Hey from Chattanooga!

GoMocs · December 26, 2004

Hey from Chattanooga! Any of yall coming over for the Dr Pepper Classic this week? How is your team doing this year?

If you are coming to Chattanooga and want help with hotels, directions, restaurants, etc, do not hesitate to come on over to our message board. You have to register, but its free and quick.

Our "official" site is http://www.gomocs.com

unofficial site where all the fans hang out is http://www.mocfans.com

our message board is at http://p197.ezboard.com/bmoctalk

feel free to stop by and talk, but please no smack...we dont' talk smack and don't appreciate it back at us...

Good luck, except for the first game, and have a great trip.

chattanoogamocs · December 26, 2004

I also welcome NT fans to drop by the mocfans board. As far as I know, this is the first time NT and UC have played in any sport (at least in recent memory)...so the learning curve on each others schools will be steep between now and Wednesday for the fans.

December 26, 2004

How is your team doing this year?

We are doing well this year and are off to the best start in years. Our record is 6-3 with our losses to 19th ranked Alabama, 15th ranked Texas, and TCU who has wins over Texas Tech and Florida State. We easily could have beaten TCU had our starting PG not had gone down half way through the first half, after which we were forced to put in a true freshman at PG who has never played PG before until this season.

Alabama had an early run against us which turned out to be the game as we played them evenly for the rest of the game and even won the second half. Texas beat us pretty handily due to their amazing size and depth. We had a couple of runs against them that were promising, but couldn't keep it up.

We have quality wins over UNC Wilmington and Lamar, and revenge wins over Southern and SE Missouri St., both of whom beat us last year.

As opposed to last year, our team is much more athletic and really excels when we push the ball and press. We can change paces and play in the half court, which is what we usually do to start games. However, since our biggest post player in Justin Barnett is out with a hand injury, we may start pressing earlier in the game. Our best player is SG Leonard Hopkins, and him and starting PF Mike Jones are our only seniors who play significant minutes. The rest of the team is young with sophomore SF Calvin Watson as our sharpshooter, and freshmen Quincy Williams as our starting center. He is a bit undersized for center at around 6'8", but has shown great promise on both ends of the floor with the ability to score and block shots. We have a true PG in Isaac Hines, who is a JUCO transfer and was the 7th ranked JUCO player in the nation last year. He really runs the offense well and finds the open man, but he can also knock down a shot if he has some space. He is definitely a pass first PG, and he is very good on the defensive end of the court as well.

BleedGreen64 · December 27, 2004

We played UC in football bacin the late 60's. I believe it was Coach Odis Mitchell's lst game and we ran up (I believe) it was 50 sonmething poinjts against them.

SUMG · December 27, 2004

UC will be really tough to beat on their home court.

One question any UC fans out there: Your mascot is the Mocs, right? I thought that was short for moccasins.....as in snakes. But, I notice on your website, you have a large bird mascot.

Is Moc short for some kind of bird?

GMGBTHOOUC

Coach · December 27, 2004

I noticed that too, and that the bird was wearing engineer's gear with a train logo under it. This explains it, off their website. I don't think we could ever complain about logo/identity problems after reading this. I don't like it that they stole the name of our mascot though.

Faced with politically sensitive issues and in need of a stronger core identity to help establish UTC as a growing intercollegiate athletics program, UTC asked SME Design, Inc. to create a comprehensive identity program. Through much exploration and working closely with a 17-member committee (students, alumni, donors, faculty, staff), SME Design determined the “new” direction of the athletics identity, moving away from the politically incorrect, Native American Indian imagery.
Several identities have been used in the past. With the old nickname “Moccasins,” a snake was used in the 1920’s and an Indian was used until the year of major change in 1996. A moccasin shoe was even used in the 1980’s.
SME Design (www.smedesign.com) has designed logo identities for many college teams including Arizona, Auburn, Florida, Kentucky, Maryland, North Carolina, Penn State, Villanova and Virginia. SME also boasts designs for the Atlanta Hawks, Denver Nuggets, Florida Panthers, Jacksonville Jaguars, Washington Capitals, and the logos for the NBA Finals and the World Series.
Adopting the State Bird of Tennessee (the Mockingbird) as the core of the new identity, while incorporating the strong regional imagery of the “Chattanooga Choo-Choo” and Chattanooga’s vast railroad history, SME Design created a strong and very unique athletics identity for UTC.
The committee also recognized the need for the word “Chattanooga” to have a great emphasis in the logo. Thus, “The University of Tennessee at” is much smaller than the prominent place of “Chattanooga.” The nickname “Moccasins” was shortened to simply “Mocs.” Thus established, UTC could rebuild its athletics programs and initiatives around this new identity.
And rebuild we did. Quickly establishing the identity program in February 1997, combined with tremendous success in the NCAA Men’s Basketball Tournament, UTC had positioned itself to reach for the “next level.”
The primary logo is our mascot, Scrappy, riding a train. The secondary logo features the front of a train with the word Mocs built into the logo. This logo is affectionately called the “Cowcatcher logo,” referring to the front lower grill of the train that helped push objects from the train tracks.
The identity program also utilizes several word marks and peelable logos, including the word “Chattanooga,” Scrappy’s head, and “UTC” and “Mocs” in distinctive styles.

user posted image

Edited December 27, 2004 by Coach

GoMocs · December 27, 2004

The name "Scrappy" goes way back. We had a football coach who was first hired in the 1920s, he quickly became head coach and remained head coach until the late 1960s. His name was A.C. "Scrappy" Moore. Our teams have been called the "scrappy" Mocs on and off forever it seems.

chattanoogamocs · December 27, 2004

That would be national hall of fame coach Scrappy Moore

Your right bleedgreen...

