Why Support this Program?….Seriously!?

[Meangreen Fight]

I am officially hopeless when it comes to this program.    As long as Eric Morris is here I am NOT going to another in 2025 or beyond until I see 6 wins, us beat a ranked opponent  o Morris is just another Air Raid Offensive Coordinator nothing special.  
 

https://www.nfl.com/news/ravens-promote-inside-lbs-coach-zach-orr-to-defensive-coordinator

Call Zach Orr’s agent right now and start recruiting him to be the 2025 or 2026 Head Coach.   We have to do something different and stop making Air Raid a head coaching requirement.  Give Eric Morris a heads up.  His conditions for retaining his job after 2025 season are

1. Conference Championship Game Appearance

2. 9 regular season wins and Bowl win.  (With those 9 wins, a good close loss to a ranked P4 in a bowl might save you).

Let him find an OC job in the P4.  

 

Edited November 16 by Meangreen Fight

[Meangreen Fight]

24 minutes ago, Matt said:

Well I’m sure as hell not going all in! Have you seen this shit show? 

This inspired my topic. 

[untlynchka1]

2+ words…. Chris Jimmerson Jr.  

[Matt]

I haven’t been to a game in a while and I’m probably not going to until we have a defensive minded staff in place. Air raid teams are soft rarely ever get too far. I’m not interested in spending my dollars on this nonsense when I can go to the Super Pit and enjoy watching a team that fights like hell. One that makes me proud to have graduated from the University of North Texas. This program does the complete opposite. 

[gangrene]

26 minutes ago, Meangreen Fight said:

I am officially hopeless when it comes to this program.    As long as Eric Morris is here I am NOT going to another in 2025 or beyond until I see 6 wins, us beat a ranked opponent

You can replace Eric Morris' name with any of our coaches, dating back to 1978. 

Seth Littrell

Dan McCarney

Todd Dodge

Darrell Dickey

Matt Simon

Corky Nelson

Bob Tyler

Jerry Moore

Only Littrell and Moore had .500 records, all others were sub-.500.  We haven't been ranked since 1977, which was also the year we beat a ranked opponent, #16 Mississippi State, by way of a forfeit.  I believe we have one other win against a ranked opponent but I have no idea who or when...probably before my lifetime.

 

[FirefightnRick]

30 minutes ago, gangrene said:

You can replace Eric Morris' name with any of our coaches, dating back to 1978. 

Seth Littrell

Dan McCarney

Todd Dodge

Darrell Dickey

Matt Simon

Corky Nelson

Bob Tyler

Jerry Moore

Only Littrell and Moore had .500 records, all others were sub-.500.  We haven't been ranked since 1977, which was also the year we beat a ranked opponent, #16 Mississippi State, by way of a forfeit.  I believe we have one other win against a ranked opponent but I have no idea who or when...probably before my lifetime.

 

Comparing overall records of past coaches can be misleading.  Compare Dickey’s non conference opponents to those non conference opponents of any coach since and It’s not even in the same universe.  Yet from ‘01’ to 04’ he found a niche that worked in conference play.  And he did it in possibly the most decrepit facility in FBS to recruit to for fractional pay compared to what the last three coaches have enjoyed.

 

Rick 

[Matt from A700]

Fire Caponi, Fire Morris, hell... Fire Brett Vito and move the basketball forum above football PERMANENTLY.

[Salsa_Verde]

Hilarious. Dudes have been in here since the 70s waiting for a miracle. I refuse to waste that much time. 

[UNT 90 Grad]

5 hours ago, gangrene said:

Only Littrell and Moore had .500 records, all others were sub-.500.  We haven't been ranked since 1977, which was also the year we beat a ranked opponent, #16 Mississippi State, by way of a forfeit.  I believe we have one other win against a ranked opponent but I have no idea who or when...probably before my lifetime.

