Part of Our Problem

DeepGreen · January 7, 2018

10 minutes ago, BTG_Fan1 said:

Russell Wilson has size?

5-11, 215 versus 5-10, 175-180. To me, that 35-40 lb difference is something to consider.

GrandGreen · January 7, 2018

Players are drafted into the NFL because of their talent not were they when to school at. The fact that NT hasn't had anyone drafted in ages is because they have not recruited that kind of talent.

Faulty thinking to believe you will be drafted at school A and not school B because scouts are to lazy to scout all schools.

BTG_Fan1 · January 7, 2018

1 hour ago, DeepGreen said:

5-11, 215 versus 5-10, 175-180. To me, that 35-40 lb difference is something to consider.

When Wilson came out he was 204 http://www.nfl.com/combine/profiles/russell-wilson?id=2532975

Mason is still 2 years away in terms of playing his full 4 years like Wilson, and 3 years away in terms of spending 5 years in college because Wilson had a RS year in 2007 .. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Russell_Wilson#Statistics

Wilson likely so bulked up following his final season at WISC leading up to the combine, pro day, etc and that adds on a few pounds.. Mason is basically 20 lbs away (to be super conservative saying Wilson only put on 4 pounds of added bulk) and has 2 years to still develop...

Safe to say, Wilson had no real major size advantages over Mason likely..

Edited January 7, 2018 by BTG_Fan1

PlummMeanGreen · January 7, 2018

16 hours ago, BTG_Fan1 said:

Russell Wilson has size?

Drew Brees has size?

What if Mason has a growth spurt like 5'10" Cedrick Hardeman did who filled out to 6'5" 240 lbs. before he graduated from UNT & theN got drafted #1 by the 49'ers?

Like many of you, I never say never or no can do with Mason Fine anymore. Last time I did that I almost missed seeing the greatest & most exciting finish to a Mean Green football game in our history. * If Ron Shanklin's TD catch against Frank Broyle's Arkansas Razorbacks had been allowed that would be #1 in our history IMHO.

Hellsbells! Those same UA Hogs played UT for a NCAA National Championship the next season. See how close we got to becoming football 👑 royalty, Greenbackers? Yet (again) 3 giant steps forward & ...you know the rest.

GMG!

Edited January 8, 2018 by PlummMeanGreen

UNTLifer · January 7, 2018

17 hours ago, BTG_Fan1 said:

The staff needs to point the positives or find positives and expand on them and not continue pointing out the very minimal NFL success with an LB, a FB, and scat back RB.

So you are saying our staff points out the very minimal NFL success...? I find this highly unlikely and ridiculous to even consider.

As noted in another post, scouts find talent everywhere. If a young man has the talent and measurables, they will find him.

BTG_Fan1 · January 7, 2018

25 minutes ago, UNTLifer said:

So you are saying our staff points out the very minimal NFL success...? I find this highly unlikely and ridiculous to even consider.

As noted in another post, scouts find talent everywhere. If a young man has the talent and measurables, they will find him.

They (the AD office and football staff) point it out weekly when they do the how former UNT players did this past NFL week with only 1 real player.

UNT has produced very little current NFL talent.. Our only productive current player is Robertson. SL has coached bigger names like Gronk and Foles at Arizona, T. Coleman of Atlanta, Swisher of the Cowboys (and a few NFL OL) and coached the #2 in Trusbicky.

instead of just focusing on UNT players, the AD office, Football Staff, and us need to expand and talk about who the coaches have coached..

Where did I say NFL scouts won’t find talent?! I never did, I’ve pointed that people think Fine won’t get a chance and he is basically the same player as Russell Wilson..

Edited January 7, 2018 by BTG_Fan1

UNTLifer · January 7, 2018

You made it sound like they point that out to recruits on their visits.

I don't take it that the current meangreensports.com articles updating Robertson's performance are a negative, but something that has been needed. If we don't promote our alumni we get criticized and if we do it is a negative. I think you are reaching with this.

I am sure SL and staff talk about players that have played for them during recruits visits and during home visits. Something tells me SL isn't overlooking this.

BTG_Fan1 · January 7, 2018

7 minutes ago, UNTLifer said:

You made it sound like they point that out to recruits on their visits.

I don't take it that the current meangreensports.com articles updating Robertson's performance are a negative, but something that has been needed. If we don't promote our alumni we get criticized and if we do it is a negative. I think you are reaching with this.

I am sure SL and staff talk about players that have played for them during recruits visits and during home visits. Something tells me SL isn't overlooking this.

The point is not updating Robertson career.. it’s that we go through our current NFL players in 3 paragraphs with 2 of the 3 being as a back up and FB..

If Thompson did pass because of our lack of NFL production a way to expand it is via listing who the coaches have coached and not players only directly tied to UNT.

