Is the MWC Better for UNT

[Hookset]

Just wondering if this is what is best for UNT. I have read a few articles about G5’s re-organizing into more regional conferences in order to save money on travel expenses for all sports (we never will have a tv contract that will offset the costs). Also encourages rival games from schools within driving distance. 
UNT hasn’t dominated CUSA in football but moving to a better conference will change that for the better???

Also the MWC is a much better basketball conference. It typically is only at best a 2 bid conference. Are we going to dominate the MWC’s better basketball programs for one of the 2 bids???

Maybe we should work harder to dominate in our “weak” conference. Is it more realistic to be a big fish in a small pond? Any thoughts, comments???

 

[casual fan]

Stay put and add Liberty plus one more school to CUSA.

[Jonnyeagle]

6 hours ago, casual fan said:

Stay put and add Liberty plus one more school to CUSA.

You read my mind man.  Absolutely think CUSA should add Liberty and maybe another couple of the better Sun Belt programs.  

[untjim1995]

1 minute ago, Jonnyeagle said:

You read my mind man.  Absolutely think CUSA should add Liberty and maybe another couple of the better Sun Belt programs.  

I’ve read several posts over the years on gmg that they don’t want anything to do with being in a conference with Liberty because of their evangelical views academically. I’d be all right with them, because that stuff has no bearing on my enjoyment of a game. But I bet I’m in the minority on this 

[MeanGreenTexan]

I guarantee if NT was doing better in football, none of y'all would even remotely entertain the idea of remaining in C-USA while all of this other shifting is occurring.

But since we're losing, you're resigning yourself to remaining where we are.    

Wren, 
If you're reading this...  this is where your fanbase is right now.    Do something!

[Jonnyeagle]

My biggest worry about the Mountain West is it would be a very tough league for us to win in basketball.

[MDH]

7 minutes ago, Jonnyeagle said:

My biggest worry about the Mountain West is it would be a very tough league for us to win in basketball.

football wouldn't be much better. The argument is that MWC raises our recruiting profile. To the extent it doesn't....might not be pretty.

[Hookset]

35 minutes ago, MeanGreenTexan said:

I guarantee if NT was doing better in football, none of y'all would even remotely entertain the idea of remaining in C-USA while all of this other shifting is occurring.

But since we're losing, you're resigning yourself to remaining where we are.    

Wren, 
If you're reading this...  this is where your fanbase is right now.    Do something!

Yep, exactly. We aren’t a dominant program in our current conference. Why would a stronger conference want us? In 10 years we haven’t even sold out our 31K seat stadium. When we came close, it was because we had a great visitor crowd. We don’t bring people to home games so we damn sure aren’t going to travel to Utah, Idaho, California…

I personally don’t like seeing our poor showings for football now. I damn sure don’t want to see us get clobbered by better programs every week.

I know many of our programs are starting to show success (MBB, WBB, track, softball, golf, volleyball). And soccer has always been good (more people should praise that program for it’s success). I want to see if we can maintain this more than 3-4 years at a time before a coach leaves and we regress. 
For football, we need to quit scheduling SMU (6 wins in almost 50 tries! Most of those wins from before I was born!!!). I am tired of getting curb stomped by them. What’s the definition of insanity? Doing the same thing over and over again and expecting a different result.

 
How about we try playing some of the lower MWC schools or lower Sunbelt schools or WAC?

Edited September 23, 2021 by Hookset

[MrAlien]

Lots of people in the media are speculating that Gonzaga might be joining the MWC, which would make the conference a very strong basketball conference.  If UNT were in that mix, then we might see a few sell outs at the super pit come conference play.  Even though it might be hard for UNT to win, it would be a huge boost for recruiting. 

 

 

[DentonLurker]

So what you're saying is all schools should only move into better conferences when they are good in their current conference even if there are solid financial, exposure, rivalry, recruiting reasons to move up? Just trying to make sure I understand your argument.

Edited September 23, 2021 by DentonLurker

[SteaminWillieBeamin]

Very strange defeatist arguments going on here. We don't deserve better, so don't do better? Like the abused spouse... 

[UNTLifer]

19 minutes ago, Hookset said:

Yep, exactly. We aren’t a dominant program in our current conference. Why would a stronger conference want us? In 10 years we haven’t even sold out our 31K seat stadium. When we came close, it was because we had a great visitor crowd. We don’t bring people to home games so we damn sure aren’t going to travel to Utah, Idaho, California…

I personally don’t like seeing our poor showings for football now. I damn sure don’t want to see us get clobbered by better programs every week.

I know many of our programs are starting to show success (MBB, WBB, track, softball, golf, volleyball). And soccer has always been good (more people should praise that program for it’s success). I want to see if we can maintain this more than 3-4 years at a time before a coach leaves and we regress. 
For football, we need to quit scheduling SMU (6 wins in almost 50 tries! Most of those wins from before I was born!!!). I am tired of getting curb stomped by them. What’s the definition of insanity? Doing the same thing over and over again and expecting a different result.

 
How about we try playing some of the lower MWC schools or lower Sunbelt schools or WAC?

