New G-5 Conference for NT?

[Jonnyeagle]

New G5 "SouthWest" Division.  Busride to all games.

North Division

SMU
Louisiana Tech
Tulsa
Memphis
Tulane
North Texas

South Division

Houston
Tx State
Tx San Antonio
Tx El Paso
Rice
Lafayette

[GrandGreen]

What should happen but never will, is a complete reorganization  of  NCAA based on geography..

Set minimum standards for inclusion than eliminate schools that just don't have the resources for inclusion. 

Then use a computer model that creates conferences based on location, distance and travel factors.

NT could end up with something like a league composed of SMU, TCU,, Oklahoma, OKlahoma St, Tulsa, Texas Tech, Kansas, Kansas St, Missouri..   Add in non-football schools like Wichita St. and UTA.  

Then the next step would be to mandate expense controls.  Caps on coaches salaries, the number of make up positions now used to expand the athletic department and restrictions on recruiting funding based on individual schools natural recruiting areas.  

The  result of this "dream" scheme would be a much cheaper and competitive NCAA.  

[untjim1995]

Until schools look at conferences as a way to reduce costs instead of increased exposure/revenue, the G5s will remain as they are. The idea of P5s that are large state schools being associated with G5s in a conference just isn't going to happen. The networks/alums/legislatures won't allow the state schools in power conferences to join lesser brands. As evidenced by the Big XII, the networks PAID their conference more to not accept anyone from a G5 league--so UH, UCF, USF, etc...yall are stuck just like we are, albeit with a much better TV contract than the SBCUSA has...

[cwb]

Worst. Virus. Ever.

[wardly]

I think that the CUSA committee evaluating existing membership is going to recommend a shuffling of the deck along geographic lines, perhaps with the SBC. This is just a guess, but report is do out the end of April. If memory serves when CUSA was refigured as basically Sunbelt #2 it was trying to have a presence in as many major markets as possible for television money. When that dried up we were left with a model that doesn't work. It also wouldn't surprise me if the recommendation was to include basketball only schools in an effort to strengthen the conference nationally. I am afraid that being one of 5 programs classified as G5 programs in Texas is going to create a problem in attracting schools from the southeast to voluntary join us in creating a new conference[ I do not consider Houston a G5 program.] La. Monroe is a real stumbling block. They are basically a 1aa program with probably the lowest athletic budget in D1, and no way in hell does La. Tech partner with them. If realignment does occur between CUSA and SBC the real winner might be New Mexico State who could find a home.

[Wag Tag]

Subsidizing expenses is going to have to stop! Ticket and TV revenue pricing is going to drop. Maybe it comes back but maybe not quickly as people have found other things to do. 

[NorthTexasSportsNetwork]

1 minute ago, Wag Tag said:

Subsidizing expenses is going to have to stop! Ticket and TV revenue pricing is going to drop. Maybe it comes back but maybe not quickly as people have found other things to do. 

I mean does the C-USA make TV revenue?

[untjim1995]

34 minutes ago, wardly said:

I think that the CUSA committee evaluating existing membership is going to recommend a shuffling of the deck along geographic lines, perhaps with the SBC. This is just a guess, but report is do out the end of April. If memory serves when CUSA was refigured as basically Sunbelt #2 it was trying to have a presence in as many major markets as possible for television money. When that dried up we were left with a model that doesn't work. It also wouldn't surprise me if the recommendation was to include basketball only schools in an effort to strengthen the conference nationally. I am afraid that being one of 5 programs classified as G5 programs in Texas is going to create a problem in attracting schools from the southeast to voluntary join us in creating a new conference[ I do not consider Houston a G5 program.] La. Monroe is a real stumbling block. They are basically a 1aa program with probably the lowest athletic budget in D1, and no way in hell does La. Tech partner with them. If realignment does occur between CUSA and SBC the real winner might be New Mexico State who could find a home.

I would love to see La Tech make the decision to be an independent and kill off their programs than be associated with ULM, which does way more with much less and would probably do very well in a more regionalized conference.

La Tech isn't SMU--they can't buy their way away from other programs they deem below them if push really comes to shove here. Same with UTEP and NMSU.

[Travis]

I see the annual posts are right on schedule. 

