DRC Sunday column: UNT's C-USA title dreams are going to require a defensive renaissance

[Brett Vito]

DRC: UNT has struggled defensively in big spots over the last few years. Littrell must figure out if it's the players, the scheme or a combination of both

https://dentonrc.com/sports/brett-vito-unt-s-c-usa-title-dreams-are-going/article_28f871fc-d432-5685-9fd5-7efaec3a59f7.html

[Pavlovs Eagle]

Just once I hope to read a Seth Littrell quote the truly explains team deficiencies that lead to a loss.  And each time I read something that basically equates to Littrell explaining that a winning team is the one with the most points on the board at the end.

Gee Whiz! Thanks for deep dive into the X's and O's Coach!

🙄

[UNTLifer]

Littrell isn't one to throw players or coaches under the bus, even if it would make you all feel better.

[FirefightnRick]

UNT must find a way to play big defensively in big games if it’s ever going to get to where it wants to go.

 

 

Rick

[NorthTexasWeLove]

48 minutes ago, UNTLifer said:

Littrell isn't one to throw players or coaches under the bus, even if it would make you all feel better.

Pretty sure he indirectly does this with some frequency. After losses he often times conjures up the words effort and execution and sets those words on the doorstep of the players. 

[NorthTexasSportsNetwork]

16 minutes ago, NorthTexasWeLove said:

Pretty sure he indirectly does this with some frequency. After losses he often times conjures up the words effort and execution and sets those words on the doorstep of the players. 

But he also refers to himself and coaches. Really most of the losses in the past few years, he's said "Us coaches will get corrected, and we will all get better" BS

[wardly]

The bottom line is the we have been over rated the past two seasons, and it caught up with us this year.Our defense was a concern to me after watching the Abilene Christian win and culminated with out butt whipping by Houston. You can blame it on the DC,but he only coaches the players he has. This goes back to our recruiting ,which is as over rated as this years team.

[SilverEagle]

Quote

“We didn’t make enough stops,” UNT coach Seth Littrell said. “When you give up 32 points in the second half, it’s hard to beat people.”

Wow! I'm sure glad he's getting paid 1.8 mil to dispense such great wisdom. Because, Damn! I never would have figured that one out.

[SilverEagle]

32 minutes ago, wardly said:

The bottom line is the we have been over rated the past two seasons, and it caught up with us this year.Our defense was a concern to me after watching the Abilene Christian win and culminated with out butt whipping by Houston. You can blame it on the DC,but he only coaches the players he has. This goes back to our recruiting ,which is as over rated as this years team.

So if players of the exact right size and exact right speed are not handed to him by the recruitment coordinator, he's just helpless as a coach?

I seem to recall reading a few years ago about how Gary Patterson typically moves players to positions they've never played before and DEVELOPING them into all-conference players in the position they were moved....in most cases to the defense.  

Our own history has many examples of players that started one place and were ASSESSED and DEVELOPED to play at another position. 

For instance, Cedric Hardeman came to NT as a safety/running back and eventually developed into a pretty good DE.

Rex Johnson (late 80's.) was an all-american MLB in Juco, but Corkey Nelson moved him to nose tackle where he developed into an All-American (1-AA) at that position. 

addendum:

One more example. Steve Williams (Austin) (#96 on your program) was an almost elite RB in HS. By the time he got to North Texas (via JUCO) he was playing DE for NT. 

Edited October 28, 2019 by SilverEagle

[FirefightnRick]

1 minute ago, SilverEagle said:

So if players of the exact right size and exact right speed are not handed to him by the recruitment coordinator, he's just helpless as a coach?

I seem to recall reading a few years ago about how Garry Patterson typically moves players to positions they've never played before and DEVELOPING them into all-conference players in the position they were moved. 

Our own history has many examples of players that started one place and were ASSESSED and DEVELOPED to play at another position. 

For instance, Cedric Hardeman came to NT as a safety/running back and eventually developed into a pretty good DE.

Rex Johnson (late 80's.) was an all-american MLB in Juco, but Corkey Nelson moved him to nose tackle where he developed into an All-American (1-AA) at that position. 

 

 

I thought about this and what Gary Patterson would have done with some of our players.  And there’s a good chance that if Bean is as fast as they say he is and as fast as he looks that Patterson would have moved him to a DB position or at least considered it?

 

Rick

[UNTLifer]

16 hours ago, NorthTexasWeLove said:

Pretty sure he indirectly does this with some frequency. After losses he often times conjures up the words effort and execution and sets those words on the doorstep of the players. 

Sorry, I wasn't specific enough.  Littrell doesn't point out specific players and coaches and throw them under the bus.

[wardly]

6 hours ago, SilverEagle said:

So if players of the exact right size and exact right speed are not handed to him by the recruitment coordinator, he's just helpless as a coach?

I seem to recall reading a few years ago about how Gary Patterson typically moves players to positions they've never played before and DEVELOPING them into all-conference players in the position they were moved....in most cases to the defense.  

