Here’s what happens if you fire Littrell during the season

[NorthTexasSportsNetwork]

Well for starters, that would be the dumbest move by Wren Baker ever. To fire someone during the season, it takes a hell of a lot of bad to do that. Why create mass chaos within the university, athletic department, and locker room?

2nd: you gotta pay him out. Let him ride out the mediocrity stint that he has and find a better coach. It’s clear something’s not clicking, but everyone has to be realistic in this situation.

Overreaction for sure, but we still have 10 games left I guess.

I feel for the players, however. Guys like Jake Roberts, KD Davis, Manase Mose are guys that compete at better schools, but stuck around. 

[Pavlovs Eagle]

And when he is able to #hit6 by end of season and you're surrounded by another year of a beaten down fan base that is so ready to move on to Basketball that they just don't care enough to push Wren and the University about it?  Because thats whats going to happen.  And thats how we end up with a 2023 AAC inaugural season with Littrell at the helm.

[Hall Eagle 2011]

I think all of this was said last year too. Then we won 5 straight and somehow the need to get rid of him subsided (not necessarily by the fan base). 

He rode out his mediocrity last year and the year before. There should have been some movement with this in the off-season regardless. No one wants another mediocre season, repeating the same concerns about our head coach all over again.

It’s exhausting not seeing change.

[Hookset]

22 minutes ago, NorthTexasSportsNetwork said:

2nd: you gotta pay him out. Let him ride out the mediocrity stint that he has and find a better coach. It’s clear something’s not clicking, but everyone has to be realistic in this situation.

I listened to a podcast this summer and Wren stated UNT’s entire coaching budget is $40 million. For comparison SMU is $90 million. He stated sometimes changes are not made in order to afford keeping coaches. 
Example: If Littrell is fired, he gets his buyout, then new football coach gets a well compensated contract and his new assistants as well. There wouldn’t be enough money to keep deserving coaches like McCasland or DeLong. 
This sucks but is a reality. 

[El Paso Eagle]

2 hours ago, Hookset said:

I listened to a podcast this summer and Wren stated UNT’s entire coaching budget is $40 million. For comparison SMU is $90 million. He stated sometimes changes are not made in order to afford keeping coaches. 
Example: If Littrell is fired, he gets his buyout, then new football coach gets a well compensated contract and his new assistants as well. There wouldn’t be enough money to keep deserving coaches like McCasland or DeLong. 
This sucks but is a reality. 

So what you are saying is we mortgaged our program to get into the AAC but now we will be Bottom Feeders and can't truly afford to compete with the existing schools that were there already

[untjim1995]

3 hours ago, Hookset said:

I listened to a podcast this summer and Wren stated UNT’s entire coaching budget is $40 million. For comparison SMU is $90 million. He stated sometimes changes are not made in order to afford keeping coaches. 
Example: If Littrell is fired, he gets his buyout, then new football coach gets a well compensated contract and his new assistants as well. There wouldn’t be enough money to keep deserving coaches like McCasland or DeLong. 
This sucks but is a reality. 

@UNTLifer…you told me we had the money and that’s not why SL was still here when I said it was clearly the money that was keeping him here. 
 

Sounds like Wren Baker is saying it’s the money…

[TIgreen01]

With the early signing period firing a coach mid season is much more difficult.  You essentially need to fire and then rehire before December?  I don’t know how you do that realistically.  You lose a recruiting class no matter what you do.

[Mike Jackson]

On 9/4/2022 at 12:48 AM, Hall Eagle 2011 said:

 

I think all of this was said last year too. Then we won 5 straight and somehow the need to get rid of him subsided (not necessarily by the fan base). 

He rode out his mediocrity last year and the year before. There should have been some movement with this in the off-season regardless. No one wants another mediocre season, repeating the same concerns about our head coach all over again.

It’s exhausting not seeing change.

