Promotions - Getting DFW to The Super Pit

greenminer · January 30, 2022

Hypothetical. Hoping for some fresh ideas. Hoping we can maybe inspire our AD to find something effective.

let's say you had 5+ million dollars to spend on getting DFW to The Super Pit. We don't have that, but I want you to think big anyways. What would you do?

Buy out massive radio time?
Send our staff for appearances on every local news station?
A huge social media campaign?
Some kind of traveling showcase, maybe arrange pickup games around local high schools, using 1 or 2 starters from the team?
Do something at a Stars/Mavs/Rangers/Cowboys game?

...I'm just throwing this out there. I'm sure COVID is playing a role in the low-numbers but man! we have to solve this Denton/DFW attendance problem.

That's what it is: a problem. Not a riddle. not a mystery or an inconvenience. If you want to keep Coach McCasland in Denton, this low attendance crap is a problem.

Edited January 30, 2022 by greenminer

CMJ · January 30, 2022

I do think Covid is part of it. Not sure how much, but it's part. But I know in some of JJ's good years we were averaging at least a thousand more a game than this squad, coming off of the Purdue win, is. So, SOMETHING has to be part of that reason.

As far as spending time/money goes - I'm not a marketing guy. But I do think if there was a concerted effort....and I mean literally a staff of hundreds of volunteers going to every business, PTA meeting, American Legion/VFW Hall, church group, rotary club, gardening club, etc, etc. and ask for four to five minutes to hype up the team. Go to the area schools and ask for a 30 minute assembly and sell discounted tickets.

TV and radio help, but I think Denton has shown you need to press the flesh.

southsideguy · January 30, 2022

How about a dunk tank with jones family sitting in the tank? think we could sell out the pit and make us money?

Matt from A700 · January 30, 2022

I think the students and the local residents are the key. Baylor Athletics have been on the rise for 10-15 years, and it's not just students and alumni filling the stadium. Unfortunately, though Denton is also a college town, unlike Baylor we are too close to too many more entertainment options. And we're not in a major conference, so to the casual college student, apparently the high stakes aren't there for us.

In the past, the free semester of tuition handout has resulted in great student attendance (although I think this was during the CBI run).

Can the athletic department work with our other big programs (music, art, film)? Showcase campus bands, art projects in the concourse before and during games, pregame film festival, halftime performance by the UNT Improv Club? To get the non-sports fans to some games? What happened to music students performing the national anthem?

I know the ticket sales department is supposed to be selling halftime performances, but I don't see dog shows drawing in any more people (especially when there's no pre-promotion of it on social media).

Others have mentioned that RA's need to be getting their floors to the game. But there's not as much pride in the dorm floor you live in compared to the frat or sorority you're in (referencing Greek Week). What incentivizes a dorm floor to have more presence than another floor? When I was a freshman at Kerr Hall, my only complaint (besides the S'mores flood) was the scarcity of laundry machines. Maybe the university can spare each week's winning floor some extra flex dollars (if those are still a thing)?

And if the RA's are leading the charge, I'll reiterate what I said in another thread about starting parade lines from Kerr/Greene Hall and Bruce Hall to build up the hype and anticipation to the Pit.

Also, I think digital ticketing has also hurt in another small way. There's no more ticket trailer on the library mall during passing periods. The casual student doesn't know games are usually Thursdays and Saturdays, or that they technically already have tickets for the game (as long as they're signed up for the student ticket app). I think we need to have that ticket trailer presence throughout the week for basketball season.

Going back to my thesis, if you can get more students involved and interested, that of course increases the likelihood they return as alumni, especially if the team is good and getting national attention.

As for the local community, we need to get all of the local club teams and high school teams out here to see that UNT is the real deal. And not just the Denton teams, but reach out to the surrounding smaller towns -- they love getting attention too.

This may be too minor-league, but if you're looking to fill seats, can we get our hands on a mailing list and send vouchers good for 4 free tickets to every residence in Denton? Like the circus does?

NorthTexasSportsNetwork · January 30, 2022

31 minutes ago, CMJ said:

I do think Covid is part of it. Not sure how much, but it's part. But I know in some of JJ's good years we were averaging at least a thousand more a game than this squad, coming off of the Purdue win, is. So, SOMETHING has to be part of that reason.

