Time to Rethink the Dickey situation

eeally · September 21, 2005

Whatever will be will be...But after last week, I don't like what I see in Dickey. The Tulsa game was a debacle. Growing fan base wiped out like a mobile home in a tornado. With K-State we have some speculation that this would be Dickey's "Dream Job". Well we will see how he fares this week. Will this be a job interview. How will he react in Manhatten. Look at the facts of Dickey's tenure. He has shown great ablity to recruit but has this jaded him. Always having to develop the 3rd tier player looked over by BCS teams. He is ready and primed for the "next level". I think it is time for UNT to ask for a Head Coach that wants to stay here. An ex UNT player perhaps. We need to go to the next level and Dickey may not be the guy. If he fares well against K-State then everyone will say he could go there next. If he blows OOC again this year this board will look at what went wrong. Alumni at Div 1 need results and so far I don't see a win/win situation however we do against K-State.

Eagle-96 · September 21, 2005

Whatever will be will be...But after last week, I don't like what I see in Dickey. The Tulsa game was a debacle. Growing fan base wiped out like a mobile home in a tornado. With K-State we have some speculation that this would be Dickey's "Dream Job". Well we will see how he fares this week. Will this be a job interview. How will he react in Manhatten. Look at the facts of Dickey's tenure. He has shown great ablity to recruit but has this jaded him. Always having to develop the 3rd tier player looked over by BCS teams. He is ready and primed for the "next level". I think it is time for UNT to ask for a Head Coach that wants to stay here. An ex UNT player perhaps. We need to go to the next level and Dickey may not be the guy. If he fares well against K-State then everyone will say he could go there next. If he blows OOC again this year this board will look at what went wrong. Alumni at Div 1 need results and so far I don't see a win/win situation however we do against K-State.
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It may be DD's dream to coach at Kansas State but I doubt it is K-States dream to have DD as coach. They could get any number of better and more qualified candidates to apply for the job there.

Gary Patterson(TCU)

Jeff Bower(Southern Miss)

Dan Hawkins(Boise St)

Pat Hill(Fresno St)

June Jones(Hawaii)

Frank Solich(Ohio)

Paul Johnson(Navy)

Bob Petrino(Louisville)

Mike Price(UTEP)

Tom Amstutz(Toledo)

VideoEagle · September 21, 2005

I didn't realize the head coach position at K-state was open.

medpilot21 · September 21, 2005

Oh come on, guys... It's one OOC loss. Everyone (including myself) panicked after the Baylor game last year too. Yes we looked ridiculous in the Tulsa game, but this is a VERY young defense and a Freshman QB. Darrell Dickey has given you four conference titles, and four straight bowl games... Is there a coach out there you think can do better than that? Please name him, an then tell me how you get him here? Darrell Dickey is not just a class act, he is a motivator and a proven winner.

We played a flag football game in April for the Andrew Smith Scholarship Fund and raised almost $500 from just the players. Coach Dickey was there for us. How many Division-I coaches show up to watch their alums and students play a game like that? Their time is extremely valuable. He also brought a boat-load of water and siged new hats for EVERYONE THERE... this coach is a rare breed, and we are very lucky to still have him. He wants to be here or he wouldnt be.

This is an easy one. Coach Dickey is here, and most of us hope that doesnt change aytime soon...

Just my two and a half cents.. GMG!!!

BIG DAWG · September 21, 2005

Is there a coach out there you think can do better than that? Please name him, an then tell me how you get him here? Darrell Dickey is not just a class act, he is a motivator and a proven winner.

For these reasons alone, we keep DD for as along as we are lucky enough to keep him here.

Guy swe are having the same problems that OU is having without the same level of talent.

Before you all roast me, I know we are not Ou, and I am not comparring us to them, except for the fact that we are in similar situations.

Guys it is hard to win with a QB new to a certain level:

JV to varsity

Highschool to college

College to the NFL

This is why all offenses in this situation are bad. This is something we are going to have to work through.

