Feelings on Giving Money to UNT

MrStrange18 · February 21, 2020

I graduated in 2018. I take advantage of the Young Alumni discount program but intend to up my gift every year.... be it only a small gift now. They do not require much to take advantage of the program and its goes for 5 years. Its an easy way to get on board without digging too deep into your pockets.

LongJim · February 21, 2020

Someone is always going to bitch if they're called. Others will bitch when they aren't.

Oh well. Laissez faire les bon temps rouler, I guess.

Stan R · February 21, 2020

On 2/19/2020 at 10:59 PM, UNTLifer said:

Thanks for the compliment.

I worked my way through school and also had some help from scholarship money. I understand not maybe not being able to give immediately after graduation, but posting Nicholson shooting the finger is uncalled for. UNT students have never been conditioned to give back. I have been called to give at times in my life when I just couldn't swing it, but I wasn't upset or mad they were asking.

jimmy fallon agree GIF

97and03 · February 21, 2020

2 hours ago, TheColonyEagle said:

No I'm sure they just hate it....

Do you think it was some conspiracy to hike up tuition? Did they just arbitrarily decide that it would be fun?

The Texas legislature cut funding so tuition went up. At the same time funding formulas rewarded growing student populations which triggered the college arms race (needing to construct new dorms and such plus building expensive recreation centers and student unions and the like to attract students). Thus student fees also went up. Easy access to loans, however, made a free market approach somewhat irrelevant, since students could “afford” the rising costs by taking on debt.

But please don’t act like universities just wanted to charge more.

————————

“Since higher education funding is discretionary, increases in funding usually come in years when Texas’ economy is strong. It’s also often the first place to see cuts when the economy is on a downturn.
Tuition deregulation was done in 2003 in part to make up for higher education cuts made as lawmakers tried to address a $10 billion deficit without raising taxes. In 2011, higher education saw another round of budget cuts after the housing crash.”

“There’s only so much funding available after the state makes its required payments. Officials often say the state essentially “backs into” a total number for higher education within the overall general revenue without much wiggle room unless they decide to increase funding.

The state then uses formulas to distribute that allocated pot of money across all public universities. Formulas are based on the number of classes universities provide and semester credit hours are weighted depending on the class. For instance, a nursing or engineering class costs more to teach than an English or philosophy class, because they can require expensive equipment and lab space.”

“One thing is clear: since deregulation, every Texan attending college in-state has seen their tuition bill increase. Between 2003 and 2017, the statewide average total academic charges increased 138 percent. At the same time, state investment in higher education declined by six percent when adjusted for inflation.”

“Last year, Texas students graduated college with an average of almost $27,000 in student debt...about two times more than when deregulation took effect.“

https://alcalde.texasexes.org/2019/01/looking-at-higher-education-funding-in-texas-and-how-we-got-here/

“While the underlying concept of deregulation makes sense in more traditional free markets, proponents of the law in Texas failed to take a key factor into account: the explosion of readily accessible student loan debt.“

”Since 2003, tuition and fees at Texas public universities have more than doubled, and designated tuition (the portion of tuition set directly by the universities) has increased an astounding 222 percent.”

https://www.statesman.com/news/20161128/sen-schwertner-how-tuition-deregulation-is-failing-texas-students

https://www.texasmonthly.com/burka-blog/taking-on-tuition-deregulation/

GrandGreen · February 21, 2020

Yes, Texas cut funding but that is not the major reason that costs have soared.

Sports play a part as that so called institution funding has to come from somewhere. Most of it comes from student tuition

Add the costs of all the services and added infrastructure that has been added over the decades. . Much nicer buildings and student recreational facilities.

This all has been fueled by the easy access of student loans as noted.

meangreanmick · February 21, 2020

1 hour ago, GrandGreen said:

Yes, Texas cut funding but that is not the major reason that costs have soared.

Sports play a part as that so called institution funding has to come from somewhere. Most of it comes from student tuition

Add the costs of all the services and added infrastructure that has been added over the decades. . Much nicer buildings and student recreational facilities.

This all has been fueled by the easy access of student loans as noted.

That is not true, no part of tuition is used for athletics.

Tuition have risen for several reasons that a simple read of any number of studies will confirm:

- states cut funding due to budget issues

- significant increase in demand for college education. It’s nearly a requirement now to have a degree - increase demand = increase price

- increased financial aide. More money available so colleges can charge more.

other costs related to attending college have risen also, but not at the same rate as tuition.

GrandGreen · February 21, 2020

9 minutes ago, meangreanmick said:

That is not true, no part of tuition is used for athletics.