[wardly]

New Mexico State would love to be in any D1 conference otherwise they are going to die. ULL plays La. Monroe so no problem there. However, I think La. Tech would go east or west depending on which direction would allow them to avoid La. Monroe. You could take the 5 Texas programs, throw in New Mexico State, Arkansas State, ULL, and La. Tech plus UTA and UALR for basketball only. That would give you 8 conference games, 2 money games, and 2 other, probably one being a 1aa program the other G5. Probably the only thing good to come out of the Virus is the possibility of regionalized G5 conferences. Decisions are easier when options are limited.

Edited April 15, 2020 by wardly
spelling

[DeepGreen]

I like this conference.  Makes so much sense.  But I would make the following changes.

New G5 "SouthWest" Division.  Busride to all games.

North Division

North Texas
Louisiana Tech
Tulsa
Memphis
Tulane
SMU

South Division

Houston
Tx State
Tx San Antonio
Tx El Paso
Rice
Lafayette

North Division would be a tough division.  South would be dominated by Houston.

Edited April 15, 2020 by DeepGreen

[97and03]

1 hour ago, NorthTexasSportsNetwork said:

I mean does the C-USA make TV revenue?

[southsideguy]

The P-5 schools are not share in the profits.  They would prefer to kill college football.

[UNTLifer]

I am going to Wuhan to kick someone’s ass. Above everything else, they have cancelled spring ball and extended the off season. 
 

[untjim1995]

6 hours ago, southsideguy said:

The P-5 schools are not share in the profits.  They would prefer to kill college football.

Basically, they already have. College football is very different for the 20 or so teams that are truly allowed to play for a championship. After that the next 45 schools have it very different from the next 25 or so, which then have more than the lower G5’s. 
 

Again, those Power schools need to pull away for good. Texas has nothing in common in athletics with North Texas,  not does Tennessee with MUTS or Alabama with UAB. Let them move on and let the rest of us play on a much more equal platform with a chance to reward our players, coaches, and fans with an actual national championship.

[NorthTexan95]

Houston would own their division. 

[GrayEagle]

There needs to be a shrinking of G5.  When the 1-AA division was created the criteria to be in the top division was a stadium of 30,000 and home attendance average of 17,000.  We would not expand Fouts at that time so we were destined for the lower division. 

I believe that the criteria were fair to be considered a major college and play in the highest division.  But, it was never enforced after the initial change.  When these undeserving colleges were able to get in for a greater share of the TV pie it diluted the payout for conferences that had those teams.

Every G5 conference but the AAC has more than one member that would not be qualified under the original rules.  Some miss the stadium requirement, some miss the attendance requirement and a decent sized number miss both.  No one in the MAC meets both although some have in the past.  The Mountain West is mostly in compliance but some have remodeled their stadiums and the capacity has fallen a little below 30,000.  The other large culprits are CUSA and the Sun Belt Conference.

Eight of the fourteen teams in CUSA meet both requirements.  I would like to see them combined into one conference along with the four qualifiers from the Sun Belt.  The evolving conference would be Marshall, Appalachian State,  Florida Atlantic, Troy, UAB and Southern Miss in the East and Louisiana, Louisiana Tech, Arkansas State, North Texas, Rice and UTSA in West. 

UTEP obviously has the stadium but their attendance, which was once above 30,000 has now dropped to about half that figure.  I think that they can more easily meet their attendance requirements in the MWC than CUSA.

Those that fail to meet the requirements should be forced to play as independents if they remain in the FBS division.

 

[Cougar King]

18 hours ago, Jonnyeagle said:

New G5 "SouthWest" Division.  Busride to all games.

North Division

SMU
Louisiana Tech
Tulsa
Memphis
Tulane
North Texas

South Division

Houston
Tx State
Tx San Antonio
Tx El Paso
Rice
Lafayette

We would drop football before joining a garbage conference like that. SMU would too.

[UNT86]

The only thing I would add to GrayEagle's post is that there needs to be a standard for who counts as attendance.  You should not get to count the ushers and concession workers.  

[wardly]

7 hours ago, GrayEagle said:

There needs to be a shrinking of G5.  When the 1-AA division was created the criteria to be in the top division was a stadium of 30,000 and home attendance average of 17,000.  We would not expand Fouts at that time so we were destined for the lower division. 

I believe that the criteria were fair to be considered a major college and play in the highest division.  But, it was never enforced after the initial change.  When these undeserving colleges were able to get in for a greater share of the TV pie it diluted the payout for conferences that had those teams.

