Assuming everyone is healthy what is your starting UNT '22 lineup?

[MeanGreenTexan]

1 hour ago, Cr1028 said:

I agree Ruder’s chances aren’t good. I doubt Littrell expected to get a transfer as high profile as Gunnell when he asked Aune to come back. If Aune starts it will be because he is vastly improved or because it was losing our top 3 receivers that made him look bad last year. I doubt either of those and have my money on Gunnel as the day 1 starter.

My only hold-up on naming Gunnell Day-1 starter is that this very same scenario unfolded last offseason with Ruder, Littrell rushed him in, & he bombed.   
So, even if Gunnell is leaps & bounds better than Ruder was when he got here, you know the saying:  "Fool me once, shame on you, fool me twice, shame on me".   Littrell might feel like he wants to give the known guy a chance to keep the job instead of rushing the new guy in again.    I guess we'll see.

[Tom McKrackin]

Ok so without any question Gunnell is the top rated and top performing at the highest level QB we have ever had here.   The fact that we have fans trying to discuss scenarios where he would not come in and immediately start just blows my mind.  Guys, Gunnell is our day one starter period!  There is no question and I promise you he absolutely did not transfer here for any other reason.

Littrell needs to stop with the bullshit around who is the guy.  He's been playing that game the whole time he's been here and it's not fair to the kids who come here to play QB.  A great example is Kason Martin, he should have never been told that he had a chance here to play.  Name your day one starter and be honest about it.  The players, parents and fans appreciate honesty. 

[UNTLifer]

2 hours ago, MeanGreenTexan said:

He has a family and needs to start making money to support them.  

Kid's a millionaire.

[MeanGreenTexan]

11 minutes ago, Tom McKrackin said:

Ok so without any question Gunnell is the top rated and top performing at the highest level QB we have ever had here.   The fact that we have fans trying to discuss scenarios where he would not come in and immediately start just blows my mind.  Guys, Gunnell is our day one starter period!  There is no question and I promise you he absolutely did not transfer here for any other reason.

Littrell needs to stop with the bullshit around who is the guy.  He's been playing that game the whole time he's been here and it's not fair to the kids who come here to play QB.  A great example is Kason Martin, he should have never been told that he had a chance here to play.  Name your day one starter and be honest about it.  The players, parents and fans appreciate honesty. 

If I could give this a million downvotes I would.

 

Both of these dudes would whip Gunnell.   Get outta here with that BS.

[greenminer]

2 hours ago, MeanGreenTexan said:

I don't think Aune just chose to come back on his own without any input from coaches.   He has a family and needs to start making money to support them.   Instead, he chose to return.  He had to have the coaches' backing.   Then, adding not one, but 3 QB transfers this offseason...  just not good optics when looking at Ruder's chances.    And, from everything we've been hearing from Spring Practice, it sounds like Aune has a strangle-hold on QB1.   I will be surprised if he doesn't start!

With zero insight in Aune's mind, I can speak with confidence that some athletes really struggle to let their sport go.  They have not equipped themselves - emotionally or whatever - to be ready to embrace the next phase of their life.

[Cr1028]

46 minutes ago, MeanGreenTexan said:

My only hold-up on naming Gunnell Day-1 starter is that this very same scenario unfolded last offseason with Ruder, Littrell rushed him in, & he bombed.   
So, even if Gunnell is leaps & bounds better than Ruder was when he got here, you know the saying:  "Fool me once, shame on you, fool me twice, shame on me".   Littrell might feel like he wants to give the known guy a chance to keep the job instead of rushing the new guy in again.    I guess we'll see.

Yea but weren’t Kevin Sumlin and Seth Littrell both Kevin Wilson guys? Shouldn’t Gunnels have a little familiarity with the system from his time with Sumlin?  Not only that, he started the 4th game of his true freshman season against the UCLA Bruins and won while throwing for 352 yards in that first collegiate start.

Gunnels isn’t Ruder who played in mop up duty and threw for a whopping 91 yards in his 3 year UNC career. You keep acting like this is the same guy as Ruder or Alec Morris but those guys never started a collegiate game before coming to Denton. Gunnell has been there and done that.

[MGNation92]

No matter the QB we're gonna be okay because we have a QB coach who excels in zone blocking schemes teaching them high low progressions. What could go wrong?

