A great picture here..

[Stan R]

Where's waldo?

I should add that this is a freshman orientation. Picture is from the online North Texan.

Edited July 5, 2005 by Stan R

[SilverEagle]

So, what our AD should be doing is registering for Freshman Classes?

[PlummMeanGreen]

Super photo of Rick V mixing with the masses...

I just wish everyone else in his department and other departments on our campus had his evangelical zeal because that is just what its going to take to put dramatically more new faces & new fans into venerable Fouts Field.

With our location and growing NT constituency, we don't need to stay log-jammed where we presently are at the turnstiles and we won't in due time.

Fellow Greenbackers, there is going to be day when having a crowd under 30,000 will disappoints all of us, but we have a ways to go before we get there.

............................................................................................................................................................

PS: Wonder what they project our 2005 Fall Freshmen class to be? Our entire 2005 Fall enrollment?

Edited July 5, 2005 by PlummMeanGreen

[untgirl04]

I don't think we should get our hopes up for major growth in enrollment numbers this year. Last year, everyone thought that we'd siginifcantly increase our enrollment, and we only grew by 122 students or so.

As far as game attendance numbers.... I think RV has done and is doing an excellent job generating excitement for the games. Our attendance numbers will increase because Freshmen O, Eagle Camp, and other organizations are instilling NT spirit early. Even though overall student enrollment may not increase, I predict a fairly significant increase in game attendance, especially among freshmen and sophomores.

[PlummMeanGreen]

As far as game attendance numbers.... I think RV has done and is doing an excellent job generating excitement for the games. Our attendance numbers will increase because Freshmen O, Eagle Camp, and other organizations are instilling NT spirit early. Even though overall student enrollment may not increase, I predict a fairly significant increase in game attendance, especially among freshmen and sophomores.

Totally agree, untgirl04...

Our future attendance growth at Fouts will be with all those who were students (and future NT Exes) who have been part of this great 5 year run of winning Mean Green football at the University of North Texas.

I just wish we could put a hot shot up against the alums from the 1970's (my group), 1980's and 1990's--these are the NT Exes who are holding us back at the turnstiles BUT.............

.............I think the novelty and excitement of our future new state-of-the-art college football stadium at Eagle Point Campus will even bring some of that group back to campus (if for no other reason than to satisfy all their personal curiosities as to ask this question: "What in the wide world of sports is a-goin' on at my alma mater?!?!" I then feel many from that group will come check it out and stick around once they see.

Edited July 5, 2005 by PlummMeanGreen

[meanrob]

The best way to increase attendance is to increase the season ticket base.

And what are we doing to increase that?

[Stan R]

The best way to increase attendance is to increase the season ticket base.

And what are we doing to increase that?

Disagree. The best way to increase attendance IMO is through the students. Alumni side is not hurting for fans currently.

[BIG DAWG]

It is definately the sudents that will boost attendance.

A good point was made that the students that were around for the bad times are filtering out, and now you are getting a great base of students who have seen nothing but winning ways, and I think that will benefit us greatly.

What we need more than anything to get attendance up this year is WINS EARLY!

All of the 0-4, 0-5 starts really kill attendance.

If WHOEVER is at QB can be somewhat successful early, we have a CHANCE at going into conference play with an above .500 record, and that will be HUGE for attendance numbers I feel.

[UNTLifer]

True, there are 100,000 alumni in the Metroplex, have been for years. And what has this alumni base contributed to the athletic department? Not much. Our season ticket base is 3,500 or so. This base consists of not only alumni, but faculty and staff and local citizens. So our alumni support for season tickets is less than 3.5% of the alumni in the immediate area.

We have 30,000 + students on campus and historically the athletic department has done absolutely nothing to connect with the students until RV came along. When I was in school, I went to games because I wanted to. I knew when the games were because I want to, not by some great promotional job of the athletic department at that time.

I love what RV is doing. Connect and create excitement with the current student body will create connected and excited alumni when they graduate. They will more than likely be the future growth of our season ticket base, not the same old 100,000 plus alumni in the DFW market that haven't come to games in the past, aren't coming know and probably won't come in the future.

[BIG DAWG]

Eagle 1855 -

Not to try and beat you down, but every college has more alumns than students. It is just easier to get the students out in larger numbers.

No kids, careers, etc.

Don't get me wrong, we could benefit from getting more alumns in the seats, but are student section, even though brings a crowd, could and should be a lot larger.

[Stan R]

Arent there like 100,000 or so NT alumns in the DFW area?

If that is the case, seems to me you would have a bigger population number to work with (I imagine the number would be significantly larger if you added in their families, etc)

That is a much higher potential market than the student body of 30,000.

Now, which is "easiest" to actually reach given the fact students get in for FREE, Im not sure...

Doesnt seem like too much to ask to get 25k+ to each game with those numbers but we havent done it consistently yet!