I keep hearing the 5 straight wins as some kind of deciding factor.  It shouldn't have been when it was completed with a weather fluke aided win over UTSA.   Regular weather we don't win that game.  Hell in regular weather or God forbid unseasonably nice weather with +25k Seth would've made sure the play of the team didn't earn them any new fans JUST LIKR EVERY GAME SINCE FINE LEFT and most before Fine graduated.  It was a mind numbing bad decision to bring Seth back.  Indefensible to bring him back because of a bad contract situation they didn't have to get into.  Head Coach here since Dickey has been a good job offering more than what 1/2 of other G5 provide.  For football leadership has been acting like new head coaches here are coming to “Texas State" of Necessary Roughness movie lore coming off the death penalty.   (like cough err a team that just made us look like JV).  If they had dominated Miami of Ohio or played a really good P5 opponent in the bowl and lost a nail biter then maybe you have reason to bring him back other than piss poor contract management.

Edited September 5, 2022 by Mike Jackson

[Pseudo Nym]

7 hours ago, NorthTexasSportsNetwork said:

Well for starters, that would be the dumbest move by Wren Baker ever. To fire someone during the season, it takes a hell of a lot of bad to do that. Why create mass chaos within the university, athletic department, and locker room?

Mass chaos? (GIVE ME A BREAK!)

What on earth is your definition of "Mass Chaos" - the closest and ONLY thing close to mass chaos with regards to a coach of a sports team being fired IMO would be when Jerry Jones fired Tom Landry and buddy, Littrell aint no Landry and them 'Boys went on to win two Super Bowls (with a new coach and new players 🤔).

8 hours ago, NorthTexasSportsNetwork said:

2nd: you gotta pay him out.

Yes - can be negotiated down but this is a fact not worth debating at this point.

If you're on the side of replacing our HC now or ever over the past few seasons as I and many others have been: 

WE REALIZE THIS AND ARE OK WITH THAT!

8 hours ago, NorthTexasSportsNetwork said:

Overreaction for sure, but we still have 10 games left I guess.

The reaction from MANY is from the past few years.

It's not like overnight or after the game yesterday people began to think, "Maybe it's time to go a different direction."

For YEARS now, years, not weeks, not months but it's years now that many on this board have been calling for this.

8 hours ago, NorthTexasSportsNetwork said:

I feel for the players, however. Guys like Jake Roberts, KD Davis, Manase Mose are guys that compete at better schools, but stuck around. 

Simply not wanting a coach fired doesn't give you or anyone the monopoly or moral high ground when it comes to caring about players or student-athletes.

You can still want change in the program and the HC replaced and care about the players - this self-righteous nonsense is pathetic.

TL;DR: OP believes mass chaos will ensue if UNT makes a personnel move, misses the points many on the board have been making for years, attempts to moralize argument with caring about players at the end.

[NT80]

7 hours ago, Hookset said:

I listened to a podcast this summer and Wren stated UNT’s entire coaching budget is $40 million. For comparison SMU is $90 million. He stated sometimes changes are not made in order to afford keeping coaches. 
Example: If Littrell is fired, he gets his buyout, then new football coach gets a well compensated contract and his new assistants as well. There wouldn’t be enough money to keep deserving coaches like McCasland or DeLong. 
This sucks but is a reality. 

It's an excuse.   I'd rather have the players coach themselves than that garbage playcalling we saw last night!

[UNT Texas Hooligan]

8 hours ago, NorthTexasSportsNetwork said:

Well for starters, that would be the dumbest move by Wren Baker ever. To fire someone during the season, it takes a hell of a lot of bad to do that. Why create mass chaos within the university, athletic department, and locker room?

2nd: you gotta pay him out. Let him ride out the mediocrity stint that he has and find a better coach. It’s clear something’s not clicking, but everyone has to be realistic in this situation.

Overreaction for sure, but we still have 10 games left I guess.

I feel for the players, however. Guys like Jake Roberts, KD Davis, Manase Mose are guys that compete at better schools, but stuck around. 

Last night was the definition of mass chaos. It really doesn’t get much lower than that. Many coaches have been fired for way less. It’s pretty obvious the players don’t like or trust the coaches and tbh, some players just aren’t good enough. I think a total shake up is what this program needs and it needs to happen soon. 

[southsideguy]

Seth will be back next year they won't renew his contract-just like Benford.

[Snowy]

It started in 2017, even though we won 9 games, many were by the skin of our teeth. Same thing in 2018. Since then, we haven't gotten the lucky breaks, and at best we are a .500 team. The sample size is pretty big now, there's no more excuses. Littrell must go.

