With budgets tightening due to coronavirus fallout, will more college sports be cut?

[Harry]

 

Quote

 

Regional pragmatism vs. ego

One issue being heavily discussed, especially on the Eastern seaboard, is scheduling alliances to save travel costs for non-revenue sports. Using Old Dominion as an example, it makes little sense for its baseball team to travel in Conference USA league games to play at Rice (in Houston), FIU (in South Florida) and Louisiana Tech (in Ruston). Why not James Madison, Richmond and Georgetown? They are all in different leagues, but it would make much more sense.

The same could be said for schools in the Northeast, as it makes more sense for Boston College, Rhode Island, Holy Cross and UConn to play each other in non-revenue sports than many of their far-flung geographic league peers. “You would have to get to a place where people put a lot of ego aside,” said another AD in the Group of Five. “Sports is driven more by ego than common sense.”

One athletic director in a non-football league said of scheduling more geographically friendly games instead of league schedules: “We are having those discussions.” He said limiting costs on conference road trips in non-revenue sports would save his athletic department hundreds of thousands of dollars a year. In leagues outside the Power Five, that money matters.

“Can you imagine being Conference USA or the AAC and you’re sending your baseball team to UTEP or Tulsa,” the AD said, using hypothetical geographic outliers. “It doesn’t make any sense. Much like everything, we’ve done this to ourselves. For us to not think about regional scheduling alliances is complete lunacy.”

Athletic directors are doing everything possible to save sports, which means non-revenue sports could look much different whenever the sports calendar returns to normal.

Cincinnati’s decision on Thursday could end up being remembered as a tipping point. In a time of fiscal uncertainty on campuses, more cuts of sports from schools are expected to follow. 

 

 

Read more:  https://sports.yahoo.com/with-budgets-tightening-will-more-college-sports-be-cut-204423901.html

[Salsa_Verde]

https://www.underdogdynasty.com/2020/3/20/21171137/dont-hold-breath-on-realignment-to-save-your-team-aac-ucf-cincinnati-big-12-usf

[Arkstfan]

Forget the drawn in Photoshop realignment maps. Temporary problem, temporary solution.

Leave football alone. Football when it travels does so by charter bus or charter aircraft and can control for the most part who players and coaches are exposed to.

Leave the individual sports alone. (ie those without a conference schedule, just an end of season championship event). One trip isn't enough to sweat.

Hoops, volleyball, softball, baseball, women's soccer and maybe men's soccer (all the affiliates make it messy) should realign for two seasons. CUSA East and Sun Belt East in one group administered by the Sun Belt and CUSA West and Sun Belt West in one group administered by CUSA with either UAB shifted East or South Alabama shifted West so we don't have 13/13 but some 12/14 combination.

Get past the emergency. Get the financial situation worked out and everyone goes back to where they came from.

https://247sports.com/college/arkansas-state/Article/COVID-Money-Strain-Demands-A-Temporary-Realignment-146066749/

 

Edited April 15, 2020 by Coach Andy Mac

[meanrob]

1 hour ago, Arkstfan said:

Forget the drawn in Photoshop realignment maps. Temporary problem, temporary solution.

Leave football alone. Football when it travels does so by charter bus or charter aircraft and can control for the most part who players and coaches are exposed to.

Leave the individual sports alone. (ie those without a conference schedule, just an end of season championship event). One trip isn't enough to sweat.

Hoops, volleyball, softball, baseball, women's soccer and maybe men's soccer (all the affiliates make it messy) should realign for two seasons. CUSA East and Sun Belt East in one group administered by the Sun Belt and CUSA West and Sun Belt West in one group administered by CUSA with either UAB shifted East or South Alabama shifted West so we don't have 13/13 but some 12/14 combination.

Get past the emergency. Get the financial situation worked out and everyone goes back to where they came from.

https://247sports.com/college/arkansas-state/Article/COVID-Money-Strain-Demands-A-Temporary-Realignment-146066749/

I would've put money down that a global pandemic would happen before common sense in college athletics. It's practical but call me skeptical. 

[Arkstfan]

7 minutes ago, meanrob said:

I would've put money down that a global pandemic would happen before common sense in college athletics. It's practical but call me skeptical. 

Well common sense rarely takes the lead but we are at the point where our commissioners are asking permission to drop to sports, get waivers from the minimum scholarship requirements, and maybe minimum scheduling. If they can cut costs without cutting scholarships they need to do so.

