4 and 1

[Big Z]

Is it me or are we that bad at converting on 4 and 1s?

[southsideguy]

we are terrible at it, cant we run the fullback ?  He has the size and if the qb lines up under the center i think or odds go up greatly or put Quinn in the game.

[peanuts104]

We always seem to call plays that pull linemen.  The broadcasters even were able to point it out, you can't do that on 4th and 1 if they're expecting you to run it.  You just gotta get 7 on the line, tell them to push for a yard and tel your back to find the soft spot if you're going to run it out of the gun.  We get too cute with it on 4th and 1.  Make the oline move them a yard back.  Or throw play action.  I don't think we've thrown a play action pass on 4th and 1 all season.

[southsideguy]

I think one time we did play action on a fourth down and it was successful.  I can't remember which game it was.

[NM Green]

4-1 make me as nervous as gray uniforms and a 17,21 or 28 point lead.

retire the gray.

GMG

[southsideguy]

I

57 minutes ago, NM Green said:

4-1 make me as nervous as gray uniforms and a 17,21 or 28 point lead.

retire the gray.

GMG

I think we need to burn the gray, bury them and put a voodoo curse on the spot we bury them.

[UNT 90 Grad]

On the 4th and 1 against UTSA, in the post game interview, Fine said it was his bad.  He said he misread the defense on the option.  Torrey was classy about it in his post game interview and simply said he should have gotten the first down (yet there was no place for him to go).

Edited November 25, 2018 by UNT 90 Grad

[Cerebus]

If this team could convert on short power yardage it would be 12-0 right now.

Is it personnel? Play calling? Execution? It's s big enough problem that it's probably a little of everything.

[MeanGreenTexan]

1 hour ago, Cerebus said:

If this team could convert on short power yardage it would be 12-0 right now.

Is it personnel? Play calling? Execution? It's s big enough problem that it's probably a little of everything.

I don't think it's a coincidence that we lose Easly, and all-of-a-sudden we cannot get tough yards up the middle.

Torrey is great, but he's more of a scat-back kind of guy.  A gasher.   Someone who is great in space or to run up the middle when the defense is concerned about the pass.

But when it's an apparent power formation, and the box is stacked... any contact up the middle from DLs or LBs, and he goes down quickly.

[TheColonyEagle]

1 hour ago, Cerebus said:

If this team could convert on short power yardage it would be 12-0 right now.

Is it personnel? Play calling? Execution? It's s big enough problem that it's probably a little of everything.

I believe it was @meanrob who said this in another thread....

Why was it never considered to bring in Shanbour in those situations? He has been really good at the read option (and Mason is not really a threat to run) Teams do it ALL THE TIME....have a short yardage package with a different look. Having that threat there for the QB to run sure seems like it would've been effective to pick up 1 yard.

Did GH ever even consider this? 

[southsideguy]

GH should burn his 4-1 play it has not worked.  We need a big back, I do not think Easly will be back.

[DeepGreen]

20 hours ago, NM Green said:

4-1 make me as nervous as gray uniforms and a 17,21 or 28 point lead.

retire the gray.

GMG

Burn the gray!  It's an evil color....and we tend to lose wearing it.

[MGNation92]

22 minutes ago, TheColonyEagle said:

I believe it was @meanrob who said this in another thread....

Why was it never considered to bring in Shanbour in those situations? He has been really good at the read option (and Mason is not really a threat to run) Teams do it ALL THE TIME....have a short yardage package with a different look. Having that threat there for the QB to run sure seems like it would've been effective to pick up 1 yard.

Did GH ever even consider this? 

Nah, he's too busy thinking about the next time he'll run the QB draw on 3rd and long.

[greenminer]

2 hours ago, MeanGreenTexan said:

I don't think it's a coincidence that we lose Easly, and all-of-a-sudden we cannot get tough yards up the middle.

First 10 games, every offensive snap that needed 3 yards or less to convert and/or score.  Punts and FGs are not logged.  Easly played through the LT game (but not the IW game)

DOWN-DISTANCE // PLAYER INITIALS // YARDS GAINED (Pass indicated by P-YARDS GAINED)

SMU
3-2 LE 1
4-1 LE 1
2-2 DT -2
2-3 LE 5
2-2 MF 1
3-1 MF P-8
2-3 LE -1
2-2 NS 2
2-3 NS 1
3-2 NS 1
4-1 NS 0

IW
3-1 DT 2
3-3 MF P-10
1-2 DT 1
2-1 DT 0
3-1 DT 1 (TD)
4-1 DT 2
3-1 DT 1 (TD)
1-1 MF PI
2-1 DT 1 (TD)
2-2 DT 1
3-1 FALSE START
1-3 MF P3 (TD)
2-1 EJ 3
2-2 CP P6

AR
1-2 MF 2 (TD)
2-1 MF P-(-3)
1-3 LE 3 (TD)
2-3 MF PI
3-3 MF PI
3-3 MF PI

LIB
4-1 LE 5
2-1 LE 4
4-2 MF PI
3-2 LE 3
3-3 MF P-7
1-2 LE -2
2-2 LE 9
2-3 LE 3
2-1 DT 24
1-2 LE (-1)
2-1 DT 1 (TD)
2-3 QS 9
2-2 AW 5

