K-State could win the Big 12 anytime

emmitt01 · December 4, 2018

If a meteor wiped out the entire state of Oklahoma

And Austin...and Fort Worth for good measure

And the cross state rival hadn’t just hired a guy with a national title on his resume

So, basically, anytime they want.

CMJ · December 4, 2018

They did make three title game in the early years of the league, winning one. I do think it's more than possible to win a title there. But it'll never be a OU or Texas. About every 3-4 seasons they'll have a talented enough team where they can cash in if things go their way. It's all about capitalizing when they do.

emmitt01 · December 4, 2018

15 minutes ago, CMJ said:

They did make three title game in the early years of the league, winning one. I do think it's more than possible to win a title there. But it'll never be a OU or Texas. About every 3-4 seasons they'll have a talented enough team where they can cash in if things go their way. It's all about capitalizing when they do.

So, out of the 17 times the Big XII has played a championship game, K-State has played in 3 (and won 1). So, if history holds, Seth can hope to reach the conference title game every 6 or so years and win every decade and a half.

Now THAT is an enticing opportunity!!

UNTexas · December 4, 2018

7 minutes ago, emmitt01 said:

So, out of the 17 times the Big XII has played a championship game, K-State has played in 3 (and won 1). So, if history holds, Seth can hope to reach the conference title game every 6 or so years and win every decade and a half.

Now THAT is an enticing opportunity!!

Did Littrell tske the job and I missed thst one?

CMJ · December 4, 2018

18 minutes ago, emmitt01 said:

So, out of the 17 times the Big XII has played a championship game, K-State has played in 3 (and won 1). So, if history holds, Seth can hope to reach the conference title game every 6 or so years and win every decade and a half.

Now THAT is an enticing opportunity!!

The 2012 team won the league title...in a year the league had no title game.

I'm just saying it's more possible than you insinuated. And coaches have huge egos.

Edited December 4, 2018 by CMJ

untjim1995 · December 4, 2018

Look at how fast KSU fell apart when Snyder retired the first time and Ron Prince took over for 3 years...he leaves, they immediately begin losing again and both KU and Mizzou soared.

drex · December 4, 2018

Recruiting to Manhattan, Kansas must be a nightmare.

MeanGreenTexan · December 4, 2018

I guess kinda like North Texas could win our conference anytime?

I mean, since the last time we did (2004, in a conference that everyone likes to poo-poo anyway), KSSt has won the Big 12 North multiple times & outright won the conference championship once. We've won 1 division crown... and it was under Littrell's watch!

So heck, I think Emmitt just made a STRONGER argument for Littrell to go to KSSt. Way to go Emmitt. If Littrell leaves, I'm blaming you.

meangreenlax · December 4, 2018

If SL can't win a CUSA championship, what makes you think he can win one in the Big 12?

I love the guy and what he's done for the program but there's still a lot he and the team need to prove on the field. The way we blew big games this season, I can't tell if it was coaching or the players.

Edited December 4, 2018 by meangreenlax

PlummMeanGreen · December 4, 2018

8 minutes ago, MeanGreenTexan said:

I guess kinda like North Texas could win our conference anytime?

I mean, since the last time we did (2004, in a conference that everyone likes to poo-poo anyway), KSSt has won the Big 12 North multiple times & outright won the conference championship once. We've won 1 division crown... and it was under Littrell's watch!

So heck, I think Emmitt just made a STRONGER argument for Littrell to go to KSSt. Way to go Emmitt. If Littrell leaves, I'm blaming you.

I know you jest about Emmitt, but 2 extremely poorly attended rain out games this season keep popping up in my mind as clinchers for SL. Those 2 games might have even inspired WB to brush up on his own resume’.

GMG!

Green P1 · December 4, 2018

Does Kansas St still have that fat guy that wears a cardboard mask pumping them up before games?

I could see that as a positive for us.

meangreenlax · December 4, 2018

29 minutes ago, PlummMeanGreen said:

I know you jest about Emmitt, but 2 extremely poorly attended rain out games this season keep popping up in my mind as clinchers for SL. Those 2 games might have even inspired WB to brush up on his own resume’.

