CFB Stadium Rankings•••(Had No Idea TSU-San Marcos Had Such A Better Venue Than Baylor U & Others In the Big 12•••Did You)?

[DentonLurker]

I give Texas State a lot of credit for what they’ve done with that facility. That stadium used to barely be a high school-quality stadium. They’ve pulled off a lot of consistency and held onto their history in how they’ve expanded it, despite it being done in phases.

[NT80]

2 hours ago, emmitt01 said:

And for only about 30-40 million more, we could have

Yes.  We got great value for our $78 million.  I have no issue with the Wing, it's a unique design, the kids love it, and actually a great view from there too. 

The majority of Apogee is brick and concrete.  So many of the newer college stadiums (FIU, FAU, UH, etc) went for the cheaper bleacher-type stadium, with stands like the aluminum endzone seating in Fouts.  Quantity, but not quality.

[Green Otaku]

3 hours ago, emmitt01 said:

And for only about 30-40 million more, we could have

I figured it was a money issue. We should have done everything we could to make it close to that, even if it meant doing it in phases or building the endzone at a future time. 

[UNTcrazy727]

Not a huge fan of the Wing either, but our stadium is still great and better than 90% of G5 stadiums. These rankings are ass outside the top 25. Pretty sure his only "research" was blindly throwing darts.

[Mike Jackson]

22 hours ago, Green Otaku said:

 

I still remember the video they used to promote the stadium vote, and how excited I was about how the stadium looked. 

 

 

That is what we should have gotten. 

Those rendering look like 45k+ capacity.  That size maybe a little too ambitious but renovations, getting it close to that should be underway already.  And that likely would be the case if Coach Dodge or Coach Mac worked out.  Apogee would have had multiple sellouts if either of them sustain a 4 year run of over 0.500.   I just wished they had gotten a coach like Littrell when they hired Dodge.  A lot of the positive momentum from the stadium construction and first season in it was squandered.   I also think building on top Fouts would have been better for football.  And my dream scenario would been somewhere between Eagle Blvd and Oak Street.

Edited July 3, 2023 by Mike Jackson

[PlummMeanGreen]

In all fairness,  we are not the only school with a “different look” kind of end zone.  
I sat by a Rice Owls football letterman & his family in the Wing Zone (during the Covid era) & he said: “These end zone seats are quite good.” 

🍕 With Papa John pizza founder John Schnatter initially being UL’s biggest stadium contributor, some might be surprised their end zone doesn’t look like a pizza or even a slice of pizza. 
 

GMG!

Edited July 5, 2023 by PlummMeanGreen

[greenjoe]

At what school of journalism is a student taught to list a heading,

“These ones are pretty alright ?”

Edited July 6, 2023 by greenjoe

[greenminer]

3 hours ago, greenjoe said:

At what school of journalism is a student taught to list a heading,

“These ones are pretty alright ?”

I'm sure you know this and your post is sarcastic, but for the people behind you:

You're on the internet.  Anyone can buy a website and write whatever they want.  No degree required.  No peer reviews.  No certifications.

nada

[outoftown]

On 7/2/2023 at 10:05 PM, GrandGreen said:

All these stadium rating lists are bias, I bet there is not one writer of these articles that has seen half the stadiums in person. 

 

That is the thing here: This guy has actually been to 108 of the 133 stadiums. He only ranks those. He does it -by his own admission - fairly subjectively.

[UNTLifer]

9 hours ago, outoftown said:

That is the thing here: This guy has actually been to 108 of the 133 stadiums. He only ranks those. He does it -by his own admission - fairly subjectively.

Well, he's stupid.

[wardly]

On 7/3/2023 at 12:08 AM, Green Otaku said:

I figured it was a money issue. We should have done everything we could to make it close to that, even if it meant doing it in phases or building the endzone at a future time. 

