PAC 12 Realignment Talk Mega Thread (All 12 threads merged)

Cerebus · August 4, 2023

3 minutes ago, Cerebus said:

For PACx to survive:

They need to get to 8 FBS playing members to be an FBS conference.

They need to get to 7 DIV I members to stay a DIV 1 multisport conference and keep receiving the NCAA Tournament units.

NCAA Bylaw 20.02.6 Football Bowl Subdivision Conference. A conference classified as a Football Bowl Subdivision conference shall be comprised of at least eight full Football Bowl Subdivision members that satisfy all bowl subdivision requirements. An institution shall be included as one of the eight full Football Bowl Subdivision members only if the institution participates in the conference schedule in at least six men's and eight women's conference-sponsored sports, including men's basketball and football and three women's team sports, including women's basketball. A conference-sponsored sport shall be a sport in which regular- season and/or championship opportunities are provided, consistent with the minimum standards identified by the applicable NCAA sport committee for automatic qualification. (Adopted: 10/31/02 effective 8/1/05, Revised: 12/15/06)

TripleGrad · August 4, 2023

9 minutes ago, El Paso Eagle said:

A merger with the MWC, and they keep the PAC name?

Probably the only way for the MW teams to avoid that $34M payout to join the PACx in 2024

Green Otaku · August 4, 2023

8 minutes ago, El Paso Eagle said:

A merger with the MWC, and they keep the PAC name?

Depending on what kind of deal the PAC can get that might be what happens. If they invite they agree to invite the MWC fully the members can vote to dissolve the MWC, meaning they get to keep their tourney credits, and move to the PAC.

Coffee and TV · August 4, 2023

This sucks. It makes no sense for Washington to be playing Rutgers and not Washington State. This could have all been prevented if NCAA just negotiated TV rights as a whole. Instead it leads to a race for the elites to grab everything and keep further dividing the gap between G5s and P5s, or whatever the new term will be.

Cerebus · August 4, 2023

17 hours ago, TripleGrad said:

Probably the only way for the MW teams to avoid that $34M payout to join the PACx in 2024

The MWC by laws are online.

Just a quick glance but it seems that a majority of the members can:

Quote

2.16 Actions Requiring Board Approval. The approval of a majority of a quorum of the Board of Directors, or such higher vote as may be specified by other provisions of these bylaws, shall be required to:

...

(c) Initiate, determine, or repeal any rules, regulations or policies of or pertaining to the
Conference.

So if 6 of the 11 voted for it, they could simply strike out these payout rules:

Quote

1.04 Resignation.

Appendix A - 2
(a) Any Member may resign from membership in the Conference effective June 30 of each
year (the “Effective Date”) by delivering written notice to the Conference and the other
Members on or before the preceding June 30 th (the “Notice Date”). The period from a
Notice Date to an Effective Date is referred to herein as the “Interim Period.” The
resignation of a Member does not relieve the Member Institution from any obligations
such Member Institution may have to the Conference as a result of obligations incurred
or commitments made prior to the Effective Date. (Revised June 2011, April 2021)

(b) Effective April 30, 2021 and thereafter any notice of resignation given by any Member
shall be subject to the Notice Date referenced in subparagraph (a) above and the
following: the resigning Member shall pay to the Conference as an Exit Fee an amount
equal to three times the average per Member Conference distribution payment for the
preceding year. (the “Timely Notice Exit Fee”) If the resigning member gives notice after the established “Notice Date”, the resigning Member shall pay to the Conference as anExit Fee an amount equal to double the Timely Notice Exit Fee. After receiving Notice of Resignation from a Member, all payments due that Member from the Conference shall be withheld and applied to that Member’s Exit Fee. The balance of the Member’s Exit
Fee as provided above, shall be paid by the Member to the Conference on or before the
Effective Date. (Revised June 2011, January 2013, July 2016, April 2021)

So in other words, if the PACx invites at least 6 members of the MWC, the members can vote to cancel out the exit fees, and then resign from the MWC and accept the PACx invite.

Edited August 5, 2023 by Cerebus
Only need 6 of 11, not 7

Cerebus · August 4, 2023

4 hours ago, ColoradoEagle said:

The remaining Pac isn't picking apart anyone, that's a really horrible take from the writer.

30 minutes ago, Cerebus said:

Two things to remember about the "who survives, the PAC or the MWC" discussion:

The PAC is owed a lot of NCAA Tourney credits for the next five years.

The PAC is granted autonomy status under NCAA rules by name.

Cerebus · August 4, 2023

4 hours ago, Mean Green 93-98 said:

The exit fee for the MWC was $17 million, but it doubled to $34 million on July 1. That's why SDSU was in such a rush to get things done with the PAC before then.

PAC just has to invite 7 the MWC and they can vote to kill the exit fees.

Cerebus · August 4, 2023

3 hours ago, ColoradoEagle said:

There's no such thing as P5 status. (Beginning next year)

But there is Autonomy Five (A5) status an the PAC has that by name in the NCAA bylaws.

Cerebus · August 4, 2023

1 hour ago, rws69 said:

Zach Ballard writing for SB Nation suggested that Mountain West would dissolve, with six stronger programs (AF, Boise, Colo State, Fresno, SDSU, and UNLV) joining the Pac 12 remnants. The problem would be getting nine votes to dissolve with six of the twelve left hanging.

MWC bylaws are online, I think they only need 7 of 12.

GrayEagle · August 4, 2023

4 hours ago, El Paso Eagle said:

What are the exit fees for the American? I believe the MWC is $17 million

The MWC exit fee is $34 million through 2024. The fee after that has yet to be determined. I hope that no one's thinking of leaving the AAC (except SMU, who, if they get the right deal, has the money to pay it.) The right deal is anything that would make them a P5.