GMG!

If that’s the case most P5 coaches should be looking for new jobs too. Look at Big 12 attendance. It’s not exactly great, especially with bad weather. This is the new norm in college football. You either have an empty small stadium, or an empty big one.

meangreanmick · December 4, 2018

29 minutes ago, PlummMeanGreen said:

I know you jest about Emmitt, but 2 extremely poorly attended rain out games this season keep popping up in my mind as clinchers for SL. Those 2 games might have even inspired WB to brush up on his own resume’.

GMG!

Its all relative and if that little of a situation impacts him that much, he isn’t tough enough to coach college football (my point is, he seems like a tough man so I doubt that fazed him).

K state was 7th in attendance in B12, we were 4th in ConfUSA (and about avg 1000 people to be in 1st), despite those games. So that means he saw far more fans at Apogee than most of the conference games played in confUSA. It will be the opposite at K State.

And for those that think he is going for the chance to compete for national championships, K state has won exactly zero national championships in any team sport ever. So good luck in that endeavor. They are rarely a player in the Big12 championship in football, so that’s big giant hill to climb. History says if your last name isn’t Snyder, there is a good chance your career will be arriving at a deadend in Kansas.

MeanGreenTexan · December 4, 2018

7 minutes ago, meangreanmick said:

Its all relative and if that little of a situation impacts him that much, he isn’t tough enough to coach college football (my point is, he seems like a tough man so I doubt that fazed him).

K state was 7th in attendance in B12, we were 4th in ConfUSA (and about avg 1000 people to be in 1st), despite those games. So that means he saw far more fans at Apogee than most of the conference games played in confUSA. It will be the opposite at K State.

And for those that think he is going for the chance to compete for national championships, K state has won exactly zero national championships in any team sport ever. So good luck in that endeavor. They are rarely a player in the Big12 championship in football, so that’s big giant hill to climb. History says if your last name isn’t Snyder, there is a good chance your career will be arriving at a deadend in Kansas.

I can almost guarantee you, in his mind, the only thing KSSt needs in order to win the Big12 & National Championship is... him.

Also, I suppose North Texas provides more opportunity to do so?

DeepGreen · December 4, 2018

1 hour ago, PlummMeanGreen said:

I know you jest about Emmitt, but 2 extremely poorly attended rain out games this season keep popping up in my mind as clinchers for SL. Those 2 games might have even inspired WB to brush up on his own resume’.

GMG!

Curse you, Plummer! Losing Littrell, followed by Wren Baker would put this athletic program in "dumpster alert"!! I'd like to see some "positive" consistency in North Texas Athletics before I die!

Edited December 4, 2018 by DeepGreen

meangreanmick · December 4, 2018

3 minutes ago, MeanGreenTexan said:

I can almost guarantee you, in his mind, the only thing KSSt needs in order to win the Big12 & National Championship is... him.

Also, I suppose North Texas provides more opportunity to do so?

Obviously, north Texas provides no opportunity to do that. I’m sure he thinks that, but he has no shot. OU is on a roll with a lot of momentum and Texas is on a tremendous upward rise with a ton of resources behind them, the most in the country. He won’t compete for a conference championship for the next 5-6 years at best, if ever.

IF he gets offered the job, I don’t blame the guy for leaving. He has a calculated risk either way. He can take the money now and hope he can cobble together 2-3 winning seasons and quickly jump somewhere else. More likely, he won’t be successful and will either be fired in 3-4 years and be relagated to assistant jobs for the last years of his career (Prince has been in 7 different assistant jobs since being fired at KSU) or he will do just enough to get by and hang out there for 10 or so years and make a lot of money. Even if he is fired in the short term, he will have been able to bank a lot of money and be nicely set for retirement.

His other option would be stay at North Texas and hope he can continue winning and win some conference championships and then jump to a better job than KSU where he really could compete for a P5 conference championship and maybe National.

career aside, most people would take the guaranteed money now, can’t blame him for that. I’m just saying, nobody should act like KSU is some job where he can compete for anything. It’s a lot more money for his family, gets to coach in P5, and a roll of the dice to maybe make a quick jump somewhere.