I met with  a small fundraising group until Rick figured out that not only did I not have a million dollars to donate, none of my friends did either . The original plan as I recall was for 36,000 seats at about $34,000 million give or take a million or so. We had two problems. First,China was hosting the Olympics , buying all the concrete and steel in the world, which drove prices sky high. Second, we had to raise a certain amount of money in order to be able to bond the balance . I don't remember the exact number but if memory serves it was a double digit percentage of the projected cost. Without Rick,C. Dan Smith, and others extraordinary effort to raise this money, which took a longer time than was expected , coupled with the high cost of construction ,the stadium was scaled bast to its present size at over twice the original projected cost. Whether you like it or not the Winged End Zone is a source of conversation. I assume since our average attendance is at or a little below 20,000 the need for stadium enlargement is not high on UNT's to do list.Finely, there is a reason that UNT lags at or at the bottom of alumni giving of D1 schools in Texas [ SHSU not included]. With very few notable exceptions we , myself included, are basically all mouth and little money.

[meangreenfaninno]

21 minutes ago, wardly said:

Finely, there is a reason that UNT lags at or at the bottom of alumni giving of D1 schools in Texas [ SHSU not included]. With very few notable exceptions we , myself included, are basically all mouth and little money.

I for one am not accepting this theory.  We have only consistently funded athletics for about 7-8 years if that.  Past leaders used athletics for what it would provide but did not provide the money it takes to be successful and attract support and donations.  SO it will not miraculously have 50K alums start giving when there has been no success and it looks like a bad investment.  If we could win and win consistently I think we would see some huge numbers of donations but I will not allow you to say we deserved more money from alums when there were very little results to get excited about.

Look at Apogee, until this Cal opener how many big programs have we even had come play here?  Very few.  Would Baylor or TCU break attendance records if they were spending years in the Big West and Sun Belt?  I seriously doubt it.  They struggle with attendance now. 

[DentonLurker]

10 minutes ago, meangreenfaninno said:

If we could win and win consistently I think we would see some huge numbers of donations but I will not allow you to say we deserved more money from alums when there were very little results to get excited about.

I think this logic is part of our issue at UNT. Everyone uses the wins/losses as an excuse to either get on board or not. I support UNT because my family enjoys the tailgating/games/being with other fans/etc not because they are good or bad. Texas A&M, for the most part, has been a middle of the pack kind of football program but they are a high revenue department anyway. You can’t expect UNT leadership to provide the kind of funding it takes to be successful. Fans/alums/etc have to do that.

[meangreenfaninno]

1 hour ago, DentonLurker said:

I think this logic is part of our issue at UNT. Everyone uses the wins/losses as an excuse to either get on board or not. I support UNT because my family enjoys the tailgating/games/being with other fans/etc not because they are good or bad. Texas A&M, for the most part, has been a middle of the pack kind of football program but they are a high revenue department anyway. You can’t expect UNT leadership to provide the kind of funding it takes to be successful. Fans/alums/etc have to do that.

That's just not realistic.  You have to have some sort of consistency to ever build anything that is solid.   There is a saying, “If the gardener does his job, everything will be fine.”

UNT administration has not been a very good gardner in my opinion.

[DentonLurker]

17 minutes ago, meangreenfaninno said:

That's just not realistic.

And I think it’s unrealistic to expect sustained success without support from the fan base.

[UNTLifer]

4 hours ago, DentonLurker said:

And I think it’s unrealistic to expect sustained success without support from the fan base.

[NT80]

8 hours ago, meangreenfaninno said:

Look at Apogee, until this Cal opener how many big programs have we even had come play here?  Very few.  Would Baylor or TCU break attendance records if they were spending years in the Big West and Sun Belt?  I seriously doubt it.  They struggle with attendance now. 

In the next 10 years we do have Texas Tech, Baylor, Missouri, Army and Colorado scheduled to visit Denton.  But we have several more openings available too....

[Green Otaku]

11 hours ago, wardly said:

I met with  a small fundraising group until Rick figured out that not only did I not have a million dollars to donate, none of my friends did either . The original plan as I recall was for 36,000 seats at about $34,000 million give or take a million or so. We had two problems. First,China was hosting the Olympics , buying all the concrete and steel in the world, which drove prices sky high. Second, we had to raise a certain amount of money in order to be able to bond the balance . I don't remember the exact number but if memory serves it was a double digit percentage of the projected cost. Without Rick,C. Dan Smith, and others extraordinary effort to raise this money, which took a longer time than was expected , coupled with the high cost of construction ,the stadium was scaled bast to its present size at over twice the original projected cost. Whether you like it or not the Winged End Zone is a source of conversation. I assume since our average attendance is at or a little below 20,000 the need for stadium enlargement is not high on UNT's to do list.Finely, there is a reason that UNT lags at or at the bottom of alumni giving of D1 schools in Texas [ SHSU not included]. With very few notable exceptions we , myself included, are basically all mouth and little money.