Were you alive 3 years ago? 

https://meangreensports.com/news/2021/11/27/football-unt-earns-bowl-bid-with-drubbing-of-no-15-utsa

[Meangreen Fight]

2 hours ago, UNT 90 Grad said:

Were you alive 3 years ago? 

https://meangreensports.com/news/2021/11/27/football-unt-earns-bowl-bid-with-drubbing-of-no-15-utsa

I condone and understand the mistaken omission.  It was the most misleading victory in Mean Green history.  I was there for that game in club seat because the weather was horrible.  A pass happy UTSA came to Denton with a cold windy miserable wet day that made it impossible to throw the ball.  Maybe they win the game if the weather was not so bad.  But the fact they let that game be an excuse to keep Littrell another season was infuriating! 🤬.  A decision like that had nothing to do with winning football because they followed that up with another double digit loss in the closet thing to a home Bowl Game in Frisco losing by double digits to a juggernaut  6-6 Miami OH.   I said this at the time as well. And it was a confirmed bad decision when Seth couldn’t find a better QB than Austin Aune or get his completion percentage above 60% for more than 2 games in a row.

This department is comfortable with mediocrity and programs new to the FBS level like UTSA our asses routinely.   Long as we can beat teams having historically bad seasons for their program and FCS teams we are good.  I am sure many of the few loyal fans were annoyed that there were enough fans that partied outside the stadium for homecoming to make the game a sellout.  But after 20 years of the bullshit, I can’t be disappointed in them anymore. 

[wardly]

8 hours ago, gangrene said:

You can replace Eric Morris' name with any of our coaches, dating back to 1978. 

Seth Littrell

Dan McCarney

Todd Dodge

Darrell Dickey

Matt Simon

Corky Nelson

Bob Tyler

Jerry Moore

Only Littrell and Moore had .500 records, all others were sub-.500.  We haven't been ranked since 1977, which was also the year we beat a ranked opponent, #16 Mississippi State, by way of a forfeit.  I believe we have one other win against a ranked opponent but I have no idea who or when...probably before my lifetime.

 

Going back to 1913, only Fouts,Mitchell, and Fry had winning records.

[peanuts104]

9 hours ago, Meangreen Fight said:

I am officially hopeless when it comes to this program.    As long as Eric Morris is here I am NOT going to another in 2025 or beyond until I see 6 wins, us beat a ranked opponent  o Morris is just another Air Raid Offensive Coordinator nothing special.  
 

https://www.nfl.com/news/ravens-promote-inside-lbs-coach-zach-orr-to-defensive-coordinator

Call Zach Orr’s agent right now and start recruiting him to be the 2025 or 2026 Head Coach.   We have to do something different and stop making Air Raid a head coaching requirement.  Give Eric Morris a heads up.  His conditions for retaining his job after 2025 season are

1. Conference Championship Game Appearance

2. 9 regular season wins and Bowl win.  (With those 9 wins, a good close loss to a ranked P4 in a bowl might save you).

Let him find an OC job in the P4.  

 

[TIgreen01]

Pat Cobbs needs a more prominent role.  If he wants it.  If not, and all he ever wants is to coach RBs, then he should have a job here for life.

I’m all for grooming Cobbs into a HC and giving him the keys to the university already.  His unit is consistently awesome and we’re down to the 5th freaking stringer.  

[SilverEagle]

8 hours ago, FirefightnRick said:

Comparing overall records of past coaches can be misleading.  Compare Dickey’s non conference opponents to those non conference opponents of any coach since and It’s not even in the same universe.  Yet from ‘01’ to 04’ he found a niche that worked in conference play.  And he did it in possibly the most decrepit facility in FBS to recruit to for fractional pay compared to what the last three coaches have enjoyed.

 

Rick 

And it was Craig Helwig that hired him, NOT RV. And, up to the DD hiring, I thought CH was the worst AD we had ever had. Don't ask me to choose now.

In fact RV and DD didn't even like one another at all. SO, you had a coach setting a winning record in conference play and an AD that only supplied minimal support to him. 

