Fine Compared to Mccarney QBs

[BillySee58]

Whenever I look back at prior recruiting classes since I started following the program (2011), one thing that always stands out to me is all of the QBs we signed during the Mccarney era and how none of them really panned out.

In Mccarney’s five recruiting classes (2011-2015) he signed nine players who were announced/started their career as QBs. They were Andrew McNulty, Brent Osborn, Cooper Jones, Brock Berglund, Dajon Williams, Josh Greer, Connor Means, Caleb Chumley, and Damarcus Smith. Here are the combined career stats for those 9 QBs:

5-20 W/L record in games started, 419/820 completions for 51%, 4588 yards passing, 5.6 yards/attempt, 27 TDs against 28 INTs

Here are Mason Fine’s stats:

15-10 W/L record in games started, 544/862 completions for 63%, 6486 yards passing, 7.52 yards/attempt, 44 TDs against 21 INTs

Mason Fine has single-handedly out produced the career numbers of nine QBs by almost 2000 yards and 17 TDs and he is possibly only about half way done with his NT career.

[Harry]

3 minutes ago, BillySee58 said:

Whenever I look back at prior recruiting classes since I started following the program (2011), one thing that always stands out to me is all of the QBs we signed during the Mccarney era and how none of them really panned out.

In Mccarney’s five recruiting classes (2011-2015) he signed nine players who were announced/started their career as QBs. They were Andrew McNulty, Brent Osborn, Cooper Jones, Brock Berglund, Dajon Williams, Josh Greer, Connor Means, Caleb Chumley, and Damarcus Smith. Here are the combined career stats for those 9 QBs:

5-20 W/L record in games started, 419/820 completions for 51%, 4588 yards passing, 5.6 yards/attempt, 27 TDs against 28 INTs

Here are Mason Fine’s stats:

15-10 W/L record in games started, 544/862 completions for 63%, 6486 yards passing, 7.52 yards/attempt, 44 TDs against 21 INTs

Mason Fine has single-handedly out produced the career numbers of nine QBs by almost 2000 yards and 17 TDs and he is possibly only about half way done with his NT career.

[DeepGreen]

No wonder we were not worth a crap under McCarney.  Those numbers tell the whole story.

[BillySee58]

1 minute ago, DeepGreen said:

No wonder we were not worth a crap under McCarney.  Those numbers tell the whole story.

When you sign 9 QBs and the best one ends up being Andrew McNulty, that doesn’t put you in a great position to win FBS games. And there was no indication that things were getting better.

[BillySee58]

Also ironic that all of those QBs were 6’1” or taller, and most were 6’3” and up. And that’s right in line with all of the QBs Mccarney offered. Mccarney wouldn’t even have given Fine a legitimate look for a scholarship offer because he didn’t pass the absolutely necessary height requirement 

[Harry]

Need someone to paint a “boulevard of broken dreams” painting with that list!

[NT93]

Funny you posted this today because I was just thinking earlier today about a hypothetical of trading McNulty for Fine.  How much different would each team have been because of one player?  I know the team around him wouldn't have been as good, but I think Mason would have been worth at least a couple of wins on those bad teams.  Conversely, would last years team have won 5 games with McNulty?  (I'm singling out McNulty because, as mentioned, he was probably the best of the bunch)

Edited September 10, 2018 by NT93

[BillySee58]

1 minute ago, NT93 said:

Funny you posted this today because I was just thinking earlier today about a hypothetical of trading McNulty for Fine.  How much different would each team have been because of one player?  I know the team around him wouldn't have been as good, but I think would have been worth at least a couple of wins on those bad teams.  Conversely, would last years team have won 5 games with McNulty?  (I'm singling out McNulty because, as mentioned, he was probably the best of the bunch)

That’s interesting. McNulty did a pretty good job of getting the call to Carlos Harris, so it’s possible he would’ve done the same with Guyton and Bussey. But he also struggled completing passes more than 7 yards downfield some games.