Conference expansion and the reason some schools are invited and others aren't goes way beyond "being the dominant program".

[97and03]

29 minutes ago, DentonLurker said:

So what you're saying is all schools should only move into better conferences when they are good in their current conference even if there are solid financial, exposure, rivalry, recruiting reasons to move up? Just trying to make sure I understand your argument.

I feel like a lot of these people ended up taking their cousin to prom.

[untjim1995]

If you are gonna lose, at least make more money while doing it...the MWC pays better because of the TV deal, of which CUSA pays nothing, as well as the fact that you might be able to draw more fans to come watch the current MWC teams play here. It would be a tad easier to get your old UNT roommate or buddies to go watch us play Boise State or the AFA than it is to get them to watch us play F_U or Old Dominion. 

I really don't think it matters anymore, though. The MWC isn't adding a team that sucks at football and that is the only thing driving the bus. The folks at UTSA picked a great time to hit the jackpot on their football coach--it probably gets them into the AAC or MWC. I used to think the MWC would expand here to Texas, but if they keep their 12 teams together, I bet they just add Gonzaga for all sports and balances their league to 12 in all sports, since Hawaii is football only. Right now, the AAC has three teams to replace--that appears to be UAB, UTSA, and FAU if they cannot get any MWC teams to jump. I just don't see any of them leaving, knowing that their travel expenses will skyrocket for a league that really isn't close to what they have now.

The interesting thing to see is if CUSA can convince the SBC teams to move to CUSA or if the SBC gets CUSA teams to jump to them. For example, does Texas State look at CUSA West and jump on that, since its close teams in Texas and LA to play in a conference, versus the current setup of games with ULM and ULL only. Does La Tech block any interest that ULL would have in CUSA or does CUSA even care about La Tech's views on ULL? Would Arkansas State jump to CUSA or do they like their SBC setup now. Same questions exist for Appy State and Coastal Carolina, too. And, of course, the Judy Factor has to be noted--as she loves her some big city schools to trumpet as another big market in CUSA, which means Georgia State might just be her number one candidate to go after...

If the SBCUSA continues to fight realignment on geographical positions, this is the $hit we have to endure--all because of ridiculous views on TV networks running these conference affiliations. So stupid, but it is what it is as long as SMU sits above us on the FB S Totem Pole.

[ColoradoEagle]

6 minutes ago, untjim1995 said:

The folks at UTSA picked a great time to hit the jackpot on their football coach--it probably gets them into the AAC or MWC.

Enough people on here parroting this line that you'd think UTSA is some world beating, top 10 ranked football program. They went 7-5 last year folks and a combined 22-38 the five years before that. Tap the damn brakes.

[untjim1995]

6 minutes ago, ColoradoEagle said:

Enough people on here parroting this line that you'd think UTSA is some world beating, top 10 ranked football program. They went 7-5 last year folks and a combined 22-38 the five years before that. Tap the damn brakes.

The problem is that networks aren't tapping the brakes on that San Antonio TV market and the fact that it is a destination city with a bowl game played at UTSA's stadium. Winning football added to that list is why that gas pedal is getting pushed hard.

[Green Otaku]

1 hour ago, SteaminWillieBeamin said:

Very strange defeatist arguments going on here. We don't deserve better, so don't do better? Like the abused spouse... 

 

I don't get it. If the MWC were to throw us a lifeline why would we not take it? Better TV deal, more exposure, bigger athletic budget, better chance of recruiting? Nah, let's just purposely keep ourselves down. 

[MeanGreenTexan]

13 minutes ago, ColoradoEagle said:

Enough people on here parroting this line that you'd think UTSA is some world beating, top 10 ranked football program. They went 7-5 last year folks and a combined 22-38 the five years before that. Tap the damn brakes.

You're forgetting the old adage:  What have you done for me lately?

UTSA went from 4 wins in 2019, to 7 wins and a competitive bowl loss against #19-ranked Louisiana last year.  They were the preseason pick by many to win C-USA this year, and they've started this season now 3-0 including a road win VS a B1G team.   They've put themselves in a good position right now.

[untjim1995]

2 minutes ago, Green Otaku said:

 

I don't get it. If the MWC were to throw us a lifeline why would we not take it? Better TV deal, more exposure, bigger athletic budget, better chance of recruiting? Nah, let's just purposely keep ourselves down. 

The MWC throwing us a lifeline would be huge, only because we would have moved up. But if they lose some combo of Boise State, SDSU, Fresno, AFA, CSU, Nevada, and UNLV, then its probably not in our best interest. IOW, lets say the Big XII also invites Boise State and Memphis, as Norm Hitzges was just talking about, to get to 14. Now, the AAC has to replace 4 teams--so let's say that decide that the best way to go now is to get CSU, AFA, SDSU, and UNLV and they all jump. At that point, playing Hawaii, SJSU, Nevada, Wyoming, New Mexico, Utah State, and Fresno State probably wouldn't get as much interest from us, especially if CUSA West doesn't lose anyone.