MeanGreenTexan · December 4, 2018

1 minute ago, meangreanmick said:

Obviously, north Texas provides no opportunity to do that. I’m sure he thinks that, but he has no shot. OU is on a roll with a lot of momentum and Texas is on a tremendous upward rise with a ton of resources behind them, the most in the country. He won’t compete for a conference championship for the next 5-6 years at best, if ever.

IF he gets offered the job, I don’t blame the guy for leaving. He has a calculated risk either way. He can take the money now and hope he can cobble together 2-3 winning seasons and quickly jump somewhere else. More likely, he won’t be successful and will either be fired in 3-4 years and be relagated to assistant jobs for the last years of his career (Prince has been in 7 different assistant jobs since being fired at KSU) or he will do just enough to get by and hang out there for 10 or so years and make a lot of money. Even if he is fired in the short term, he will have been able to bank a lot of money and be nicely set for retirement.

His other option would be stay at North Texas and hope he can continue winning and win some conference championships and then jump to a better job than KSU where he really could compete for a P5 conference championship and maybe National.

career aside, most people would take the guaranteed money now, can’t blame him for that. I’m just saying, nobody should act like KSU is some job where he can compete for anything. It’s a lot more money for his family, gets to coach in P5, and a roll of the dice to maybe make a quick jump somewhere.

This is a very common misconception around here:
Only 2 options -
"Stay at NT & win to get a better opportunity than <XYZ>",
OR
"go to <XYZ> who is not set up to win now (likely the reason they're looking for a coach!) and lose, & never get a better opportunity."

I just don't buy that at all. If he has the same success at KSSt as he's had here (noticeable improvement in year 1, then maintain a high level of success... that obviously doesn't have to include championships, because it didn't here), he'll get a better opportunity.

meangreanmick · December 4, 2018

26 minutes ago, MeanGreenTexan said:

This is a very common misconception around here:
Only 2 options -
"Stay at NT & win to get a better opportunity than <XYZ>",
OR
"go to <XYZ> who is not set up to win now (likely the reason they're looking for a coach!) and lose, & never get a better opportunity."

I just don't buy that at all. If he has the same success at KSSt as he's had here (noticeable improvement in year 1, then maintain a high level of success... that obviously doesn't have to include championships, because it didn't here), he'll get a better opportunity.

A misconception, so you are saying there is no chance he goes to KSU and fails and doesn’t get another chance at the high end P5 job he wants? History says otherwise.

You are missing my point anyway, that’s not what I said. I didn’t say it was only one of those 2 options you laid out, I said it was a calculated risk either way, to stay or go, and I didn’t blame him for taking the money. He might go and have enough success in 2-3 years to jump to the job he wants. BUT, nobody with realistic look at college football would believe he would take KSU job to go compete for national championships.

And yes, I wish UNT football was where KSU was, so no, I’m not saying this job is better than that one.

KSU is a bottom half P5 programs (and Big12 for that matter). They win just enough here and there to give fans hope that maybe someday. But they have never had any real sustained success at the top of P5.

they have had 6 football CONFERENCE championships since 1909, and only 2 in the last 75 years.

It could be a misconception on my part, but no real history of football success for the past 75 years, low end of P5 resources, trying to recruit kids to Kansas, seems like there is a risk of failing at the P5 level at a place like that.

EDIT: and yes he could stay at Notth Texas and fail, that’s why it’s a calculated risk either way.

Edited December 4, 2018 by meangreanmick

MeanGreenTexan · December 4, 2018

3 minutes ago, meangreanmick said:

A misconception, so you are saying there is no chance he goes to KSU and fails and doesn’t get another chance at the high end P5 job he wants? History says otherwise.

You are missing my point anyway, that’s not what I said. I didn’t say it was only one of those 2 options you laid out, I said it was a calculated risk either way, to stay or go, and I didn’t blame him for taking the money. He might go and have enough success in 2-3 years to jump to the job he wants. BUT, nobody with realistic look at college football would believe he would take KSU job to go compete for national championships.