As far as spending time/money goes - I'm not a marketing guy. But I do think if there was a concerted effort....and I mean literally a staff of hundreds of volunteers going to every business, PTA meeting, American Legion/VFW Hall, church group, rotary club, gardening club, etc, etc. and ask for four to five minutes to hype up the team. Go to the area schools and ask for a 30 minute assembly and sell discounted tickets.

TV and radio help, but I think Denton has shown you need to press the flesh.

Covid is a maybe in this situation. It was mentioned in the game thread, but TCU has 8K+ for their game against Texas and have had great crowds this year. Same with many others.

Of course the, type, of people in the UNT area are more… not sure how you put it without getting banned for bringing up politics, BUT you get my point.

You can definitely take safety measures if you want to.

The student section is growing very well though. Keep trying to get students first, then worry about the other fans. T shirt fans will come because that’s always been the case, but it takes more, especially in this time and age, to get students to come. Not sure why, but that’s what I’ve noticed.

CMJ · January 30, 2022

25 minutes ago, NorthTexasSportsNetwork said:

Covid is a maybe in this situation. It was mentioned in the game thread, but TCU has 8K+ for their game against Texas and have had great crowds this year. Same with many others.

Of course the, type, of people in the UNT area are more… not sure how you put it without getting banned for bringing up politics, BUT you get my point.

You can definitely take safety measures if you want to.

The student section is growing very well though. Keep trying to get students first, then worry about the other fans. T shirt fans will come because that’s always been the case, but it takes more, especially in this time and age, to get students to come. Not sure why, but that’s what I’ve noticed.

I think Denton is part of it, but explain how we had much better attendance 12-15 years ago with squads that weren't this good (not demeaning some of JJ's better teams, which were a lot of fun and brought tons of joy). Covid has to be part of that equation. It's a calculus with a lot of things factoring in.

GMG_Dallas · January 30, 2022

50 minutes ago, Matt from A700 said:

I think the students and the local residents are the key.

This is all that's needed and frankly, it's all that should be focused on. SMU's website shows an average home attendance of 3,314. Ours shows 3,151. It's tough to draw basketball attendance without being in a major conference and it's not just us. That said, the students alone should be able to fill the Super Pit with ease. Unfortunately, support for UNT athletics is always low amongst students. I went as much as I could when I was at UNT and don't understand why more students don't get their butts in there. You're not going to pull casual people from DFW to get all the way to Denton for a college game mid-Saturday with everything else there is to do and if they wanted to see a college basketball game, SMU or TCU are closer. Judging by SMU's numbers, college basketball is just not a priority event for Dallasites on a Saturday. On Thursdays, that's a heck of a drive in traffic unless you're a die hard fan taking off work. This is me speaking from personal experience. I want to make games but I can't. I work Saturdays and live 65 miles away. I can't make that drive in evening traffic on Thursdays for a 6pm game when my kids have school and get out at 4:15 living 65 miles across DFW. I'm not the only one in this boat. If they want consistent attendance, they have to get it from the students and locals.

Shark84 · January 30, 2022

14 minutes ago, GMG_Dallas said:

This is all that's needed and frankly, it's all that should be focused on. SMU's website shows an average home attendance of 3,314. Ours shows 3,151. It's tough to draw basketball attendance without being in a major conference and it's not just us. That said, the students alone should be able to fill the Super Pit with ease. Unfortunately, support for UNT athletics is always low amongst students. I went as much as I could when I was at UNT and don't understand why more students don't get their butts in there. You're not going to pull casual people from DFW to get all the way to Denton for a college game mid-Saturday with everything else there is to do and if they wanted to see a college basketball game, SMU or TCU are closer. Judging by SMU's numbers, college basketball is just not a priority event for Dallasites on a Saturday. On Thursdays, that's a heck of a drive in traffic unless you're a die hard fan taking off work. This is me speaking from personal experience. I want to make games but I can't. I work Saturdays and live 65 miles away. I can't make that drive in evening traffic on Thursdays for a 6pm game when my kids have school and get out at 4:15 living 65 miles across DFW. I'm not the only one in this boat. If they want consistent attendance, they have to get it from the students and locals.

Talked to La Tech fans yesterday and they don't draw fans either. Announced crowd yesterday was 4k but actually closer to 2700 to 3000.

Green Otaku · January 30, 2022

Organizing the RAs the promote the games in the dorms with a few signs and a group meet up outside their dorms to walk over to the Pit might bring in a few more.

NorthTexasSportsNetwork · January 30, 2022

How on earth is New Mexico State, in a very Covid restricted state, drawing 12,000 while we can’t even hit 4.

