has NO relation to your post and no relation, by any means to UNT, staff, students, posters etc.... It was just a funny episode.
I think we all agree that having a 26 game winning streak against the other SBC teams was nice. IMHO this is an off year and DD has the personnel to start the streak again where we can win the SBC again. We HAVE to be dominant in our conference in FB, BB and all other sports (along with the butts in the stands and hopefully a new stadium to put our butts in).
←

Even (kinda') funnier, eulesseagle, is that I recall that particular episode.

GOD BLESS TEXAS..

MootPoint · November 18, 2005

Even (kinda') funnier, eulesseagle, is that I recall that particular episode.

GOD BLESS TEXAS..
←

OMG! That is the shortest PMG post I have seen in I don't know how long!!!

PlummMeanGreen · November 18, 2005

OMG! That is the shortest PMG post I have seen in I don't know how long!!!
←

And thats only because I had to take a bathroom break, MP, and then take some Immodium D!

Keep us all posted, Moot, I think you sometimes know more than you are telling us.

Of course at times many of us have been asked to not post some things that have to be kept in total discretion as to not jeopardize or alienate certain situations at UNT, and I think most of us have honored such requests every time, too.

GOD BLESS TEXAS...

Edited November 18, 2005 by PlummMeanGreen

KingDL1 · November 19, 2005

On the side,

I raised a wild turkey and it had no problem flying. It could get close to a hundred feet off the ground it just could not sustain it. He would roost in top of my trees. They can surely glide quite well.

I have been deer hunting and had a turkey land on top of the Deer blind which had a roof about 35 feet off the ground, scared the sh*t out of me.

KingDL1 · November 19, 2005

Is it just me or is the "FIRE DD retoric" only coming from the internet? Or is there a sign or billboard in Denton along one of the highway's, or has anyone seen a plane flying a banner over campus that I have not seen because I don't live there?
←

If I had a banner I would have been flying it over campus yesterday in a heartbeat!

Any publicity is good publicity, I think.

Edited November 19, 2005 by KingDL1

PlummMeanGreen · November 19, 2005

Is it just me or is the "FIRE DD retoric" only coming from the internet? Or is there a sign or billboard in Denton along one of the highway's, or has anyone seen a plane flying a banner over campus that I have not seen because I don't live there? Most of the sarcasm that comes from DD about "CRITICISMS" he takes(the article after the ULL game where he was qouted as saying "Everything is about statistics and everything is negative here") only comes from the internet as far as I have been able to tell. I know some people in the stands by the pressbox have voiced their displeasure, but I doubt he hears any details concerning the OOC record and all out on the field. So if it's all coming mostly from the internet, how does he hear about it in order to comment on it?
Damn internet!
Rick
←

With GoMeanGreen.com having received as many bytes as a few million per month in the recent past as I recall hearing from one of you, I think the internet is more than sufficient for most any subject, Rick. I think one told me it is during football season that GoMeanGreen.com has the most views (which only makes sense). We all know how in the past we've heard of those on campus who have said they "never" read this board, but for sure many times many of them always seem to know its content to the extent that one might have to question those "I never read THAT board" comments.

The fact remains that since the veil has been lifted with DD's disguised SBC successes of the last 4 years with a stark reality that has surfaced after recent poor performances against 2 SBC Florida schools (neither yet even fully D1-A as of Homecoming Day at NT) PLUS large point differential losses against 2 schools (Tulsa U and La Tech) that many of our NT fans and NT alumnus base have (somewhat) used as barometers of just how well we've similarly recruited the last 4 years (you know, our 4 bowl years?); nevertheless, all this culminating to the harsh cold reality that this football program under Darrell Dickey's leadershp will virtually be un-marketable for the 2006 football season and will undoubtedly and most likely stop the membership momentum that the 2005 Mean Green Club was impressively (and admirably) beginning to have.

The question that many in the NT community will have (even) during Homecoming weekend is do we have the kind of leadership at the University of North Texas who (first of all) can..........or will know just when to pull the trigger on all this; and that before we lose such a sizable amount of support with a fan base of which 4 bowl games in a row has hardly caught its imagination or noticeably increased and improved the turstile numbers at Fouts Field.