[untjim1995]

But how would Fine do on Chico’s tests during the week?

😂

[FirefightnRick]

There is a very telling explanation relating to this thread by Mr. Quinn Shanbour on last week's Beyond The Green.

He explains that he's been here since 2014, and was describing how in this offense there's now an "identity".  Says under the previous regime we had a smash mouth running game, but from week to week we might pass 5 times and go RPO 25 and do the opposite the next week.  And because of that the QB's and backs could never get in sync with the line and receivers.  

The way he described it I immediately thought..."Yup, that explains a lot of what we saw".

 

Rick

[golfingomez]

8 hours ago, BillySee58 said:

Also ironic that all of those QBs were 6’1” or taller, and most were 6’3” and up. And that’s right in line with all of the QBs Mccarney offered. Mccarney wouldn’t even have given Fine a legitimate look for a scholarship offer because he didn’t pass the absolutely necessary height requirement 

I think we can criticize McCarney for a LOT of things... but lets not forget that about 128 other FBS head coaches did not offer Fine a scholarship either

[oldguystudent]

You guys miss Derek Thompson yet? 

(Old message board reference joke and not intended to be a dig at Derek who is a fine young man and I believe coaching in Denton, right?) 

[outoftown]

16 minutes ago, oldguystudent said:

You guys miss Derek Thompson yet? 

(Old message board reference joke and not intended to be a dig at Derek who is a fine young man and I believe coaching in Denton, right?) 

Well... I did miss him for about two seasons there.

I think the whole part about Thompon not being a MacCarney recruit is difficult to navigate here, as obviously none o Macs recruits panned out, but he did do okish with what Thompson could offer.

Edited September 10, 2018 by outoftown

[Marty]

1 hour ago, oldguystudent said:

You guys miss Derek Thompson yet? 

(Old message board reference joke and not intended to be a dig at Derek who is a fine young man and I believe coaching in Denton, right?) 

Derek is OC at Sherman.

[drex]

Boulevard of Broken Dreams seems like a great painting of the entrance into SMU.

[BillySee58]

7 hours ago, golfingomez said:

I think we can criticize McCarney for a LOT of things... but lets not forget that about 128 other FBS head coaches did not offer Fine a scholarship either

The criticism is not that he didn’t offer Fine. It’s that he signed 9 QBs and not one of them stuck. He was 0-9 in terms of getting a legitimate FBS caliber starting QB, which is accentuated by the fact that Mccarney wouldn’t even give shorter QBs a legitimate look when those are often the best QBs available for G5 schools since the QBs who are tall and good get scooped up by P5s.

[Travis]

15 hours ago, outoftown said:

Well... I did miss him for about two seasons there.

I think the whole part about Thompon not being a MacCarney recruit is difficult to navigate here, as obviously none o Macs recruits panned out, but he did do okish with what Thompson could offer.

About the same as I missed Dickey. 🙂

[GrandGreen]

It would have taken a lot more than a good QB to lift those McCarney recruited teams up.

Fine I believe maybe the best QB every at NT.   However, that doesn't change the fact that no other FBS team recruited him.  

Give tons of credit to Littrell and staff for recognizing a great talent.   

Over decades of watching NT football I have seen a number of great statistics small school guys recruiting by NT.  Few were big contributors to the program.  So the odds are not great particularly for QB's and linemen.  

[DT 90]

Another question is how would have Thompson performed under the present regime?

 

 

[greenjoe]

Thompson was the most successful QB under McCarney.  I have thought of what a switch of Mason Fine and Derek Thompson would have looked like.  Prior to Fine, I guess I also thought a college QB had to be 6-2 or taller.  As stated above, 128 coaches felt the same way.

 

If you haven't watched "Born and Bred" do so.  A very interesting look into small town America and what appears to be a fine (!) family.

GO MEAN GREEN

[golfingomez]

1 hour ago, DT 90 said:

Another question is how would have Thompson performed under the present regime?

 

 

under the present regime, or under the present regime, with the present competition?