Only at UNT..........😠

[wardly]

19 minutes ago, SilverEagle said:

And it was Craig Helwig that hired him, NOT RV. And, up to the DD hiring, I thought CH was the worst AD we had ever had. Don't ask me to choose now.

In fact RV and DD didn't even like one another at all. SO, you had a coach setting a winning record in conference play and an AD that only supplied minimal support to him. 

Only at UNT..........😠

Helwig had Dickey playing 3 or 4 money games a year which skews his record. Coach Jake refused doing the same in basketball and was fired.

[gangrene]

9 hours ago, FirefightnRick said:

Comparing overall records of past coaches can be misleading.  

Rick 

Agreed. Similar case can be made for Simon, as he coached in the first few years of our return to D1 when half our games were body bag games. And the guys preceding him were playing D-2 schedules.  
 

But, the point is we are historically a really bad program no matter who is coaching, which conference, classification or stadium we’re playing in.  
 

Any time a UNT coach has success, we worry he will use as a stepping stone to a better program. We should be so lucky. Hugh Freeze, Mario Cristobal, Lane Kiffin are three former conference opponent coaches that immediately come to mind, now coaching P5 schools.

[gangrene]

4 hours ago, UNT 90 Grad said:

Were you alive 3 years ago? 

https://meangreensports.com/news/2021/11/27/football-unt-earns-bowl-bid-with-drubbing-of-no-15-utsa

Yep, and thanks. So, are MSU and UTSA the only 2 ranked opponents we’ve ever beaten? I can’t find a good resource for that info but did hear it announced during the Army game.  If so, that’s even more pathetic than I first thought: one win was via forfeit and the other was against a startup program.

[tmjerm]

4 minutes ago, gangrene said:

Yep, and thanks. So, are MSU and UTSA the only 2 ranked opponents we’ve ever beaten? I can’t find a good resource for that info but did hear it announced during the Army game.  If so, that’s even more pathetic than I first thought: one win was via forfeit and the other was against a startup program.

#20 SDSU in 1974

[MCMLXXX]

9 hours ago, FirefightnRick said:

Comparing overall records of past coaches can be misleading.  Compare Dickey’s non conference opponents to those non conference opponents of any coach since and It’s not even in the same universe.  Yet from ‘01’ to 04’ he found a niche that worked in conference play.  And he did it in possibly the most decrepit facility in FBS to recruit to for fractional pay compared to what the last three coaches have enjoyed.

 

Rick 

Random Thoughts:

I remember that on a long bus ride back from Monroe Louisiana you wanted Dickey fired.

I agree that Dickey did more with less than any Coach we have had in this Millennium.

The 4 Bowl Games in New Orleans, especially the win over Cincinnati, are still among my favorite memories as a fan.

If Dickey had dumped Ramon Flanigan very early and replaced him with a competent OC he would have been more successful.  

I was told that Dodge wanted to keep Defensive Coaches from Dickey's Staff and RV nixed that idea. I have never asked RV if that is true. However, if Dodge had kept the entire Defensive Staff from the Dickey years, I believe he would have been successful. 

[NM Green]

Wasn’t Tennessee ranked #8 when we beat them out in Knoxville in the 70’s? 

GMG

[MCMLXXX]

8 minutes ago, NM Green said:

Wasn’t Tennessee ranked #8 when we beat them out in Knoxville in the 70’s? 

GMG

No, they were 3-2 at the time we played them. It appears they were #16 one week earlier before Alabama beat them.

1975 Tennessee Volunteers Schedule and Results | College Football at Sports-Reference.com

Edited November 16 by MCMLXXX

[FirefightnRick]

18 minutes ago, gangrene said:

But, the point is we are historically a really bad program no matter who is coaching, which conference, classification or stadium we’re playing in.  

I know you know that but others don’t and to me it’s unfair saying so without highlighting the why’s.  
 

