One reason to feel confident about the bowl game

[Matt from A700]

Leading into Seth's first 4 bowl games:

2016: Lost 4 of 5, including letting a 3-win UTEP squad hang 52 on us in the regular season finale

2017: Got blown out by FAU for the second time in one year in the conference championship

2018: 5-3 after a 4-0 start including two field-goal victories vs. UTSA and FAU

2020: Lost 2 of 3 and a chance at a winning record (although I don't think many teams got momentum during the Covid season)

 

2021: Won five straight

We are finally playing our best football of the year at the right time. This isn't a thread to debate if Seth should be back or not next year. All I'm saying is that I am staying hopeful for a bowl win this year finally. Hopefully the game is nearby and isn't against a non-CUSA double-digit win G5 conference champion.

[greenminer]

I think there’s a backbone to this team that other SL teams lacked: they seem really tired of losing. Going through some check boxes here:

• sick of losing
• competent DC
• offensive identity. Very strong here
• faith/belief in each other
• playmakers at key positions

something feels different about this team. Like, in a good way.

[Glory to the Green]

54 minutes ago, Matt from A700 said:

Leading into Seth's first 4 bowl games:

2016: Lost 4 of 5, including letting a 3-win UTEP squad hang 52 on us in the regular season finale

2017: Got blown out by FAU for the second time in one year in the conference championship

2018: 5-3 after a 4-0 start including two field-goal victories vs. UTSA and FAU

2020: Lost 2 of 3 and a chance at a winning record (although I don't think many teams got momentum during the Covid season)

 

2021: Won five straight

We are finally playing our best football of the year at the right time. This isn't a thread to debate if Seth should be back or not next year. All I'm saying is that I am staying hopeful for a bowl win this year finally. Hopefully the game is nearby and isn't against a non-CUSA double-digit win G5 conference champion.

Good defense and a strong running game. Late season recipe for winning!

[GrandGreen]

52 minutes ago, Matt from A700 said:

Leading into Seth's first 4 bowl games:

2016: Lost 4 of 5, including letting a 3-win UTEP squad hang 52 on us in the regular season finale

2017: Got blown out by FAU for the second time in one year in the conference championship

2018: 5-3 after a 4-0 start including two field-goal victories vs. UTSA and FAU

2020: Lost 2 of 3 and a chance at a winning record (although I don't think many teams got momentum during the Covid season)

 

2021: Won five straight

We are finally playing our best football of the year at the right time. This isn't a thread to debate if Seth should be back or not next year. All I'm saying is that I am staying hopeful for a bowl win this year finally. Hopefully the game is nearby and isn't against a non-CUSA double-digit win G5 conference champion.

 

Success in Bowl games has so much to do with the competition.   Most NT fans were ecstatic over the UNLV victory despite them being probably the weakest team that got a bowl that year. 

Over half the teams get a bowl game, and obviously over 1/4 of the teams get a win.  It will be very interesting to learn which bowl and what team, NT will draw.  

I actually like NT's chances against any G5 and not top tier P5's.

 

 

[golfingomez]

The most impressive part of this run has been the play of our defensive line. I think opposing coordinators are having trouble figuring out how to stop these guys.

[Cr1028]

13 minutes ago, golfingomez said:

The most impressive part of this run has been the play of our defensive line. I think opposing coordinators are having trouble figuring out how to stop these guys.

Edited November 28, 2021 by Cr1028

[SilverEagle]

1 hour ago, Cr1028 said:

Did Cliff Claven from Cheers have a son?

[Cr1028]

3 minutes ago, SilverEagle said:

Did Cliff Claven from Cheers have a son?

Haha yep, and he is an O-lineman coaching D-line, go figure. I guess maybe we aren’t that mad Bennett hired his son-in-law anymore.

I also saw a very interesting tweet.

 

[MeanGreenTexan]

20 hours ago, Cr1028 said:

Oh wow, you have to be kidding me.

Not only are you going to give Littrell all of the credit for the last 5 weeks...   you're going to give Passwaters credit for DLine play?   Incredible.

 

EDIT:
As for the topic at hand, if NT rolls into the Frisco Bowl against a 6-win MAC team, we're likely going to win.  A huge home crowd, a defense that's clicking, and a ground/pound offense would be a recipe for a good day for the guys in Green!

Edited November 29, 2021 by MeanGreenTexan

[Cr1028]

55 minutes ago, MeanGreenTexan said:

Oh wow, you have to be kidding me.

Not only are you going to give Littrell all of the credit for the last 5 weeks...   you're going to give Passwaters credit for DLine play?   Incredible.

 

EDIT:
As for the topic at hand, if NT rolls into the Frisco Bowl against a 6-win MAC team, we're likely going to win.  A huge home crowd, a defense that's clicking, and a ground/pound offense would be a recipe for a good day for the guys in Green!

