The Truth About Tortilla-Gate

[FirefightnRick]

Let me first say that, I was completely blown away at the show of support from so many tonight in the stands, and so quickly too. I don't know how to describe it, really? It was amazing and I was really moved. You all mean so very much to me and my family, thank you.

The incident in queston.

Right before half I walked up one section to let someone know that another alumn in my area was looking for him and then he gave me a stack of tortilla's. I then walked directly in front of a tall security guard that was standing at the top of our section's stairs, the same stairs the coaches and media staff travel to get between the stadium ground and the press box. I had the stack directly in front of me and in plain site as I walked past the security guard. As I sat down to talk to someone on my row I see the tall security guard go down past me to talk to the bald-headed security guard who alway's stands below the gate. Then I see the bald headed fella point up at our area. He's done it before so I thought nothing of it. The next thing I know the tall security guard comes up the stairs directly to me and points at the stack of tortilla's and states: "You have tortilla's and you have been throwing them on the field. You either can get rid of them or leave". I said, "I haven't thrown a thing, much less a tortilla". He states next "My Supervisor saw you throw them onto the field, either get rid of them or leave, I'll give you 5 minutes to get rid of them". So I simply handed them to him and said "Here, take them then.". He immediately said "No, I don't want them either, you go ahead and get rid of them", and he walked off.

So everyone in my section and in other sections walked over and took the tortilla's, the bag and everything. About one minute later the tall security guard comes back down to me and asks "Where's the tortilla's?". I said "I did what you told me to do, I got rid of them". He asked, "Where are they, I didn't see you leave?". I said, "People came by here and took them with them". He got angry then and asked "What people?". I said, "People all around you". He then asked "Your going to show me who all has them and your' all going to leave, right now". I asked "Why?", I didn't have any tortilla's, I didn't bring any in and I have not thrown any?". He said "My supervisor saw you throw them onto the field, so you have to leave". At this point I got confused because no one had said a word to me before about having a tortilla in my hand, and since I had not thrown one at all much less onto the field, nor had I ever seen one thrown onto the field, I didn't think I had done anything wrong. So then I told him "I haven't done anything wrong, I did what you asked and I have not thrown a thing and I'm not leaving until I talk to "YOUR SUPERVISOR". He then said, "Then we'll call police and MAKE YOU LEAVE", which I figured, at least maybe PD might understand what the sudden fuss is about holding a tortilla is, so I stated "Fine, call PD", and he did.

When PD gets there it got extremely loud with all the hollering at PD and security. The CO asked me what happened and I tried to tell him but couldn't because of the shouting and all, so he said, "Let's go, you gotta leave". So I collected my F5 and walked out. But when we got to the end of the portal the CO stopped me and said he wasn't walking me out, he only wanted to difuse the situation and get me out into a quieter place so that I could tell him what had happened and I did. He then said he would try and get a clearer view about it and asked me to return to my seat. Which I did. After thinking about it for second and hearing everyone yelling it was amazing to me at how many hundreds of folks care about the tortilla's?

And of course, when I get back to my seat I find out Ramone Flanagan threatened one of our guys...ON MY ROW of course, while I was out talking to PD earlier?

Someone stated that it's a policy written in our season tickets that does not allow for people to throw tortilla's any more. I haven't seen anything posted at the gates yet about it, but I looked in my season ticket information and just for the record it say's on the back of each ticket "No outside Food or drink allowed into stadium". Well, I didn't bring any outside food into the stadium nor have I ever brought outside food into the stadium.

Also in the "Fouts Field Stadium Information & Policies pamphlet under "Fan Conduct" it states: Fans using foul or abusive language or gestures will be ejected, fans appearing intoxicated will be ejected and fans interfering with the progress of the game, throwing objects or going onto the field may be subject to ejection and possible citation and/or arrest University disciplinary action. I also had not thrown an object tonight, nor did I throw an object tonight onto the field.

At the back of my parking ticket it says to "Please visit meangreensports.com for the most up to date game day policies", but I have checked the site and couldn't find any "game day policies at Fouts Field" on the site.

