New Basketball Arena proposed on Light the Tower Masterplan update

[ADLER]

On 2/25/2023 at 1:17 PM, Green Otaku said:

 

Envision? Aren't the Light the Tower renders the final design?

NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOoooooooooooooooooooo!!!!!!!!!!!!

Please Dear Football Gods, NO! ... Do something that adds to our stadium, not just enhancing the office amenities. This location is WAY TOO VALUABLE real estate to waste by desecrating it with this limited vision project. This design is so SJSU. Find some other place to build this unsightly shed and it's 50 seats. It looks like pre-fab housing. The principle reminds me of when you'd see shacks with washers and dryer sets placed on the front porch. "It may be unsightly as hell, but we too have got one".

Why not something like Tech's revised endzone football facility which is also designed to fit between their stadium and their athletics facility? Theirs is designed to be an integral part of their stadium unlike our proposed abomination.

(We can do better, much, much better)

Edited February 27, 2023 by ADLER

[UNTcrazy727]

8 hours ago, ADLER said:

NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOoooooooooooooooooooo!!!!!!!!!!!!

Please Dear Football Gods, NO! ... Do something that adds to our stadium, not just enhancing the office amenities. This location is WAY TOO VALUABLE real estate to waste by desecrating it with this limited vision project. This design is so SJSU. Find some other place to build this unsightly shed and it's 50 seats. It looks like pre-fab housing. The principle reminds me of when you'd see shacks with washers and dryer sets placed on the front porch. "It may be unsightly as hell, but we too have got one".

Why not something like Tech's revised endzone football facility which is also designed to fit between their stadium and their athletics facility? Theirs is designed to be an integral part of their stadium unlike our proposed abomination.

(We can do better, much, much better)

I agree with you. If that's the final design then its extremely disappointing. I have no expectations or desire for us to match Texas Tech, but we HAVE to at least match what Louisiana Tech built. 

[UNTLifer]

Why are we talking AC Expansion in the new basketball arena thread?

[Green Otaku]

58 minutes ago, UNTcrazy727 said:

I agree with you. If that's the final design then its extremely disappointing. I have no expectations or desire for us to match Texas Tech, but we HAVE to at least match what Louisiana Tech built. 

Agree, ours needs to look at least this good or better. 

[Green Otaku]

34 minutes ago, UNTLifer said:

Why are we talking AC Expansion in the new basketball arena thread?

We did get sidetracked a bit..

[Green Otaku]

I brought that discussion over to the football forum, because I think it's a really good/important thing to ask questions about. As for the BB side, I am still fully behind getting a new arena. It will really solidify our 2 biggest sports and give them top notch facilities. 

[Matt from A700]

Here's a thought I've been having while looking at our campus from Google Maps.

The forum seems to be split on whether we should even build a new arena. But what about location?

The AD seems determined to get all athletic facilities in the Mean Green Village, including a new 7,000-seat arena. However, I am not keen on this idea as I think student attendance will decline. There's still only one dorm in the village and no student apartments. And now all of sudden, it's an inconvenience for students to walk across a bridge six Saturdays a year when everything has been fine for 10 years.

With games more frequent but on inconsistent days of the week in basketball, I think convenience is even more key for a new arena.

My proposal: demolish the Union garage and relocate the Baptist Student Ministry and put the arena there. May need another few feet north-to-south, so demolish the north end of Union Circle and reconstruct the south end to form a circle similar to the one off of Avenue D and the Pit. It'd go between the Union and the hypothetical arena.

If you replace the Union Garage, you could put it behind Wooten Hall, but it may not be aesthetically pleasing to have two parking garages caddy-cornered from each other. You could build one behind the RTVF building. I get this could get a lot of eye rolls or thumbs down because you'd be demolishing a very new BSM building.

However, this is the most central location on campus you could put a new arena without demolishing historic buildings or places. Right by the popular Union and easy walking distance from not only most of the dorms on campus, but the Greek population which has been severely lacking in the past few years. Also, only a few blocks from Fry!

Notes: This idea came about without looking at what UNT's Master Plan might have in mind for the affected areas. Also, I have no idea what the current parking regulations are for the affected area.

[Green Otaku]

23 minutes ago, Matt from A700 said:

Here's a thought I've been having while looking at our campus from Google Maps.

The forum seems to be split on whether we should even build a new arena. But what about location?