And yes, I wish UNT football was where KSU was, so no, I’m not saying this job is better than that one.

KSU is a bottom half P5 programs (and Big12 for that matter). They win just enough here and there to give fans hope that maybe someday. But they have never had any real sustained success at the top of P5.

they have had 6 football CONFERENCE championships since 1909, and only 2 in the last 75 years.

It could be a misconception on my part, but no real history of football success for the past 75 years, low end of P5 resources, trying to recruit kids to Kansas, seems like there is a risk of failing at the P5 level at a place like that.

You said it was "more likely" he would fail. I don't think so.
"or his other option", which to me sounds like you think he has 2 options: Stay here, or "more likely" fail at KSSt.

Every single negative thing you said about KSSt was applicable to North Texas prior to him wanting to take this job. And he turned this thing around VERY quickly... so here we are. We're lucky to have him, and I think KSSt would be too.

Mike Jackson · December 4, 2018

11 minutes ago, MeanGreenTexan said:

You said it was "more likely" he would fail. I don't think so.
"or his other option", which to me sounds like you think he has 2 options: Stay here, or "more likely" fail at KSSt.

Every single negative thing you said about KSSt was applicable to North Texas prior to him wanting to take this job. And he turned this thing around VERY quickly... so here we are. We're lucky to have him, and I think KSSt would be too.

Incorrect there are no relative juggernauts in CUSA that dominate the conference. Compared to our division foes Denton is one of the best places to recruit to. A good recruiting team and head coach in Denton should always have top 3 recruiting class for CUSA. You definitely cannot say that about KSU. If you get consistent top 3 Big 12 Recruiting class at KSU you are a miracle worker. Relative to our conferences KSU is in a weaker position than UNT.

MeanGreenTexan · December 4, 2018

5 minutes ago, Mike Jackson said:

Incorrect there are no relative juggernauts in CUSA that dominate the conference. Compared to our division foes Denton is one of the best places to recruit to. A good recruiting team and head coach in Denton should always have top 3 recruiting class for CUSA. You definitely cannot say that about KSU. If you get consistent top 3 Big 12 Recruiting class at KSU you are a miracle worker. Relative to our conferences KSU is in a weaker position than UNT.

You say that, NOW, after Littrell has transformed us.
Prior to that, who was going to compete with C-USA West juggernaut LATech, who continuously brought in top classes & transfers, and won C-USA 3 of 4 years.

People, just like UNT in 2015, KSU is not looking for a new coach because they're in a good place RIGHT NOW. Yet, he took our job in 2015, and here we are. Everyone noticed, not just KSU, and now we're worried.

All About UNT · December 4, 2018

2 hours ago, Green P1 said:

Does Kansas St still have that fat guy that wears a cardboard mask pumping them up before games?

I could see that as a positive for us.

ahh yes. Time for a revisit. Dude is probably face-down in a bowl of spaghetti at this point since he hasn't been seen online in years.

southsideguy · December 4, 2018

2 minutes ago, All About UNT said:

ahh yes. Time for a revisit

Does UTEP still have their crazy guy who does videos?

Mike Jackson · December 4, 2018

6 minutes ago, MeanGreenTexan said:

You say that, NOW, after Littrell has transformed us.
Prior to that, who was going to compete with C-USA West juggernaut LATech, who continuously brought in top classes & transfers, and won C-USA 3 of 4 years.

People, just like UNT in 2015, KSU is not looking for a new coach because they're in a good place RIGHT NOW. Yet, he took our job in 2015, and here we are. Everyone noticed, not just KSU, and now we're worried.

Nope I said it back before he came. Since UNT invested in the program after Dickey. And if we hired a competent staff to replace Dickey we would have been nearly as bad as we were.

And if you are comparing La Tech's relative conference strength to OU's AND Texas 🤷🏾‍♂️ I don't even know how to address that.

PlummMeanGreen · December 4, 2018

1 hour ago, DeepGreen said:

Curse you, Plummer! Losing Littrell, followed by Wren Baker would put this athletic program in "dumpster alert"!! I'd like to see some "positive" consistency in North Texas Athletics before I die!