We shouldn’t abandon the Army series

[Cooley]

We are still trying to build a program and increase interest/attendance. We gave up 800 total yards against FAU and over 500 rushing against Army. We need schools at Apogee that will bring a crowd and we need a defense to play those type schools. 

[Ben Gooding]

3 minutes ago, meangreenJW said:

Agreed last night was good for recruiting. AND so was last week vs a winless UTEP team and virtually the same size crowd. What is good for recruiting is winning. The culmination of the season is why last night was special. Not saying Army isn't somewhat compelling for fans, but surely you don't think we had a great crowd because of Army. If we'd had FAU in town last night, Apogee might have been sold out. Success + Facilities drives recruiting. Winning a conference championship will drive recruiting. Keeping coaches here will drive recruiting. (That became much harder to do with last night's injuries.) That's what the coaches say. Gonna trust them over a fan who's never recruited on this one. I might buy fans enjoy watching Army, I won't buy it helps recruiting unless you're talking Army recruiting. Definitely helps them to get in Texas

No way. Army had a legit 4-6K fans. You think FAU brings the same 4-6K and an additional 4-5K just miraculously show up because Florida Atlantic University? It was the same showing as Homecoming BECAUSE Army and their fans. UTEP maybe brought 1.5K. The additional makeup of the equal crowds was due to it being Homecoming. Homecoming has its draw for the casual alum that pays attention from afar and tries to make 1 game a year. Homecoming is usually their ticket. 

[Ben Gooding]

4 minutes ago, meangreenJW said:

You do realize Liberty is currently FBS. Not sure why you say they are FCS. They have officially made the jump. They are FBS independent.

Negative, Ghost Rider. 

 

 

 

EDIT: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Liberty_Flames_football 

Edited November 19, 2017 by Ben Gooding

[Ben Gooding]

1 minute ago, Cooley said:

we need a defense

FIFY. 

[meangreenJW]

18 minutes ago, GreenN'walinsVet said:

Not sure if you noticed, but Army had every bit of 4-6 thousand fans there last night. FAU would have had 200. So attendance might have been 20-22k instead of 26k. 

I don't think it was anywhere near 4-6 but I agree there were more Army fans than any other visiting team I can remember in Apogee. And I've seen all but 3 games in Apogee. Impressive.

[meangreenJW]

16 minutes ago, Ben Gooding said:

Negative, Ghost Rider. 

 

 

 

EDIT: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Liberty_Flames_football 

I'd probably award both of us a half point. In 2018, the NCAA will consider that an FBS game. NCAA says provisional status means they count as an FBS program they just aren't postseason eligible. 

[meangreenJW]

19 minutes ago, Ben Gooding said:

No way. Army had a legit 4-6K fans. You think FAU brings the same 4-6K and an additional 4-5K just miraculously show up because Florida Atlantic University? It was the same showing as Homecoming BECAUSE Army and their fans. UTEP maybe brought 1.5K. The additional makeup of the equal crowds was due to it being Homecoming. Homecoming has its draw for the casual alum that pays attention from afar and tries to make 1 game a year. Homecoming is usually their ticket. 

Also, FWIW I don't like the Liberty games either. Not a fan of the divisive politics preached by Falwell and would rather UNT not associate with it. But if coaches and admin strongly felt getting out of the series was best and Liberty was the only option to take the games, then I don't see it as a dumb move. An unpopular one maybe, but not a "dumb" one. 

[Ben Gooding]

2 minutes ago, meangreenJW said:

I'd probably award both of us a half point. In 2018, the NCAA will consider that an FBS game. NCAA says provisional status means they count as an FBS program they just aren't postseason eligible. 

They are playing in the FCS Big South Conference vs FCS Big South Conference teams. As in this year. EX: They played FCS Charleston Southern yesterday...A FCS team in their FCS conference. 

[Ben Gooding]

3 minutes ago, meangreenJW said:

Also, FWIW I don't like the Liberty games either. Not a fan of the divisive politics preached by Falwell and would rather UNT not associate with it. But if coaches and admin strongly felt getting out of the series was best and Liberty was the only option to take the games, then I don't see it as a dumb move. An unpopular one maybe, but not a "dumb" one. 

It's dumb in the context that it does nothing for our program with a W and it hurts us with a L. It's why so many P5's are hesitant to schedule anything other than P5 road games. 

Edited November 19, 2017 by Ben Gooding

[NorthTexan95]

I wouldn't be surprised to see Liberty have a good group of fans.  They have some great support.  i lived in Virginia for 8 years before moving back here this summer.  I know and worked with a lot of great people who went to Liberty or follow them.  I'm hopeful I can go to the game at Liberty next season. 