[Cr1028]

18 minutes ago, MeanGreenTexan said:

Both of these dudes would whip Gunnell.   Get outta here with that BS.

Whip him at what? You haven’t even seen the man in a Mean Green jersey yet.

[MeanGreenTexan]

31 minutes ago, Cr1028 said:

Yea but weren’t Kevin Sumlin and Seth Littrell both Kevin Wilson guys? Shouldn’t Gunnels have a little familiarity with the system from his time with Sumlin?  Not only that, he started the 4th game of his true freshman season against the UCLA Bruins and won while throwing for 352 yards in that first collegiate start.

Gunnels isn’t Ruder who played in mop up duty and threw for a whopping 91 yards in his 3 year UNC career. You keep acting like this is the same guy as Ruder or Alec Morris but those guys never started a collegiate game before coming to Denton. Gunnell has been there and done that.

Littrell doesn't run that offense anymore.  It's Briles' offense now.

And excuses are long.   I'm glad Gunnell has experience at Arizona.  That will absolutely serve him well.   I'm glad he wasn't a turnover machine there, but I don't have a clue about why Arizona was so atrocious under Sumlin.  Maybe subpar QB play played a role?  

Facts are: Gunnell transferred to Memphis after Sumlin was canned, and now he can't beat Henigan for his job at a 6-6 Memphis team, even with that experience at Arizona.   So, he needed to find another place to get PT or he would be in line to be the "mop up" guy, as you say, at Memphis this year.   Enter North Texas, who is obviously hurting for high-level QB play.    We have "good" QB play now.  We need "great".  

And remember the reason Ruder was available to us last year wasn't because he was going to go 571yds/3TD/5INT/54%comp....  It was because he was just stuck behind a Heisman caliber QB and couldn't get on the field.   He is the real deal.... yadda, yadda, yadda.   We've heard it before.

We'll see if Gunnell can beat Aune.  I'm not gonna crown him now. 

 

43 minutes ago, Cr1028 said:

Whip him at what? You haven’t even seen the man in a Mean Green jersey yet.

At being the "top performing at the highest level QB we've ever had around here".   I haven't seen him, but I've seen several like him.    Like I said,  ...Show me.

[BillySee58]

1 hour ago, MeanGreenTexan said:

My only hold-up on naming Gunnell Day-1 starter is that this very same scenario unfolded last offseason with Ruder, Littrell rushed him in, & he bombed.   
So, even if Gunnell is leaps & bounds better than Ruder was when he got here, you know the saying:  "Fool me once, shame on you, fool me twice, shame on me".   Littrell might feel like he wants to give the known guy a chance to keep the job instead of rushing the new guy in again.    I guess we'll see.

I think we need to stop making it seem like Ruder failed because he was “rushed.” He didn’t have to be lights out by the SMU game. He was given time and by game 4 he started 3-10 for 13 yards, more than 4 months after he got to Denton. 

We’re talking about guys in their 4th year of college like Ruder was last year and Gunnell will be this year. 4 months of learning an offense that doesn’t have a ton of plays or read progressions, and 4 games under their belt, if they are still struggling and not showing signs of progress, that says more about the player than them being rushed IMO. 

[BillySee58]

15 minutes ago, MeanGreenTexan said:

Littrell doesn't run that offense anymore.  It's Briles' offense now.

And excuses are long.   I'm glad Gunnell has experience at Arizona.  That will absolutely serve him well.   I'm glad he wasn't a turnover machine there, but I don't have a clue about why Arizona was so atrocious under Sumlin.  Maybe subpar QB play played a role?  

Facts are: Gunnell transferred to Memphis after Sumlin was canned, and now he can't beat Henigan for his job at a 6-6 Memphis team, even with that experience at Arizona.   So, he needed to find another place to get PT or he would be in line to be the "mop up" guy, as you say, at Memphis this year.   Enter North Texas, who is obviously hurting for high-level QB play.    We have "good" QB play now.  We need "great".  

https://www.actionnews5.com/2021/09/09/tigers-gunnell-set-surgery/

Reports were that Gunnell was running with the 1st huddle before he injured his Achilles. Henigan had an amazing true freshman season. There is a huge margin between Henigan and what we have been rolling out. Not that hard to see him falling in between there. 

[MeanGreenTexan]

15 minutes ago, BillySee58 said:

I think we need to stop making it seem like Ruder failed because he was “rushed.” He didn’t have to be lights out by the SMU game. He was given time and by game 4 he started 3-10 for 13 yards, more than 4 months after he got to Denton. 

