Ranting about the AD, Students, Attendance and Fan Support

[NT80]

I feel this needed it's own thread instead of intermixed on the FAU game thread and other threads...

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  35 minutes ago, NorthTexasWeLove said:

Exactly. It all starts at the top. 

And it's not an obsessive thing with wanting to see attendance. 

Attendance does a lot of things outside of creating an environment that player want to play in and coaches want to coach in. It creates more monies for other things, helps recruiting, helps conference movement, helps, getting chosen to be on TV more often if you have an awesome environment, etc etc. Attendance does several very positive things. It's imperative that it gets fixed. Frankly, if I am Ross, I am questioning this straight to the face of the athletic director. It's obviously talked about inside the lockerroom when players are bringing it up and pointing it out during post games press conferences. It's an issue. And our AD is just sitting on hands. Maybe he has found his WVU and is coasting like Wren did. At least we aren't hearing, "Tony Mitchell with the dunk!"

Get it fixed. 

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I agree it all starts at the top for Athletics...as in AD and President of the University.

I am on my 9th AD and 10th President by my count.

Money is the u$ual determining and motivating factor for getting more out of our AD department.

More students/fans > more tickets/donations/revenue > more facilities/staff > creates more interest > creates more fans

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Beyond other factors, I judge an AD's success by communication, and attendance in football and men's basketball.  This is weighted by era, conference, and facilities.

I would give Wren a C and Jared a D to date.   

The AD must do a much better job of spurring the students, alums, and locals.  Find out why they don't come and fix it!!

When they do come, the entertainment and production is not keeping them engaged.   It all needs fixed!

Edited Monday at 06:02 PM by NT80

[NorthTexasWeLove]

It's a real problem that needs real solutions. All we can do as alum to fix this awful attendance issue is just bitch and moan. But it's a serious problem that I feel didn't have to happen and could be resolved. 

[Censored by Laurie]

honest question...why are y'all expending all this energy to complain about it here instead of collecting grievances and sending it direct to Mosely? he's the AD of a mid-tier athletic program...it's not like you're trying to get T-Swift's ear. 

[Wag Tag]

This is where Private Equity could definitely do a better job. You need to offer more than just the game. Have we ever had any type of entertainment the Dac? I think wrestling at one time? 

[meangreenfaninno]

25 minutes ago, Wag Tag said:

This is where Private Equity could definitely do a better job. You need to offer more than just the game. Have we ever had any type of entertainment the Dac? I think wrestling at one time? 

I think private equity will require too much commission.  I think it would better to get a loan from the government at a lower interest rate to fund it.

[meangreenfaninno]

Sort of like a PPP loan that could be forgiven later potentially.

[meangreenfaninno]

Sort of like a PPP loan that could be forgiven later potentially.

[jtm0097]

Our AD hire was a lazy one, just like the Cowboys hiring Schottenheimer. 

[MeanGreen22]

2 hours ago, NT80 said:

Find out why they don't come and fix it!!

Has anyone stopped to think maybe we know why people don’t show and it just is what it is. 
 

We collectively come here and workshop different things to engage the unengaged, but if they just don’t want to come then not sure what you’re suppose to do at this point. 

[NT80]

1 hour ago, Censored by Laurie said:

honest question...why are y'all expending all this energy to complain about it here instead of collecting grievances and sending it direct to Mosely? he's the AD of a mid-tier athletic program...it's not like you're trying to get T-Swift's ear. 

This is sending it to the AD.  You don't think they read GMG?  Would you read GMG if you were AD to get a pulse of the fanbase?   

[NT80]

13 minutes ago, MeanGreen22 said:

Has anyone stopped to think maybe we know why people don’t show and it just is what it is. 

We collectively come here and workshop different things to engage the unengaged, but if they just don’t want to come then not sure what you’re suppose to do at this point. 

I think that's what we're asking...what is the disconnect?    Is the AD investigating the reasons? 

It's not our job to get 5,000 more students to come to games.   I guess we could stand on the campus walkways and poll students why they don't attend an athletic game.   Are there more Art students that don't care than Education majors?  I would really be interested in knowing the mindset of students today that aren't engaged in their school competing with another school.  The same for alums and locals.

Colleges, and thus the school's degrees, are linked and valued by many employers based on their Brand. I say Athletics and it's success directly affects UNT's media > thus Brand value.

[Censored by Laurie]

41 minutes ago, NT80 said:

This is sending it to the AD.  You don't think they read GMG?  Would you read GMG if you were AD to get a pulse of the fanbase?   

if there's as much apathy from the AD as you all claim (and that appears evident...I live too far away to speak first-hand), then maybe I'm reading the board but really not giving it too much weight. 

at best, hoping to affect change here is just being passive-aggressive. if you don't have the check-book to do so, at least be direct in your communications. 

[NT80]

39 minutes ago, Censored by Laurie said:

if there's as much apathy from the AD as you all claim (and that appears evident...I live too far away to speak first-hand), then maybe I'm reading the board but really not giving it too much weight. 

at best, hoping to affect change here is just being passive-aggressive. if you don't have the check-book to do so, at least be direct in your communications. 