Comparing overall records to some coaches who were FORCED to face meat grinder seasons to other coaches who didn’t needs pointing out.  Dickey’ noncon was insane and the highlight of that insanity was during two seasons between 2000 and 2004 where he faced at 11-2 Oklahoma the year after Oklahoma won the National Championship, then faced an 11-1 Texas team in 2004 the year before Texas would win the National Championship in ‘05. And many P5’s in between.

 

These weren't just barely ranked 25th Army’s.  These were dominant, best college football programs in the world and at times we hung with them.

 

That kind of effort by our programs need learning by our younger folks, imo.

 

Rick 

 

 

[Cr1028]

10 hours ago, FirefightnRick said:

Comparing overall records of past coaches can be misleading.  Compare Dickey’s non conference opponents to those non conference opponents of any coach since and It’s not even in the same universe.  Yet from ‘01’ to 04’ he found a niche that worked in conference play.  And he did it in possibly the most decrepit facility in FBS to recruit to for fractional pay compared to what the last three coaches have enjoyed.

 

Rick 

 

2 hours ago, SilverEagle said:

And it was Craig Helwig that hired him, NOT RV. And, up to the DD hiring, I thought CH was the worst AD we had ever had. Don't ask me to choose now.

In fact RV and DD didn't even like one another at all. SO, you had a coach setting a winning record in conference play and an AD that only supplied minimal support to him. 

Only at UNT..........😠

Respectfully Darrell Dickey was one Big West season away from being fired. If the Sun Belt hadn’t fallen into his lap he’d have been gone at the end of 2001.
 

And yes Dickey had tough out of conference games, but he also lost to both Troy and FAU during the 26 game conference win streak (they just weren’t in our conference yet). From 2001 to 2004 he only beat 3 bowl eligible teams.

 

Here is a snippet from one of my prior posts on Dickey. I doubt anyone would say ULM had facilities advantages on us, even in 2001.

************

From October 13, 2001 to September 10, 2005,  Dickey’s teams won 26 consecutive conference games. The streak was bookended by wins over the MUTS. The week before the streak started we lost to 2-9 conference mate ULM. The game that ended the streak was a loss to 4-7 Troy. The combined record for the 26 teams run through was 99-203. If you exclude the 26 losses from NT, their combined record was 99-177. Of those 26 wins, just three came against bowl-eligible teams.

Additionally, we lost to future conference mates Troy at the end of ‘01 and FAU at the start of ‘04 which would’ve shrunken the streak to 13 games if they had been in our conference at the time.

*************

Edited November 16 by Cr1028

[Mean Green 93-98]

Dickey had a great run through about 2002-03, but he had been a major loser of a head coach for years before he got to that point.

[FirefightnRick]

15 minutes ago, Cr1028 said:

 

Respectfully Darrell Dickey was one Big West season away from being fired. If the Sun Belt hadn’t fallen into his lap he’d have been gone at the end of 2001.
 

And yes Dickey had tough out of conference games, but he also lost to both Troy and FAU during the 26 game conference win streak (they just weren’t in our conference yet). From 2001 to 2004 he only beat 3 bowl eligible teams.

 

Here is a snippet from one of my prior posts on Dickey. I doubt anyone would say ULM had facilities advantages on us, even in 2001.

************

From October 13, 2001 to September 10, 2005,  Dickey’s teams won 26 consecutive conference games. The streak was bookended by wins over the MUTS. The week before the streak started we lost to 2-9 conference mate ULM. The game that ended the streak was a loss to 4-7 Troy. The combined record for the 26 teams run through was 99-203. If you exclude the 26 losses from NT, their combined record was 99-177. Of those 26 wins, just three came against bowl-eligible teams.

Additionally, we lost to future conference mates Troy at the end of ‘01 and FAU at the start of ‘04 which would’ve shrunken the streak to 13 games if they had been in our conference at the time.

*************

What would Dickey’s ‘01-‘04 teams had done in CUSA and the American?  Strictly defense-wise I’d say they would have won at least a couple of championships.  
 

To me that’s the take away of my earlier points.

 

Rick