TSU new possible in-state rivalry game

jbchis · September 29, 2005

I think it is just frustration boiling over that SGA could be so out of touch with the current football landscape.

Green Lantern · September 29, 2005

We need to be focusing on getting a rivalry with a D-1 school period. TSU will not cut it (they may make a move to 1-A in a few years...and I don't have any hard feelings towards TSU in general...but Come on!)

Several on this board have offered many competent suggestions such as SMU, TCU, Texas Tech, Houston, UTEP...and I would be happy with establishing an extended series with any of these teams.

Another team I would throw into the mix would be New Mexico State...as they are the closest that we have had to a real rivalry over the past few years. Good close games with passionate fans on either side...if we were somehow able to attach a meaning to this game, they could be another potential candidate for an extended series.

I agree with an above post that stated...NT-TSU rivalry series = Worst. Idea. Ever.

Edited September 29, 2005 by Green Lantern

Eagle1855 · September 29, 2005

Why not....it could be a home game, give our teams early on gel time, and a nice little win.
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Im sorry, did you catch the A&M TxState game? Someone tell me where the nice little win would come from. No gimme games from what I watched

We have nothing to gain by playing a Div 1AA team like that and much MUCH more to lose. Unless they move to the Sun Belt, no thanks.

Edited September 29, 2005 by Eagle1855

UNTLifer · September 29, 2005

SGA should save money and travel time and pick a fight with TWU.

FirefightnRick · September 29, 2005

This is the same board who three weeks ago pretty much said Dickey was the best coach of all time after one victory.

Could you point that out? I seem to have missed it driving back from the Murf.

Rick

The Fake Lonnie Finch · September 29, 2005

Here's a list of teams we've played at least 20 times. Also, years are listed for spans of 10 years or greater that we played them. Finally, the last year we played them.

New Mexico State - 33 games : 1951-68 : 2004

SMU - 31 games : 1931-42 : 1992

Louisiana-Monroe - 21 games : 1980-94 : 2004

UTEP - 21 games : 1951-66 : 1980

Tulsa - 20 games : 1957-70 : 2005

Memphis - 20 games : No 10 year span : 2003

Here's a list of teams we've played 10-19 times, five year consecutive game spans listed, final year played listed.

TCU - 18 games : 1929-35 : 2002

Louisville - 17 games : 1961-74 : 1995

Cincinnati - 17 games : 1958-73 : 2002

Arkansas State - 14 games : 1983-90, 1999-2004 : 2004

Baylor - 13 games : No 5 year span : 2004

Houston - 12 games : 1946-51 : 1998

Nevada - 11 games : 1995-99 : 1999

Oklahoma State - 11 games : No 5 year span : 1994

Other schools we've played five years in a row:

Idaho - 9 games : 1996-2004 : 2004

Louisiana-Lafayette - 9 games : 2000-04 : 2004

Louisiana Tech - 9 games : 1983-87 : 1987

Texas Tech - 8 games : 1997-2001 : 2001

Utah State - 7 games : 1996-2000 : 2004

Boise State - 6 games : 1996-2000 : 2000

Middle Tennessee State - 5 games : 2001-2005 : 2005

It seems to me the best thing to do is pick a team that is close for both sets of fans, and that has at least some history. With those two simple points, I like the idea of trying to get long term deals with Tulsa, Baylor, Houston, Texas Tech, Louisiana Tech, SMU, or TCU.

Obviously, SMU and TCU are a little uppity towards us. We've got a good shot with Tulsa because of the Kragthorpe connection currently there.

There has been noise about Texas Tech and Oklahoma State trying to make their game like an OU-Texas II. I doubt it will ever be built up that way. OSU has a new AD who hasn't really said much about it. But, the border battle thing works well for many programs.

I think an annual UNT-Tulsa match-up would work well as a border battle set-up, as would Louisiana Tech.

Anyway, just some food for thought.

September 29, 2005

....or they are being proactive and anticipating that TSU will soon become I-A. Why jump to a negative conclusion about students at your own school??
It seems to me that this rivalry would work better on the basketball court for now. If the SGA approaches it from that angle, then you wouldn't have to worry about scheduling a I-AA football team every year and worry about the perception problems if we were to lose that game. TSU plays I-A basketball, last time I checked, and scheduling them wouldn't bring a big perception problem upon us. Then, if down the road TSU upgrades their football to I-A then we are already half way down the rivalry road....
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When indeed was the last time you checked about SWTSU basketball? Hell, you don't even know that there isn't D1AA basketball for crying out loud, so don't get onto that guy for saying that SGA might not know that SWTSU plays D1AA football.