I love hearing first hand accounts of things, mostly because I feel like our AD is not very open to sharing gritty details. I wish more posters on this board would share these insights. 

[NorthTexasWeLove]

On 7/1/2023 at 2:17 PM, mgfan said:

Wing zone needs to go. 

I agree. Too many think it's unique. It's sort of grown into an almost always empty eyesore. Cut the tips off and square it off. When expansion ever becomes a need (it's clearly not right now) then attach the endow to grandstand and student side. 

[wardly]

19 hours ago, meangreenfaninno said:

I for one am not accepting this theory.  We have only consistently funded athletics for about 7-8 years if that.  Past leaders used athletics for what it would provide but did not provide the money it takes to be successful and attract support and donations.  SO it will not miraculously have 50K alums start giving when there has been no success and it looks like a bad investment.  If we could win and win consistently I think we would see some huge numbers of donations but I will not allow you to say we deserved more money from alums when there were very little results to get excited about.

Look at Apogee, until this Cal opener how many big programs have we even had come play here?  Very few.  Would Baylor or TCU break attendance records if they were spending years in the Big West and Sun Belt?  I seriously doubt it.  They struggle with attendance now. 

Deserves has nothing to do with it. Even with numerous football bowl and post season basketball appearances in the past 20 odd years we still rank at or near the bottom in alumni giving among D1 state universities athletic programs in Texas.You just can't say we would draw more fans and financial support if we were in the Big 12, SEC, or Big 10 and use that as an excuse for lack of alumni financial commitments. Be real. Also, define "struggling:. I don't see TCU and Baylor having difficulties gaining fan support in football and basketball.

[wardly]

15 minutes ago, wardly said:

Deserves has nothing to do with it. Even with numerous football bowl and post season basketball appearances in the past 20 odd years we still rank at or near the bottom in alumni giving among D1 state universities athletic programs in Texas.You just can't say we would draw more fans and financial support if we were in the Big 12, SEC, or Big 10 and use that as an excuse for lack of alumni financial commitments. Be real. Also, define "struggling:. I don't see TCU and Baylor having difficulties gaining fan support in football and basketball.

Also please review the recent post " football/athletics growth and trends" which is excellent. In 2023 Baylor was at 98% of capacity in football and 92% in basketball while TCU was 93.3% in football and 91% in basketball. This article only compares the Power 5 conferences and the MAC, but I would estimate our average football attendance at 66% and basketball  at 40%.

[wardly]

1 minute ago, wardly said:

Also please review the recent post " football/athletics growth and trends" which is excellent. In 2023 Baylor was at 98% of capacity in football and 92% in basketball while TCU was 93.3% in football and 91% in basketball. This article only compares the Power 5 conferences and the MAC, but I would estimate our average football attendance at 66% and basketball  at 40%.

Actually its "football and basketball  attendance and trends" and explains why the PAC 12 is having difficulty negotiating a media contract, plus the decline in attendance in all conferences in both sports.

 

[UNTLifer]

8 hours ago, wardly said:

Also please review the recent post " football/athletics growth and trends" which is excellent. In 2023 Baylor was at 98% of capacity in football and 92% in basketball while TCU was 93.3% in football and 91% in basketball. This article only compares the Power 5 conferences and the MAC, but I would estimate our average football attendance at 66% and basketball  at 40%.

The difference?  Baylor does a fantastic job of connecting with the citizens of Waco and surrounding area, and TCU does the same with Fort Worth. UNT?  We cancel traditions like the Homecoming parade and are in a constant battle with the citizens of Denton. Denton and the surrounding communities need to feel that we are their team. When that happens, people will come. 

[wardly]

1 hour ago, UNTLifer said:

The difference?  Baylor does a fantastic job of connecting with the citizens of Waco and surrounding area, and TCU does the same with Fort Worth. UNT?  We cancel traditions like the Homecoming parade and are in a constant battle with the citizens of Denton. Denton and the surrounding communities need to feel that we are their team. When that happens, people will come. 

Well I have waiting since my freshman year of 1961 and have decided it just ain't going to happen in my lifetime.