[meangreenJW]

1 minute ago, Ben Gooding said:

They are playing in the FCS Big South Conference vs FCS Big South Conference teams. As in this year. EX: They played FCS Charleston Southern yesterday...A FCS team in their FCS conference. 

Understood. But we aren't playing them this year. They will be FBS provisional when we play. This is their last year with an FCS schedule. Not saying they are Alabama but in the eyes of the NCAA they'll be an FBS opponent

[UNTLifer]

1 hour ago, BillySee58 said:

The next time we play them, those players will be gone. No guarantee this program just remains a cheap-shot taking team over the next four years. 

If their coach didn't condone that type of play, they wouldn't be doing it now. They are a reflection of their coach. 

[meangreenJW]

1 minute ago, meangreenJW said:

Understood. But we aren't playing them this year. They will be FBS provisional when we play. This is their last year with an FCS schedule. Not saying they are Alabama but in the eyes of the NCAA they'll be an FBS opponent

Below is their schedule. It's an FBS schedule. How about home and away with NMSU. I've never seen that in football.

 

2018 Liberty Flames Football Schedule
Date		Opponent	Time/TV	Tickets
Date TBA		Spring Football Game Williams Stadium, Lynchburg, VA	Time TBA TV TBA
Saturday Sep. 1		Old Dominion Monarchs Williams Stadium, Lynchburg, VA	Time TBA TV TBA
Saturday Sep. 8		at Army Black Knights  Michie Stadium, West Point, NY	Time TBA TV TBA
Saturday Sep. 15		Norfolk State Spartans  Williams Stadium, Lynchburg, VA	Time TBA TV TBA
Saturday Sep. 22		North Texas Mean Green  Williams Stadium, Lynchburg, VA	Time TBA TV TBA
Saturday Sep. 29		at New Mexico Lobos  Dreamstyle Stadium, Albuquerque, NM	Time TBA TV TBA
Saturday Oct. 6		at New Mexico State Aggies  Aggie Memorial Stadium, Las Cruces, NM	Time TBA TV TBA
Saturday Oct. 13		Troy Trojans  Williams Stadium, Lynchburg, VA	Time TBA TV TBA
Saturday Oct. 20		Idaho State Bengals  Williams Stadium, Lynchburg, VA	Time TBA TV TBA
Saturday Oct. 27		OFF
Saturday Nov. 3		at UMass Minutemen  McGuirk Stadium, Amherst, MA	Time TBA TV TBA
Saturday Nov. 10		at Virginia Cavaliers  Scott Stadium, Charlottesville, VA	Time TBA TV TBA
Saturday Nov. 17		at Auburn Tigers  Jordan-Hare Stadium, Auburn, AL	Time TBA TV TBA
Saturday Nov. 24		New Mexico State Aggies  Williams Stadium, Lynchburg, VA	Time TBA TV TBA

[Ben Gooding]

1 minute ago, NorthTexan95 said:

I wouldn't be surprised to see Liberty have a good group of fans.  They have some great support.  i lived in Virginia for 8 years before moving back here this summer.  I know and worked with a lot of great people who went to Liberty or follow them.  I'm hopeful I can go to the game at Liberty next season. 

When we initially scheduled them when our progress was still a little uncertain, I was worried about this game. They are a middling FCS conference team. They will struggle mightily next season vs a pretty weak FBS schedule. I'm not as worried anymore. 

[Ben Gooding]

1 minute ago, UNTLifer said:

If their coach didn't condone that type of play, they wouldn't be doing it now. They are a reflection of their coach. 

I agree 100%. I told my wife this very thing at the game. It's not that he's just doing it, but not ounce did I see a coach approach him on the sideline and he obviously played the entirety of the game. Same goes for #84, and I believe #23. If it's not being corrected, it's being tolerated. If it's being tolerated, it might as well be encouraged. 

[BTG_Fan1]

7 minutes ago, meangreenJW said:

Below is their schedule. It's an FBS schedule. How about home and away with NMSU. I've never seen that in football.