C Rod · August 4, 2023

24 minutes ago, meangreenbob said:

First they need to fire that commissioner.

PAC should hire Judy. She was able to save CUSA after it got raided, just imagine what she’d do for the PAC 😂

Mike Jackson · August 4, 2023

8 hours ago, El Paso Eagle said:

I realize all most think of is football,

It isn’t about football or educating future professionals and leaders; it is about MONEY generation. If your programs win but don’t generate big viewership numbers in key markets and 40k+ home stadium tickets sales the people offering media contracts don’t care. Stanford water polo, volleyball, track, fencing, gymnastics or etc isn’t generating significant revenue from media. It sucks and I believe we going to a 30-50 team super FBS with regular season with a lot less drama and very few annual regional rivalries. These big programs could have been playing each other regularly out of conference for decades but didn’t. Now ironically when Conference play dictate them playing when they are both highly ranked it will lack drama because the top 4 teams from SEC, Big 10, and likely/hopefully the Big 12 🤷🏽‍♂️ will be in the playoff every year. And in many years they might rematch in a conference championship game or excuse my 🤮🤮 “conference playoff game”. I’m not interested in semi-pro leagues whether it USFL, CFL, AAFL, XFL or whatever this Super FBS ends up being. These checks they are writing are going to come due. Fans will check out and organically without their greedy short sightedness assistance, sport interest in younger generations is on the decline. My teenage sons haven’t sat down to watch a NFL, NBA, or MLB game on their own in years but they all about their favorite YouTubers and Twitch Streamers. Hell a Twitch Streamer started a riot in NYC requiring a 1000 NYPD officers to respond.

Edited August 4, 2023 by Mike Jackson

TripleGrad · August 4, 2023

I wonder how the SDSU AD is feeling tonight?

Cougar King · August 4, 2023

Big 16! Big 16! Big 16!

meangreenbob · August 4, 2023

What if Aresco agrees to rebuild the PAC. He takes a few schools from AAC and a few from the MWC. 🫤

meanrob · August 4, 2023

1 hour ago, Cerebus said:

MWC bylaws are online, I think they only need 7 of 12.

After SDSU’s run you think their BBall credits are as much as the PACs?

Mike Jackson · August 5, 2023

9 hours ago, NorthTexasWeLove said:

Have you ever watched a usf game? Attendance is no bueno.

I have watched USF and their attendance looks worst than it actually is. Raymond James Stadium holds 70k (expandable to 75k). When they were on the cusp of being BCS Bowl Buster they averaged over 40k. Beyond Rice or SMU we need to pause whenever being critical of another AAC program’s attendance.

Hunter Green · August 5, 2023

On 7/30/2023 at 10:35 PM, NT93 said:

Too much of a good thing…

Will kill the golden goose.

Hunter Green · August 5, 2023

2 hours ago, El Paso Eagle said:

2024 PAC 😈

SINCE YOU HAVE TO HAVE 6 TEAMS (MINIMUM)

Welcome, Army, UCONN, and UMASS

No way Army joins that mess. Or any of them for that matter.

wardly · August 5, 2023

2 hours ago, Cerebus said:

The MWC by laws are online.

Just a quick glance but it seems that a majority of the members can:

So if 7 of the 12 voted for it, they could simply strike out these payout rules:

So in other words, if the PACx invites at least 7 members of the MWC, the members can vote to cancel out the exit fees, and then resign from the MWC and accept the PACx invite.

So if the PAC 12 invites Fresno ST.,UNLV, AFA, Colorado State,Boise St. , Utah State, and SDSU , and they cancel out the exit fees then , move to the PAC hopefully taking SMU with them and they have 12 programs. The " left behind" programs can join the WAC or CUSA. However, like any divorce, the PAC 4 are going to learn to live on a lot less than $30 million a year and cut their other athletic programs to the bone

Cerebus · August 5, 2023

1 minute ago, wardly said:

So if the PAC 12 invites Fresno ST.,UNLV, AFA, Colorado State,Boise St. , Utah State, and SDSU , and they cancel out the exit fees then , move to the PAC hopefully taking SMU with them and they have 12 programs. The " left behind" programs can join the WAC or CUSA. However, like any divorce, the PAC 4 are going to learn to live on a lot less than $30 million a year and cut their other athletic programs to the bone

Oh there is no doubt the PACx of the future is not the PAC12 of the past, but it will survive. MWC should be concerned.

Cerebus · August 5, 2023

1 hour ago, meanrob said:

After SDSU’s run you think their BBall credits are as much as the PACs?

They are actually higher this year, but remember its on a five year sliding scale, so PAC’s money will be higher,.

Fair warning: I don’t know the exact numbers, this is what some NCAA basketball nerds have posted.

NM Green · August 5, 2023

I like that Aresco seems to be holding his cards close to his chest. I bet he plans a work through with the MWC based on the PACS move. I could see the PAC going the way of the SWC and disappearing. I could see the pairing of programs to make sure everyone has a home. I could see an outright poaching attempt. But Aresco isn’t sitting still despite the silence.

Leftover programs after the PAC invites leave only 1 that fits our profile and two maybes.

San Jose State fits the AAC.
Hawaii and New Mexico are stretches but could have some intrigue.

Personally without some anchors in Colorado I wouldn’t go too far west. Better situation would be UNLV, SDSU, San Jose State or Fresno, Boise, AF, Colorado State.

GMG

Matt from A700 · August 5, 2023

Would be cool to get some names like Cal and Stanford in the same conference, but I think you need more teams in that area to make it feasible. Colorado State and Air Force would be nice but I don't think they would bail on the MWC if that's where the Pac-4 reminants end up. I think it's a "merge" with the MWC but I would think a rebrand to the Pac-16 or whatever.

Who would have thought CUSA would outlive the Pac-12?