Let that hate out Clayton.

I don’t give Littrell “all of the credit” for the last 5 weeks but you sure as hell give him all of the blame for the first 7. As for Passwaters, don’t you think he deserves a little credit? Maybe you were at a UTSA watch party rooting against us on Saturday but in Apogee, where I was, Passwaters was actively engaged with the our DLine throughout the entirety of the game, especially the Murphy twins.

I don’t know what happened to you over the last 3 years but you have really grown to despise the leaders of this program and our success of late actually seems to bring you pain. You have lost all objectivity and have already decided that there is no way this staff can redeem themselves in your eyes. Yea I sound like a Seth fanboy but I’m actually a UNT fanboy that noticed a change in direction over the last 6 weeks. 

At 1-6, RV would’ve fired Littrell because that is the type of shit RV did. RV canned both Dickey and Dodge midseason and we had to deal with the Chico for coach campaign. Wren is not RV and doesn’t do RV things so maybe that makes your line of thinking a little more #olddenton than mine.

[MGNation92]

8 minutes ago, Cr1028 said:

Let that hate out Clayton.

I don’t give Littrell “all of the credit” for the last 5 weeks but you sure as hell give him all of the blame for the first 7. As for Passwaters, don’t you think he deserves a little credit? Maybe you were at a UTSA watch party rooting against us on Saturday but in Apogee, where I was, Passwaters was actively engaged with the our DLine throughout the entirety of the game, especially the Murphy twins.

I don’t know what happened to you over the last 3 years but you have really grown to despise the leaders of this program and our success of late actually seems to bring you pain. You have lost all objectivity and have already decided that there is no way this staff can redeem themselves in your eyes. Yea I sound like a Seth fanboy but I’m actually a UNT fanboy that noticed a change in direction over the last 6 weeks. 

At 1-6, RV would’ve fired Littrell because that is the type of shit RV did. RV canned both Dickey and Dodge midseason and we had to deal with the Chico for coach campaign. Wren is not RV and doesn’t do RV things so maybe that makes your line of thinking a little more #olddenton than mine.

I think his point that you're missing is not that he's dogging coaches, but that the DL group was easily the best unit on the team heading into the season.

The point there is that Passwaters didn't have to do much to have an already stacked group perform up to snuff. He may very well be a great DL coach, but let's see what happens when we lose Novil/Colvin and have to replace that production in the middle. 

Edit: To add to that, Chris Petrilli (who I love, probably my favorite coach on the staff) seems to be the one coaching the DE's or "Devils" as they're called in this defense, which further shows Passwaters may not be doing as much as his title lets on

 

Edited November 29, 2021 by MGNation92

[97and03]

Yes definitely not giving Coach Nepotism much credit for the play of two very experienced starting DTs. Novil was already all-conference. 

[Cr1028]

17 minutes ago, MGNation92 said:

I think his point that you're missing is not that he's dogging coaches, but that the DL group was easily the best unit on the team heading into the season.

The point there is that Passwaters didn't have to do much to have an already stacked group perform up to snuff. He may very well be a great DL coach, but let's see what happens when we lose Novil/Colvin and have to replace that production in the middle. 

By stacked, you mean Novil? He was the only all-conference defender we had last season. At the very least, would you give Passwaters props for not screwing it up? I think the twins have shown tremendous improvement and will be one of the top pass rush duos in all of FBS for the next 2-3 years.

[MGNation92]

3 minutes ago, Cr1028 said:

By stacked, you mean Novil? He was the only all-conference defender we had last season. At the very least, would you give Passwaters props for not screwing it up? I think the twins have shown tremendous improvement and will be one of the top pass rush duos in all of FBS for the next 2-3 years.

I mean yeah. To say he took an all conference DT, and two very clearly improving DE's (whom again, were coached by Petrilli, not him) and made them better? I'd say that's a bit disingenuous. 

So kudos to Passwaters for not making them worse. Let's see how they look next year without Novil taking 2 OL on any given play

Edited November 29, 2021 by MGNation92

[Cr1028]

9 minutes ago, 97and03 said:

Yes definitely not giving Coach Nepotism much credit for the play of two very experienced starting DTs. Novil was already all-conference. 

I’m sure you gave Bloesch the same discount in 2020 when the majority of his starting linemen were redshirt juniors. 

[Cr1028]

18 minutes ago, MGNation92 said:

I mean yeah. To say he took an all conference DT, and two very clearly improving DE's (whom again, were coached by Petrilli, not him) and made them better? I'd say that's a bit disingenuous. 

So kudos to Passwaters for not making them worse. Let's see how they look next year without Novil taking 2 OL on any given play

I’ll concede that Petrilli’s twitter seems to show the twins as part of his group, however, I will stand by my comment that the twins were on the sidelines talking with Passwaters most of the game.