Tuition have risen for several reasons that a simple read of any number of studies will confirm:

- states cut funding due to budget issues

- significant increase in demand for college education. It’s nearly a requirement now to have a degree - increase demand = increase price

- increased financial aide. More money available so colleges can charge more.

other costs related to attending college have risen also, but not at the same rate as tuition.

How do you think those institutional funds are generated?

The vast majority of those funds are generated by student tuition.

As for as your reasons for tuition rising, seems to be about the same as I stated. Other than you erroneously believe that athletics are not substantially funded by tuition.

Plus I would disagree with your assertion of the increasing value of a college degree.

If anything, people are realizing that the value of a college degree is questionable. Due both to the increase in cost and the availability of higher paying non-degree required jobs.

97and03 · February 22, 2020

Just for clarification, we often use the term “tuition” to encompass a student’s payment but technically tuition and fees are separate charges.
As much as tuition has gone up, fees also keep getting tacked on. So what the poster is referring to is that Texas schools can’t dip into tuition money for sports or other activities. So they get charged fees for services. Athletic fee, rec center fee, computer fee, international education fee, health center fee, student service fee, etc. It adds up.
And undergrad liberal arts student taking 18 hours will pay $1,423.53 in fees on top of the $4,351.65 in tuition each semester.

Edited February 22, 2020 by 97and03

GrandGreen · February 22, 2020

43 minutes ago, 97and03 said:

Just for clarification, we often use the term “tuition” to encompass a student’s payment but technically tuition and fees are separate charges.
As much as tuition has gone up, fees also keep getting tacked on. So what the poster is referring to is that Texas schools can’t dip into tuition money for sports or other activities. So they get charged fees for services. Athletic fee, rec center fee, computer fee, international education fee, health center fee, student service fee, etc. It adds up.
And undergrad liberal arts student taking 18 hours will pay $1,423.53 in fees on top of the $4,351.65 in tuition each semester.

Ok, again where do you think those institutional funds come from that miraculously cover the shortages in the athletic revenues?

Why do you think athletics can't receive funds generated by tuition?

In Texas they do not receive state funds, but that has nothing to do with tuition.

Most universities cannot come close to generating revenues necessary to cover their costs in the ever increasing athletic arms races. Guarantees, ticket revenues, donations, conference and NCAA distributions, etc. probably no longer even cover the coaches and AD salaries.

To make up this shortfall, students have been in some cases asked, but in most instances forced to contribute more. This could be in the form of additional fees or just higher tuition.

I doubt NT athletics has ever had a program that didn't heavily rely on student money, whether in the form of fees or tuition.

97and03 · February 22, 2020

Oh I agree that the university has to make up for revenue shortfalls and that students largely fit the bill. I remember T one point a few years ago we had one of the highest percentages of amount of AD budget financed by student fees.

Hence the need for alumni donations.

Matt from A700 · February 22, 2020

I can't afford to give back at the moment but when I was called I treated the guy with respect because a) I'm in sales, too and b) he was a student probably making these calls (this call was 7pm Eastern) to help pay for his schooling.

MeanGreen2019 · February 22, 2020

On 2/19/2020 at 9:30 PM, 97and03 said:

This is why I like the AD’s program for free tickets and $25 donation levels. Establishing the connection and even a small level of giving early is a great approach.

I highly support asking recent grads to give $10 a year for the first five years.
@GMG_Dallas would you give 10?

I agree. I graduated last spring and donated $25 to the athletic program. I have a good amount of student loans that I’m paying off, but $25 for the whole year isn’t a ridiculous sacrifice.

cogido · February 22, 2020

An SMU alum called after reading this board with its hard luck stories. The Pony grads are taking up a collection to buy the po ntsu unemployed a Snicker bar and a cup of lemonade at the next game given the sad state of affairs. Gotta luv $$$MU.

GMG24 · February 23, 2020

On 2/20/2020 at 10:23 AM, GMG_Dallas said:

Find me other 4 year universities in Texas that are cheaper. I'll wait.

San Angelo State, Tarleton State, UTA, A&M Commerce, A&M Corpus Christi, Midwestern State University

I can keep going.

GrandGreen · February 23, 2020

17 minutes ago, GMG24 said:

San Angelo State, Tarleton State, UTA, A&M Commerce, A&M Corpus Christi, Midwestern State University

I can keep going.

NT has a better football team than any of those schools.

Joking, but even attempting to escape my bias: I would argue those are not overall equivalent institutions.

GMG_Dallas · February 24, 2020

4 hours ago, GMG24 said:

San Angelo State, Tarleton State, UTA, A&M Commerce, A&M Corpus Christi, Midwestern State University

I can keep going.

I'm not going to look at all your examples but I looked at UTA because they're in DFW. Per their website, their tuition is $27,280 per year which is about $2000 more per year than UNT per UNT's website.