I have already spoken to a department official on the matter tonight and asked if throwing tortilla's is against the rules or not? He stated there is a policy now in place to ban throwing tortilla's. He also stated that it is in no way the intention of the department to start having people hauled off to jail for it either. I think they want to faze it out slowly. He also stated to me that he did not know that it was a 17 year tradition, that he figured it started a couple of years ago and that it was only a copy from Tech. I let him know that was not the case at all. Regardless, they want to faze it out because of two reasons. One, the cheerleaders have complained about it in the past and the department has a responsibility to protect them.(and we wonder why we can't pay them to do a unified, controlled chant?). I saw the cheerleaders throwing tortilla's at each other tonight on our side, by the way. And two, the tortilla's end up getting crushed on the track and the track team ends up having to spend needed practic time getting it off, which is difficult when they turn into little pieces from being stepped on. And I'm sure they have recieved some other complaints that we don't know about? I suggested that we could possibly get a volunteer group to help pick them up off the track before we leave. A group with some blowers could do it pretty quick. And I don't know what if anything will come from my suggestion. Hopefully RV will consider it for next year. I think it's a simple solution.

In closing.

I'm a traditionalist that believes without tradition, we forget who we are and how we define ourselves. Lose that and you lose it all. It's been a huge struggle to help the University of North Texas remember it's traditions these past 20 plus years for me and many of you. Without me, the Swartz family and many others here on this board there would be no Model A, No Spirit Bell, No "Boomer the Cannon", and even though there is currently an AD employee who DOES NOT LIKE IT, there would be no NT Battle Flag at the games or for sale in the bookstores. And throwing tortilla's to honor one of our football teams greatest come from behind, underdog victories in our history is no different. I am the last person who would stand by and let someone from the outside who didn't attend NT tell me what my traditions are now going to be. I didn't with Helwig when he tried so hard to do just that, and I won't with this current administration. But we finally have a group in the AD dept who knows what they are doing. They are so far ahead of the Helwig days it is crazy to even think about. Game day at North Texas, for the first time EVER in 80 plus seasons, feels like a college game day. And if it's going to be such a danger to others, and such a problem for another team and a problem to some individuals in the stands who may think twice about coming back because of it, and if there's not a comprimise that can be found with the above suggestions, then so be it. I'll go and get a large nacho order to toss in honor of Corky's '88 squad.

My final thought:

I want everyone here to know one thing about tonight. After all of this, I did not throw a single tortilla during this entire game tonight. NOT ONE. The entire fiasco tonight in the stands over the tortilla throwing was created by one man who decided he would take it upon himself to go after me, for.......whatever reason, I haven't the faintest clue? The bald headed CSC? employee has been agitated over the tortilla throwing from the beginning when he came to that section. He has made sarcastic comments to the kids below at the railing because of it and to other kids who sit behind them. However, he's seen adults walking all over the stands for many games now with tortilla's in their hands, but until tonight he has never spoken a word to them concerning the issue, that we know of. Not once. But the most sorry part of it all was he chose to creat a lie about the situation to one of his subordinates, then unfairly placed him(the taller security guard) at the point of the chaos while he himself sat back and watched from a distance. For no reason at all he saw an opportunity to create a mess that could have easily turned very, very ugly with my 4 year old and many other small kids unfortunately right in the middle of it. And this wasn't the end of it for Mr. Clean. After the game while I walked with several of you across the field and stood in front of the tunnel, the same CSC empoyee walked by our group, and as he did, he then turned and walked backwards while staring at us the entire time as if to dare anyone to say something to him? I couldn't believe it.

That's about it. I had a lot of phone messages immediately afterwards and didn't get back with everyone and thought you should know what occured.

Rick

Edited November 6, 2005 by FirefightnRick

[Rudy]

We've DEFINETLY got your back brother. Mr Clean needs to unclench his youknowwhat and take a hike. I was hoping he was going to say something more to me when he passed us on the field. However, I have already sent an e-mail to the president/CEO of CSC about the actions of him and the other employees. If you like, I can tell you the e-mail address, Rick. You did NOTHING wrong tonight. It was that arrogant SOB that was after you.

