What a weird season

[golfingomez]

3 minutes ago, golfingomez said:

the previous 5 years definitely played into my thoughts, and with that is factored in his overall performance. the man's record stands at 34-37 and like it or not, the barometer is always set by what has come before. if he wins two out of the 3 remaining games, he will be at 36-38, with a solid team returning next year. This is not a case of a head coach simply not wanting to recruit (McCarney, who's last two years in Denton unraveled unbelievably fast), a coach who is couldn't win a game unless he was playing Western Kentucky( It took Dodge 43 games to get to 37 losses, which still baffles me) or a coach who has positioned himself and his team against the school/university (Dickey, who went 5-18 with his hijinx against UNT).

This is also not a team where we think we are positioned to be world beaters next year and just need a change in voice to get us there, this can be a good team(8-9 wins),  but i don't think we could go undefeated, unless there is a miracle of some kind.

I know we aren't going to agree on this issue, but I like Seth and I hope he continues to improve our program, I still think he is trying.

side note, i just looked at the two deep for UTEP, do we seriously only have 7 seniors on the two deep leaving after this year?

[MeanGreenTexan]

2 hours ago, Side.Show.Joe said:

I agree.

And since Seth hasn't beaten a team that finished their season with a winning record since USM in November of 2018 (3 years ago), you are probably more likely to win the lottery.

The new Athletics Center is gonna have a ‘SideShowJoe’s kettle corn station’.  It’s going to be incredible!  No expenses spared.

[greenminer]

1 hour ago, golfingomez said:

the previous 5 years definitely played into my thoughts, and with that is factored in his overall performance. the man's record stands at 34-37 and like it or not, the barometer is always set by what has come before. if he wins two out of the 3 remaining games, he will be at 36-38, with a solid team returning next year. This is not a case of a head coach simply not wanting to recruit (McCarney, who's last two years in Denton unraveled unbelievably fast), a coach who is couldn't win a game unless he was playing Western Kentucky( It took Dodge 43 games to get to 37 losses, which still baffles me) or a coach who has positioned himself and his team against the school/university (Dickey, who went 5-18 with his hijinx against UNT).

This is also not a team where we think we are positioned to be world beaters next year and just need a change in voice to get us there, this can be a good team(8-9 wins),  but i don't think we could go undefeated, unless there is a miracle of some kind.

I know we aren't going to agree on this issue, but I like Seth and I hope he continues to improve our program, I still think he is trying.

Can we agree that this is a really really low bar to set? We are paying this coach a ton of money. IMO we should expect more out of this position.

I think we all believe this can be a good team next year. I’ve seen enough the last 1.5 years to believe this coach won’t find the missing piece(s).

[Cr1028]

1 hour ago, golfingomez said:

side note, i just looked at the two deep for UTEP, do we seriously only have 7 seniors on the two deep leaving after this year?

We are very young, especially on offense.

[golfingomez]

1 minute ago, greenminer said:

Can we agree that this is a really really low bar to set? We are paying this coach a ton of money. IMO we should expect more out of this position.

I think we all believe this can be a good team next year. I’ve seen enough the last 1.5 years to believe this coach won’t find the missing piece(s).

like i said, like it or not, the previous coaches always set the expectations. and while i agree that we are overpaying, there's no getting that horse back in the barn, moving forward we will be paying more for a new coach.

[greenminer]

2 minutes ago, golfingomez said:

like i said, like it or not, the previous coaches always set the expectations. and while i agree that we are overpaying, there's no getting that horse back in the barn, moving forward we will be paying more for a new coach.

I think you’re intentionally overlooking the pay.  Like it or not, pay can and does dictate expectations. Previous coaches are good for context, but I think pay and, on an even higher level, our football budget supersedes that.

[Cr1028]

3 minutes ago, greenminer said:

I think you’re intentionally overlooking the pay.  Like it or not, pay can and does dictate expectations. Previous coaches are good for context, but I think pay and, on an even higher level, our football budget supersedes that.

What would you say about Texas then with their seemingly limitless football budget and failure to meet expectations over the last decade?

Salary plays a role but so does the environment. Kansas could pay Nick Saban $100M per year and it probably wouldn’t make a damn bit of difference. They might pull a Mangino and win 10 games one year but overall they will always suck. We need to be patient. Last year f’d everything up so I don’t even count that year negatively for him. 

It is in our and Seth’s best interest for this to work out. Seth will want to take the first job that offers and we will want to get out of his buyout. We both stand to win in that situation. If we keep wishing him to fail, it will he to our and his detriment.