So you all enjoy the next 2 week's football games, and even if we win or lose, we still have 8 years of a below .500 record by DD, recent bowl game losses to CUSA's "4'th"place teams and 4 strategic losses this Fall (2 from Fla. & TU/LTU) as solid proof and evidence that this NT football program under DD is showing no improvement and going nowhere. Our football players deserve better. If being the "best of the worst" is what floats our NT leadership's boat, then they can sail out to sea by themselves on that boat because I know a growing number of many who will no longer be on that boat.

So have a nice homecoming football game at Fouts, fellow alums...it will be the first one I will (relunctantly) miss since 1973. This NT EX (Class of 1976) just cannot watch what is happening with NT football anymore under present leadership and trends.

GOD BLESS TEXAS (and NT Exes, too)

Edited November 19, 2005 by PlummMeanGreen

SilverEagle · November 19, 2005

You have to go back to Fry to find a more successful coach than DD, bottom line.
It doesn't matter if you think the SBC is a horrible conference, you can't tell me the southland was better than it.
And we never won the SLC 4 time in a row, and never won a 1AA playoff game.
DD has raised the level of expectations so much that people are not happy with 4 strainght bowl games. Do you remember when Simon left? I would have been happy if the new coach could have gotten us to 4 straight winning seasons.
Now, the standards have been raisesed, people expect more, but since DD was the guy who raised those standards, he is going to get some slack cut to see if he can move us the next level.
DD is getting fired this year, give that up.
←

If Corky had ever been given six turnovers in a playoff game, he damn sure would have won it. And THEN they would be even on that count.

SUMG · November 19, 2005

With GoMeanGreen.com having received as many bytes as a few million per month in the recent past as I recall hearing from one of you, I think the internet is more than sufficient for most any subject, Rick. I think one told me it is during football season that GoMeanGreen.com has the most views (which only makes sense). We all know how in the past we've heard of those on campus who have said they "never" read this board, but for sure many times many of them always seem to know its content to the extent that one might have to question those "I never read THAT board" comments.
The fact remains that since the veil has been lifted with DD's disguised SBC successes of the last 4 years with a stark reality that has surfaced after recent poor performances against 2 SBC Florida schools (neither yet even fully D1-A as of Homecoming Day at NT) PLUS large point differential losses against 2 schools (Tulsa U and La Tech) that many of our NT fans and NT alumnus base have (somewhat) used as barometers of just how well we've similarly recruited the last 4 years (you know, our 4 bowl years?); nevertheless, all this culminating to the harsh cold reality that this football program under Darrell Dickey's leadershp will virtually be un-marketable for the 2006 football season and will undoubtedly and most likely stop the membership momentum that the 2005 Mean Green Club was impressively (and admirably) beginning to have.
The question that many in the NT community will have (even) during Homecoming weekend is do we have the kind of leadership at the University of North Texas who (first of all) can..........or will know just when to pull the trigger on all this; and that before we lose such a sizable amount of support with a fan base of which 4 bowl games in a row has hardly caught its imagination or noticeably increased and improved the turstile numbers at Fouts Field.
So you all enjoy the next 2 week's football games, and even if we win or lose, we still have 8 years of a below .500 record by DD, recent bowl game losses to CUSA's "4'th"place teams and 4 strategic losses this Fall (2 from Fla. & TU/LTU) as solid proof and evidence that this NT football program under DD is showing no improvement and going nowhere. Our football players deserve better. If being the "best of the worst" is what floats our NT leadership's boat, then they can sail out to sea by themselves on that boat because I know a growing number of many who will no longer be on that boat.
So have a nice homecoming football game at Fouts, fellow alums...it will be the first one I will (relunctantly) miss since 1973. This NT EX (Class of 1976) just cannot watch what is happening with NT football anymore under present leadership and trends.
GOD BLESS TEXAS (and NT Exes, too)
←