Police murder innocent man in Kansas

[forevereagle]

1 hour ago, southsideguy said:

I think we are seeing more acts like this because our society has become so much more violent.

I am not sure that is really the case. It is easy to make these assertions based on our access to information and general population growth, but just because we hear about everything that happens across the country doesn't indicate some kind of trend. If there are actual statistics that back this up, that would be different, but this feels anecdotal.

[UNTFan23]

3 hours ago, SCREAMING EAGLE-66 said:

---Maybe the caller ID was shown [ and spoofed ] to 911. BUT .. It they had actually entered that number into the phone and called ( not just returned the call ) ... they would have discovered it was fake especially since the caller wasn't even in the same area code... and not the guy that really called. There was nothing to lose by doing this. ... and he would not have been shot....  The police need to get smarter. ... also not so fast to shoot when aren't certain he has a gun and are at a rather safe distance....  This is terrible police work. 

Telephone numbers can be easily spoofed though.

[UNTLifer]

It is easy to be critical of police work when the one being critical doesn't wear a badge every day.

[GTWT]

10 hours ago, UNTLifer said:

It is easy to be critical of police work when the one being critical doesn't wear a badge every day.

No, it's not easy.  It is, however, necessary.  Law enforcement is too important to a free society to be immune to public scrutiny.  Remember, no one dared criticize the Gestapo.

[Rudy]

20 hours ago, SCREAMING EAGLE-66 said:

---Maybe the caller ID was shown [ and spoofed ] to 911. BUT .. It they had actually entered that number into the phone and called ( not just returned the call ) ... they would have discovered it was fake especially since the caller wasn't even in the same area code... and not the guy that really called. There was nothing to lose by doing this. ... and he would not have been shot....  The police need to get smarter. ... also not so fast to shoot when aren't certain he has a gun and are at a rather safe distance....  This is terrible police work. 

Area codes don't mean anything.  I still use my Denton phone number.  Many law enforcement have college degrees.  As to "not shooting so fast", go look up the OODA Loop video on youtube.  It gives a pretty eye opening insight into reaction times. 

1 hour ago, GTWT said:

No, it's not easy.  It is, however, necessary.  Law enforcement is too important to a free society to be immune to public scrutiny.  Remember, no one dared criticize the Gestapo.

And I'm fine with that, however, in order to have a legitimate discussion on use of force, the public needs to make the effort to be better educated.  Instead of painting with a broad brush like Ryan does, ask for insight from those who have been in that position.  Also, go participate in some use of force exercises.  Also, law enforcement is not the only profession that needs to be under scrutiny.  I don't recall any repercussions for the cardiologist who's negligence could have killed my mother. 

[SCREAMING EAGLE-66]

I realize people use phones of different area codes.... but if they had called that number without the area code they would have realized  it did not come from a local address.  That isn't fool proof but doesn't 911 just go to the local 911 center.?? .... I think if you had a Dallas phone and were in Houston you would get 911 in Houston...  I also doubt the the prank call actually displayed the real number called from.   Calling back might have raised some doubts and maybe made them realize it did not from as local phone.  especially if the number was spoofed to a local number. . . 

[GTWT]

7 hours ago, Rudy said:

 I don't recall any repercussions for the cardiologist who's negligence could have killed my mother. 

Rudy, that MD whose negligence could have killed your mother is a menace to society.  He/she took an oath, one part of which was to 'cause no harm'.  If that oath was forsaken, the cardiologist should lose their license & be subject to legal consequences.  A policeman takes an oath too - 'to serve and protect'.  This officer appears to have failed that oath.  Like the MD the cop should face severe consequences. 

[UNTFan23]

3 hours ago, GTWT said:

Rudy, that MD whose negligence could have killed your mother is a menace to society.  He/she took an oath, one part of which was to 'cause no harm'.  If that oath was forsaken, the cardiologist should lose their license & be subject to legal consequences.  A policeman takes an oath too - 'to serve and protect'.  This officer appears to have failed that oath.  Like the MD the cop should face severe consequences. 

Are you fine with every police involved killing going to trial, whatever the cost to the taxpayer might be?

[GTWT]

7 hours ago, UNTFan23 said:

Are you fine with every police involved killing going to trial, whatever the cost to the taxpayer might be?

If I kill someone the case will go to a grand jury.  They, with the advice of the government attorney, will decide what charges, if any, should be prosecuted.  Why should it be different for a policeman?

[Rudy]

5 hours ago, GTWT said:

If I kill someone the case will go to a grand jury.  They, with the advice of the government attorney, will decide what charges, if any, should be prosecuted.  Why should it be different for a policeman?

It's not different.  I can't say too much, because of the civil lawsuit, but an officer I know was in a shooting.  The individual lived.  There was no doubt it was justified.  It still went to the grand jury.  Just because the news doesn't broadcast it, doesn't mean it didn't go to the grand jury.  Also, I've seen the dashcam and body cam footage.  Even knowing the outcome, it was still shocking how quickly it all unfolded.

Edited January 7, 2018 by Rudy

[GTWT]

4 hours ago, Rudy said:

It's not different.  I can't say too much, because of the civil lawsuit, but an officer I know was in a shooting.  The individual lived.  There was no doubt it was justified.  It still went to the grand jury.  Just because the news doesn't broadcast it, doesn't mean it didn't go to the grand jury.  Also, I've seen the dashcam and body cam footage.  Even knowing the outcome, it was still shocking how quickly it all unfolded.

You're right.  I was responding to UNTFan23's query, "Are you fine with every police involved killing going to trial, whatever the cost to the taxpayer might be?".  Every killing, whether police are involved or not, is investigated & a decision is made by the Grand Jury concerning whether the case goes to trial.  So, given that process, my answer to UNTfan23 is, 'Yes.  I'm willing to have my tax dollars go toward serving justice, even if, especially if, the police is involved.   

Edited January 7, 2018 by GTWT