[MeanGreenTexan]

18 minutes ago, Cr1028 said:

...

I don’t know what happened to you over the last 3 years but you have really grown to despise the leaders of this program and our success of late actually seems to bring you pain. You have lost all objectivity
...

I'm still trying to cut through extra stuff to the heart of the matter here.
What happened 3 years ago is well-documented.   The results speak for themselves since then.  I shouldn't have to say anything about them, but here we are.   

What's odd is that I really think I'm actually hanging my hat on my objectivity here.   
There are some folks on here that want to throw away 2.5 years of painful football because we won 5 games against teams with an overall record of 26-34 (and that includes beating 11-1 UTSA!!).   That, to me, seems like maybe you & those folks are the ones without objectivity, basing it more on 'what-have-you-done-for-me-lately?'.

I suppose a key question would be: What is the goal for North Texas Football in your eyes?   I may be wrong, but it seems like your goal is based off of previous regimes, and to me that ship has sailed.  The RV era is gone from the horizon.  We can't see it anymore.  If the bar for you is .500 Football, as Littrell has achieved, then I feel like that bar is too low now.   

Wren has a track record of hiring EXCELLENT coaches.   I'm fairly certain he would do it again, so we can get to the point where we were post McCarney & pre Littrell's flirtation with KSU.  Those feel-good days of 9-win seasons!

[MeanGreenTexan]

56 minutes ago, Cr1028 said:

I’m sure you gave Bloesch the same discount in 2020 when the majority of his starting linemen were redshirt juniors. 

Bloesch took over for the 2nd-worst coaching hire Littrell made while here (congrats Tate Wallis!).  And that's saying a lot with Bowen & Reeder, among others.   I don't think Coach Yellock or Coach Mathies were on that level of Langston-awful.

[Udomann]

15 minutes ago, MeanGreenTexan said:

There are some folks on here that want to throw away 2.5 years of painful football because we won 5 games against teams with an overall record of 26-34 (and that includes beating 11-1 UTSA!!).   That, to me, seems like maybe you & those folks are the ones without objectivity, basing it more on 'what-have-you-done-for-me-lately?'.

That's a real big strawman. I don't think 95% of the folks here want Seth back next year. 

But, The REALITY is he will be here barring any surprise changes. At this point we are accepting the reality, and discussing the best steps forward. Is it a new QB? new WRs? Prettier cheerleaders? Less clowns on the GMG.com?

Seth will be here. We want him to blow the doors off and prove us all wrong. THAT is reality right now. You see failure, only expect failure. and yes, maybe it will be failure

 

At this point, the "burn the whole thing down" bandwagon is just noise. We are 99% stuck with Seth, and yelling louder ain't changing it. I'd rather just ride the high than keep yelling at the clouds.

[golfingomez]

24 minutes ago, Udomann said:

That's a real big strawman. I don't think 95% of the folks here want Seth back next year. 

But, The REALITY is he will be here barring any surprise changes. At this point we are accepting the reality, and discussing the best steps forward. Is it a new QB? new WRs? Prettier cheerleaders? Less clowns on the GMG.com?

Seth will be here. We want him to blow the doors off and prove us all wrong. THAT is reality right now. You see failure, only expect failure. and yes, maybe it will be failure

 

At this point, the "burn the whole thing down" bandwagon is just noise. We are 99% stuck with Seth, and yelling louder ain't changing it. I'd rather just ride the high than keep yelling at the clouds.

never hurts

[ADLER]

23 hours ago, Cr1028 said:

Cliff Clavin?

[Cr1028]

16 minutes ago, MeanGreenTexan said:

I'm still trying to cut through extra stuff to the heart of the matter here.
What happened 3 years ago is well-documented.   The results speak for themselves since then.  I shouldn't have to say anything about them, but here we are.   

What's odd is that I really think I'm actually hanging my hat on my objectivity here.   
There are some folks on here that want to throw away 2.5 years of painful football because we won 5 games against teams with an overall record of 26-34 (and that includes beating 11-1 UTSA!!).   That, to me, seems like maybe you & those folks are the ones without objectivity, basing it more on 'what-have-you-done-for-me-lately?'.

I suppose a key question would be: What is the goal for North Texas Football in your eyes?   I may be wrong, but it seems like your goal is based off of previous regimes, and to me that ship has sailed.  The RV era is gone from the horizon.  We can't see it anymore.  If the bar for you is .500 Football, as Littrell has achieved, then I feel like that bar is too low now.   

Wren has a track record of hiring EXCELLENT coaches.   I'm fairly certain he would do it again, so we can get to the point where we were post McCarney & pre Littrell's flirtation with KSU.  Those feel-good days of 9-win seasons!