We’re talking about guys in their 4th year of college like Ruder was last year and Gunnell will be this year. 4 months of learning an offense that doesn’t have a ton of plays or read progressions, and 4 games under their belt, if they are still struggling and not showing signs of progress, that says more about the player than them being rushed IMO. 

Yeah, but this schedule is not backloaded with wins like last season.  NT can't afford the slow start like we did last season.   
This year, some of the most winnable games are very early.   Gunnell is going to have to wrestle the job away from a guy I would think Littrell (and even Bloesch) trust... however far.   I don't think he just struts in with his Arizona highlight tape and starts day-1 like some folks seem to think.

So, does Littrell roll the dice again throwing a relatively new guy out there ahead of the guy who has actually gotten the job done, somewhat, for those must-win early games?

[Mean Green 93-98]

2 hours ago, Wag Tag said:

With the addition of Latrell, what are the chances of an empty backfield with 4 wide? We are now stacked with talent in the receiver room! On paper the qb and receiver group are the best that I have seen at UNT! I believe the future in these positions will be the transfer portal and not HS.

I don't see it with any kind of frequency.  We started winning games last year once we started leaning heavily on the run game.  We may be stacked in the receiver room, but I still see some uncertainty there, just as I do in the QB room.  Latrell is unproven; Bush was solid-not-spectacular last year for the short time he was healthy.  If Oscar is back and healthy, I see us leaning heavily on the run, at least in the early part of the season.

Now if the passing game really starts clicking, who knows where we'll go from there?  For all the concerns about Littrell that have been addressed here on this board, one thing he does pretty well is play to our strengths.  If the passing game is where we're getting yards and touchdowns, we'll see more ways of using that area of strength.

[GrandGreen]

5 hours ago, Wag Tag said:

With the addition of Latrell, what are the chances of an empty backfield with 4 wide? We are now stacked with talent in the receiver room! On paper the qb and receiver group are the best that I have seen at UNT! I believe the future in these positions will be the transfer portal and not HS.

Also have a potentially very good number of running backs.

Don't see many empty backfield formations for NT. 

The threat of a run and having at least one blocker in the backfield, who can also drift out for the occasionally pass seems a better gameplan.  

[MeanGreenTexan]

18 hours ago, GrandGreen said:

Also have a potentially very good number of running backs.

Don't see many empty backfield formations for NT. 

The threat of a run and having at least one blocker in the backfield, who can also drift out for the occasionally pass seems a better gameplan.  

Right.   
Virtually all offensive plays will originate in a 10 (which still gets you 4 wide), or mainly 11 (which will get Gumms &/or Roberts in) personnel formation.   The RB may flex out every once in a while, but there will only be maybe a handful of plays per game with 01 or 02 personnel.

[Cr1028]

22 hours ago, MeanGreenTexan said:

And remember the reason Ruder was available to us last year wasn't because he was going to go 571yds/3TD/5INT/54%comp....  It was because he was just stuck behind a Heisman caliber QB and couldn't get on the field.   He is the real deal.... yadda, yadda, yadda.   We've heard it before.

I was against that narrative  because he wasn’t stuck behind Sam Howell; he was stuck behind Sam Howell and a younger player named Jacolby Criswell that passed him on the depth chart.

@GOMeanGOwas the one trumpeting the “he was at UNC so he should be the instant starter at your inferior school” business. I didn’t believe that, if he had played meaningful minutes like Gunnell, maybe I would’ve been more persuaded.

Edited May 18, 2022 by Cr1028

[UNTLifer]

1 hour ago, Cr1028 said:

I was against that narrative  because he wasn’t stuck behind Sam Howell; he was stuck behind Sam Howell and a younger player named Jacolby Criswell that passed him on the depth chart.

@GOMeanGOwas the one trumpeting the “he was at UNC so he should be the instant starter at your inferior school” business. I didn’t believe that, if he had played meaningful minutes like Gunnell, maybe I would’ve been more persuaded.

One poster, don't recall who and am not researching it, stated he was stuck behind a Heisman candidate and future 1st round draft pick.

Heisman voting: Howell didn't make the Top Ten that included five QB's.

NFL Draft:  Not quite a first rounder, Howell was picked to open the 5th round.