All time football series, UNT leads 5-3

NT got three win in Chattanooga 1947: 14-7, 1950: 19-14, and 1956: 20-7. Plus two in Denton 1957: 13-0 and 1966: 42-7.

UC got two home wins 1951: 32-20 and 20-19. ...and a road win in 1955: 14-6

It should be noted that Scrappy was the coach in all those games. Looks like it was a very competitive series except for the last one.

UNTStill · December 27, 2004

OK, forgive me if I'm drifting too far off into Trivia World -- and someone with a UNT football book will have to check this out -- but I was at that Chattanooga game in 1966, and recall that not only was it Odus Mitchell's last game for then-NTSU, but also the 42 points by great coincidence represented the total number of years he had been coaching (we forget he had had a great HS career before coming to UNT in 1946 -- in fact, at Marshall High he coached a certain quarterback you might have heard of, name of Y. A. Tittle). I was a young, green DR-C sportswriter at the time -- green, as in inexperienced, but loayl -- and remember chatting briefly with Coach Moore on the sidelines -- sort of tall, lean, great shock of white hair, if I remember correctly. Anyway: can someone with the records book verify this, about Mitchell's total number of years coaching? I know it was 20 at UNT.

A great, great guy, Coach Mitchell. I remember being at Texas Stadium for the SMU game in the 70s, and sitting several rows in front of the Coach, and for quite a long time, there was a line of former players stretching down the steps waiting for a chance to say hello to him.

DeepGreen · December 27, 2004

Does Chattanooga still play football? Hope so. FireFightnrick might want you all to join the Sun Belt in a few years! Just kidding Rick!

GoMocs · December 28, 2004

Below is a picture of Scrappy being carried off the field after his last game he coached in 1967, a victory. Yes, by then his hair was white.

user posted image

Scrappy, a Chattanooga native, was an All American football player at Univ of Georgia, but baseball may have been his best sport. He played in the minor leagues for several years and got a short call up to the Chicago Cubs. His "greatest" victory was probably the 1958 victory in Knoxville over the University of Tennessee, which resulted in a riot with dozens of people arrested on the field after the game.

And to answer your question, yes we still play football, Div I-AA, and for the last seven years have hosted the National Championship game. Our most famous football alum is probably Terrell Owens and our most famous basketball alum is probably Gerald Wilkins.

Edited December 28, 2004 by GoMocs

NT80 · December 28, 2004

Does Chattanooga still play football? Hope so. FireFightnrick might want you all to join the Sun Belt in a few years! Just kidding Rick!

For now UTC still plays football. This article mentions their current situation as well as former NT AD Steve Sloan, now UTC's AD, and former NT coach Jerry Moore....

Attendance dips, but program safe (T-FP)

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

By Brad Shepard Staff Writer

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Dropping football is not an option now for the University of Chattanooga, school officials said. Attendance was down this year at Finley Stadium and a committee in the Faculty Senate is looking into the cost of the football program that has not had a winning record since 1997. But university interim chancellor Fred Obear said football is on solid ground.

"Football is totally safe," he said. "There’s no ambiguity about that at all. This is a university policy issue that falls under the responsibility of the athletic board, and when they met, the issue was not even on the agenda.

"It’s not on the radar screen at all." In the state’s budget-conscious climate where fellow Division I-AA program East Tennessee State made the decision to drop football after last season, UTC has to deal with rumors that it might be next.

It doesn’t help that this season’s attendance — a 5,648 average in the five games — was the worst since 1996, when UTC was still at Chamberlain Field.

UTC athletic director Steve Sloan believes the attendance will rise with the number of victories.

"We haven’t been able to compete with Georgia Southern, Furman, Wofford and Appalachian State for years," Sloan said, "and when you can’t compete with teams in your conference, you lose fans.

"Those (attendance) numbers are not staggering. They’re actually fairly consistent for a program that hasn’t been winning."

This season, however, Southern Conference coaches noticed the discrepancy between UTC’s attendance and that of other league universities.

"The crowds when we go over there have never been very good," said Appalachian State coach Jerry Moore, whose team lost 59-56 to UTC on Oct. 30 in front of an announced crowd of 4,486.

"It’s a little disappointing, partly when they came off a win in Cullowhee, you’d think there’d be a little more support than that. It’s a shame."

One SoCon coach with a unique perspective is Elon’s Paul Hamilton, who headed the now-defunct ETSU program. He said the Bucs’ crowds and interest level were comparable to UTC’s before the school dropped football.