[Greenrex]

Common sense is the predisposed notion that others share your opinion.

 

[Wag Tag]

As in any business in this kind of environment non performing assets, salaries and fixed overhead has to be cut! You also are going to have to plan for reduce ticket pricing .

[El Paso Eagle]

If programs are cut, due to the Title 9 requirements, they will be men's programs.

[NorthTexasSportsNetwork]

1 hour ago, El Paso Eagle said:

If programs are cut, due to the Title 9 requirements, they will be men's programs.

We have like 3 less men's programs than women's right? That would be stupid if they drop one of the few we have. 

[El Paso Eagle]

11 minutes ago, NorthTexasSportsNetwork said:

We have like 3 less men's programs than women's right? That would be stupid if they drop one of the few we have. 

Agree, but logic will not play a role. I could see schools "dropping/furloughing" things like men's track, baseball to keep women's rowing, bowling, etc. to keep legally compliant.  

Would not be surprised to see some schools do the "UAB" and drop football to clean house and restart it in another year.

[Jonnyeagle]

4 minutes ago, El Paso Eagle said:

Agree, but logic will not play a role. I could see schools "dropping/furloughing" things like men's track, baseball to keep women's rowing, bowling, etc. to keep legally compliant.  

Would not be surprised to see some schools do the "UAB" and drop football to clean house and restart it in another year.

What UAB and UTSA dd was criminal and should never be allowed again.

[El Paso Eagle]

4 minutes ago, Jonnyeagle said:

What UAB and UTSA dd was criminal and should never be allowed again.

Agree, but as long as the "rules" are vague (also reference SMU with the transfers) schools will find a way 

[GrayEagle]

Unless they change the rules, if we cut any teams we would drop a classification.  The FBS requires 16 teams which is exactly what we have.  

We have six men's sports...football, basketball, track & field indoor & outdoor, cross-country, and golf.  We have ten women's sports...basketball, soccer, softball, track & field indoor & outdoor, cross-country, tennis, swimming & diving, volleyball and golf.

My memory's a little fuzzy and I'm too lazy to look it up.  It could be only 14 if track & field indoor and outdoor are not considered separate sports.

So, I don't see us dropping a sport but others in Division 1A/FBS might be compelled to do so.  It is possible that we could swap a women's sport for one less expensive...say women's bowling for swimming & diving.

Edit:  The number of sports for FBS/Division 1A is 16 and indoor and outdoor track & field are considered separate sports.

 

Edited April 19, 2020 by GrayEagle

[GrandGreen]

On 4/17/2020 at 1:34 PM, GrayEagle said:

Unless they change the rules, if we cut any teams we would drop a classification.  The FBS requires 16 teams which is exactly what we have.  

We have six men's sports...football, basketball, track & field indoor & outdoor, cross-country, and golf.  We have ten women's sports...basketball, soccer, softball, track & field indoor & outdoor, cross-country, tennis, swimming & diving, volleyball and golf.

My memory's a little fuzzy and I'm too lazy to look it up.  It could be only 14 if track & field indoor and outdoor are not considered separate sports.

So, I don't see us dropping a sport but others in Division 1A/FBS might be compelled to do so.  It is possible that we could swap a women's sport for one less expensive...say women's bowling for swimming & diving.

Edit:  The number of sports for FBS/Division 1A is 16 and indoor and outdoor track & field are considered separate sports.

 

The problem with equating men and women sports is they count scholarships not the number of teams.

85 in football is hard to offset.

That is why you have swimming and not bowling.

Title 9 is and always will be political and not practical.

I am all for women to have equal opportunity in athletics. However, to not factor in the cost/benefit ratio is absurd.  Women's sports just do not have the support or visibility of football and men's basketball. 

Although NT best programs are soccer, volleyball and softball, I doubt the combined attendance of all their home games would equal an average Apogee crowd.

 

 

[ADLER]

The University of North Texas has been very generous to its students while keeping student athletics contributions extremely low, especially for a full Division 1 program that includes football, that plays in on-campus facilities that are paid for by the athletic department. No public university in Texas even comes close to offering comparable value.

To put it simply, UNT students, by far, get the most bang for their buck.

Here are the student fees per credit hour as reported by UNT-Dallas this past month.