The AD seems determined to get all athletic facilities in the Mean Green Village, including a new 7,000-seat arena. However, I am not keen on this idea as I think student attendance will decline. There's still only one dorm in the village and no student apartments. And now all of sudden, it's an inconvenience for students to walk across a bridge six Saturdays a year when everything has been fine for 10 years.

With games more frequent but on inconsistent days of the week in basketball, I think convenience is even more key for a new arena.

My proposal: demolish the Union garage and relocate the Baptist Student Ministry and put the arena there. May need another few feet north-to-south, so demolish the north end of Union Circle and reconstruct the south end to form a circle similar to the one off of Avenue D and the Pit. It'd go between the Union and the hypothetical arena.

If you replace the Union Garage, you could put it behind Wooten Hall, but it may not be aesthetically pleasing to have two parking garages caddy-cornered from each other. You could build one behind the RTVF building. I get this could get a lot of eye rolls or thumbs down because you'd be demolishing a very new BSM building.

However, this is the most central location on campus you could put a new arena without demolishing historic buildings or places. Right by the popular Union and easy walking distance from not only most of the dorms on campus, but the Greek population which has been severely lacking in the past few years. Also, only a few blocks from Fry!

Notes: This idea came about without looking at what UNT's Master Plan might have in mind for the affected areas. Also, I have no idea what the current parking regulations are for the affected area.

 

The big problem is the players who use the facility everyday are going to have to shuttle to use the court? I don't think it's smart to trade the convenience of the players for the convenience of the students. They can go from their dorms, to the weight room, to the arena, and to a team meeting in a short walk.

The master plan has more dorms planned by Traditions and Santa Fe Square, and a 2nd dorm behind Victory.

Dark yellow is existing dorms, and light yellow are planned/suggested dorms:

 

Here is an overall plan for all new buildings:

 

The site you are talking about next to the BSM is supposed to be another large parking garage. Looking at everything I think it would be odd to have a new arena so isolated from everything else. 

If I had no money restrictions and could do whatever I wanted I would build the arena where the AD master plan says, but I would cover I-35 like the did in downtown Dallas and connect the 2 parts of campus like so:

Now students and everyone else could easily walk across to both FB or BB. 

[rojomojo]

2 hours ago, Matt from A700 said:

Here's a thought I've been having while looking at our campus from Google Maps.

The forum seems to be split on whether we should even build a new arena. But what about location?

The AD seems determined to get all athletic facilities in the Mean Green Village, including a new 7,000-seat arena. However, I am not keen on this idea as I think student attendance will decline. There's still only one dorm in the village and no student apartments. And now all of sudden, it's an inconvenience for students to walk across a bridge six Saturdays a year when everything has been fine for 10 years.

With games more frequent but on inconsistent days of the week in basketball, I think convenience is even more key for a new arena.

My proposal: demolish the Union garage and relocate the Baptist Student Ministry and put the arena there. May need another few feet north-to-south, so demolish the north end of Union Circle and reconstruct the south end to form a circle similar to the one off of Avenue D and the Pit. It'd go between the Union and the hypothetical arena.

If you replace the Union Garage, you could put it behind Wooten Hall, but it may not be aesthetically pleasing to have two parking garages caddy-cornered from each other. You could build one behind the RTVF building. I get this could get a lot of eye rolls or thumbs down because you'd be demolishing a very new BSM building.

However, this is the most central location on campus you could put a new arena without demolishing historic buildings or places. Right by the popular Union and easy walking distance from not only most of the dorms on campus, but the Greek population which has been severely lacking in the past few years. Also, only a few blocks from Fry!

Notes: This idea came about without looking at what UNT's Master Plan might have in mind for the affected areas. Also, I have no idea what the current parking regulations are for the affected area.

I live in Mozart, the second closest dorm to Apogee (other than Victory of course) Mozart is literally right on the other side of the highway yet it takes 10 minutes to walk to. This isn't a "campus walk" either. This is a walk across asphalt parking and a pedestrian bridge. 

Imagine for a second how long the walk would be for someone living in the interior of campus? (Kerr, Maple, Bruce, etc)

 

[NorthTexasWeLove]

6 hours ago, rojomojo said:

I live in Mozart, the second closest dorm to Apogee (other than Victory of course) Mozart is literally right on the other side of the highway yet it takes 10 minutes to walk to. This isn't a "campus walk" either. This is a walk across asphalt parking and a pedestrian bridge. 

Imagine for a second how long the walk would be for someone living in the interior of campus? (Kerr, Maple, Bruce, etc)

 

I get it. 

