Another example of a spineless NCAA? What if UNT/others did the same?

[El Paso Eagle]

Like him or not, Coach Sanders is doing what he wants. My question is, why is he being allowed to openly violate the P5 rules with no consequences? What if other coaches had done the same thing? Should Nort Texas and other schools be allowed to make yearly cuts? 

As part of the "P5" conferences, each school has agreed to the following - 

 

In 2015, the NCAA Division I “Power 5” Schools implemented a rule that has the effect of “protecting” Division I student-athletes from having their athletic scholarship cancelled or not renewed for any athletics reason.  Quite simply, a coach cannot take away a scholarship for poor athletic performance.

It will be interesting to see if there is any fallout from this.

https://footballscoop.com/news/jim-mora-subtweets-then-defends-deion-sanders-on-transfer-policy

Edited April 27, 2023 by El Paso Eagle

[Cr1028]

1 hour ago, El Paso Eagle said:

Like him or not, Coach Sanders is doing what he wants. My question is, why is he being allowed to openly violate the P5 rules with no consequences? What if other coaches had done the same thing? Should Nort Texas and other schools be allowed to make yearly cuts? 

As part of the "P5" conferences, each school has agreed to the following - 

 

In 2015, the NCAA Division I “Power 5” Schools implemented a rule that has the effect of “protecting” Division I student-athletes from having their athletic scholarship cancelled or not renewed for any athletics reason.  Quite simply, a coach cannot take away a scholarship for poor athletic performance.

It will be interesting to see if there is any fallout from this.

https://footballscoop.com/news/jim-mora-subtweets-then-defends-deion-sanders-on-transfer-policy

That policy was pre-portal. The landscape has changed and coaches have to make the decision to get on board or get left behind. This is the new college football for better or worse. A semi-pro league.

[Mike Jackson]

5 hours ago, Cr1028 said:

That policy was pre-portal. The landscape has changed and coaches have to make the decision to get on board or get left behind. This is the new college football for better or worse. A semi-pro league.

Nothing new about it unless 30 years plus qualifies as "new".  Programs large and small have been playing fast and lose with the rules since before SMU got the death penalty.   And that 2015 rule was just a half ass attempt to delay the inevitable of paying players who are essential in generating a billion dollars of revenue every year.

[C Rod]

8 hours ago, El Paso Eagle said:

Like him or not, Coach Sanders is doing what he wants. My question is, why is he being allowed to openly violate the P5 rules with no consequences? What if other coaches had done the same thing? Should Nort Texas and other schools be allowed to make yearly cuts? 

As part of the "P5" conferences, each school has agreed to the following - 

 

In 2015, the NCAA Division I “Power 5” Schools implemented a rule that has the effect of “protecting” Division I student-athletes from having their athletic scholarship cancelled or not renewed for any athletics reason.  Quite simply, a coach cannot take away a scholarship for poor athletic performance.

It will be interesting to see if there is any fallout from this.

https://footballscoop.com/news/jim-mora-subtweets-then-defends-deion-sanders-on-transfer-policy

Deion is not making cuts or taking away scholarships. He is setting the depth chart and being open and honest with players from a 1-11 team about their opportunities for playing time. Players can stay on scholarship and never see the field or they can jump in the portal and play ball somewhere else. Are these tough conversations? Yes. Are players having to make tough adult decisions. Yes. Is Deion breaking the rules, no.

https://apple.news/A2lYTK0JHTKevqwUD4y9G4g

[DentonLurker]

I've been trying to figure out if that was sort of a gentlemen's agreement or an actual NCAA rule change.

One thing I think is interesting is that the NCAA has allowed true multi-year scholarships since 2012. Coaches and programs have not chosen to go that route. Hmmmm. Maybe Deion isn't the only one not willing to commit 4 years to athletes.

[Coach_1976]

I am sure that this happens at all schools even UNT, if any body has a start of spring and now roster look at see who is on it and not on it. We know several kids are hitting the portal but there may be some names we haven't heard so just look and see. I don't have a start of spring roster or i would. Just my 0.2

[MrAlien]

Do players really want the scholarship or are they just after that NIL money?  The portal and the NIL is really starting to devalue the educational side of college athletics.  