Athletic fee comparison of Texas public universities

UNT Dallas -- $7

Angelo State -- $8

University of Texas Arlington -- $8

Lamar -- $10

Midwestern State -- $10

Sul Ross State -- $10

Texas A&M San Antonio -- $10

Texas Southern -- $10

University of Texas Rio Grande -- $11

Texas A&M - Texarkana -- $11

UT El Paso -- $12

UT Permian Basin -- $12

Prairie View A&M -- $12

UNT -- $14

UT San Antonio -- $16

Texas A&M - Kingsville -- $17

Sam Houston State -- $20

Texas State -- $20

Texas A&M Corpus Christi -- $21

Tarleton State -- $22

Texas A&M International -- $23

Texas A&M - Commerce -- $32

 

And yes, that $32 per credit hour at Texas A&M-Commerce is accurate: TAMU-Commerce Athletics Fee raised from $10.99 per credit hour to $32.00 per credit hour

 

[greenminer]

I don't doubt those numbers, @ADLER but I thought I read years ago during our own athletic fee voting that the state put a cap on how high it could be per student @ appx 12-13 dollars.  Maybe I misread or something has changed.

[DeepGreen]

I wish someone would dig into Louisiana Tech to see "if" they have a student athletic fee.  LT fans say no way.  Several years ago I seem to recall running across something where they did charge students a per semester athletic fee.

[ADLER]

3 minutes ago, greenminer said:

I don't doubt those numbers, @ADLER but I thought I read years ago during our own athletic fee voting that the state put a cap on how high it could be per student @ appx 12-13 dollars.  Maybe I misread or something has changed.

At the time(2008-ish), the state maximum for an athletics fee was $20 per credit hour, and Texas State immediately applied that fee for up to 15 hours per semester. North Texas started at $10, but only after Apogee was opened, and has a provision that they can raise the fee by $1 (10% of original fee) per year until the $20 per credit hour is reached. North Texas has only raised the fee $4 during the last nine years.

Meanwhile, the parameters of the fees have been changed on the state level, allowing schools to charge more than twice as much as North Texas students contribute. Most of these schools don't have Div 1 sports, and many don't even have on-campus facilities.

And the schools that have raised the fees the most, contrary to some arguments, have not had it impact their enrollment figures. North Texas, while keeping the athletics fees extremely low, has seen less enrollment increase than many of it's peer institutions.

University	2018[1]	2017[2]	2016[2]	2014[3]	2013[3]	2012[4]
Texas A&M University	63,694	62,915	60,435	60,507	58,219	56,378
The University of Texas at Austin	51,684	51,427	51,281	51,312	52,059	52,213
University of Houston	46,324	42,704	43,774	40,914	39,540	40,747
The University of Texas at Arlington	42,496	41,712	39,706	34,868	33,329	33,267
Texas State University	38,644	38,694	38,808	36,739	35,546	36,790
University of North Texas	38,087	38,094	37,979	36,164	36,168	36,216
Texas Tech University	37,845	37,010	36,225	34,843	32,797	32,611
The University of Texas at San Antonio	32,101	30,680	28,959	28,628	28,623	30,607
The University of Texas at Dallas	28,755	27,638	26,793	23,095	21,193	23,095
The University of Texas Rio Grande Valley	28,489	27,504	27,722
The University of Texas at El Paso	25,063	25,078	23,888	23,043	22,926	22,749
The University of Texas–Pan American				21,015	20,053	19,263
Sam Houston State University	21,025	20,938	20,477	19,573	19,210	18,396
Texas Woman's University	15,364	15,322	15,511	14,889	14,899	14,909
University of Houston–Downtown	14,261	13,919	14,245	14,436	13,754	13,916
Lamar University	14,176	13,866	14,391	14,452	13,762	14,469
Tarleton State University	13,118	13,011	13,052	11,681	10,937	10,271
Stephen F. Austin State University	13,058	12,614	12,653	12,644	12,584	12,999
Texas A&M University–Commerce	12,072	13,065	12,385	11,490	11,068	12,052
Texas A&M University–Corpus Christi	11,929	12,202	12,202	11,234	10,913	10,538
Angelo State University	10,242	10,362	9,475	6,389	6,430	6,921
West Texas A&M University	10,030	10,169	9,901	8,970	8,381	7,955
Texas Southern University	9,732	10,238	8,862	9,233	8,703	9,967
The University of Texas at Tyler	9,716	9,938	9,416	8,036	7,476	6,858
Prairie View A&M University	9,516	9,431	8,762	8,343	8,250	8,485
University of Houston–Clear Lake	8,961	8,542	8,886	8,665	8,164	8,153
Texas A&M University–Kingsville	8,541	8,682	9,278	8,728	7,730	7,231
Texas A&M International University	7,884	7,654	7,390	7,554	7,431	7,331
The University of Texas at Brownsville				7,477	8,570	8,009
Texas A&M University–San Antonio	6,616	6,470	5,474	4,521	4,512	4,133
The University of Texas of the Permian Basin	5,834	7,000	6,524	5,560	5,131	4,074
Midwestern State University	5,712	6,080	5,682	5,589	5,548	5,913
University of Houston–Victoria	4,381	4,427	4,144	4,407	4,491	4,335
University of North Texas at Dallas	3,757	3,513	3,030	2,575	2,140	2,106
Texas A&M University–Central Texas	2,464	2,611	2,619	2,316	2,404	2,259
Texas A&M University–Texarkana	2,067	2,066	1,993	1,812	1,805	1,966
Sul Ross State University	1,885	2,012	2,071	1,897	1,889	1,834
Texas A&M University–Galveston	1,806	2,483		2,174