If we are planning on SWTSU being our rival when(or if?) they reach the 1A level then we might as well drop down to 1AA ourselves. There are actually D1A schools that we have a history of playing that could possibly be rivals. By the time SWTSU moves up to 1A, if it even happens, North Texas should have bigger fish to fry. If we are at a the level of which a rivalry with SWTSU makes sense then we will be in BIG trouble.

Again, there is no D1A or D1AA basketball, there is only D1, D2, and D3. Playing them in basketball would be fine, but don't expect any kind of significant increase in attendance. The only increase in attendance besides the fans who take the time and effort to make it out for games will be SWTSU fans who make the trip.

Bottom line is that if we are setting our sights so low as to try to stir up a rivalry with a D1AA school that has no immediate plans of even moving up to D1A, then we have some very serious problems. If the SGA wants to lobby to get more games with SMU, NMSU, TCU, UH, UTEP, then great and good luck. Otherwise get to business and do something about the +/- grading scale and other important issues that they should be worrying about.

Edited September 29, 2005 by e-bone

Travis · September 29, 2005

TEXAS STATE?!?! hell, we might as well set up a rivalry with North Central Texas College.

Way to set that bar!!!

ipEAGLE · September 29, 2005

I'm not saying I agree with this... but don't look down on Texas State.

They have 26,000+ students with a fairly new athletic complex that rivals our new one.

DallasGreen · September 29, 2005

I'm not saying I agree with this... but don't look down on Texas State.
They have 26,000+ students with a fairly new athletic complex that rivals our new one.
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Why would we look down on them---we sure couldn't play TAM as well as they did!!

Eagle1855 · September 29, 2005

Why would we look down on them---we sure couldn't play TAM as well as they did!!
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We look down on their academics. Not athletics. I think thats what iP meant, however I fail to see a correlation between the quality of academics in relation to strength of athletic programs. Great facilities does not make your degree any less spare

No reason for us to be associated with SWT/TSU or whatever who plays in Div1AA...

Edited September 29, 2005 by Eagle1855

eulesseagle · September 29, 2005

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I think we are all in agreement we need regional rivalries.....but at the same time why not set some rivalries up with some MAC teams??

gamebreaker · September 30, 2005

i think the main reason most are against this is b/c they know we would probably lose. the aggies would have beaten us by 80. t-state will be D1 real soon...why not start a good in-state rivalry? its better than getting spanked by less than avg tulsa and k-state teams.....

September 30, 2005

Well, a lot has been said since the hooey that started this thread, but let me just say that I have to believe it is BS because no one could actually be that stupid.

Ibleedgreen · September 30, 2005

...and although he was not a personal favorite of mine, LBJ was actually very effective at getting his agenda past Congress.

PlummMeanGreen · September 30, 2005

i think the main reason most are against this is b/c they know we would probably lose. the aggies would have beaten us by 80. t-state will be D1 real soon...why not start a good in-state rivalry? its better than getting spanked by less than avg tulsa and k-state teams.....
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Texas State has put their NCAA D1-A aspirations on hold indefinitely. That whole thing was more their late AD, ie, Jim Wacker's dream than it ever was the SWT administration. I think Texas State is a very good school, have had many friends who graduated from there, but even with their enrollment growth, I just don't see D1-A for the Bobcats anytime soon.

If they tried to move up, TSU's main concern from the onset would be how to put a complete D1-A schedule together on an annual basis without having a D1-A conference to be a member of. TSU has never had a Baylor, Oregon State, Vanderbilt, TCU or similar schools at their campus stadium as we have, either.

Still amazing to me is how these 2 losses have caused some of our alums to go into a complete tailspin. I bet Hayden Fry (who still loves NT to this day) would have some most pointed things to tell such NT fans in the next few days when he is in Denton for next Tuesday nights game at Fouts. I think what he would say would be very convincing and any alum/fan would have no doubt where he stands on the sujbect.

GMG!

Edited September 30, 2005 by PlummMeanGreen

UNTFan23 · September 30, 2005

i think the main reason most are against this is b/c they know we would probably lose. the aggies would have beaten us by 80. t-state will be D1 real soon...why not start a good in-state rivalry? its better than getting spanked by less than avg tulsa and k-state teams.....
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And losing to a 1AA causes us to lose even more credibility. You lose to a 1AA and people think you don't belong in 1A period. Lose to a B©S school and people just think you don't belong with the "big boys". Tulsa will hopefully just be a game that snow-balled on us. Blow-outs happen, but losses to 1AA programs are just plain unacceptable.