[untjim1995]

17 minutes ago, NT80 said:

It's an excuse.   I'd rather have the players coach themselves than that garbage playcalling we saw last night!

An excuse or a reason….both lead to it being a reality

[Cr1028]

The only reason you don’t fire him during the season js to prevent having an interim coach. The problem with having an interim coach is that you are now forced by the fanbase to consider them as a permanent candidate if they have even marginally better success than the fired HC. 

Imagine last year we fire Littrell and then Bloesch or Mainord took over and led us on the 5 win streak, you really think people would’ve let Wren hire someone else? We need a clean break from the entire staff at season’s end unless a dramatic improvement shocks us all. As of now we know we are far from AAC ready and there is nobody on the current staff that can get us there. We will need new blood that can bring us the players and gameplan to compete at the higher levels of G5 football.

[untjim1995]

17 minutes ago, UNT Texas Hooligan said:

Last night was the definition of mass chaos. It really doesn’t get much lower than that. Many coaches have been fired for way less. It’s pretty obvious the players don’t like or trust the coaches and tbh, some players just aren’t good enough. I think a total shake up is what this program needs and it needs to happen soon. 

Coaches haven’t been fired here for way less, I can promise you that. 

[Green Mean]

8 hours ago, NorthTexasSportsNetwork said:

Well for starters, that would be the dumbest move by Wren Baker ever. To fire someone during the season, it takes a hell of a lot of bad to do that. Why create mass chaos within the university, athletic department, and locker room?

2nd: you gotta pay him out. Let him ride out the mediocrity stint that he has and find a better coach. It’s clear something’s not clicking, but everyone has to be realistic in this situation.

Overreaction for sure, but we still have 10 games left I guess.

[UNT Texas Hooligan]

12 minutes ago, untjim1995 said:

Coaches haven’t been fired here for way less, I can promise you that. 

I know and it’s very Old Denton.Things need to change

[Hookset]

7 hours ago, El Paso Eagle said:

So what you are saying is we mortgaged our program to get into the AAC but now we will be Bottom Feeders and can't truly afford to compete with the existing schools that were there already

Even if we stayed in CUSA Wren has to make unpopular decisions in order to keep the coaches he wants. If he paid Littrell to go away, he wouldn’t have been able to raise the salaries for the coaches he wants (McCasland, DeLong, Mitchell, track coach…). 
Can’t spend money you don’t have.

[El Paso Eagle]

1 minute ago, Hookset said:

Even if we stayed in CUSA Wren has to make unpopular decisions in order to keep the coaches he wants. If he paid Littrell to go away, he wouldn’t have been able to raise the salaries for the coaches he wants (McCasland, DeLong, Mitchell, track coach…). 
Can’t spend money you don’t have.

That problem is even going to widen in CUSA. I believe, and please correct me if I am wrong, the current AAC schools will be getting quite a bit more money than we do. 

[Hookset]

Just now, El Paso Eagle said:

That problem is even going to widen in CUSA. I believe, and please correct me if I am wrong, the current AAC schools will be getting quite a bit more money than we do. 

Yep. And I believe part of the conditions to enter the AAC is we don’t get the TV money for the first year either. 

[NorthTexasSportsNetwork]

Y’all still aren’t seeing the point of this.

Firing a head coach mid season is not worth it, but if y’all want to see a disaster, let’s have SL fired.

[KingDL1]

6 hours ago, untjim1995 said:

@UNTLifer…you told me we had the money and that’s not why SL was still here when I said it was clearly the money that was keeping him here. 
 

Sounds like Wren Baker is saying it’s the money…

We been told at ever level money is not an issue. And the damage it does to the fanbase is also a cost. 

[Travis]

9 minutes ago, NorthTexasSportsNetwork said:

Y’all still aren’t seeing the point of this.

Firing a head coach mid season is not worth it, but if y’all want to see a disaster, let’s have SL fired.

Seems with the new recruiting that more teams are firing sooner than later to get involved in the process as soon as possible. I can’t see how waiting helps with that. 

[Pseudo Nym]

9 minutes ago, NorthTexasSportsNetwork said:

y’all want to see a disaster, let’s have SL fired.

"Mass Chaos" and "Disaster"..... there's a book that talks about that and SL didn't write it, I think you're getting confused.