ESPN: worst loss of the day

[Marcelo]

Tonight I saw an analyst on ESPN pick UNT as the worst loss of the day. 

 

[PlummMeanGreen]

1 hour ago, Marcelo said:

Tonight I saw an analyst on ESPN pick UNT as the worst loss of the day. 

 

This team has caught the imagination of many fans across America.  
Hell!  Even author Stephen King was on the Mean Green bandwagon after we beat #20 ranked Purdue in last year’s March Madness. Remember reading his tweet? 

[GMG_Dallas]

This is why media perception is so frustrating. Since C-USA is viewed as a weak conference, there's no room for error even as a 6 point loss. Meanwhile, number 11 Providence losses by 27 on the same day and yet ours is the worst loss... BS. UNT's worst loss is by 12 to a projected 2 seed and we'll get snubbed but teams with 30 point losses will get at-large bids.

[CMJ]

1 hour ago, GMG_Dallas said:

This is why media perception is so frustrating. Since C-USA is viewed as a weak conference, there's no room for error even as a 6 point loss. Meanwhile, number 11 Providence losses by 27 on the same day and yet ours is the worst loss... BS. UNT's worst loss is by 12 to a projected 2 seed and we'll get snubbed but teams with 30 point losses will get at-large bids.

I mean, Providence was a 3 or 4 seed or so going into yesterday.  They're not gonna drop out of the tourney entirely.

 

 

[Tom McKrackin]

I don’t sense we have even begun to deal with the ramifications of this loss.  We will have to go through some things to get through this.

[Mean Green Matt]

3 minutes ago, Tom McKrackin said:

I don’t sense we have even begun to deal with the ramifications of this loss.  We will have to go through some things to get through this.

What does this mean?

[GMG_Dallas]

33 minutes ago, CMJ said:

I mean, Providence was a 3 or 4 seed or so going into yesterday.  They're not gonna drop out of the tourney entirely.

 

 

Yeah I get that hence where the problem lies. They were a 3 or 4 and we were a 11 or 12 with AQ with about the same record. You've got teams getting in with an at-large with 10+ losses and/or 30 point losses yet a mid-major with their biggest loss being by 12 to Kansas and less than 10 losses can't get a ticket to the dance.

[Mean Green Matt]

Just now, GMG_Dallas said:

Yeah I get that hence where the problem lies. They were a 3 or 4 and we were a 11 or 12 with AQ with about the same record. You've got teams getting in with an at-large with 10+ losses and/or 30 point losses yet a mid-major with their biggest loss being by 12 to Kansas and less than 10 losses can't get a ticket to the dance.

What do you think our record would have been playing in the Big East?

[GMG_Dallas]

2 minutes ago, Mean Green Matt said:

What do you think our record would have been playing in the Big East?

Conference or total? 

[RiseUNT]

4 minutes ago, Mean Green Matt said:

What do you think our record would have been playing in the Big East?

Before or after we get Big  East money?

[Mean Green Matt]

Just now, GMG_Dallas said:

Conference or total? 

Either one. We’d be nowhere near .500 in conference playing the same schedule that Providence had to play. And they won that conference. That’s why they are a 3 or 4 seed. 

[CMJ]

They also had a tougher schedule.  Look, I love the Mean Green, but we weren't worthy of a 3 or 4 seed heading into yesterday.  Should we get in the Big Dance?  Probably, yes.  We had a helluva season and showed last season we can play with a Top 20 school.  The border between who is in and out is so small in the NCAAs though.  Like I said last night it's only 20% of all of D1 basketball, and numerous spots are given to conference champs who aren't really one of the best 68 teams in the country (I'm not saying the MEAC champ shouldn't be there btw, just that it cuts down for quality at large teams).  Really, it's only probably the top 50-55 schools with the rest being the weak league champs.  So that REALLY makes it that that much tougher to get in.

[RiseUNT]

If Big East gets more than half their teams in and MWC gets 4 teams in while CUSA is a one bid league I will be upset.

Edited March 12, 2022 by RiseUNT

[El Paso Eagle]

5 minutes ago, Mean Green Matt said:

Either one. We’d be nowhere near .500 in conference playing the same schedule that Providence had to play. And they won that conference. That’s why they are a 3 or 4 seed. 

But you assumed if we were in the Big East we would have the same players that we have.

[Mean Green Matt]

Just now, El Paso Eagle said:

But you assumed if we were in the Big East we would have the same players that we have.

This is a discussion about this year and who is deserving of what. Big East money or hypothetical recruiting are irrelevant to that. 

[emmitt01]

10 minutes ago, RiseUNT said:

Before or after we get Big  East money?

 

This is the “Power Conference” argument in a nutshell.

Q: Who are the best teams?

A: The top teams in the power conferences

Q: And what makes the power conferences good?

A: The number of ranked teams

Q: And why are they ranked

A: Because of all the power conference teams they play and beat

Q: But how do you know the teams they beat were good? 
 

A: Because they play in a power conference

Q: And what makes a power conference good?  