[El Paso Eagle]

19 minutes ago, DentonLurker said:

I've been trying to figure out if that was sort of a gentlemen's agreement or an actual NCAA rule change.

One thing I think is interesting is that the NCAA has allowed true multi-year scholarships since 2012. Coaches and programs have not chosen to go that route. Hmmmm. Maybe Deion isn't the only one not willing to commit 4 years to athletes.

From everything I have read, this was an agreement put in place by the P5 conferences.

[DentonLurker]

Just now, El Paso Eagle said:

From everything I have read, this was an agreement put in place by the P5 conferences.

Right, but you're alleging the NCAA should be enforcing it. I'm trying to figure out if it's an NCAA rule or if it was more of a soft agreement between conferences that the NCAA had nothing to do with.

[El Paso Eagle]

1 hour ago, C Rod said:

Deion is not making cuts or taking away scholarships. He is setting the depth chart and being open and honest with players from a 1-11 team about their opportunities for playing time. Players can stay on scholarship and never see the field or they can jump in the portal and play ball somewhere else. Are these tough conversations? Yes. Are players having to make tough adult decisions. Yes. Is Deion breaking the rules, no.

https://apple.news/A2lYTK0JHTKevqwUD4y9G4g

Maybe you have a different definition of being cut 

Now-former Buffaloes explained to The Athletic how Sanders transformed CU's spring practices into an NFL-style training camp, cuts and all.

“He’s walking with me and said, ‘Hey buddy, you’re going to get cut today. I’m sorry to tell you this. I didn’t want you to hear it from Coach Prime. I wanted you to hear it from my mouth. I didn’t want to cut you, but we had to cut five offensive linemen, and you were the last one,’” offensive lineman Travis Gray told The Athletic on Tuesday evening.

When Gray walked into Sanders’ office, his head was down. Then he looked up.

“I was like, ‘Oh, God.’ I saw the mean mug in his face,” Gray said. “He told me, ‘You’re 6-foot-8, 320 pounds. I know in my heart of hearts a school is going to pick you up in the portal when you enter. Make your weaknesses your strengths and keep progressing. I hope you have a great future, it just won’t be here at the University of Colorado.’”

[greenminer]

Pre portal lingo that has ties to the BCS.  Are we certain in this post-BCS world that this rule still exists/applies?

[El Paso Eagle]

18 minutes ago, greenminer said:

Pre portal lingo that has ties to the BCS.  Are we certain in this post-BCS world that this rule still exists/applies?

It's mentioned all over the place, but not if it is official or how it's enforced - Sounds like most other NCAA rules (except they made sure to cover the evils of buying a recruit a hamburger)

[C Rod]

2 hours ago, El Paso Eagle said:

Maybe you have a different definition of being cut 

Now-former Buffaloes explained to The Athletic how Sanders transformed CU's spring practices into an NFL-style training camp, cuts and all.

“He’s walking with me and said, ‘Hey buddy, you’re going to get cut today. I’m sorry to tell you this. I didn’t want you to hear it from Coach Prime. I wanted you to hear it from my mouth. I didn’t want to cut you, but we had to cut five offensive linemen, and you were the last one,’” offensive lineman Travis Gray told The Athletic on Tuesday evening.

When Gray walked into Sanders’ office, his head was down. Then he looked up.

“I was like, ‘Oh, God.’ I saw the mean mug in his face,” Gray said. “He told me, ‘You’re 6-foot-8, 320 pounds. I know in my heart of hearts a school is going to pick you up in the portal when you enter. Make your weaknesses your strengths and keep progressing. I hope you have a great future, it just won’t be here at the University of Colorado.’”

The term cut is being used liberally. Deion told players to their faces they won't ever play at CU and if they want to keep playing college football, they'll need to hit the portal. That's how the term "cut" is being used by these former players.

In reality, scholarships are legal four-year guarantees where a player can only lose it if they commit a felony, break team or school rules, or quit the team. Entering the port is consider quitting the team which is why Deion is being so brazen about it. He can't turn around the program with players from a 1-11 team. 

[DentonLurker]

25 minutes ago, C Rod said:

scholarships are legal four-year guarantees

This isn’t true

[97and03]

11 hours ago, El Paso Eagle said:

From everything I have read, this was an agreement put in place by the P5 conferences.