[Legend500]

Same sorta thing happened on the Student side as well tonight...CSC dudes spent half the 4th quarter chasing down some terrorist-loving tortilla vagrant. Cops just walked the guys out, but still, most of the students in that area cleared out when the cop came.

There were really bad spots tonight where a bunch of inebriated college students throwing tortillas really lifted everyone's spirits. And what do they get for that? Marched out of the stadium so that the cheerleaders can throw tortillas at each other without outside interference?

It's gonna be an ugly end of the year. We need every fan and every crazy tradition to keep us going and ready to help the team. Even if the track team loses 15 minutes of practice.

[res1dg16]

1) Every security team has its Barney Fife!

2) I simply don't understand the fascination with wanting to throw a tortilla.

3) On the bright side ... how about that soccer team?

[rcade]

Sorry to hear that happen to you, Rick. What kind of security staff is UNT hiring, that they would call the cops on one of the team's most recognizeable fans? What next -- are they going to prosecute Scrappy for disorderly conduct?

[GoMeanGreen1999]

Great post and explanation Rick. My dad and I are sitting two sections over and next to your section wondering why the heck we have come to the point of causing such a comotion over a tortilla.

Its just really sad, that for so long, this University has tried over 3 decades to get people to come out to the games and have fun, and just about every time the fans do things to do that, the University wants to squelsh the idea. Whats funny is that TT throws tons of more Tortilla's then we do with 40000 people, and they don't seem to have the problems with them that we do - why is that I wonder?

I wonder if all of us season ticket holders decided to flood the emails of RV with these questions, that they would address them with more consideration?

[NTEdgex2]

I sit two rows right in front of Rick. It seems that whatever powers that be are TRYING to run the fans off! We need every body we can get that is in any way, shape or form interested in he Mean Green. If the tortillas get more people to the games, they should be handing them out at the gates! Just about everyone (not all) around us was picking up tortillas thrown from above and throwing them again. Why they picked on Rick, I don't know! As far as RF, (it happened just behind my right shoulder) the man knows his job is on the line, but there is no excuse for that kind of rage directed at a fan for a comment. It must have really hit home.

GMG!

[Rudy]

I put this in another thread, but I want to repost it so more will see it. Again, I know that some may take this as I have an ego, tooting my own horn, etc, but it needs to be said:

I do want to point something out to everyone, even though I know some will take it as I have an ego. The people in the yellow shirts ARE NOT SECURITY. They have no formal training, nor do they hold any licensing from the State of Texas Private Security Board. Even though I don't plan on doing it for long, I am proud of what I do now, which IS security, for the courthouse. I do have formal training and I take my job very seriosuly. Its aholes like Mr Muscles that give real security officers a bad name. They have a false sense of empowerment, and believe that they hold the same powers of a peace officer. REAL security do not, as they understand their job is to assist peace officers, and they understand their powers and limitations within the law.

I'm sorry to go off on the subject, it just bugs me. But the yellow shirts ARE NOT SECURITY!!!!

Just want to be sure that all understand.

[medpilot21]

Whats funny is that TT throws tons of more Tortilla's then we do with 40000 people, and they don't seem to have the problems with them that we do - why is that I wonder?

Actually, Texas Tech does have a problem with it. They banned the tortilla thing last year. We were at the Tech-Kansas game in Lubbock this year, and there were no tortillas thrown. I asked an Alumnist about it and she said they eject anyone now who throws tortillas. Kind of a sad day when you cant see that..pretty funny tradition I thought.

My point simply is this... If the security guys need to throw someone out to make an example, they are already screwing up. There are a few fans at the NT games that have given everything but blood over the past several years, and they should be un-touchable. They are as much a part of the gameday experience as tailgating. I brought a first-time fan to the game (his first college footbal game to attend ever, not just at NT), and this was not the image to leave him with? We yelled at the security guys hassling Rick, and we yelled when Ramon charged after Silver. Our attention was completely off the game for who knows how long, and La-La even scored a TD while we were distracted by the Rick-rousters. (we didnt see it? I looked back at the field and scoreboard showed they had 21?)