MAY THE FOOTBALL GODS HAVE PITTY ON OUR OPPONENTS IN 2006!

eulesseagle · September 21, 2005

Let's look at the positive side of DD:

1. He has gotten UNT 4 SBC Championships...3 more bowl games than any other UNT/NTSU/NTSC coach.

2. He has placed UNT in the top 10 polls of the non-BCS schools on more than two or three occasions.

3. He has gotten the UNT program back on track with a very respectful football program that has, probably& indirectly helped the BB program under JJ.

4. He has kept us ranked around the mid-tier of all D-1 schools instead of where the majority of the SBC schools are located (between 100 - 117 in the rankings) and by the way that is where UNT was not too long ago.

5. He does recruit well in Texas because of his raport with Texas coaches and now is reaching into Oklahoma for recruits because of his reputation.

I would like to see us win more OOC games but that is the nature of the beast when you line up any given "Saturday night."

DD is right for UNT and for all the alums that have seen coaches come and go DD is the right fit for UNT and will be able to take us to the next level. Be patient.

tonyhuntoon · September 21, 2005

DD will never, repeat NEVER, be at a BCS school.

UNTSIG · September 21, 2005

Here's my problem....I think that there has been signifigant improvements in the last few years with North Texas Athletics in general. With the facility upgrades, better recruiting and I think a better all outlook for the future of the program. However, I think that one true way to measure how far we have come as a football program is by how well we compete against out of conference opponents. Why OOC? Because the level of competition in that has not changed. Changing to the Belt is what's changed. We get blown out. Against Baylor? Tulsa? - I can understand getting killed by UT, OU (of the past), and other "major" programs but I think that we have tricked ourselves into thinking that we are better than we are or that we are in a better position than what we really are. Everyone of us considers us a "mid major" but the truth is, we can't beat teams that are not even considered good "mid majors." i.e. FAU, Baylor, Air Force...since 2002 we have won 3 games against OOC opponents, we have played 16. We beat Baylor, Nicholls St and Cincinatti. There is a difference between being negative and being a realist who expects more from your school. If we want to be a big time program, we (as fans) need to react to 50 point losses against Tulsa (?) as such. What is the measuring stick now? Are we content with just winning the Sun Belt every year? I just think that the benchmark needs to change and we should start expecting more

PlummMeanGreen · September 21, 2005

Whatever will be will be...But after last week, I don't like what I see in Dickey. The Tulsa game was a debacle. Growing fan base wiped out like a mobile home in a tornado. With K-State we have some speculation that this would be Dickey's "Dream Job". Well we will see how he fares this week. Will this be a job interview. How will he react in Manhatten. Look at the facts of Dickey's tenure. He has shown great ablity to recruit but has this jaded him. Always having to develop the 3rd tier player looked over by BCS teams. He is ready and primed for the "next level". I think it is time for UNT to ask for a Head Coach that wants to stay here. An ex UNT player perhaps. We need to go to the next level and Dickey may not be the guy. If he fares well against K-State then everyone will say he could go there next. If he blows OOC again this year this board will look at what went wrong. Alumni at Div 1 need results and so far I don't see a win/win situation however we do against K-State.
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There is only one thing that takes our football program to the next level and I've been reading more and more of you now saying the same thing:

N-E-W ** S-T-A-D-I-U-M

Actually, Coach DD may be looking at KSU's Bill Snyder as his role model inasmuch as we watch NT officials get him all the football related facilities he needs. Such facilities that it took KSU a number of years to get Snyder as he slowly built his own little empire in Manhattan, KS.

NT needs all the ancillery football facilities to recruit against schools who already have (or will soon have) what TAMU's Coach Fran calls the "WOW" factor during recruiting season. For now, NT just needs to keep building better facilities than the schools that we annually recruit against. I really believe we've already passed a few of those with what we already have at our Eagle Point Campus. IMO, all that plus our new stadium will take us to the next level.

Edited September 21, 2005 by PlummMeanGreen

UNTLifer · September 21, 2005

Whoever taught PMG to add color and change the size of his font should be shot.

PlummMeanGreen · September 21, 2005

Whoever taught PMG to add color and change the size of his font should be shot.
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Actually, one of our key tail-gate leaders is the one who emailed me some advice on that; but in all fairness to him, I will not quote his name as to PROTECT THE INNOCENT!