Definitely not an NCAA issue, as they don’t have separate p5 and g5 rule books. 🙄

[NT93]

21 hours ago, C Rod said:

He can't turn around the program with players from a 1-11 team. 

So coaching doesn’t matter.  Gotcha.

[El Paso Eagle]

16 minutes ago, NT93 said:

So coaching doesn’t matter.  Gotcha.

He can recruit and motivate, but has he shown he is a good coach? Is it even necessary in his system?

[DentonLurker]

1 hour ago, NT93 said:

So coaching doesn’t matter.  Gotcha.

Let’s be real. This isn’t a one or the other approach. A team that went 1-11 needs both better coaches and better players.

[C Rod]

2 hours ago, NT93 said:

So coaching doesn’t matter.  Gotcha.

If that’s the silly conclusion you want to jump to, have at it.
 

But let’s be honest and rational about this. If you were in Deion’s position (along with the hype and pressure from fans & donors), would you choose to coach a group players with a 1-11 record, recruited by the last failed coaching staff; OR would you rather recruit the #1 recruiting class in 2023 and coach them instead?
 

Y’all’s disdain for Deion is clouding your judgment if you choose the former over the latter. 

[El Paso Eagle]

3 minutes ago, C Rod said:

If that’s the silly conclusion you want to jump to, have at it.
 

But let’s be honest and rational about this. If you were in Deion’s position (along with the hype and pressure from fans & donors), would you choose to coach a group players with a 1-11 record, recruited by the last failed coaching staff; OR would you rather recruit the #1 recruiting class in 2023 and coach them instead?
 

Y’all’s disdain for Deion is clouding your judgment if you choose the former over the latter. 

And it could also be said your infatuation with him is clouding yours. Some are going to like him, and some won't like him, regardless. It will be interesting to see how his approach to having a team full of "get mine" players. At JSU, he looked great, with a roster full of P5/G5 level players against lower-level FCS players. 

[C Rod]

2 minutes ago, El Paso Eagle said:

And it could also be said your infatuation with him is clouding yours. Some are going to like him, and some won't like him, regardless. It will be interesting to see how his approach to having a team full of "get mine" players. At JSU, he looked great, with a roster full of P5/G5 level players against lower-level FCS players. 

My friend, I would be thrilled to have Deion at UNT. I would love to see UNT with the #1 recruiting class in 2023. I would love for our stadium to be sold out every home game for the first time EVER. I would have loved to see our Spring Game sold out. I would love the millions of dollars in free digital advertising Deion and his son would bring to UNT. If you want to try and color me infatuated, go right ahead. What I won't be is a hypocrite. 

[DentonLurker]

The hype with Deion is certainly a cash cow for Colorado in the short run. We will see if it pays off in the long run. If they win some games, it could be a long term win for them. We will see how that part plays out. The short term wins will fade out if the product on the field doesn’t match up with the hype.

I think there’s a lot being said publicly by Deion and the players that isn’t typically played out publicly. I don’t really have a problem with it because I think those things are happening everywhere.

As far as “cutting” players goes, these guys will be just fun. Hell, my junior high had cuts for 7th grade basketball back in the day. It’s just part of the game, and I don’t think it’s new to college football.

[NT93]

49 minutes ago, C Rod said:

If that’s the silly conclusion you want to jump to, have at it.

More of a tongue in cheek comment than a silly conclusion.  BUT…coaches are expected to turn things around with what they’ve got.  Going out and getting better players doesn’t make him a good coach.  I’ve never seen him win at any level as a coach when he had equal talent.  
 

I will concede that my dislike for him probably clouds my judgment.  He’s such a self absorbed fraud.

[NT93]

11 minutes ago, DentonLurker said:

I think there’s a lot being said publicly by Deion and the players that isn’t typically played out publicly. I don’t really have a problem with it because I think those things are happening everywhere.

I feel like a lot of what’s being said should be kept private out of respect for the players.  Everything shouldn’t be for public consumption.  
 

What is happening at Colorado isn’t happening everywhere…not on the same scale.  46 CU players have entered the portal.  FORTY-SIX!!! Another sign that Deion has no respect for these players.  He is looking out for #1 as always.  

[NorthTexasWeLove]

This been happenin, years and years. Coaches try to be slick rick about. Deion don't. That's the only difference.