The goal for me in this moment is improvement. Long term 8-9 wins consistently is the floor for me. A down year once in a while won’t bother me if we typically finish with 9 wins. Littrell has shown me he is capable of winning 9 per season.

2019 was a bad year, Bodie Reeder was a terrible hire to take over for Harrell. I agree with you, that one is on Littrell.

We disagree on this but I give him and everyone else in college football a pass for last year because it was a mess all the way around.

This year I just wanted improvement on 2019. From UAB all the way up to Liberty I was on the “fire Seth” train wanting to hire Briles (or Carthel if Briles was too much trouble) but as the team started coming together, it seemed to make more financial sense to let the season play out and see if they could show some improvement over 2019. Shockingly, they did. Once we beat UTEP, I was good with giving him another year. I think next season he needs 8 wins to stay here in 2023 on his existing contract. He’d need to win the division at a minimum to get a one-year extension. Wren needs to have a side piece on the line just in case Seth doesn’t get it done. My side piece would be Carthel but yours will be different and that is ok. If he get 5 to 7 wins, we “mutually part ways”. If he wins 4 or less, he gets flat out fired.

I think he is going to do his very best to make the most out of next year’s weaker schedule to get this entire staff hired by a big fish. This would be great for all involved. 

[MeanGreenTexan]

43 minutes ago, Udomann said:

That's a real big strawman. I don't think 95% of the folks here want Seth back next year. 

But, The REALITY is he will be here barring any surprise changes. At this point we are accepting the reality, and discussing the best steps forward. Is it a new QB? new WRs? Prettier cheerleaders? Less clowns on the GMG.com?

Seth will be here. We want him to blow the doors off and prove us all wrong. THAT is reality right now. You see failure, only expect failure. and yes, maybe it will be failure

 

At this point, the "burn the whole thing down" bandwagon is just noise. We are 99% stuck with Seth, and yelling louder ain't changing it. I'd rather just ride the high than keep yelling at the clouds.

I dunno.   We'll see.   I do know we're 99% stuck with Seth through whatever bowl game we get.   We'll have to see what the result of that game is, and whatever coaches remain available at that time to see how it shakes out.
I see failures.  I see successes.   I expect failures.  I expect more successes.  I've been a season ticket holder since the Todd Dodge era, and was a student during the Dickey era.   I've seen 20 years of NT football.   In 2015, when Littrell was announced as the new HC, if you would have told me in 6 years, he would have a .500 record with bowl appearances in 5 of those 6 years, I would be elated with the hire... just based on the circumstances back then.   Things have changed now.

I also see (at least, I think I see) what Smatresk and Baker have planned for our Alma Mater, and it can be so much better than 37-37 over a 6-year span!   Rawlins was a good president, who did a lot of nice things for the University, but I don't know that he planned on getting UNT up to Carnegie Tier1 Research level like Smatresk did.   Our enrollment numbers went up and so did our acceptance levels, meaning we're being more selective on the kinds of students we let in, yet our numbers continue to rise.  This is fantastic leadership from Smatresk.   His vision has UNT as an actual TOP UNIVERSITY in the U.S.!
Athletics-wise, we're seeing conference championships at a clip we've never witnessed around here before.  From the steady Soccer ladies (they'll bounce back, I know it), to now Basketball, Golf, Softball, CC, etc...   The bar is being raised all around at the Athletics Center.  This is fantastic leadership from Baker.   His vision has UNT as an actual TOP ATHLETICS PROGRAM in the U.S.!

If NT wins the bowl game, I don't see any possibility of Littrell being fired.   He'd have the backing of the entire locker room in a very emotionally-charged time.   
But keeping Littrell if we lose the bowl game is a low-odds dice roll, IMO.  He's going to need to identify an actual QBs coach/OC that is somewhat close to Harrell's level (if he can't bring Harrell back, which would be awesome).  That is an absolute MUST.  If he cannot do this, we're doomed to another 6-6 year, or worse.
Defensively, having a year under Bennett's tutelage would be very beneficial for next season's squad.  Does Bennett even hang around after next season though?  If no, then what?   

[rcade]

On 11/28/2021 at 2:03 PM, Cr1028 said:

He looks like every coach I had in the 1980s at Burleson Middle School. I'm having flashbacks to running lines in the gym while Eye of the Tiger plays on loop.

The D line played as epic on Saturday as his stache.

[Cr1028]

20 minutes ago, rcade said:

He looks like every coach I had in the 1980s at Burleson Middle School. I'm having flashbacks to running lines in the gym while Eye of the Tiger plays on loop.

The D line played as epic on Saturday as his stache.

Hahaha, Rogers I think you are probably the funniest dude on this whole message board.