LT
2-2 LE 4
3-1 LE 3
4-3 MF P-7 (TD)
3-2 LE 0
2-2 LE 14
3-3 NS 30
2-2 MF PI
3-2 NS 0

UTEP
2-3 MF -4
3-1 NS 1
2-3 DT 3
4-1 MF PI
3-2 DT 4
3-3 MF P-0
4-3 MF PI
3-2 DT 0
4-2 MF P-11
2-3 NS 1
3-2 DT 1

USM
2-1 MF P-5
2-2 DT 5
3-3 MF PI
3-3 DT 8
3-1 DT 34

UAB
3-3  DT 1
4-2 DT 0
3-1 DT 0
4-1 MF PI

RICE
2-2 PENALTY

ODU
2-1 MF PI
3-1 DT 0
4-1 DT 5
2-3 DT 5
2-3 MF PI
3-3 MF P-23 (TD)
3-1 DT 37 (TD)
2-1 DT 0
3-1 DT 8
2-2 MF P-5
2-1 MF P-8
3-2 MF PI
4-2 ODU PENALTY
2-2 DT 4
2-1 DT 3
2-3 MF P-(-1)
4-1 DT 0

Edited November 26, 2018 by greenminer

[UNTLifer]

1 hour ago, DeepGreen said:

Burn the gray!  It's an evil color....and we tend to lose wearing it.

+1 for the post and +100 for spelling lose correctly.

[FirefightnRick]

Scrub to the 2:48 mark.  

This was such a bad 4th and 1 play that the three linebackers never even got involved.

I’ll never understand snapping the ball back 6 yards...to make 1.  Still, MF admitted he missed a read and he sure did.  If he just pulls the ball he has Smith 1 on 1 on a SS in front of him and might have taken it to the house?

 

 

Rick

Edited November 26, 2018 by FirefightnRick

[Withers940]

UNT is ranked 106 in the nation on 4th down at .429 Percent 9/21.

 

With how much speed we have why wouldn't we do a toss play? Give Torrey the ball on the pitch in the open and he has the maneuvering to get the first down. It's not going to work every time you draw it up but the success rate has to be better than us running it up the middle

[Withers940]

19 minutes ago, FirefightnRick said:

 

 

 

Rick

At the :36 mark you see another failed 4th down conversion where everyone and their mother knew we were headed to the left. Our line got blown off the ball as well so that didnt really help either

[untbowler]

48 minutes ago, FirefightnRick said:

Scrub to the 2:48 mark.  

This was such a bad 4th and 1 play that the three linebackers never even got involved.

I’ll never understand snapping the ball back 6 yards...to make 1.  Still, MF admitted he missed a read and he sure did.  If he just pulls the ball he has Smith 1 on 1 on a SS in front of him and might have taken it to the house?

 

 

Rick

That was brutal O-Line just got bowled over, GH must be insane or dumb, for running same play over and over again with no success

[FirefightnRick]

21 minutes ago, untbowler said:

That was brutal O-Line just got bowled over, GH must be insane or dumb, for running same play over and over again with no success

It was Murray’s man.  But in his defense how in hell do you ask him to curl up and launch his 6’9” frame from a pass-defense stance across to his right to stop a 2 technique who is in a 4 point stance and already has the position advantage before the ball is even snapped?  

I mean....it’s a head scratcher trying to figure out the expectation there?

 

Rick

Edited November 26, 2018 by FirefightnRick

[UNTLifer]

Poor play calling on both plays.

[MGNation92]

Why don't we run a PA boot with Smith in the flat? 

Give Mason a chance to run or throw it

[meangreen08]

9 hours ago, Cerebus said:

If this team could convert on short power yardage it would be 12-0 right now.

Is it personnel? Play calling? Execution? It's s big enough problem that it's probably a little of everything.

YEP

[97and03]

8 hours ago, MeanGreenTexan said:

I don't think it's a coincidence that we lose Easly, and all-of-a-sudden we cannot get tough yards up the middle.

Torrey is great, but he's more of a scat-back kind of guy.  A gasher.   Someone who is great in space or to run up the middle when the defense is concerned about the pass.

But when it's an apparent power formation, and the box is stacked... any contact up the middle from DLs or LBs, and he goes down quickly.

That is just false. Torrey is a very tough runner and quite often bounced off tacklers or ran through their tackles. Watch his TD from last week. This is some kind of misperception due to his size. 

[FirefightnRick]

53 minutes ago, 97and03 said:

That is just false. Torrey is a very tough runner and quite often bounced off tacklers or ran through their tackles. Watch his TD from last week. This is some kind of misperception due to his size. 

Amen!  Go to the 1:36 mark below and look what he does to Tuaeffa, who is expected to enter the draft in the spring.

 

Pound for pound possibly one of the top 5 backs in the nation.

 

Rick