 

Either way, I am still holding out hope for Rudder.  Not sure why, but I just feel the young man has something and just needs to realize a little success and he will be on his way.

[NorthTexasSportsNetwork]

I’m late to this, but here is what I have:

QB: Gunnell

RB: Ragsdale/Adaway split snaps

WR1: Maclin 2nd string: Burns

WR2: Shorter 2nd string: Bush

HB: Gumms

TE: Roberts

LT: Brown

LG: Blair

C Mose

RG Carroll (him and Mose could switch)

RT: Duncan (Moreka is a really close option, he sometimes switches)

DEFENSE:

DE: Trieb

NT: Brown

DT: Jackson

MIKE: KD Davis (out for a while but when healthy the captain)

WILL: Wood

EAGLE: Whitlock 

DEVIL: Faulkner (hybrid)

CB: Davis

S: Crosby

S: Nawaasah (West is a close call too)

CB: Gaddie (injured back half of spring but when healthy he’s better at CB)

Wilson and Williams  are 2 players that I expect to see the field a lot in rotations, which they did in spring.

Kropp should see time along with Nixon, depending on how healthy KD is.

Gumms was, once again, a beast from what I saw. I said it last fall, he is gonna be a huge impact in the run game and overall blocking game with his size he’s put on.

I was tempted to put Aune as first string since I’ve yet to see Gunnell in action (practice wise) for UNT but I have faith.

Neville will have to really stand out in the fall.

Caleb Johnson is an interesting name that I didn’t see that much in spring. Possibly on the move, position wise?

It’s tough for me to solely put Adaway as RB, even if healthy, recovering from his gruesome knee injury is really tough. He is expected to possibly get some light action in fall, but I’m not 100% sure on that until I see it in person.

 

A lot of questions marks, especially on defense. But this is a solid depth chart.

Edited May 18, 2022 by NorthTexasSportsNetwork

[NorthTexasSportsNetwork]

On 5/17/2022 at 10:03 AM, MeanGreenTexan said:

If I could give this a million downvotes I would.

 

Both of these dudes would whip Gunnell.   Get outta here with that BS.

Riley Dodge wouldn’t get close. Gunnell actually had decent numbers in the Pac 12 against WAY better defenses than Dodge faced in the Sun Belt. Gunnell also has a better coach…

[MeanGreen22]

On 5/17/2022 at 9:24 AM, MeanGreenTexan said:

My only hold-up on naming Gunnell Day-1 starter is that this very same scenario unfolded last offseason with Ruder, Littrell rushed him in, & he bombed.   
So, even if Gunnell is leaps & bounds better than Ruder was when he got here, you know the saying:  "Fool me once, shame on you, fool me twice, shame on me".   Littrell might feel like he wants to give the known guy a chance to keep the job instead of rushing the new guy in again.    I guess we'll see.

Valid points. I think the best counterpoint is that Gunnell has 12 games under his belt. Started as a freshman in the PAC-12. If he’s healthy, it feels like he’s the starter.

[MeanGreenTexan]

2 hours ago, NorthTexasSportsNetwork said:

Riley Dodge wouldn’t get close. Gunnell actually had decent numbers in the Pac 12 against WAY better defenses than Dodge faced in the Sun Belt. Gunnell also has a better coach…

We'll see.  Dodge went first.  The bar is set.   And statistically, it's very, very low because we all know about that HC's tenure.    Even Aune has already cleared most of them (comp% looks to be a tough hurdle).   But considering the supporting cast, Riley was one of the best I've seen in my time following the team.

Gunnell also certainly does NOT have a better QBs coach than Todd Dodge.   It's important to differentiate HC Todd Dodge with QB-whispering Todd Dodge.   Unfortunately, Gunnell's QB coach is an OL coach.

[Cr1028]

3 hours ago, MeanGreenTexan said:

We'll see.  Dodge went first.  The bar is set.   And statistically, it's very, very low because we all know about that HC's tenure.    Even Aune has already cleared most of them (comp% looks to be a tough hurdle).   But considering the supporting cast, Riley was one of the best I've seen in my time following the team.

Gunnell also certainly does NOT have a better QBs coach than Todd Dodge.   It's important to differentiate HC Todd Dodge with QB-whispering Todd Dodge.   Unfortunately, Gunnell's QB coach is an OL coach.

To this day Riley Dodge is still the most accurate quarterback we have ever had by completion percentage.