"I think from my perspective having been at ETSU and what went on down there is I hope people get behind Rodney Allison and what they’re doing," Hamilton said. "Finley is a great venue to watch college football. Even before we dropped football (at ETSU), we’d have 5-6,000 when we played.

"Chattanooga obviously needs to pick it up some."

Comparisons can be made between UTC and ETSU in their recent lack of success. But UTC isn’t facing the same Title IX issues, or stadium renovations that were going to cost more than $1 million at ETSU. "The only thing we don’t have at UTC is a winning program, and I think that can be fixed," UT trustee John Thornton said. "You don’t quit something just because you’re losing.

"To me, there are a lot of good reasons to remain in football, and there’s one bad reason to quit, and that’s we’re not winning."

The committee is examining other reasons, such as the hidden costs of football. Dr. Joe @#%$, a computer science professor, is on the committee and is opposed to football at the university.

He insisted he spoke only for himself and not the committee, calling UTC’s football program a "money sink." He compared the school’s situation to ETSU’s, predicting that dropping the sport might save the university in excess of $1 million.

He wonders where the football program will find necessary funding to stay afloat when the Tennessee Higher Education Commission outlaws public colleges spending state money on athletics beginning in 2008.

"My guess is, personally, we could realize the same savings or maybe even more than ETSU," @#%$ said. "I don’t want to anticipate what the committee’s findings will be. "But my personal opinion is I think having a I-AA football team is not really with keeping with what UTC is about. It’s spending a lot of money in a division doomed to failure. The only teams that make money off football by rule are Division I teams."

Dr. Richard Rice, president of UTC’s Faculty Senate, said he hopes to study the committee’s findings and make a recommendation to UTC’s chancellor concerning football by spring of 2005.

Even if the committee finds there will be funding problems, Rice said he isn’t sure it will matter because of the boosters and community leaders on football’s side.

"There’s such a strong support in the community that if the report comes out showing the program is indeed costly, I really wonder given the community support if the university administration would drop it," he said.

A student athletic fee, which would have helped cover the costs of the athletic department, was voted down by the students earlier this year.

Many feel the next chancellor of the university will be the one who makes the ultimate decision.

"(Former UTC chancellor) Bill Stacy would not touch football," @#%$ said. "As long as he was here, football stayed. Now, he’s gone."

Stacy wanted to distance himself from the situation but left a message after being contacted. He left UTC in August to take the headmaster position at Baylor School.

"I take great confidence in Coach Sloan rebuilding the football program and great confidence in Rodney Allison," Stacy said. "The other part is I’m gone. I’m across the river and don’t know much about it."

The biggest consequence of ETSU dropping football was having to leave the SoCon. The league’s bylaws state a member institution must have football to compete in the conference (current members UNCGreensboro, Davidson and College of Charleston were granted waivers to the rule).

"We think we’re on the right track with (our) program," Obear said. "We like our Southern Conference membership, which is contingent on us having football."

Like most other SoCon institutions, UTC budgets money to assist the athletic department each year. According to Debbie Parker, UTC associate vice chancellor for business and finance, the college has spent $187,943 more than it budgeted on the athletic department during the past four years. No separate numbers were available for football specifically.

In only his second year at the helm of UTC’s football program, Allison has made efforts to put his name and face in the community along with a voice trying to sell his program.

Ultimately, he knows the biggest selling point would be winning.

"I know it costs money, but once you get to a point where you’re successful, you draw fans," Allison said.

"It’s only human nature — especially here — for people to be skeptical. They’ve been told this before. They’re going to wait and see before they go spend their entertainment dollars. "I think eventually, this town and this university wants a successful football program, and I don’t think at this point, they’re willing to give up on it."

GoMocs · December 28, 2004

What was yall's impression of Sloan at NT? This supposedly is his "retirement" job. He was born and raised about 25 miles up the road from Chattanooga in Cleveland.

NT80 · December 28, 2004

What was yall's impression of Sloan at NT? This supposedly is his "retirement" job. He was born and raised about 25 miles up the road from Chattanooga in Cleveland.

I personally liked Sloan. He started the ball rolling on our Stadium expansion to 30,000 and bringing us back to 1-A football after 13 years in 1-AA. But he liked golf more than NT and left us for a job in Florida to be closer to year-round golf.

UNTLifer · December 28, 2004

What was yall's impression of Sloan at NT? This supposedly is his "retirement" job. He was born and raised about 25 miles up the road from Chattanooga in Cleveland.

Didn't care for him because of his above stated love affair with golf. Too much time on the golf course and not enough advancing our programs. His stint here was pretty nondescript. He was hired for his name only.

chattanoogamocs · December 28, 2004

A good AD can raise a lot of money on a golf course...for many, it is their second office

I have always found it interesting that Sloan's last two jobs have led both schools from I-AA to I-A football. (UNT and UCF)

Apologies for continuing to keep this thread on football instead of basketball.

So from the NT SID report, it looks like best way to beat the Mean Green is to have a lead at the half and score over 80. (of course, most team would probably win with those factors). Ought to be an interesting game, both team seem to like to score a lot and both shoot a lot of threes. I hate that what appears to be the two best team in the tournament will be playing each other the first night.