Rudy · September 30, 2005

Well, my first thought is the same as many on the board. Wait untill they move up to D-1A then we can piss them off and create a rivalry. Until then, no way.

Second, if we want SMUt to acknowledge us and start a rivalry, well I know a few ways we could get them to "acknoledge" us

I like the idea of starting a rivalry with UH or RU, both are in the Houston area, so a rivalry could help create an avenue to go and steal recruits from each other. But heres an idea I dont know if anyone thought of, how about UTEP?

Whoever it is, we need to find someone, and piss them off enough to start a rivalry. Whoever we choose, Im in

ntmeangreen11 · September 30, 2005

If this game brings in 28000+ to the stadium, OR they are 1A I am for it. It would be good to have a rival, but not DIV1AA much less DIV 2.

TIgreen01 · September 30, 2005

When indeed was the last time you checked about SWTSU basketball? Hell, you don't even know that there isn't D1AA basketball for crying out loud, so don't get onto that guy for saying that SGA might not know that SWTSU plays D1AA football.

Yeah, there are some 300+ div1(top level) basketball schools...last time I saw our RPI we were somewhere below 240. I'm sure they're competitive with that...and if not, who cares we're not exactly in a position to talk down to anyone when it comes to basketball.

If we are planning on SWTSU being our rival when(or if?) they reach the 1A level then we might as well drop down to 1AA ourselves. There are actually D1A schools that we have a history of playing that could possibly be rivals. By the time SWTSU moves up to 1A, if it even happens, North Texas should have bigger fish to fry. If we are at a the level of which a rivalry with SWTSU makes sense then we will be in BIG trouble.
Again, there is no D1A or D1AA basketball, there is only D1, D2, and D3. Playing them in basketball would be fine, but don't expect any kind of significant increase in attendance. The only increase in attendance besides the fans who take the time and effort to make it out for games will be SWTSU fans who make the trip.
Bottom line is that if we are setting our sights so low as to try to stir up a rivalry with a D1AA school that has no immediate plans of even moving up to D1A, then we have some very serious problems. If the SGA wants to lobby to get more games with SMU, NMSU, TCU, UH, UTEP, then great and good luck. Otherwise get to business and do something about the +/- grading scale and other important issues that they should be worrying about.
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I tend to agree that we should be picking on schools that are currently I-A football schools or are planning to move up quickly...but seriously, why the hate (not just from e-bone) towards SGA. They've got a ton of other stuff to work on, but they also have a huge budget and direct access to some pretty high offices within the UNT administration. If the SGA didn't champion this kind of thing, who else on campus would?

Edited September 30, 2005 by TIgreen01

Zeke · September 30, 2005

........... If the SGA didn't champion this kind of thing, who else on campus would?
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As I said before, rivalries are not created in a brainstorming session. There never was a show of hands at a UT SGA meeting to make OU or A$M their rival.

Edited September 30, 2005 by Zeke

rhaprez03-04 · September 30, 2005

Ok, Lets look at this what make a rivalry? Intresting question. Keep in my folks, a good, money rich, and unforgettable has a good deep history. For example, Growing up in Waco, during the old SWC era, ever conference game was a hugh rivalry game for Baylor. The Baylor-TCU game was one of the oldest rivalry game in college football dating all the way back to when TCU was in Waco. Here is a good one. The Texas A&M -Baylor game has always been a big Rivalry. "The Battle on the Brazos" has been a big game. But did you know that a literal war was almost started between the two school. (Baylor alums back me up on this).

So who do we have really deep history with?

SMU? TCU?

Rudy · September 30, 2005

Ok, Lets look at this what make a rivalry? Intresting question. Keep in my folks, a good, money rich, and unforgettable has a good deep history. For example, Growing up in Waco, during the old SWC era, ever conference game was a hugh rivalry game for Baylor. The Baylor-TCU game was one of the oldest rivalry game in college football dating all the way back to when TCU was in Waco. Here is a good one. The Texas A&M -Baylor game has always been a big Rivalry. "The Battle on the Brazos" has been a big game. But did you know that a literal war was almost started between the two school. (Baylor alums back me up on this).
So who do we have really deep history with?
SMU? TCU?
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I thought NT and NMSUcks had a pretty heated thing going. Even though we were beating them, they were still pissin and bitchin.

DeepGreen · October 9, 2005

We DO NOT NEED a rivalry with a D1AA team. We can't get respect by trading punches with TSU. Trading hits with TCU, SMU, and hell- even the two Houston area teams would be so much more desirable than with TSU.
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You are correct.

Edited October 9, 2005 by DeepGreen