Embarrassing

NorthTexasSportsNetwork · January 30, 2022

15 minutes ago, Shark84 said:

Talked to La Tech fans yesterday and they don't draw fans either. Announced crowd yesterday was 4k but actually closer to 2700 to 3000.

It looked like 4,000 to me. A really great atmosphere, whatever the attendance was…

emmitt01 · January 30, 2022

Here’s what I would do. I would advertise the following fact and put it everywhere you could find it. “There are exactly 2 teams in the state of Texas that are currently #1 in their college basketball conference. One of them is in Denton”

GreenN'walinsVet · January 30, 2022

1 hour ago, CMJ said:

I think Denton is part of it, but explain how we had much better attendance 12-15 years ago with squads that weren't this good (not demeaning some of JJ's better teams, which were a lot of fun and brought tons of joy). Covid has to be part of that equation. It's a calculus with a lot of things factoring in.

I am on the side of Covid taking a big chunk of fans out of the equation.
look at the games right before covid hit. There was over 8k for that WKU game…

Pavlovs Eagle · January 30, 2022

1 hour ago, GMG_Dallas said:

On Thursdays, that's a heck of a drive in traffic unless you're a die hard fan taking off work.

People may think this, but for years we methodically leave Central Plano 55-60 mins before our Thursday 7p (and occasional 6p) games and make it to the Pit Parking 10 mins before tip off. I could see it being a bit longer if you're inside of Belt Line Rd or 635, but I'd guess there's enough semi interested alumni in Collin and Denton Counties to fill the Pit 10x over. The problem is I'm not sure some alumni know how good the team is.

I think the Alumni Association not having in person events in Dallas, Ft Worth, and Collin County in 2 years (I think the last Stonebriar CC event was pre-CV19) is starting to take a toll on Mean Green interest. They did a decent job of repping the programs. Also you can't discount how much Littrell has f'ed up interest in BB by having a year over year crappy football performance. Football is a gateway for interest in other sports, especially when alumni interest is so fickle at UNT.

UNT could try brining two tour busses to central spots in Dallas, Ft Worth, Legacy, and McKinney and offer to shuttle fans to Denton prior to the games. Even if they filled half of four 56 passenger buses, that could be 100 more people brought to the pit.

greenminer · January 30, 2022

1 hour ago, NorthTexasSportsNetwork said:

How on earth is New Mexico State, in a very Covid restricted state, drawing 12,000 while we can’t even hit 4.

Embarrassing

UTEP-UNM-NMSU are a gem of southwest basketball tradition. Lots of history there, and with football being such a suckhole, the fans will flock to a 20-win Aggie team.

greenminer · January 30, 2022

@FirefightnRick touched on a great point: if we have an arena that is constantly being hushed instead of pumped, that could be an area for big changes.

Get people hanging onto the edge of their seat: challenge a guy to hit multiple shots within 45-60 seconds, rather than a one-off attempt for a prize.

Get people pumped instead of quieted. Do loud music jams that gets people dancing, instead of promotional trivia that requires people to shut up and listen.

...stuff like this doesn't cost a dime.

Also, might be worth looking for ideas among the minor league baseball circuits. They have been forced to be creative for generations.

Edited January 31, 2022 by greenminer

Cooke County Kid · January 30, 2022

Give away to the students free tuition. Two drawings each game, halftime and end of game for free UNT stuff and at the end of the season pick one name out of the previous winners including that night for one years free tuition.

Keep the students coming for that chance of the tuition. Have a contest between the Greek Organizations to see which one can get the most members there and give them some sort of an award, do it for each game. Get a fast food place to sell discounted tickets with a meal. The ideas should be endless.

GO MEAN GREEN!!!
WIN GAMES!!!

GMG_Dallas · January 30, 2022

1 hour ago, Pavlovs Eagle said:

People may think this, but for years we methodically leave Central Plano 55-60 mins before our Thursday 7p (and occasional 6p) games and make it to the Pit Parking 10 mins before tip off. I could see it being a bit longer if you're inside of Belt Line Rd or 635, but I'd guess there's enough semi interested alumni in Collin and Denton Counties to fill the Pit 10x over.