Yes the staff likely talks about it, but again if you want to pump up a fan base, give fans hope and something else to sale is to list who they have coached. Would look a lot better us being able to rifle off 10-20 players this staff has coached and 5-6 LBs (including Orr/Robertson) that have come from this staff as well. The message has to be twitched, not completely changed...

greenminer · January 8, 2018

10 hours ago, GrandGreen said:

Players are drafted into the NFL because of their talent not were they when to school at. The fact that NT hasn't had anyone drafted in ages is because they have not recruited that kind of talent.

Faulty thinking to believe you will be drafted at school A and not school B because scouts are to lazy to scout all schools.

Don’t you think that’s a little bit of tunnel vision? A kid can look at a school and identify coaches and staffs that can help them get drafted. Coaches that have contacts in the NFL, and experience coaching in the NFL (I would imagine) probably seem more attractive to these kids than a Staff with no ties whatsoever.

GrandGreen · January 8, 2018

43 minutes ago, greenminer said:

Don’t you think that’s a little bit of tunnel vision? A kid can look at a school and identify coaches and staffs that can help them get drafted. Coaches that have contacts in the NFL, and experience coaching in the NFL (I would imagine) probably seem more attractive to these kids than a Staff with no ties whatsoever.

Coaching staffs probably do sell their ability to send players to the pros. Bending the truth is a staple in recruiting.

There are obviously recruits. maybe the player discussed in this thread, that believe them.

You will have to explain your tunnel vision comment. I am not sure how my view is any closer to tunnel vision than what you have expressed.

UNTLifer · January 8, 2018

Sell not sale.

PlummMeanGreen · January 8, 2018

Beggin' a few pardons, but how many NFL draft choices has Vandy' had lately?🤔

If you measure a college program's success by how much overall NFL talent it produced then Darrell Royal's years at UT-Austin would have been considered a failure. The NFL talent that came out of Austin during most of the DKR years was amazingly very small in numbers considering their successes.

Think about the UT QB James Street national championship teams of the late 60's/early 70's? I can think of one drafted & that would be Palestine's Super Bill Bradley who came to UT as a highly touted HS QB phenom who ended up as a Longhorn defensive back & later was a Philly Eagle low draft choice (as a DB).

GMG!

Edited January 9, 2018 by PlummMeanGreen

MGNation92 · January 8, 2018

On 1/6/2018 at 8:14 PM, AustinFromUNT said:

We recently had a player commit and then decommit 2 days later. If you read into this tweet he is basically saying going to UNT doesn’t give him a chance to make it to the NFL. The last time we had a player drafted was 2003 (2004?) that’s 15 YEARS ago. I love UNT, but can you really blame a guy for not coming here when we can’t get anybody drafted? We don’t have much of a chance of getting someone drafted this year. Jeff would have had a chance if he hadn’t been injured pretty much every year. Kishawn McClain saw a huge drop off in production this year. Trevor Moore is consistent, but it’s rare for kickers to get drafted (could be a good UFA). We don’t really have anyone next year with a good draft stock. Our best chance of getting someone drafted is if Mason Fine can put up 4500-5500 yards with at least a 2.5:1 TD:INT ratio for the next 2 seasons. I love this school, but we can’t be surprised when we lose kids when we can’t get anyone drafted.

I don't think this tweet is about the NFL. I think this tweet is about the quality of education he's receiving. I love UNT and our academics, but we can't hold a candle to Vanderbilt and that's just being honest. Sure there's a possibility if he balls out against SEC opponents that he'll get drafted, but that degree from that school means a hell of a lot.

Graddean · January 8, 2018

Certainly Vanderbilt has a plus reputation. There is more to it than the overall reputation of a school. Every school has relative stronger and weaker departments. Good hirers know the relative reputations of departments. In fact, research has shown the institutional reputation is only a force for about five years. This is because a recent graduate likely has little work history; therefore GPA and institutional reputation is important. After five years, hiring is based on work performance history not on other factors. Saints fans don't care where Robertson went to school? They just care how well he does his job. Same way in life.

greenminer · January 8, 2018

10 hours ago, GrandGreen said:

Coaching staffs probably do sell their ability to send players to the pros. Bending the truth is a staple in recruiting.

There are obviously recruits. maybe the player discussed in this thread, that believe them.

You will have to explain your tunnel vision comment. I am not sure how my view is any closer to tunnel vision than what you have expressed.

If I'm aspiring to play in the NFL one day, you better believe I'm looking at a staff and how former players have done on draft day.

There are players that are going to get drafted no matter where they go, sure. I'm really talking about those guys that are probably rated 3 star or less out of high school and want a staff/situation that can best maximize their chances.

Aldo · January 9, 2018

I mean who wants to go to an SEC school anyway, ACC is where it's at now.

(also ftr, since it's being tossed around, Vandy + ULL + Toldedo = 30 draft picks since Cody Spencer)

It's ok to say Vanderbilt > North Texas. Really is.

What do we take away from it?

Win = Better recruits
Better recruits = NFL draft
NFL = Even better recruits

While we've been in a black hole of suck, we're still in the middle of working our way out from those depths.