Any way to know what the attendance break down is? Students vs paid admissions?

Here's the problem I see with your arguments.

1.) The 100,000 estimate is wildly overblown and overused. How many of that 100,000 do we actually have contact information for? Is that number really accurate? How many have we already contacted and have basically said forget it?

2.) The students are a captive and in most cases indifferent audience. They haven't been hardened by attitudes of "this school sucks, etc.. etc.." and they can be reached with marketing, promotions directly on campus. The market is right in front of you and in most cases the promotions would be much cheaper and eaiser to implement.

Now - with that said - has enough been done to market to the students, probably not. But that being said - I'm of the opinion that money would be MUCH better spent to get another 5,000 students to get involved (and probably at some later point become season ticket holders) than to dump $500,000 for a billboard on I35 that mostly reaches OU, UT and A&M fans...

[Ktulu7]

You guys could possibly put up a point system on students' ID cards where they are eventually entered into a drawing for something like an XBox or whatever for going to athletic events. There are giveaways and barbecues and free tailgates and things of the sort at LaTech. It worked very well last year as the student section was amazing. They add a lot to any school's games because they're usually such a loud, insane crowd compared to the old folks.

[NTEagle08]

I don't think we should get our hopes up for major growth in enrollment numbers this year. Last year, everyone thought that we'd siginifcantly increase our enrollment, and we only grew by 122 students or so.

As far as game attendance numbers.... I think RV has done and is doing an excellent job generating excitement for the games. Our attendance numbers will increase because Freshmen O, Eagle Camp, and other organizations are instilling NT spirit early. Even though overall student enrollment may not increase, I predict a fairly significant increase in game attendance, especially among freshmen and sophomores.

student enrollment will probably go up a little, just like it did last year, but not by much. I think the big enrollment boom for universities is going to come in the Fall of 2006, when the students who enrolled in community colleges for two years, due to tuition deregulation, start transfer to the major four year universities.

[PlummMeanGreen]

Arent there like 100,000 or so NT alumns in the DFW area?

If that is the case, seems to me you would have a bigger population number to work with (I imagine the number would be significantly larger if you added in their families, etc)

That is a much higher potential market than the student body of 30,000.

Now, which is "easiest" to actually reach given the fact students get in for FREE, Im not sure...

Doesnt seem like too much to ask to get 25k+ to each game with those numbers but we havent done it consistently yet!

Any way to know what the attendance break down is? Students vs paid admissions?

Once we get the right formula, ie, a very pro-active and out in the community marketing program (just like the above photo shows) to solve this attendance thing (and I think we will) there is nothing that can stop this program especially when all the new venues at the Mean Green Athletic Village are completely finished.

I say it about this time every year when this attendance subject comes up, but TCU had a very pro-active "TCU: My Home Team" type campaign that really included a very large cross-section of community and Tarrant County leaders and they are now in the 30's per game average attendance most years. I just have to think that that community focus had much to do with the Frog's success.

You know, though, if 50,000 fans will sit in heat and humidity at a Texas Ranger game yesterday even with all the bad publicity they've gotten lately, I just have to think NT can put over 30,000 fans for any home game no matter who we play. We need to (as meanrob posted) increase the season ticket base and just go "lights out" for new fans and we can do all that in Denton County (population, over 500,000 citizens). And then any NT Exes we get from outside Denton County can be the icing on the cake at our football stadium's turnstiles.

Solving the attendance situation at NORTH TEXAS should be our next new frontier in Denton as we seemed to have conquered making it to bowl games.

Edited July 5, 2005 by PlummMeanGreen

[MeanGreen61]

Disagree. The best way to increase attendance IMO is through the students. Alumni side is not hurting for fans currently.

When you have the # of season tickets and the attendance numbers we have.........the alumni side or any side is definately hurting

Edited July 5, 2005 by MeanGreen61

[Stan R]

When you have the # of season tickets and the attendance numbers we have.........the alumni side or any side is definately hurting

True, but I guess I'm just talking in relative terms. There are more alumni out there than students. Maybe "not hurting" was a bad choice of words.

[untgirl04]

I think the season ticket numbers will increase in the next few years because of the increased student involvement on campus. I agree with marketing more to the students than alumni because you have a lot greater future benefit in numbers. Now, I agree that we need to increase season ticket sales and get more Dentonites out to the games, but in a lot of ways, that's a short-term fix. When you market to the students and get them loving NT before they graduate, students are more likely to participate throughout their lives, giving more money and time to the university over the long haul, which is what makes a program truly successful and long-lasting.