I know RV is a great guy, and we trust him completely. He has to do something about this mess with security. I dont know what the attendance was last night, but it was not good enough to start scaring people away for something so trivial? As for the Flannigan thing, I would let Dickey handle that. If the peace is going to be restored, RF needs to be on his way BACK to SMU, but thats not our call. I know many of you are upset with Coach Dickey, but Flanny is still his OC and DD needs to take care of him. Coach Dickey is a class act and will do what is needed with Ramon Flannigan.

I'm hoping never to see RF's "fan-charging", angry ass again...but that's just me.

GMG!!!

[GreenBat]

Some CSC head will roll over this. Rick, thanks for the post clearing up the situation.

[Rudy]

Emmitt had a great idea, and I think Im going to try this as well. If tortillas are soooooooooooooooooo dangerous like Mr Clean thinks they are, then Emmitt said he will no longer carry his weapon when on patrol. The next time he patrols, and the next time I go on duty, we are going to carry a holster full of tortillas on our duty belts.

One other thing about the 2 incidents. The angels priorities are way out of whack. While everyone was taking Rick's side, a few of the angels said outloud that there was a game going on and we needed to pay attention and support the team. What the hell?! Do they not realize that the people in those sections are the donors to the program and have probably supported the program more than they have, or in some cases ever will? They have the gall to scold US? I saw some of them doing HOMEWORK during the Troy game. When flanny tried to assult Silver, one of them approached me to scold us on our behavior in front of the recruits. We find out later, that they made the comment to the extent of, "If we could get all of you to move down to the first couple of rows so we can create a good atmosphere for you, we want to create a BARRIER between you and the fans? That is complete BS! And they are so effing concerned about their precious "section" that they have pretty yellow tape around. God forbid ANYONE, including the Lord Jesus Christ himself, even put one foot in that section. They go completely ape s over it. I was moving back and forth during Rick's incident to get a better view, and I made the mistake of standing in their unfull section. When I was yelling at Mr Clean why he would try to throw me out, I didnt do anything illegal, one of those idiots yelled out, "But it is ILLEGAL to sit in our section, thank you!" They are more concerned that noone sit in the pretty little section than the actual game. They are so proud that they have pretty little yellow caution tape over it. The Talons can't even get their section roped off, yet they have done more for this university than the angels ever will.

I know some of the Angels will read or hear about this, so let me make it clear, Its the actions of a FEW that are giving them a bad name. I am not saying that its the entire organization.

And to those who want to protect their little section, here is an idea. YOU FILL IT WITH RECRUITS, THEN YOU WONT HAVE TO WORRY ABOUT ANYONE SITTING IN THE HALF EMPTY SECTION!

[mini_green_cooper]

i wondered what had happened. When Keith came home all he said was there was lots of booing and chanting and it got louder and louder then there was an announcement that said that wasn't booing of the teams but booing because firefightnrick had just been thrown out of the game! But, keith wasn't feeling well and left before he could find out anything else so thanks for the explanation. i'm glad no one was hurt during the incident. and yes, rick, you do have a lot of support. and you shouldn't be surprised.

[Guest Aquila_Viridis]

It was rumored that the tall security guard was spotted talking to Karl Rove last week.

Either that or the NT administration, etc. has been infiltrated by closet supporters of certain other institutions that are trying to keep NT football in the dungeon.

[Pierow 2]

Many people were wanting to storm the gates with you if you just gave the nod. We could set it up to make homecoming a tortilla showdown.

[KingDL1]

Many people were wanting to storm the gates with you if you just gave the nod. We could set it up to make homecoming a tortilla showdown. 

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No kidding there! Almost everyone in the sections around Rick were ready to make some kind of statement.

We rained down about 400 tortillas from our group as they took Rick out. They did not say a word to us.