Every G5 conference but the AAC has more than one member that would not be qualified under the original rules.  Some miss the stadium requirement, some miss the attendance requirement and a decent sized number miss both.  No one in the MAC meets both although some have in the past.  The Mountain West is mostly in compliance but some have remodeled their stadiums and the capacity has fallen a little below 30,000.  The other large culprits are CUSA and the Sun Belt Conference.

Eight of the fourteen teams in CUSA meet both requirements.  I would like to see them combined into one conference along with the four qualifiers from the Sun Belt.  The evolving conference would be Marshall, Appalachian State,  Florida Atlantic, Troy, UAB and Southern Miss in the East and Louisiana, Louisiana Tech, Arkansas State, North Texas, Rice and UTSA in West. 

UTEP obviously has the stadium but their attendance, which was once above 30,000 has now dropped to about half that figure.  I think that they can more easily meet their attendance requirements in the MWC than CUSA.

Those that fail to meet the requirements should be forced to play as independents if they remain in the FBS division.

 

Actually we did expand Fouts Field to reach 30,000 capacity . An alum gave us $1 million to add 10,000 in seating for metal bleachers to our existing 20,000. This had nothing to do with dropping down to 1AA. Our athletic department was broke, and we either had to drop down in classification or drop football.

[DeepGreen]

Mr recollection is that all of this stadium and attendance requirements started in the very late 1970's when we were still in the highest Division of college football- 1A.  Back then there were less than 100 schools that were in D1A.  UNT dropped to 1AA, into football purgatory for 10 yrs(?).  Only when we decided to meet the stadium requirements were we able to move back to 1A(FBS).  That was in '94(?).

At least that's how I remember the great "snafu" that kept UNT down for so long.  Had we stayed the course back in the early '80's and had an administration that cared about athletics, we would be in the AAC or better.

[untjim1995]

1 minute ago, DeepGreen said:

Mr recollection is that all of this stadium and attendance requirements started in the very late 1970's when we were still in the highest Division of college football- 1A.  Back then there were less than 100 schools that were in D1A.  UNT dropped to 1AA, into football purgatory for 10 yrs(?).  Only when we decided to meet the stadium requirements were we able to move back to 1A(FBS).  That was in '94(?).

At least that's how I remember the great "snafu" that kept UNT down for so long.  Had we stayed the course back in the early '80's and had an administration that cared about athletics, we would be in the AAC or better.

You can truly make the argument that had we actually been smart about our goal of moving up when Fry was here, we should have gone hard after the Big Eight if the SWC didn't want us. We would have had teams like OU, OSU, Nebraska, and Colorado coming here for football, all because the Big Eight would have loved to have gotten into the DFW area. In hoops, imagine KU, KSU, Mizzou, and Iowa State coming here for conference games...

But, instead, we gave up. And it killed any possibility of ever being at the top level of college athletics. 

 

[untjim1995]

6 hours ago, Cougar King said:

We would drop football before joining a garbage conference like that. SMU would too.

I actually understand how both would feel like this. Right now, with games against regional teams like Tulane, Tulsa, Memphis, and Wichita State, y'all have a very nice setup. Add in non-conference games with TCU and UNT for SMU, as well as Rice and UNT for UH, you guys have a very strong schedule right now.

[GrandGreen]

8 hours ago, Cougar King said:

We would drop football before joining a garbage conference like that. SMU would too.

We being you, I serious doubt UH would drop football to satisfy delusional fans" views. 

College administrations are going to make their decisions based on the opportunities available. I am sure fans's views are considered, but hardly a deciding factor.

UH is a G5, and unfortunately the P5's obviously have the same view of UH that you have of fellow G5's.  

 

Edited April 16, 2020 by GrandGreen

[wardly]

5 hours ago, DeepGreen said:

Mr recollection is that all of this stadium and attendance requirements started in the very late 1970's when we were still in the highest Division of college football- 1A.  Back then there were less than 100 schools that were in D1A.  UNT dropped to 1AA, into football purgatory for 10 yrs(?).  Only when we decided to meet the stadium requirements were we able to move back to 1A(FBS).  That was in '94(?).

At least that's how I remember the great "snafu" that kept UNT down for so long.  Had we stayed the course back in the early '80's and had an administration that cared about athletics, we would be in the AAC or better.

We met the stadium requirements but the attendance. The big problem was that administration didn't see any value to athletics.