Been dealing with H. RITA last 48 hours as my old home place is 20 miles from the Gulf of Mexico between Galveston and Freeport and I'm afraid something very near and dear to my childhood may be a goner in the next few days. Of course, its just a house and those can be replaced, but you who grew up in one house know where I am coming from here.

We have many on this board who I do hope are in their cars heading north as we all post, all our Houston posters, Deep Green, Island Eagle, twodogs, MG61, and many others who I hope are in the enormous Texas-sized car caravan leaving the coastline of the Gulf Coast. God speed to you all.

Edited September 21, 2005 by PlummMeanGreen

ntsumgspe · September 21, 2005

Whoever taught PMG to add color and change the size of his font should be shot.
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BTW, how exactly do you make those changes ?

Coffee and TV · September 21, 2005

Here's my problem....I think that there has been signifigant improvements in the last few years with North Texas Athletics in general. With the facility upgrades, better recruiting and I think a better all outlook for the future of the program. However, I think that one true way to measure how far we have come as a football program is by how well we compete against out of conference opponents. Why OOC? Because the level of competition in that has not changed. Changing to the Belt is what's changed. We get blown out. Against Baylor? Tulsa? - I can understand getting killed by UT, OU (of the past), and other "major" programs but I think that we have tricked ourselves into thinking that we are better than we are or that we are in a better position than what we really are. Everyone of us considers us a "mid major" but the truth is, we can't beat teams that are not even considered good "mid majors." i.e. FAU, Baylor, Air Force...since 2002 we have won 3 games against OOC opponents, we have played 16. We beat Baylor, Nicholls St and Cincinatti. There is a difference between being negative and being a realist who expects more from your school. If we want to be a big time program, we (as fans) need to react to 50 point losses against Tulsa (?) as such. What is the measuring stick now? Are we content with just winning the Sun Belt every year? I just think that the benchmark needs to change and we should start expecting more
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You've said everything I've been thinking. Where is the reaction, great 4 Sun Belt titles, thanks Dickey, now prove you can beat someone other than the lowlies that many programs don't even consider Div 1A.

PlummMeanGreen · September 22, 2005

You've said everything I've been thinking. Where is the reaction, great 4 Sun Belt titles, thanks Dickey, now prove you can beat someone other than the lowlies that many programs don't even consider Div 1A.
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I think our main problem is that the Brandon Kennedy recruiting class of about 8-12 high quality football players have not been recruited to take their place; and if they have been, we are just at that juncture (very few will be patient with) of just having to wait on their development. This just looks like a classic rebuilding year to me even after the win over MTSU. For the moment, what is going on with our offensive line has many of us completely baffled. Hopefully, they will work it out because we all want them to be successful. I am sure our entire backfield would concur with that, too.

Edited September 22, 2005 by PlummMeanGreen

UNTSIG · September 22, 2005

In "rebuilding" years, aren't you suppose to do worse than what you did in non "rebuilding" years? So far we have beat a Sun Belt team and lost badly to a OOC team...I don't see the difference. Sounds like the last 4 years to me

Got5onIt · September 22, 2005

In "rebuilding" years, aren't you suppose to do worse than what you did in non "rebuilding" years? So far we have beat a Sun Belt team and lost badly to a OOC team...I don't see the difference. Sounds like the last 4 years to me
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Hammer, nail, hit it on the head.

PlummMeanGreen · September 22, 2005

In "rebuilding" years, aren't you suppose to do worse than what you did in non "rebuilding" years? So far we have beat a Sun Belt team and lost badly to a OOC team...I don't see the difference. Sounds like the last 4 years to me
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Of course, our win is against and 0 & 3 MUTS football team.

I think we all share the same frustration. I really believed that in 2005 we'd take our next step up the BCS ladder with 1 or 2 OOC wins and if we got lucky--mabye 3. Well, at this moment, all bets are off with that.

Yet haven't many of us have played most of our teams 2005 football schedule of what we penciled in as would-be wins with (basically) last years Mean Green football team?