A: See answer above

Edited March 12, 2022 by emmitt01

[CMJ]

5 minutes ago, El Paso Eagle said:

But you assumed if we were in the Big East we would have the same players that we have.

Wasn't the question where would THIS team be in the Big East.  Sure we could always play the hypothetical game of we'd get better players, but the question was what would this team's record be - not some scenario where we've played in the BE for the last dozen years.

[GMG_Dallas]

2 minutes ago, Mean Green Matt said:

Either one. We’d be nowhere near .500 in conference playing the same schedule that Providence had to play. And they won that conference. That’s why they are a 3 or 4 seed. 

I'll disagree on conference record. CUSA has pulled an upset every NCAA tournament since 2015 but one. At some point, the conference deserves to be recognized as a decent conference. Of course when you only let 1 team in, the odds of a team from CUSA making it deep are slim. I understand some midmajor conferences are weaker than others but when a specific conference regularly pulls off upsets, are they really upsets or is the conference better than what you give it credit for?

To answer your question, I think UNT this year would finish around 12-7, what Creighton finished, in conference record.

And yes, they win their conference and finish 3rd or 4th in seeding despite two 28-point losses and an 18 point loss. I think they have a good team but those are some pretty big losses yet they seemingly have no impact on their seeding.

[GMG_Dallas]

12 minutes ago, CMJ said:

They also had a tougher schedule.  Look, I love the Mean Green, but we weren't worthy of a 3 or 4 seed heading into yesterday.  Should we get in the Big Dance?  Probably, yes.  We had a helluva season and showed last season we can play with a Top 20 school.  The border between who is in and out is so small in the NCAAs though.  Like I said last night it's only 20% of all of D1 basketball, and numerous spots are given to conference champs who aren't really one of the best 68 teams in the country (I'm not saying the MEAC champ shouldn't be there btw, just that it cuts down for quality at large teams).  Really, it's only probably the top 50-55 schools with the rest being the weak league champs.  So that REALLY makes it that that much tougher to get in.

Yeah it's a love-hate relationship for me. I love that it's tough to get invites as an at-large. Makes getting in that much sweeter. I don't want it to be like football where everybody gets a bowl game, even at 5-7. I'm just asking for a bit more fairness in multi-bid conferences.

In soccer, FIFA will add or remove bids to a continent that is performing poorly in their international competitions. C-USA keeps pulling off first round upsets yet gets no love.

[CMJ]

Yeah, our record in the Big Dance the last ten years or so merits consideration of more love for sure.

 

On the same token, one can say that they don't even give some power leagues the benefit of the doubt.  Last season the Pac 12 got three teams into the Elite 8, and right now they're projected to get three in total into the entire field.

Edited March 12, 2022 by CMJ

[RiseUNT]

14 minutes ago, CMJ said:

Wasn't the question where would THIS team be in the Big East.  Sure we could always play the hypothetical game of we'd get better players, but the question was what would this team's record be - not some scenario where we've played in the BE for the last dozen years.

All those teams coming down to Denton to play? Our style of play shows it travels well. So I actually like our chances with this team.

[GMG_Dallas]

12 minutes ago, emmitt01 said:

 

This is the “Power Conference” argument in a nutshell.

Q: Who are the best teams?

A: The top teams in the power conferences

Q: And what makes the power conferences good?

A: The number of ranked teams

Q: And why are they ranked

A: Because of all the power conference teams they play and beat

Q: But how do you know the teams they beat were good? 
 

A: Because they play in a power conference

Q: And what makes a power conference good?  

A: See answer above

And then the media is shocked when a power conference, say the BIG 10, has 8 of their 9 teams knocked out in the first two rounds last year (including a play-in game). But because one of their two number 1 seeds make it to the Elite Eight, they're justified in getting 9 bids. Never mind the fact that they had a number 1, two number 2, and a number 4 seed all get booted in their first 2 rounds. And they'll probably get another 6+ bids this year.

[CMJ]

Actually I do too.  I don't think we'd challenge for the league title, but we'd be pretty competitive in the Big East with this season's team.  Even if we were like Butler, this season - look at the scores...the Bulldogs lost a lot of really close games.  They may have finished 10th, but they were a solid team.  Usually even the bottom of the league squads are pretty salty in the Big East, so it's tough to know where we'd stack up.  I know we wouldn't be blown out every night though.  We can play with just about anyone.

[GMG_Dallas]

20 minutes ago, CMJ said:

Yeah, our record in the Big Dance the last ten years or so merits consideration of more love for sure.

 

On the same token, one can say that they don't even give some power leagues the benefit of the doubt.  Last season the Pac 12 got three teams into the Elite 8, and right now they're projected to get three in total into the entire field.

Not so much "our" record but our conference's record. Pulling an upset every season since 2015 but one should warrant consideration for an extra bid. This isn't the same program regularly pulling off upsets either. CUSA has produced good teams recently but gets no appreciation for it.

As it pertains to the Pac 12, I agree that's BS. Meanwhile, the Big 10 still is projected to have 9 teams.

[CMJ]

I used "we" as in the Royal we.  You know, the editorial.

Edited March 12, 2022 by CMJ