It's great that you could make that drive. For me, coming from Kaufman County, 1 hour will get me to north dallas at that time of day. And after a long day of work, a causal fan or "simply" alumni is not making that 1 hour drive even if just from Plano. The fans who care about the team know how good they are. If they know how good they are and aren't making it, it's because they can't. Those who aren't making it don't care to know how good they are because it's not their thing. This needs to be about building local fans who can consistently make games and the way to do that is to find the people who it would be easy to make the games. Create new fans. Expose people but to people won't budge on something they don't care about if it's inconvenient. That's local fans you need to get. You aren't going to get somebody who doesn't care about UNT athletics to drive 1 hour in traffic after work to watch a game they don't care about, doesn't matter how many hot dogs you give away.

GMG_Dallas · January 30, 2022

Also, make it easier to get tickets. I have a family of 7. UNT doesn't sell online unless through Stub Hub. I can't buy 7 tickets at once on their site. The max is 6 or 8. So I either need to drive from nearly Terrell to Denton to go to the box office or call/email and give my payment that way. People don't buy stuff that way, it's all online. Not a great way to get casual fans to buy tickets.

ADLER · January 30, 2022

Outside the Super Pit on the night of a huge game

Amazon.com: 4" x 6" Black Rectangle Labels (500 per Roll) : Industrial & Scientific

Outside the Super Pit on a night when absolutely nothing is happening Amazon.com: 4" x 6" Black Rectangle Labels (500 per Roll) : Industrial & Scientific

Notice the differences? Neither do potential fans.

Any Questions?

MrAlien · January 30, 2022

The big issue is how to get students to go to the games, many of them live on campus and probably walk right past the Super Pit all the time. I have not noticed any Student groups (not counting the band, maniacs, and cheerleaders) at a game this year. When I was a student, almost every student group or club had a social outing to a game, with some kind of acknowledgement during a time out.

drex · January 30, 2022

If you come from out of town and are a visitor, I challenge you to find the ticket booth on the west side of the coluseum. Pitch black with one pissant window open with about a 50 watt light bulb pouring out faint light. It is hard to see and someone is going to get hurt in the darkness one of these days.

keith · January 30, 2022

Perhaps an unpopular opinion, but I think COVID is an excuse, not a reason. Look around the country. If people *want* to be there, stadiums and arenas are packed.

I’ve been hard on the local Denton population, but have been reconsidering. Assume for a minute if you lived in another college town that you had zero affiliation with. Would you adopt this new university/team as yours or would you not really care and continue to follow your team on air or on-line?

I have no clue about the college demographics of Denton. Is that what’s happening? Sure we have large faculty, staff and employee base, but I suspect they got their undergrad/grad degrees elsewhere. If that was you, would you become a fan of some other U just because you worked there?

I’m sure we could pick up some fringe fans, but we should be laser focused on current students first, alumni second and the casual fan a distant third.

Do whatever is necessary to get students to the games to create experiences and culture that will extend into their alumni years.

Edit: To be clear I'm not referring to individual situations (staying home because you are not feeling well, recently tested positive, high risk categories, etc.). I'm referring to those whose responsibility is to drive attendance at events using covid as the excuse when they fail at their job.

Edited January 31, 2022 by keith

NTXDJ · January 31, 2022

@ADLER makes a good point about the darkness. I haven't been to a game at the Super Pit since '19, but the last one I went to I noticed how dark it was outside. I was hoping that when they updated the exterior that they might install some additional lighting as well. Another thing that would help is to trim or cut down some of the trees surrounding the building. I know trees on a college campus are usually a plus, but when you can't see the entrances for the trees, it's time for a trim.

I don't think it could be done for $5 million, but it would be cool if the DCTA A-Train went up to the campus instead of downtown Denton. Imagine if the train stopped at the parking lot just west of the Super Pit! That would help some of us who live in the Dallas area, but just don't want to mess with the drive up I-35.

Tom McKrackin · January 31, 2022

2 hours ago, NTXDJ said:

@ADLER makes a good point about the darkness. I haven't been to a game at the Super Pit since '19, but the last one I went to I noticed how dark it was outside. I was hoping that when they updated the exterior that they might install some additional lighting as well. Another thing that would help is to trim or cut down some of the trees surrounding the building. I know trees on a college campus are usually a plus, but when you can't see the entrances for the trees, it's time for a trim.

I don't think it could be done for $5 million, but it would be cool if the DCTA A-Train went up to the campus instead of downtown Denton. Imagine if the train stopped at the parking lot just west of the Super Pit! That would help some of us who live in the Dallas area, but just don't want to mess with the drive up I-35.

Agree 100 percent!