[Green Otaku]

13 minutes ago, untjim1995 said:

The MWC throwing us a lifeline would be huge, only because we would have moved up. But if they lose some combo of Boise State, SDSU, Fresno, AFA, CSU, Nevada, and UNLV, then its probably not in our best interest. IOW, lets say the Big XII also invites Boise State and Memphis, as Norm Hitzges was just talking about, to get to 14. Now, the AAC has to replace 4 teams--so let's say that decide that the best way to go now is to get CSU, AFA, SDSU, and UNLV and they all jump. At that point, playing Hawaii, SJSU, Nevada, Wyoming, New Mexico, Utah State, and Fresno State probably wouldn't get as much interest from us, especially if CUSA West doesn't lose anyone.

 

If a deal were made while those schools are still in the MWC I'd hope our administration would be smart enough to put a clause that allowed us to reconsider without penalty if the membership changes before we join. 

[SMU2006]

2 hours ago, Hookset said:

Yep, exactly. We aren’t a dominant program in our current conference. Why would a stronger conference want us? In 10 years we haven’t even sold out our 31K seat stadium. When we came close, it was because we had a great visitor crowd. We don’t bring people to home games so we damn sure aren’t going to travel to Utah, Idaho, California…

I personally don’t like seeing our poor showings for football now. I damn sure don’t want to see us get clobbered by better programs every week.

I know many of our programs are starting to show success (MBB, WBB, track, softball, golf, volleyball). And soccer has always been good (more people should praise that program for it’s success). I want to see if we can maintain this more than 3-4 years at a time before a coach leaves and we regress. 
For football, we need to quit scheduling SMU (6 wins in almost 50 tries! Most of those wins from before I was born!!!). I am tired of getting curb stomped by them. What’s the definition of insanity? Doing the same thing over and over again and expecting a different result.

 
How about we try playing some of the lower MWC schools or lower Sunbelt schools or WAC?

The SMU-UNT game should go on as long as possible.  Zero travel costs and a nice money maker at the gate for both schools.  Why in the world would UNT want out of the series?

[ColoradoEagle]

1 hour ago, MeanGreenTexan said:

You're forgetting the old adage:  What have you done for me lately?

UTSA went from 4 wins in 2019, to 7 wins and a competitive bowl loss against #19-ranked Louisiana last year.  They were the preseason pick by many to win C-USA this year, and they've started this season now 3-0 including a road win VS a B1G team.   They've put themselves in a good position right now.

Success is fleeting, though, for most G5 teams. They haven't really proved anything yet, and they have some severe negatives (low athletic budget, rented football stadium, laughable basketball arena, no basketball success, etc). The one thing they have going for them is exclusivity in the San Antonio market, but that isn't helping them fill up the Alamo Dome or anything.

It's hard to reconcile 'possibly a sleeping giant, because of the San Antonio market' with the first two games of the season drawing 16k. If anything, their history and lack of attendance show they're a project.

[untjim1995]

15 minutes ago, SMU2006 said:

The SMU-UNT game should go on as long as possible.  Zero travel costs and a nice money maker at the gate for both schools.  Why in the world would UNT want out of the series?

I'm in the minority on this, big time, but the SMU series does nothing for us, except get our fans all kinds of bent out of shape when we play yall. We get our asses kicked, yall get the recruits and the favorable local coverage, as well as a thousands of fans to come to your stadium to watch us get prions raped. And when yall come to Denton, you bring about 50 fans.

We would be much better off just playing other G5s than playing SMU. When we lose to Ohio, Lousiana, Wyoming, or Tulsa, no one gets angry about it, except for the few thousand MG faithful. Lose to SMU and its basically watching the entire program completely fall apart--see 2015, 2019, 2020, and 2021. Only season that a SMU loss didn't lead to a complete dumpster fire was in 2017, when Mason Fine led us to close wins in games against LT, UTSA, and Army.

[UNTLifer]

1 hour ago, untjim1995 said:

The problem is that networks aren't tapping the brakes on that San Antonio TV market and the fact that it is a destination city with a bowl game played at UTSA's stadium. Winning football added to that list is why that gas pedal is getting pushed hard.

Fixed.

[SMU2006]

11 minutes ago, untjim1995 said:

I'm in the minority on this, big time, but the SMU series does nothing for us, except get our fans all kinds of bent out of shape when we play yall. We get our asses kicked, yall get the recruits and the favorable local coverage, as well as a thousands of fans to come to your stadium to watch us get prions raped. And when yall come to Denton, you bring about 50 fans.

We would be much better off just playing other G5s than playing SMU. When we lose to Ohio, Lousiana, Wyoming, or Tulsa, no one gets angry about it, except for the few thousand MG faithful. Lose to SMU and its basically watching the entire program completely fall apart--see 2015, 2019, 2020, and 2021. Only season that a SMU loss didn't lead to a complete dumpster fire was in 2017, when Mason Fine led us to close wins in games against LT, UTSA, and Army.

Looks to me like the UNT home attendance when SMU comes to Denton is better than just about anyone you've played since the stadium opened.  Why would you ever want to do away with that?