I've talked directly in the past to at least four AD's at events asking same type questions about spurring interest.  It always starts with politician AD-speak,, chicken-and-egg comparisons....money = marketing = fans = money, etc.   Then it ends up with a donation request.   

In other words....they don't really know the answer either....or actually care...because their next job will be better than this one... they hope.

[MeanGreen22]

1 hour ago, NT80 said:

I think that's what we're asking...what is the disconnect?    Is the AD investigating the reasons?

That’s kinda what I’m saying. What if the AD had investigated and the feedback is “We’re good”? Let’s not pretend that most kids that go to UNT aren’t there for the athletic prestige. I’m just trying to play devils advocate here because it’s obviously not an easy task or else it would be done. 

[SilverEagle]

38 minutes ago, NT80 said:

I've talked directly in the past to at least four AD's at events asking same type questions about spurring interest.  It always starts with politician AD-speak,, chicken-and-egg comparisons....money = marketing = fans = money, etc.   Then it ends up with a donation request.   

In other words....they don't really know the answer either....or actually care...because their next job will be better than this one... they hope.

Heavy sigh.

How many times in the past have I ranted about this and got not much reaction, other than the usual "roll-eyes" emogie or the Barney Fife "Oh Boy" emogie.

Stop blaming Mosley. I have watched (as a student/alumni) North Texas football since the early 70's and this is the best AD we've had since Hayden Fry. We always look for quick fixes for this and while winning certainly helps, it has never been the single cure......obviously.

To begin with, I like the idea of student surveys. I would start with a question about involvement in the athletic program(s) where they went to High School. Did they attend/participate in their HS athletic events? What were the traditions of their High Schools? Did they enjoy participating as a fan during games? Was fan participation an expectation at their school? Does NT have sports traditions? What are they? What are a couple of the "North Texas" yells? Do you feel like you are "part of the crowd spirit" at games. etc, etc. 

The only tradition at North Texas is building and maintaining their bureaucracy. A petty bureaucrat almost cancelled out battle flag.  FFR had to stand up to him at a meeting to finally make him shut up about the flag being illegal and against the law. I had an e-mail exchange with the GB director from about 10 years ago (he was a former GB drum major) who is no longer with the school. I suggested what I thought would be a good song for them to play for the Dancers some time. He responded that he loved the song that I had suggested, but he didn't make the decision about the music for the dancers. He said that he would pass on the suggestion to the director of the Dance team. The Dance team doesn't perform with the Band any longer. I wonder how many committee meetings, and other bureaucrats, were involved before that decision was made. 

As I've said before, North Texas doesn't have celebrations of their traditions and spirit. They contract with the appropriate groups to put on a football show. Fan participation is mostly optional.

 

Edited Monday at 10:50 PM by SilverEagle

[kj86]

I see a two-pronged marketing issue.  One problem is getting an effective message to existing students.  The other is marketing the University in a was that attracts a larger percentage of students more inclined to support athletics.  UNT is way behind on both.  While I agree to some extent with those who say "just win", that's just not enough.  I've never seen the University put forth anything I'd characterize as a full court marketing press to increase attendance.

[SilverEagle]

5 minutes ago, kj86 said:

I see a two-pronged marketing issue.  One problem is getting an effective message to existing students.  The other is marketing the University in a was that attracts a larger percentage of students more inclined to support athletics.  UNT is way behind on both.  While I agree to some extent with those who say "just win", that's just not enough.  I've never seen the University put forth anything I'd characterize as a full court marketing press to increase attendance.

"Come join us and be part of this great program" should at least be one of the marketing themes.

[ColoradoEagle]

39 minutes ago, SilverEagle said:

Stop blaming Mosley. I have watched (as a student/alumni) North Texas football since the early 70's and this is the best AD we've had since Hayden Fry.

What are the notches on his belt? What can he currently point to as "I did that"? I'm genuinely curious. Ross Hodge was an obvious choice and already here, but kudos I guess on not flubbing an easy one. I won't list what I feel like are the shortcomings, because I'm genuinely curious what makes him the best AD since Hayden Fry.

I will say this man is being paid over half a million dollars a year, and the trajectory seems to be downwards.

[NM Green]

I like Jared in the Boardroom. 

For those posters who just think it’s over there is no more than these 4k that care about basketball, I expect an AD to fight like heck vocally for that 4,300, then 4,500 then 5,000. 

I’m talking nonstop effort. For a business person like Jared it’s constant wealth growth. A entrepreneurial business mindset. No business development no bill pay. No business acquisition no food in the pantry. Why are we having our first promoted tailgate this Saturday? Sorry if I missed the press on the other games but I’m talking Wyoming and UTSA intense press every home game. I don’t want to Beach but this passive promotion doesn’t work except for places like the SEC. Big 12 programs have to be aggressive. 