 

[ADLER]

1 minute ago, DeepGreen said:

I wish someone would dig into Louisiana Tech to see "if" they have a student athletic fee.  LT fans say no way.  Several years ago I seem to recall running across something where they did charge students a per semester athletic fee.

They don't. The athletic departments at state schools are funded by the (cough, cough) State of Louisiana.

 

As a matter of fact, very few in-state students at Louisiana state schools even pay tuition, it too is paid by the state.

And somehow, in typical Louisiana bureaucratic fashion, the majority of those cost are somehow passed on to the taxpayers of the United States.

[DeepGreen]

Then hats off to Tech.

[greenminer]

ODU with a 24K enrollment bringing in triple the student fee budget vs. UNT.

[ttunt1970]

When we dropped to1AA our funding was below the LA schools because the state supplemented their budgets, but when the oil revenues dropped the funding dropped almost in half. That’s when they cut some programs and had to go schedule MONEY GAMES like us.

[MCMLXXX]

7 hours ago, ADLER said:

The University of North Texas has been very generous to its students while keeping student athletics contributions extremely low, especially for a full Division 1 program that includes football, that plays in on-campus facilities that are paid for by the athletic department. No public university in Texas even comes close to offering comparable value.

To put it simply, UNT students, by far, get the most bang for their buck.

Here are the student fees per credit hour as reported by UNT-Dallas this past month.

Athletic fee comparison of Texas public universities

UNT Dallas -- $7

Angelo State -- $8

University of Texas Arlington -- $8

Lamar -- $10

Midwestern State -- $10

Sul Ross State -- $10

Texas A&M San Antonio -- $10

Texas Southern -- $10

University of Texas Rio Grande -- $11

Texas A&M - Texarkana -- $11

UT El Paso -- $12

UT Permian Basin -- $12

Prairie View A&M -- $12

UNT -- $14

UT San Antonio -- $16

Texas A&M - Kingsville -- $17

Sam Houston State -- $20

Texas State -- $20

Texas A&M Corpus Christi -- $21

Tarleton State -- $22

Texas A&M International -- $23

Texas A&M - Commerce -- $32

 

 

UNT is $16.25 per hour. 

https://sfs.unt.edu/explanation-fees

 

Edited April 21, 2020 by MCMLXXX

[GrandGreen]

5 minutes ago, MCMLXXX said:

It is always best to use the actual source for information. UNT is $16.25 per hour. 

https://sfs.unt.edu/explanation-fees

Not unless you like comparing apples and oranges

If comparing data, it makes sense to use the same source. .

[MCMLXXX]

5 hours ago, DeepGreen said:

I wish someone would dig into Louisiana Tech to see "if" they have a student athletic fee.  LT fans say no way.  Several years ago I seem to recall running across something where they did charge students a per semester athletic fee.

 

4 hours ago, ADLER said:

As a matter of fact, very few in-state students at Louisiana state schools even pay tuition, it too is paid by the state.

And somehow, in typical Louisiana bureaucratic fashion, the majority of those cost are somehow passed on to the taxpayers of the United States.

A breakdown of LaTech revenues.

http://cafidatabase.knightcommission.org/fbs/c-usa/louisiana-tech-university#!quicktabs-tab-where_the_money-1