[LongJim]

Heard Jub-Jub call Rick out on the radio out at Lake Tawakoni Sat. night as we listened to the game out there.

Wondered what the hell was going on...

OT, but there was a MG fan in downtown Wills Point, TX Saturday morning with a spiffy JC jersey coming out of Subway. Cool to see a MG fan out there!

[Mad Hatter]

All I know is that I took a bag of tortillas to the game against Troy, and threw them at the first kick off. Immediatley a security guy came up and just picked up the bag and started to walk away. I harassed him a little bit for not explaining himself and that he was REALLY taking food out of my kid's mouth (which got a smirk), but he just kept going. I haven't tried to throw anything since.

[tonyhuntoon]

I remember when the cheerleaders used to throw frisbees into the stands. I cannot tell you how many times I saw an unsuspecting person get conked in the head with a flying saucer!

I think we should start throwing batteries instead. Maybe it would jumpstart that robot, Darrell Dickey.

Edited November 7, 2005 by tonyhuntoon

[greenjoe]

What about those equally lethal t-shirts that get fired by a GUN into the stands. The Wendy's T-Shirt cannon must be stopped.

GO MEAN GREEN

[yyz28]

Unreal. It's like anarchy run amuck around here... Gestapo security, and rouge violent coaches. Rather amazing.

[DallasGreen]

It was rumored that the tall security guard was spotted talking to Karl Rove last week.

Either that or the NT administration, etc. has been infiltrated by closet supporters of certain other institutions that are trying to keep NT football in the dungeon.

←

Interesting thought-- LJ and RF = one common denominator---they both came from SMU

[FireFightnJoey]

Actually, Texas Tech does have a problem with it. They banned the tortilla thing last year. We were at the Tech-Kansas game in Lubbock this year, and there were no tortillas thrown. I asked an Alumnist about it and she said they eject anyone now who throws tortillas. Kind of a sad day when you cant see that..pretty funny tradition I thought.

Tortillas have been banned at Tech for many seasons. I attended several games with friends between 1997 and 2001 and participated in the tortilla throwing several times. But they were banned around 99 and the ban has been enforced off and on over the years. Main reason for ban ---> people were freezing them and throwing them to get more air time to the field. Worked, but it also knocked out lots of folks including media and folks around the field. If you got caught --> ejection. But it was mainly the student section that had the problem.

Now, it does suck they are banning them at Fouts.

Good post Rick. It's a shame you had to go through that. Just another ingredient to the recipe of building a fan base.

[Green92]

At Tech they could cover most of the field with the tortillas. Here, we can't even get them to the other side of the track.

[EagleD]

I'm reposting this b/c i think it's valid:

I'm trying real hard to stay out of Tortilla Gate, but bashing these particular fans seems out of whack to me. So let me add my 2 cents.

Fans have thrown tortillas for years. Like it or hate it, it's fact. If the administration wanted to change the rules they should have let the fans know in no uncertain terms that the throwing of torts will not be allowed. Just having security suddenly confront fans about torts is going to create some problems.

The admin should have been proactive in this. Say it. Repeat it. Repeat it again and again. In short: CYA!

Try this analogy: If you have been attending class and turning in assignments in blue ink, then half way through you start getting marks off b/c you aren't using black ink, you're going to be upset (of course we should all be using green ink). You have a legitimate complaint even if the syllabus says only turn in assignments in black ink.

The athletic dept. should have chosen a side on this long ago. Either embrace the "tradition" (I use that term loosley) or ban it and let it be known that it will not be tolerated! Don't just spring it on the fans. Just because we all see the draw play coming doesn't mean we are all mind readers!

For the record I'm anti tortilla tossing. Unless it's filled with fajita meat and tossed with a Shiner Bock behind it.

[SilverEagle]

For the record I'm anti tortilla tossing. Unless it's filled with fajita meat and tossed with a Shiner Bock behind it.

←

What a great idea .....messy, but great.

Having attended YEARS of NT games when the fans did NOTHING but polite "tennis applause", I have to fall on the side of pro-tortilla.

After all, we don't want to be "outfanned" do we?