That being said, I'd like to point out something on the board that I think many of you have forgotten about - the value of time. As a recent grad and newly-wed, my husband and I can't contribute as much financially right now as we'd like. Think back to when you just graduated, were looking for a job, or just got married. How much money could you really spare? But we volunteer our time to Sunday Funday and other NT events to show new and prospective students just how much we love NT. Perhaps the key to marketing to the Denton area is that of time. This year, I volunteered at the Benbrook Relay for Life, where TCU participated and had many of their starting football players. I walked away from that event more impressed by TCU than I have ever been before. They played football with the little kids, auctioned off TCU paraphanalia, and raised more than $500 for Cancer research. What I saw was a real connection with the community.

So why can't North Texas do that? They hold the Denton Relay for Life at Fouts, but does North Texas really participate? Do we ever send our athletes or students out to schools to referee Field Days or read to students? The answer to some of these questions may be yes, but in my years at NT, I never really heard of the school really participating in the community. If it happens, it's not advertised.

Now, before everyone jumps on me, I understand that money is what brings in scholarships, pays for a new stadium, and gets us national recognition. I think the money will come in time, if you just be patient. I know many of you have been waiting for a long time, too long, but with RV and our current administration, I think things are definitely heading in the right direction.

[GrayEagle]

They're both important but the alumni base is more important. Why? Because season ticket sales is money in the bank. If we sold 10,000 season tickets consistently we wouldn't have to be looking for the 'big donor'; we could issue revenue bonds for the new stadium. Also, the popularity of season ticket ownership is contagious.

Student support is essential to future attendance and perpetuation of traditions, so it is also very important. But, ALL students pay fees that go to the athletic department whether they attend or not. It also used to be true for the Fine Arts series and possibly still is. To me, both are essential to creating a well-rounded student and those are the ones that are most likely to foster improved attendance and involvement. Any non-traditional student that we can involve in athletics is gravy, IMO.

[centex eagle]

Went to freshman orientation with my Junior to be daughter and RV did a great job back then. With this president and athletic director, NT has a great chance to really continue the progress of the last several years. Tailgating is great now and I agree that these years of students have a better chance of supporting North Texas than any of those other groups of students from the past. These students really have developed more pride to take with them. Gaining many more students than we have is not as important as slow growth and better pride and involvement of those we have. The facilities and campus have improved so much from the 70's that this really is becoming a place to show off and be proud of.

[PlummMeanGreen]

Went to freshman orientation with my Junior to be daughter and RV did a great job back then.  With this president and athletic director, NT has a great chance to really continue the progress of the last several years.  Tailgating is great now and I agree that these years of students have a better chance of supporting North Texas than any of those other groups of students from the past. These students really have developed more pride to take with them.  Gaining many more students than we have is not as important as slow growth and better pride and involvement of those we have. The facilities and campus have improved so much from the 70's that this really is becoming a place to show off and be proud of.

If GMG.com had a "thumbs up" icon that is exactly what I would be putting as a single icon response to the aforementioned post.

[Stan R]

They're both important but the alumni base is more important.  Why?  Because season ticket sales is money in the bank.  If we sold 10,000 season tickets consistently we wouldn't have to be looking for the 'big donor'; we could issue revenue bonds for the new stadium.  Also, the popularity of season ticket ownership is contagious. 

Student support is essential to future attendance and perpetuation of traditions, so it is also very important.  But, ALL students pay fees that go to the athletic department whether they attend or not.  It also used to be true for the Fine Arts series and possibly still is.  To me, both are essential to creating a well-rounded student and those are the ones that are most likely to foster improved attendance and involvement.  Any non-traditional student that we can involve in athletics is gravy, IMO.

Going after alumni is too little too late. You have to start earlier than that. If they leave here without ever going to a NT football game, I'd say 9 times out of 10 you're too late.

Recruiting alumni is like going after the Junior College recruits, going after the students is like making a committment to go after the high school recruits, if I've confused myself enough..

[kj86]

Recent grads, current and future students are where our future fanbase will come from. Those who have been here through the "RV" years and feel a connection to the program will come back. Nothing short of a surprise invite to the Big 12 will get the "lost" alumni back in substantial numbers.

[greenfrog]

Our attendance will take care of itself with:

1 Continued hard work by the AD and his staff and the backing of the Adminsitration and the board.

2. Geographically blessed and a new stadium that all conferences (and someday the Big 14) can't

pass us up.

3. The continued growth of the metroplex that is moving to the North of Dallas and FW as we breathe.

Soon, and not soon enough for us, the smu's and tcu's will not be able to keep up because of rising

costs and will settle into the middle level conferences. You just can't compete for the long haul if

you are a private institution with 8 or 9,000 students. NT's greatest years are ahead of us. Lot's

of Universities can't say that. Those have had their years in the sun in the 40"s and 50's.

The Mean Green locomotive is coming down the track, and although some would like to derail it,

they may get run over!

[FirefightnRick]

A win over LSU will take care of all concerns.

Rick

[BIG DAWG]

Rick is most definately correct here, a win vs. LSU will have people coming out in droves!