[UNTLifer]

21 minutes ago, golfingomez said:

like i said, like it or not, the previous coaches always set the expectations. 

I will respectfully disagree.  Those that are successful look at the errors or the past and eliminate those issues.  The bar is not set by the previous coaches.  That is nothing but an excuse to keep on underperforming,

[greenminer]

36 minutes ago, Cr1028 said:

What would you say about Texas then with their seemingly limitless football budget and failure to meet expectations over the last decade?

they have failed to meet expectations

Salary plays a role but so does the environment. Kansas could pay Nick Saban $100M per year and it probably wouldn’t make a damn bit of difference. They might pull a Mangino and win 10 games one year but overall they will always suck. We need to be patient. Last year f’d everything up so I don’t even count that year negatively for him. 

If KU was paying that much, the expectation would be 10 games every year

It is in our and Seth’s best interest for this to work out. Seth will want to take the first job that offers and we will want to get out of his buyout. We both stand to win in that situation. If we keep wishing him to fail, it will he to our and his detriment.

I see what you're getting at, and it seems more about context than expectations.

I stand by my statement: that's a low bar and we need to expect better.  Wren should expect better, and if there is something external/environmental that is preventing possible successes, then he should look into that and fix it.  If it can't be fixed, then we shouldn't be paying this much.

[meangreenbob]

4 hours ago, Cr1028 said:

We are very young, especially on offense.

We’re always very young or whatever excuse we need. 

[Cr1028]

9 hours ago, greenminer said:

I see what you're getting at, and it seems more about context than expectations.

I stand by my statement: that's a low bar and we need to expect better.  Wren should expect better, and if there is something external/environmental that is preventing possible successes, then he should look into that and fix it.  If it can't be fixed, then we shouldn't be paying this much.

I agree with the “we shouldn’t be paying this much”.

[97and03]

13 hours ago, greenminer said:

I can win the lottery every 2-3 years?

Become an FBS head coach. 

[Pavlovs Eagle]

19 hours ago, El Paso Eagle said:

Better question - Is the best we have "well 5 years ago we almost won"?

6 seasons into "New Denton" feels a lot like "Old Denton" to me.

 

[El Paso Eagle]

1 hour ago, Pavlovs Eagle said:

6 seasons into "New Denton" feels a lot like "Old Denton" to me.

 

I am beginning to think we are siting through a bad prequel of "Old Denton"

[El Paso Eagle]

6 hours ago, Cr1028 said:

I agree with the “we shouldn’t be paying this much”.

Maintain the salary pool at a minimum. If you are not having to pay a HC as much then utilize the remaining money to upgrade assistant's salary and raise the levels of those hires. 

[MeanGreenDan]

18 hours ago, golfingomez said:

side note, i just looked at the two deep for UTEP, do we seriously only have 7 seniors on the two deep leaving after this year?

Plus everyone who will jump into the transfer portal as soon as the last whistle blows.

[greenminer]

9 hours ago, 97and03 said:

Become an FBS head coach. 

[Hookset]

On 11/9/2021 at 10:36 AM, golfingomez said:

If we had competent QB play this year, we would be 6-3 right now, most likely

I agree with this statement. Better QB play and healthy wide receivers and we would have beat SMU and LaTech. 
Too many 3 and outs wore down the good efforts of a defense that was learning a new system.

[El Paso Eagle]

1 hour ago, Hookset said:

I agree with this statement. Better QB play and healthy wide receivers and we would have beat SMU and LaTech. 
Too many 3 and outs wore down the good efforts of a defense that was learning a new system.

A good group of receivers can make an average QB look good. A good QB can make average receivers look good. This year with injuries and our QB's it seems we have average (being kind) at both. Our RB's are doing well. Just think how much better if they opposing Defenses had to worry about our passing game.

 

[UNT Mean Green]

9 hours ago, Hookset said:

I agree with this statement. Better QB play and healthy wide receivers and we would have beat SMU and LaTech. 
Too many 3 and outs wore down the good efforts of a defense that was learning a new system.

 

8 hours ago, El Paso Eagle said:

A good group of receivers can make an average QB look good. A good QB can make average receivers look good. This year with injuries and our QB's it seems we have average (being kind) at both. Our RB's are doing well. Just think how much better if they opposing Defenses had to worry about our passing game.

 

Absolutely.

[Side.Show.Joe]

On 11/9/2021 at 8:48 PM, MeanGreenTexan said:

The new Athletics Center is gonna have a ‘SideShowJoe’s kettle corn station’.  It’s going to be incredible!  No expenses spared.

Ha! You know I got to get my kettle corn at every game.