My statement wasn't clear. While I'm sure there are other universities in Texas that are cheaper, from what I've seen they're mostly no more than $2,000 less. My comment was regarding the belief that you can go to a 4 year school, get a degree, and not get into debt with today's costs unless you have a scholarship or your parents are paying for you to go or unless you work 50+ hours per week, take 1 or 2 classes per semester, live with your parents, and take 6 years to graduate thus starting your career later. $2,000 less per year is a lot of money but you're still accumulating debt doing to any one of those schools you mentioned.

Salsa_Verde · February 24, 2020

That extra 2,000 at UTA is for the privilege of going to a University of Texas-Almost franchise 🥴

GMG24 · February 24, 2020

16 hours ago, GrandGreen said:

NT has a better football team than any of those schools.

Joking, but even attempting to escape my bias: I would argue those are not overall equivalent institutions.

Eh, you probably have a fair argument, but I would argue most places really don't care where your degree is from.

GMG24 · February 24, 2020

11 hours ago, GMG_Dallas said:

I'm not going to look at all your examples but I looked at UTA because they're in DFW. Per their website, their tuition is $27,280 per year which is about $2000 more per year than UNT per UNT's website.

My statement wasn't clear. While I'm sure there are other universities in Texas that are cheaper, from what I've seen they're mostly no more than $2,000 less. My comment was regarding the belief that you can go to a 4 year school, get a degree, and not get into debt with today's costs unless you have a scholarship or your parents are paying for you to go or unless you work 50+ hours per week, take 1 or 2 classes per semester, live with your parents, and take 6 years to graduate thus starting your career later. $2,000 less per year is a lot of money but you're still accumulating debt doing to any one of those schools you mentioned.

Not disagreeing, I graduated 7 years ago, and still have about 8 grand left to pay off.

UNTFan23 · February 24, 2020

If you want to see just how much tuition has exploded in Texas and specifically for North Texas, you can go to this site.

Aldo · February 24, 2020

It's that top-heavy, administrative bloat.

Too many overpaid VPs.

I recall mid-recession hiring and raise freezes, while VPs were getting bonuses and stipends (some, not all).

GrandGreen · February 24, 2020

3 hours ago, GMG24 said:

Eh, you probably have a fair argument, but I would argue most places really don't care where your degree is from.

I don't know what jobs you have interviewed for, but I strongly disagree with your statement.

In the extreme, no employer is going to believe a NT degree is equivalent to an Ivy League education.

Experience usually trumps educational background, but particularly in entrance level positions;. the degree is very important.

If you are trying to get a job in the financial, technical, or educational segments that degree is very important.

As for as most places, that is true because most jobs do not require any degree. If you are skilled enough to be a good sales person or technician than the degree or lack of one is not a major factor.

KRAM1 · February 25, 2020

21 hours ago, GrandGreen said:

I don't know what jobs you have interviewed for, but I strongly disagree with your statement.

In the extreme, no employer is going to believe a NT degree is equivalent to an Ivy League education.

Experience usually trumps educational background, but particularly in entrance level positions;. the degree is very important.

If you are trying to get a job in the financial, technical, or educational segments that degree is very important.

As for as most places, that is true because most jobs do not require any degree. If you are skilled enough to be a good sales person or technician than the degree or lack of one is not a major factor.

I have always said, and seen through the many years of hiring experiences, that a degree only helps you get your first job. After that, it is on you to build a body of work and a work attitude that propels you further in your career. I only looked at "where", if I was interviewing someone for their first job. After that, I wanted to see what they have done and how successful that had become. Period. Podunk U. was fine with me if they were knocking it dead in their career and had the skill set and experience we needed.

Now, did I seek out U&NT grads? Yep...and hired a few in my time. But, that Ivy League degree you have means zilch if you aren't getting it done after being hired.

Anyway, just my observation...

El Paso Eagle · February 25, 2020

1 hour ago, KRAM1 said:

I have always said, and seen through the many years of hiring experiences, that a degree only helps you get your first job. After that, it is on you to build a body of work and a work attitude that propels you further in your career. I only looked at "where", if I was interviewing someone for their first job. After that, I wanted to see what they have done and how successful that had become. Period. Podunk U. was fine with me if they were knocking it dead in their career and had the skill set and experience we needed.

Now, did I seek out U&NT grads? Yep...and hired a few in my time. But, that Ivy League degree you have means zilch if you aren't getting it done after being hired.

Anyway, just my observation...

Agree for the most on this. My first job out of college they brought in four "new grads". Myself, one from NM State, A&M, and Prude. Long story short the ones from A&M and Prude were not the ones who got the promotions. I was fortunate to have a great professor, Dr. Bimmerle, who had me so prepared for the "real world" that I was able to do well.