I loved hearing Coach thanking the Denton Community for making Sunday’s basketball environment fun. Where are the stories of outreach to the community like we get birthday updates of the players I have no idea who they are and if they will be here in the fall. You know visits to nursing homes, assisted living facilities, food drives, cancer hospitals. I would be so proud of our teams and executives jumping into action and building community at the local level. Groups demonstrating meaningful outreach, building relationships, recruit money and fans.

It’s the old adage that people want to belong to something and that something has to be remarkably communicated by our visionary leaders. Right now our President and AD are not speaking to the fans. We have questions  and deserve answers. 

First pack the Pit on Saturday. Should be easy to recruit friends to the tailgate. UNT be prepared. Ready yourself to make a great impression. 

GMG

[jtm0097]

They didn't start marketing the basketball games this last week until one of die hards started messaging him on Twitter. Than miraculously the marketing blasts came out. 

[NT80]

58 minutes ago, ColoradoEagle said:

What are the notches on his belt? What can he currently point to as "I did that"? I'm genuinely curious. Ross Hodge was an obvious choice and already here, but kudos I guess on not flubbing an easy one. I won't list what I feel like are the shortcomings, because I'm genuinely curious what makes him the best AD since Hayden Fry.

I will say this man is being paid over half a million dollars a year, and the trajectory seems to be downwards.

Attendance issues, both students and alums, has been a generational issue here.  It is one of the great unsolved “Mysteries of the Universe”! 

If Jared could somehow find the key to getting 5000 more students a game to football and basketball we would put him in our Hall of Fame, maybe build a statue, and name a building after him!

But I’m not seeing any motivation for it.  I just haven’t seen the communications or constant marketing that would take.  

Edited yesterday at 12:29 AM by NT80

[Censored by Laurie]

3 hours ago, MeanGreen22 said:

Has anyone stopped to think maybe we know why people don’t show and it just is what it is. 
 

We collectively come here and workshop different things to engage the unengaged, but if they just don’t want to come then not sure what you’re suppose to do at this point. 

based on this conversation and my own experience 20+ years ago, I'm gonna suggest that the number of people who don't know there is a high-level program at the Pit right now is just about the same as those who don't care.

and the prior should be the responsibility of the AD. identify where there needs to be more engagement. start at the Rec Center and the 100+ kids playing pick-up basketball every night (presumably there's still a daily run)...send a AD staffer to intramural games...bare min, have a staffer present at the greek council meeting, if not once a year going to each fraternity and sorority meeting. 

as "alternative" as our school might be...spoken as a person that most on here would likely consider pretty "alternative"...this isn't Reed College or NYU. it's a 45,000 person public university. 

[ColoradoEagle]

2 hours ago, NT80 said:

Attendance issues, both students and alums, has been a generational issue here.  It is one of the great unsolved “Mysteries of the Universe”! 

If Jared could somehow find the key to getting 5000 more students a game to football and basketball we would put him in our Hall of Fame, maybe build a statue, and name a building after him!

But I’m not seeing any motivation for it.  I just haven’t seen the communications or constant marketing that would take.  

It worries me that the school has added more than 14k students and the city of Denton has grown more than 50% since Johnny Jones started coaching at the school and attendance has been relatively flat and is now decreasing. Maybe getting people to care starts with the AD deciding to care. 

[Green Otaku]

3 hours ago, NT80 said:

Attendance issues, both students and alums, has been a generational issue here.  It is one of the great unsolved “Mysteries of the Universe”! 

If Jared could somehow find the key to getting 5000 more students a game to football and basketball we would put him in our Hall of Fame, maybe build a statue, and name a building after him!

But I’m not seeing any motivation for it.  I just haven’t seen the communications or constant marketing that would take.  

I don't think it's a great mystery. For people to show up to games there has to be a desire from the students/alums/Dentonites. The games have to be seen as a worthwhile investment of time, a fun atmosphere to enjoy a game, a connection to your fellow alums/alma mater, pride for your school, a connection to your town and you want to support the home team,  a fun family activity, etc., etc. Any of those things could be a valid reason to go, but the reason has to exist. That is the AD's job, to create those reasons and to connect with the students/alumns/town. Assess what you have, work out different strategies to try different things, find out what's effective and continue to find things that work.

[NT80]

18 minutes ago, Green Otaku said:

I don't think it's a great mystery. For people to show up to games there has to be a desire from the students/alums/Dentonites. The games have to be seen as a worthwhile investment of time, a fun atmosphere to enjoy a game, a connection to your fellow alums/alma mater, pride for your school, a connection to your town and you want to support the home team,  a fun family activity, etc., etc. Any of those things could be a valid reason to go, but the reason has to exist. That is the AD's job, to create those reasons and to connect with the students/alumns/town. Assess what you have, work out different strategies to try different things, find out what's effective and continue to find things that work.

Excellent post.  

Yes, connections are missing.  What are peer Universities doing to make these connections that we are not? 

When Jared gets the focus group together this should help him get started....