But I can get from Fry Street to my seat inside of Apogee in less than 20 minutes. We actin like students are running a marathon and the need of transitional water tables are in need. Students who want to be there will be there. The others weren't coming anyway. 

What we need are vast array of business students taking claim to the campus that take pride in their University. Student section would be overflowing. 

[Matt from A700]

6 hours ago, rojomojo said:

I live in Mozart, the second closest dorm to Apogee (other than Victory of course) Mozart is literally right on the other side of the highway yet it takes 10 minutes to walk to. This isn't a "campus walk" either. This is a walk across asphalt parking and a pedestrian bridge. 

Imagine for a second how long the walk would be for someone living in the interior of campus? (Kerr, Maple, Bruce, etc)

 

I guess I restarted this...

A 10-minute walk, or 20 minutes from Kerr/Greek Row is nothing for a 3.5 hour event, 5+ hours if you're tailgating.

Mozart is a 17-minute walk to the Language Building. Are you going to tell your Spanish professor you can't come to class because it's a long walk, too?

[Matt from A700]

7 hours ago, Green Otaku said:

The big problem is the players who use the facility everyday are going to have to shuttle to use the court? I don't think it's smart to trade the convenience of the players for the convenience of the students. They can go from their dorms, to the weight room, to the arena, and to a team meeting in a short walk.

I can't lie and say I have a list of other schools that have athletic facilities and living on different sides of campus. Do all of the basketball players live at Victory, or even on campus though?

7 hours ago, Green Otaku said:

If I had no money restrictions and could do whatever I wanted I would build the arena where the AD master plan says, but I would cover I-35 like the did in downtown Dallas and connect the 2 parts of campus like so:

Now students and everyone else could easily walk across to both FB or BB. 

A party area over an Interstate would definitely be one of the most unique tailgating spots in college sports.

 

As for the dorms, I just hope they start building upwards more often, with how little space there is to utilize. Still too tough for upperclassmen to live on campus.

[MeanGreen13]

20 minutes ago, Matt from A700 said:

I can't lie and say I have a list of other schools that have athletic facilities and living on different sides of campus. Do all of the basketball players live at Victory, or even on campus though?

When I was in school, the basketball underclassmen lived at Mozart Square right by the super pit. 

[Green Otaku]

4 hours ago, Matt from A700 said:

I can't lie and say I have a list of other schools that have athletic facilities and living on different sides of campus. Do all of the basketball players live at Victory, or even on campus though?

A party area over an Interstate would definitely be one of the most unique tailgating spots in college sports.

 

As for the dorms, I just hope they start building upwards more often, with how little space there is to utilize. Still too tough for upperclassmen to live on campus.

I'm not sure if they all live at Victory, I would assume so since I thought all student athletes live there, but that's a good question. 

Agree about the dorms needing to be taller. It seems like we are in a perpetual state of not enough housing. 

[Green Otaku]

Looking at the master plan again and taking a guess, the only 2 options of keeping a new arena on that side is to place it where the current Super Pit is, or place it where Fouts was. The only problem I see with that is I don't think you have the space to do an all-in-1 building, as they have said they want to do an arena, with 2 basketball practice courts and a volleyball facility. That's a pretty large footprint for a building.

 

[GMG_Dallas]

7 hours ago, NorthTexasWeLove said:

I get it. 

But I can get from Fry Street to my seat inside of Apogee in less than 20 minutes. We actin like students are running a marathon and the need of transitional water tables are in need. Students who want to be there will be there. The others weren't coming anyway. 

What we need are vast array of business students taking claim to the campus that take pride in their University. Student section would be overflowing. 

The logical solution here is to tear down the college of education building, Matthews Hall, and Wooten Hall and build this MFer right between the BLB, the Union, and the Greek life housing. 

I'm slightly kidding here but uhhhhuh if it's attendance and aesthetics we want, those 3 buildings listed are old and could use an update as well. Why not do it all over and use the opportunity to give other students some new facilities too.

Honestly, I wish they'd never started all of this athletic center crap on the other side of 35. I know y'all joke about it not being a long walk and bla bla. You're right, it's not. But 35 really breaks the flow of the campus. It's too late for what's already there but it's never too late to stop adding more facilities on that side of "campus." A break between the athletes and the others is not a good environment.

Regarding where the basketball players live. I have no answer but I saw Tony Mitchell at Kerr way too often with the food they have at victory and Niko Stojiljkovic often walked past Maple and Kerr to get to class. They need their legs to get to class. They're student-athletes, not athlete-students.