[97and03]

19 hours ago, NorthTexasSportsNetwork said:

I’m late to this, but here is what I have:

QB: Gunnell

RB: Ragsdale/Adaway split snaps

WR1: Maclin 2nd string: Burns

WR2: Shorter 2nd string: Bush

HB: Gumms

TE: Roberts

LT: Brown

LG: Blair

C Mose

RG Carroll (him and Mose could switch)

RT: Duncan (Moreka is a really close option, he sometimes switches)

DEFENSE:

DE: Trieb

NT: Brown

DT: Jackson

MIKE: KD Davis (out for a while but when healthy the captain)

WILL: Wood

EAGLE: Whitlock 

DEVIL: Faulkner (hybrid)

CB: Davis

S: Crosby

S: Nawaasah (West is a close call too)

CB: Gaddie (injured back half of spring but when healthy he’s better at CB)

Wilson and Williams  are 2 players that I expect to see the field a lot in rotations, which they did in spring.

Kropp should see time along with Nixon, depending on how healthy KD is.

Gumms was, once again, a beast from what I saw. I said it last fall, he is gonna be a huge impact in the run game and overall blocking game with his size he’s put on.

I was tempted to put Aune as first string since I’ve yet to see Gunnell in action (practice wise) for UNT but I have faith.

Neville will have to really stand out in the fall.

Caleb Johnson is an interesting name that I didn’t see that much in spring. Possibly on the move, position wise?

It’s tough for me to solely put Adaway as RB, even if healthy, recovering from his gruesome knee injury is really tough. He is expected to possibly get some light action in fall, but I’m not 100% sure on that until I see it in person.

 

A lot of questions marks, especially on defense. But this is a solid depth chart.

I forget which position between Eagle and Devil was the more of a rush position one of the twins had but I don’t see Faulkner or Whitlock in that role. If anything they would be competing for Davis’ former role. The configuration you laid out looks to be almost like a 3-2-6 formation. I think that position is more likely to be a mobile DE or big LB. The other more of a safety. 

[MeanGreenTexan]

1 hour ago, 97and03 said:

I forget which position between Eagle and Devil was the more of a rush position one of the twins had but I don’t see Faulkner or Whitlock in that role. If anything they would be competing for Davis’ former role. The configuration you laid out looks to be almost like a 3-2-6 formation. I think that position is more likely to be a mobile DE or big LB. The other more of a safety. 

"Devil" is the hybrid OLB/DE.
"Eagle" is the hybrid OLB/S.

[UNTLifer]

22 hours ago, NorthTexasSportsNetwork said:

I’m late to this, but here is what I have:

QB: Gunnell

RB: Ragsdale/Adaway split snaps

WR1: Maclin 2nd string: Burns

WR2: Shorter 2nd string: Bush

HB: Gumms

TE: Roberts

LT: Brown

LG: Blair

C Mose

RG Carroll (him and Mose could switch)

RT: Duncan (Moreka is a really close option, he sometimes switches)

DEFENSE:

DE: Trieb

NT: Brown

DT: Jackson

MIKE: KD Davis (out for a while but when healthy the captain)

WILL: Wood

EAGLE: Whitlock 

DEVIL: Faulkner (hybrid)

CB: Davis

S: Crosby

S: Nawaasah (West is a close call too)

CB: Gaddie (injured back half of spring but when healthy he’s better at CB)

Wilson and Williams  are 2 players that I expect to see the field a lot in rotations, which they did in spring.

Kropp should see time along with Nixon, depending on how healthy KD is.

Gumms was, once again, a beast from what I saw. I said it last fall, he is gonna be a huge impact in the run game and overall blocking game with his size he’s put on.

I was tempted to put Aune as first string since I’ve yet to see Gunnell in action (practice wise) for UNT but I have faith.

Neville will have to really stand out in the fall.

Caleb Johnson is an interesting name that I didn’t see that much in spring. Possibly on the move, position wise?

It’s tough for me to solely put Adaway as RB, even if healthy, recovering from his gruesome knee injury is really tough. He is expected to possibly get some light action in fall, but I’m not 100% sure on that until I see it in person.

 

A lot of questions marks, especially on defense. But this is a solid depth chart.

WR2 is preferable based on my own experiences.

Also, curious about your comment about KD being out for a while.

Edited May 19, 2022 by UNTLifer