We are Daniel Plainview, broken leg and all, dragging ourselves out of that ditch.

GMG24 · January 9, 2018

21 minutes ago, Aldo said:

I mean who wants to go to an SEC school anyway, ACC is where it's at now.

(also ftr, since it's being tossed around, Vandy + ULL + Toldedo = 30 draft picks since Cody Spencer)

It's ok to say Vanderbilt > North Texas. Really is.

What do we take away from it?

Win = Better recruits

Better recruits = NFL draft

NFL = Even better recruits

While we've been in a black hole of suck, we're still in the middle of working our way out from those depths.

We are Daniel Plainview, broken leg and all, dragging ourselves out of that ditch.

You hit this one spot on, I wish more people realized this instead of complaining anytime a kid flips to a bigger school. While I would love to land him if thats where he feels best then go there. His athletic ability afforded him the option to chose.

Harry · January 9, 2018

23 minutes ago, Aldo said:

I mean who wants to go to an SEC school anyway, ACC is where it's at now.

(also ftr, since it's being tossed around, Vandy + ULL + Toldedo = 30 draft picks since Cody Spencer)

It's ok to say Vanderbilt > North Texas. Really is.

What do we take away from it?

Win = Better recruits

Better recruits = NFL draft

NFL = Even better recruits

While we've been in a black hole of suck, we're still in the middle of working our way out from those depths.

We are Daniel Plainview, broken leg and all, dragging ourselves out of that ditch.

Good thoughts. I guess what stings is how quickly Kiffin was able to raise the level of recruiting at FAU.

Aldo · January 9, 2018

5 minutes ago, Harry said:

Good thoughts. I guess what stings is how quickly Kiffin was able to raise the level of recruiting at FAU.

Kiffin inherited a better team than Littrell. FAU's previous staff was just not getting the most of the roster. The North Texas roster was mismanaged. Littrell is getting the most out of the current roster.

Kiffin is also a better recruiter and a quality coach.

GrandGreen · January 9, 2018

On 1/8/2018 at 8:43 AM, MGNation92 said:

I don't think this tweet is about the NFL. I think this tweet is about the quality of education he's receiving. I love UNT and our academics, but we can't hold a candle to Vanderbilt and that's just being honest. Sure there's a possibility if he balls out against SEC opponents that he'll get drafted, but that degree from that school means a hell of a lot.

Not an expert on Vandy. However, my guess would be athletes are steered to classes that keeps them eligibility not necessarily ones that are going to prepare them for some great career once out of college. All fb division schools do this to some degree, but at so called elite academic schools, it is escalated.

So that degree from Vanderbilt may not be so great when an employer actually looks at the academics behind it.

UNTLifer · January 9, 2018

2 hours ago, GrandGreen said:

Not an expert on Vandy. However, my guess would be athletes are steered to classes that keeps them eligibility not necessarily ones that are going to prepare them for some great career once out of college. All fb division schools do this to some degree, but at so called elite academic schools, it is escalated.

So that degree from Vanderbilt may not be so great when an employer actually looks at the academics behind it.

Are you questioning the integrity of a SEC school? How dare you!?

Let's see how Kiffin does without Little Briles. I think he is a good coach, but it will be interesting to note if there is a drop in FAU's production.

UNT90 · January 10, 2018

Zach Orr gets drafted if he plays for any other FBS program in America. Dunbar probably does, also. It cost both a lot of cash.

And this is used against UNT regularly in recruiting. If you don’t think it isn’t, well, rah rah rah, sis boom bah.

Harry · January 10, 2018

36 minutes ago, UNT90 said:

Zach Orr gets drafted if he plays for any other FBS program in America. Dunbar probably does, also. It cost both a lot of cash.

And this is used against UNT regularly in recruiting. If you don’t think it isn’t, well, rah rah rah, sis boom bah.

I disagree. Look at the draft every year. There are high level picks from small schools every year. If they have the ability size and speed the teams will find them anymore.

GrandGreen · January 10, 2018

43 minutes ago, UNT90 said:

Zach Orr gets drafted if he plays for any other FBS program in America. Dunbar probably does, also. It cost both a lot of cash.

And this is used against UNT regularly in recruiting. If you don’t think it isn’t, well, rah rah rah, sis boom bah.

Yes, you are right if only they all played for ULM, first round draft choices. You really believe that Dunbar and Orr were not will known by the majority of pro scouting departments. Sure they were, and it was decided not to draft them because of some metric or evaluation.

UNTLifer · January 10, 2018

3 hours ago, UNT90 said:

Zach Orr gets drafted if he plays for any other FBS program in America. Dunbar probably does, also. It cost both a lot of cash.

And this is used against UNT regularly in recruiting. If you don’t think it isn’t, well, rah rah rah, sis boom bah.

Wild ass speculation or factual, unbiased statement? I go with wild ass speculation.