Edited March 13, 2023 by GMG_Dallas

[MeanGreen22]

13 hours ago, rojomojo said:

I live in Mozart, the second closest dorm to Apogee (other than Victory of course) Mozart is literally right on the other side of the highway yet it takes 10 minutes to walk to. This isn't a "campus walk" either. This is a walk across asphalt parking and a pedestrian bridge. 

Imagine for a second how long the walk would be for someone living in the interior of campus? (Kerr, Maple, Bruce, etc)

 

Free campus shuttles don’t exist anymore or what? I lived in Victory and it didn’t stop me from getting on a shuttle to the Pit. 

[Green Otaku]

46 minutes ago, GMG_Dallas said:

The logical solution here is to tear down the college of education building, Matthews Hall, and Wooten Hall and build this MFer right between the BLB, the Union, and the Greek life housing. 

I'm slightly kidding here but uhhhhuh if it's attendance and aesthetics we want, those 3 buildings listed are old and could use an update as well. Why not do it all over and use the opportunity to give other students some new facilities too.

Honestly, I wish they'd never started all of this athletic center crap on the other side of 35. I know y'all joke about it not being a long walk and bla bla. You're right, it's not. But 35 really breaks the flow of the campus. It's too late for what's already there but it's never too late to stop adding more facilities on that side of "campus." A break between the athletes and the others is not a good environment.

Regarding where the basketball players live. I have no answer but I saw Tony Mitchell at Kerr way too often with the food they have at victory and Niko Stojiljkovic often walked past Maple and Kerr to get to class. They need their legs to get to class. They're student-athletes, not athlete-students.

Yeah I think we are married to the whole "athletic village" whether people like it or not. Once Fouts moved across the highway it was not possible to keep other things from moving over there. There just simply isn't enough space to expand unless UNT was willing to buy a considerable size of land from private owners. 

[rojomojo]

8 hours ago, NorthTexasWeLove said:

I get it. 

But I can get from Fry Street to my seat inside of Apogee in less than 20 minutes. We actin like students are running a marathon and the need of transitional water tables are in need. Students who want to be there will be there. The others weren't coming anyway. 

What we need are vast array of business students taking claim to the campus that take pride in their University. Student section would be overflowing. 

I also understand it looks weak to complain about a 10 minute walk, I agree with your standpoints and I think as long as student activity and reliant ways of transportation are available to the stadium, the location would be absolutely fine being over by the Mean Green Village... Great ideas though

[rojomojo]

57 minutes ago, MeanGreen22 said:

Free campus shuttles don’t exist anymore or what? I lived in Victory and it didn’t stop me from getting on a shuttle to the Pit. 

Bus system has been taking fire due to Denton City Council cutting routes and funding for DCTA... UNT desperately needs to enhance the bus system on campus, it would really help with attendance I feel

[UNTLifer]

33 minutes ago, rojomojo said:

I also understand it looks weak to complain about a 10 minute walk, I agree with your standpoints and I think as long as student activity and reliant ways of transportation are available to the stadium, the location would be absolutely fine being over by the Mean Green Village... Great ideas though

Get a couple of these babies rolling and just watch attendance spike.

[Cooke County Kid]

Seems to me there is a lot of empty space where Fouts Field use to be. Build it there and rent it out to the University for graduations, maybe put some classrooms in there 😉

[meanrob]

1 hour ago, Cooke County Kid said:

Seems to me there is a lot of empty space where Fouts Field use to be. Build it there and rent it out to the University for graduations, maybe put some classrooms in there 😉

Back when I worked at the Pit we could barely fit all the people for the larger school’s graduations. No way a smaller venue could hold those people. 
 

I’d be shocked if the University gave up any parking spaces for a venue. They bring in too much money. 
 

Build it at the best, most logical spot available. You don’t build it so students have to walk five mins less. I do like the overpass improvement idea though. 

[DentonLurker]

12 hours ago, NorthTexasWeLove said:

Students who want to be there will be there. The others weren't coming anyway. 

This is it. This is the post. I don’t buy that students who actually want to go are going to not go “because it’s too far.”

[NT80]

7 hours ago, Green Otaku said:

That's a pretty large footprint for a building.

 

It is there to share the Apogee parking lots, plus close to all other Athletic facilities and admin buildings.   Nice location for an arena with potential highway signage and visibility.  Needs to be expandable to 8.5k with suites. 
Students need to learn to walk!!  I think Baylor’s arena and stadium are further from dorms than this. 

Edited March 14, 2023 by NT80