 

2018 Liberty Flames Football Schedule
Date		Opponent	Time/TV	Tickets
Date TBA		Spring Football Game Williams Stadium, Lynchburg, VA	Time TBA TV TBA
Saturday Sep. 1		Old Dominion Monarchs Williams Stadium, Lynchburg, VA	Time TBA TV TBA
Saturday Sep. 8		at Army Black Knights  Michie Stadium, West Point, NY	Time TBA TV TBA
Saturday Sep. 15		Norfolk State Spartans  Williams Stadium, Lynchburg, VA	Time TBA TV TBA
Saturday Sep. 22		North Texas Mean Green  Williams Stadium, Lynchburg, VA	Time TBA TV TBA
Saturday Sep. 29		at New Mexico Lobos  Dreamstyle Stadium, Albuquerque, NM	Time TBA TV TBA
Saturday Oct. 6		at New Mexico State Aggies  Aggie Memorial Stadium, Las Cruces, NM	Time TBA TV TBA
Saturday Oct. 13		Troy Trojans  Williams Stadium, Lynchburg, VA	Time TBA TV TBA
Saturday Oct. 20		Idaho State Bengals  Williams Stadium, Lynchburg, VA	Time TBA TV TBA
Saturday Oct. 27		OFF
Saturday Nov. 3		at UMass Minutemen  McGuirk Stadium, Amherst, MA	Time TBA TV TBA
Saturday Nov. 10		at Virginia Cavaliers  Scott Stadium, Charlottesville, VA	Time TBA TV TBA
Saturday Nov. 17		at Auburn Tigers  Jordan-Hare Stadium, Auburn, AL	Time TBA TV TBA
Saturday Nov. 24		New Mexico State Aggies  Williams Stadium, Lynchburg, VA	Time TBA TV TBA

How do they play New Mexico State twice in 1 regular season?

[Stix]

Just now, BTG_Fan1 said:

How do they play New Mexico State twice in 1 regular season?

They've both desperate to schedule FBS games.  I'm surprised they have Idaho State on the schedule, and not Idaho.  But maybe Idaho will be FCS next year?

Seeing that Liberty plays Army on Sep 8, I'm wondering if there was a condition for us to get out of the games with Army that there had to be a replacement game for them, and Liberty filled both that and the space in our 2018 schedule - again, then allowing Wren to schedule the UH series.

 

[Mad Hatter]

At this point we needs wins more than a strong strength of schedule.  

[Caw Caw]

21 minutes ago, Ben Gooding said:

I agree 100%. I told my wife this very thing at the game. It's not that he's just doing it, but not ounce did I see a coach approach him on the sideline and he obviously played the entirety of the game. Same goes for #84, and I believe #23. If it's not being corrected, it's being tolerated. If it's being tolerated, it might as well be encouraged. 

You should have seen the team and coaches celebrate the targeting pick up. Still with Guyton on the ground. Turning around and hushing the crowd talking trash during an injury. I have ZERO respect for that staff. And the officiating crew. One of those 15 yard personal fouls was a right hook thrown to the head of Nate Brooks. That's an ejection and it should have been the first of two. Brooks lost his cool one time that I saw, but man they did him dirty all night. 

[MeanGreenZen]

Army is a glamorous college football team that we can actually beat.

I don't care if it is "hard" for our coaches to play Army. That is what the money is for!

I've been a season-ticket holder many years and yesterday's game was the first time anyone has ever contacted me wanting my tickets. And it had nothing to do with UNT. These people wanted to see Army play. 

No one wants to see Liberty play. Liberty is a gross, fundamentalist embarrassment to Christianity and Wren Baker screwed this up. 

 

[Ben Gooding]

2 minutes ago, MeanGreenZen said:

Army is a glamorous college football team that we can actually beat.

I don't care if it is "hard" for our coaches to play Army. That is what the money is for!

I've been a season-ticket holder many years and yesterday's game was the first time anyone has ever contacted me wanting my tickets. And it had nothing to do with UNT. These people wanted to see Army play. 

No one wants to see Liberty play. Liberty is a gross, fundamentalist embarrassment to Christianity and Wren Baker screwed this up. 

 

 

[Huff]

I agree with Harry 100% on this one.   We have been season ticket holders since 1972 and I believe this is the best home and home series we have had during those years.   I understand that their offense is difficult to prepare for but I have never known of a good coach that did not look forward to a real challenge.    Wren Baker has done a lot of good things since arriving in Denton but ending the Army series is not one of them.

[Wag Tag]

Do not want to play. Would like to see Houston or a Memphis type opponent. I hate opening the season with SMU. Would like our patty cake game first then SMU.

[MeanGreenZen]

I heard that Wren Baker cancelled the Army series because one of the coaches' wives read about an amazing bed and breakfast in Lynchburg that they just HAVE to check out. 

[BTG_Fan1]

9 minutes ago, MeanGreenZen said:

I heard that Wren Baker cancelled the Army series because one of the coaches' wives read about an amazing bed and breakfast in Lynchburg that they just HAVE to check out. 

Too soon lol the beatdown in Boca is still to fresh 😭😭😭😭

Edited November 19, 2017 by BTG_Fan1