I didn't realize or just had my head in the sand that (according to the Mean Green Radio Network guys) we are the 3'rd youngest football team in NCAA D1-A. Don't quite know how they came up with that statistic, but I think we'd all agree that against Tulsa U, we probably had way too many inexperience players on that new $700,000 turf at Fouts last Saturday night. The way Tulsa played OU should have been a pretty darn big red flag that the Hurricanes were not going to be a talent-less football team; and I don' care that OU is have a down year, because they still recruit Big 12-level talent.

Those sitting in my section kept commenting how Dan Meager was running for his life the other night most every play. It seems the TU defensive linemen were immediately in his face right after he received the ball from our center. I don't know if the TU game would be a very good barometer for the young Meager with that in mind. We really do need a whole bunch of 1'st year (no game experience) NT football players grow up very quickly in Mean Green Country.

Edited September 22, 2005 by PlummMeanGreen

FirefightnRick · September 22, 2005

I wouldn't consider 2003 or 2004 as rebuilding years and we got destroyed against OU, Texas, Baylor, Air Force, Memphis, Southern Miss and lost to a first year 1-A program during the span of those two years. We also won the Sun Belt conference both years that included wins over Sun Belt teams by margins I would describe as by the "Skin of our teeth" including a 3 point win against NMSU, a 2 point win over ULM and a 5 point win over MTSU.

With that said, DD certainly deserves our respect and support as he has done more with less. I would just like to simply see a bit of a change in offensive philosophy.

Rick

LongJim · September 22, 2005

I think our main problem is that the Brandon Kennedy recruiting class of about 8-12 high quality football players have not been recruited to take their place; and if they have been, we are just at that juncture (very few will be patient with) of just having to wait on their development. This just looks like a classic rebuilding year to me even after the win over MTSU.

Speaking as somone looking in over here from time to time, I agree. QB development can't be rushed. Period. It's the most important position on the field, and it's most apparent when someone inexperienced is back there. Heck, look at Vince Young from his So. year to now. Big improvement...I think that position is going to get better as the year goes on.

For the moment, what is going on with our offensive line has many of us completely baffled. Hopefully, they will work it out because we all want them to be successful. I am sure our entire backfield would concur with that, too.
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Frankly, I'm not real surprised. Offensive line is a position that demands not only physical ability and preparation, but attitude. They have to have an attitude of "you WILL NOT beat me, or touch my quarterback. I WILL put you either on your back, or out of my RB's path" We'll see more downfield and (successful) play action passing when the O line gets this attitude and starts making things happen in the running game, and they learn to pick up the blitz and hit the hot routes. That's just the way it works.

Tulsa sort of knew the level they needed to play at based on their game at OU. UNT as a whole, didn't, IMO. Once they got down, things snowballed, and then you have 54-2.

That's just my take. I think UNT will play much better this weekend--although the scoreboard may not show it.

Regarding Dickey: He is a winner. He is trying to build a power-running team that can throw to keep the D honest--which is IMO a very sound approach, considering the skill level of the athletes he is recruiting. He's a good coach.

Also, a poster mentioned that the level of OOC competition hasn't changed. That's right, and the talent level of their recruits hasn't either. The talent level of UNT's recruits has risen, and that's the reason they're winning the SBC right now. Having said that, they are still not recruiting athletes anywhere near as good as their OOC opponents--and I'll include Tulsa in there as well.

At any rate, Go MG--my home county team!

LoveMG · September 22, 2005

Oh come on, guys... It's one OOC loss. Yes we looked ridiculous in the Tulsa game, but this is a VERY young defense and a Freshman QB. Darrell Dickey has given you four conference titles, and four straight bowl games...
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4 conference titles in the worst conference in America. 1 bowl win in 4 tries. 30 ooc losses against 4 wins. The Tulsa game was DD in a nutshell: outcoached. We lost more fans than you know because of that debacle.