Our own history has many examples of players that started one place and were ASSESSED and DEVELOPED to play at another position. 

For instance, Cedric Hardeman came to NT as a safety/running back and eventually developed into a pretty good DE.

Rex Johnson (late 80's.) was an all-american MLB in Juco, but Corkey Nelson moved him to nose tackle where he developed into an All-American (1-AA) at that position. 

addendum:

One more example. Steve Williams (Austin) (#96 on your program) was an almost elite RB in HS. By the time he got to North Texas (via JUCO) he was playing DE for NT. 

I don't think either of us know exactly how good [or bad[ the talent our defensive coaches have to work with. Granted some players change positions when they play in college, but they are the exception. Also, its kind of silly to speculate on what Patterson would do with our defense. The bottom line is that our defense stinks, which , in my opinion , is LOFT, a lack of frigging talent. At seasons end see how many of our players, if any, make the CUSA All Conference roster. I realize its easier to fire the Defensive Coordinator  and not the team, but the reality is that we are probably right back where were before Littrell arrived, should be grateful for 17' and 18', and prepare for a rebuilding year 2020.

[Mean Green Matt]

We need a defensive renaissance, plus:

1) We win the rest of our games to finish 6-2 in conference. 

2) Southern Miss to lose two of (UAB, WKU, FAU)

3) UAB to beat La Tech in Birmingham. 

I think that would put NT, La Tech and UAB all at 6-2 and we would have the tiebreak over both. 

There is still a pathway. We just have to win. 

[DeepGreen]

To add to Silver Eagle's post above, add Brad Kassel(sp?) to the list.  Was a high school QB and developed into one of best linebackers I've ever seen at UNT.

[FirefightnRick]

1 hour ago, DeepGreen said:

To add to Silver Eagle's post above, add Brad Kassel(sp?) to the list.  Was a high school QB and developed into one of best linebackers I've ever seen at UNT.

Matt Turney from 2A Muleshoe, moved from DT to Left Tackle and started three seasons winning 2 conference championships and a bowl game.

 

Rick

[Salsa_Verde]

2 hours ago, DeepGreen said:

To add to Silver Eagle's post above, add Brad Kassel(sp?) to the list.  Was a high school QB and developed into one of best linebackers I've ever seen at UNT.

Played for the Tennessee Titans for a bit of I’m not mistaken? 

[untjim1995]

Again, Gary Patterson is a master at seeing a RB in high school and envisioning him being a big time contributor on the Front Seven of his defense. Nobody else in the Southwest does it like this. He’s a throwback to when the best athletes were always placed on defense.

These spread offense head coaches rarely care about defense. They defensive minded head coach may bring in an OC to implement the spread, but an offensive minded head coach rarely has any interest in emphasizing defense. Look at Leach, Briles, Sumlin, Kingsbury, Morris, Dodge, and Littrell. Not a one of them ever has had a defense to write home about. They never have defenses to win them a game. It’s always about getting a couple of stops so the offense can get the ball back to score. 

Maybe SL changes this all and becomes the blueprint for being a spread offense coach that also Emphasizes defense, but I’m not holding my breath. Too many examples above to change my mind on this. Add in very poor defensive coaching in Texas high school football which is now just glorified 7-on-7, and now you see why this area of the country hasn’t was jack when they face physical teams in the last decade. A&M barely competes in the SEC, the Big XII doesn’t give a rip about defenses, and the TX G5 programs usually have gotten routed when they play physical teams from outside of Texas. Add in the fact that we have been at or near the bottom of the totem pole here in Texas for recruiting and it’s not hard to see why we are where we are and to not feel real optimistic about what lies ahead. It’s not a bright picture at all...

[ADLER]

1 hour ago, Salsa_Verde said:

Played for the Tennessee Titans for a bit of I’m not mistaken? 

Jets

[GangGreen]

Cody Spencer played for the Titans.

[outoftown]

On 10/28/2019 at 1:17 AM, UNTLifer said:

Littrell isn't one to throw players or coaches under the bus, even if it would make you all feel better.

I have no problem with him protecting players. But I do feel he is a bit very protective of the coaches including himself. It is always extremely general when it comes to what is happening in terms of coaching.

This works well when everything goes mostly well, but I will apply the same rule I applied to MacCarney here: If things go bad, you need to provide a detailed, sensible and logically understandable reason for why the fanbase should be more patient with coaches than suggested based purely on recent results. The reason for this is because in absence of details the coaches DO get judged only on results because there is simply nothing else to go on (apart from the usual propaganda that fans have usually learnt to discount after a bad year or two), and if the results are bad this means the fan base is right to lose patience with the coach. If things go very bad that usually means things such as the fan base calling for his firing etc.

We are not there yet, but him communicating more honestly about what is going on with his decisions could actually buy him some room for error, right now it is dwindling. I mean imagine this board if UTEP or Rice is an L. This board may not make any decisions, but it is a good representation of what is going on among the hardcore fans and coaching when you lose those becomes a lot harder.

Edited October 29, 2019 by outoftown