PlummMeanGreen · September 22, 2005

Speaking as somone looking in over here from time to time, I agree. QB development can't be rushed. Period. It's the most important position on the field, and it's most apparent when someone inexperienced is back there. Heck, look at Vince Young from his So. year to now. Big improvement...I think that position is going to get better as the year goes on.
Frankly, I'm not real surprised. Offensive line is a position that demands not only physical ability and preparation, but attitude. They have to have an attitude of "you WILL NOT beat me, or touch my quarterback. I WILL put you either on your back, or out of my RB's path" We'll see more downfield and (successful) play action passing when the O line gets this attitude and starts making things happen in the running game, and they learn to pick up the blitz and hit the hot routes. That's just the way it works.
Tulsa sort of knew the level they needed to play at based on their game at OU. UNT as a whole, didn't, IMO. Once they got down, things snowballed, and then you have 54-2.
That's just my take. I think UNT will play much better this weekend--although the scoreboard may not show it.
Regarding Dickey: He is a winner. He is trying to build a power-running team that can throw to keep the D honest--which is IMO a very sound approach, considering the skill level of the athletes he is recruiting. He's a good coach.
Also, a poster mentioned that the level of OOC competition hasn't changed. That's right, and the talent level of their recruits hasn't either. The talent level of UNT's recruits has risen, and that's the reason they're winning the SBC right now. Having said that, they are still not recruiting athletes anywhere near as good as their OOC opponents--and I'll include Tulsa in there as well.
At any rate, Go MG--my home county team!
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Thanks for that post, T-Sipper! I bet we had many new fans/new faces at last weekend's game AND watching their, uh, "home county team!"

I guess not only do we need our team to forget last Saturday night, move on and step up to the plate the rest of the season, but I also suppose we need to ask that of all those new fans/new faces (and, of course, us) at Fouts last Saturday night do the same. Many have already dismissed all those (obvious) new fans the rest of this season based on our past, but lets just wait, see and let eveyone have a fresh start. I think we all admire perrennial losing Big Time U football programs that still fill their stadiums each home game, and one day hope we will be such a program no matter how our team is playing OR..................who we are playing.

Edited September 22, 2005 by PlummMeanGreen

Rudy · September 22, 2005

There is only one thing that takes our football program to the next level and I've been reading more and more of you now saying the same thing:
N-E-W ** S-T-A-D-I-U-M
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I agree with that in part. But, what happens when you get that beautiful new 40K seat stadium built, and for your first game we have a similar output and outcome against, say, Houston? If you think Fouts looks empty Tuesday night (weekday game and 1st game after TU), wait till you see the new stadium after a similar loss.

That being said, Go Mean Green! Kick kstates arse!!!!

PlummMeanGreen · September 22, 2005

I agree with that in part. But, what happens when you get that beautiful new 40K seat stadium built, and for your first game we have a similar output and outcome against, say, Houston? If you think Fouts looks empty Tuesday night (weekday game and 1st game after TU), wait till you see the new stadium after a similar loss.
That being said, Go Mean Green! Kick kstates arse!!!!
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And what if a chunk of ice at the North Pole the size of Texas were to break off(eventually) causing a tidal wave in New York City which eventually freezes into solid ice and creating yet another American natural disaster? (Sorry, that movie "The Day After Tomorrow" is one of my favorite "what if" the weather gets all screwed up movies); but what I am saying, Rudy, in my usual left (or right) of center sorta' way is: What can we possibly do about what "might" happen? If I were to think that way all the time, I might not want to get out of bed every day fearing what might happen once I put my feet on the bedroom floor.

Hopefully, one day our fans come to watch the Mean Green no matter what our record, the previous game's out-come or even who it is that we play. That would be a full 180 degree maturation of our athletic program that we are (for sure) not used to seeing in Denton as of yet. I hope such an attitude has even already begun with the last 5 record breaking UNT freshmen classes. They are our future in so many ways.

GMG!

PS: I do agree with your: Kick kstates arse, though!

Edited September 22, 2005 by PlummMeanGreen

Rudy · September 22, 2005

True, you can't always plan on what ifs and maybes. However, when you consider those possiblities, you have to look at the likelyhood. So far, I have not seen anything to lead me to believe that that scenario would not happen.

PlummMeanGreen · September 22, 2005

True, you can't always plan on what ifs and maybes. However, when you consider those possiblities, you have to look at the likelyhood. So far, I have not seen anything to lead me to believe that that scenario would not happen.
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Hey Rudy, lets first get that 40,000 seat stadium, take the chance and see!

GMG!