Give me Liberty or give me death!

Green P1 · May 17, 2017

21 minutes ago, UNTFan23 said:

This is the type of attitude that hurts the growth of the program more than anything else. To be so focused on who we're playing over going to see your alma mater is a very short sighted way to support the school.

baloney

MeanGreenTexan · May 17, 2017

24 minutes ago, UNTFan23 said:

This is the type of attitude that hurts the growth of the program more than anything else. To be so focused on who we're playing over going to see your alma mater is a very short sighted way to support the school.

I agree with the sentiment, but you also can't blame fans for being upset with what is seen as a step down in scheduling. It's up to us to hold the AD accountable, or apparently no one else will. We should also be vocal in patting backs when something is done right, like the TxTech series. Still waiting to see the 'finished product' before I get too upset over it all...

MeanGreen_MBA · May 17, 2017

8 minutes ago, Green P1 said:

baloney

I went to the Bama vs UNT game, the UT vs UNT game, the OU vs UNT games, and those stadiums were packed. I believe UNT playing Liberty U is no further a step down game than those schools playing UNT

untjim1995 · May 17, 2017

49 minutes ago, MeanGreen_MBA said:

I went to the Bama vs UNT game, the UT vs UNT game, the OU vs UNT games, and those stadiums were packed. I believe UNT playing Liberty U is no further a step down game than those schools playing UNT

So you think it will be packed here then?

1 hour ago, UNTFan23 said:

This is the type of attitude that hurts the growth of the program more than anything else. To be so focused on who we're playing over going to see your alma mater is a very short sighted way to support the school.

As opposed to accepting a stadium that rarely sees half its seats have butts in them...

Your long term view of this place is the exact reason we have what we have. Meanwhile, let's see who plays OOC games in other SBCUSA teams...never mind, you don't mind watching us play Lamar and Liberty. Besides, SMU is coming here every other year!! And they are just the same level opponent as they were in 1982...

Biggest lie ever told here was that Appgee would bring in more high quality OOC opponents. The exact opposite has occurred...

MeanGreen_MBA · May 17, 2017

13 minutes ago, untjim1995 said:

So you think it will be packed here then?

As opposed to accepting a stadium that rarely sees half its seats have butts in them...

Your long term view of this place is the exact reason we have what we have. Meanwhile, let's see who plays OOC games in other SBCUSA teams...never mind, you don't mind watching us play Lamar and Liberty. Besides, SMU is coming here every other year!! And they are just the same level opponent as they were in 1982...

Biggest lie ever told here was that Appgee would bring in more high quality OOC opponents. The exact opposite has occurred...

my expectations if for fans to come to the game regardless of who we are playing....support the team...

Ben Gooding · May 17, 2017

56 minutes ago, MeanGreen_MBA said:

I went to the Bama vs UNT game, the UT vs UNT game, the OU vs UNT games, and those stadiums were packed. I believe UNT playing Liberty U is no further a step down game than those schools playing UNT

I've been to a many of P5 vs G5 games and they were not packed. I was at the LSU v Towson game some years back and could not believe the emptiness. Been to Miami OH at UF and ULL at UF, same deal. Been to James Madison at UNC, desolate. LaTech at Auburn, mid 2nd quarter, I could lay on my bench seat. I go to these games because they are cheap, because there is no demand. UNT will not even pack Apogee for any conference game or SMU. Sure, some really good showings here and there, but never packed. No way Liberty does 50% capacity, unless we're winning. And if so, it'll be 60-65% capacity tops. Why you may ask. 2 reasons. We're a liberal college that has more non sports fans than sports fans and it's Liberty.

untjim1995 · May 17, 2017

Just now, MeanGreen_MBA said:

my expectations if for fans to come to the game regardless of who we are playing....support the team...

That has never happened here ever...just like it doesn't happen at almost every G5 program.

1 minute ago, Ben Gooding said:

I've been to a many of P5 vs G5 games and they were not packed. I was at the LSU v Towson game some years back and could not believe the emptiness. Been to Miami OH at UF and ULL at UF, same deal. Been to James Madison at UNC, desolate. LaTech at Auburn, mid 2nd quarter, I could lay on my bench seat. I go to these games because they are cheap, because there is no demand. UNT will not even pack Apogee for any conference game or SMU. Sure, some really good showings here and there, but never packed. No way Liberty does 50% capacity, unless we're winning. And if so, it'll be 60-65% capacity tops. Why you may ask. 2 reasons. We're a liberal college that has more non sports fans than sports fans and it's Liberty.

This

Cerebus · May 17, 2017

48 minutes ago, MeanGreen_MBA said:

my expectations if for fans to come to the game regardless of who we are playing....support the team...

The fans do come. The sad fact is there very few of us, not enough to come close to selling out Apogee.

If you want more people to come, people who might become fans, then you better win consistently for years or bring someone in that they want to see.

UNTLifer · May 18, 2017

I guess it all depends on how you would like to see the program grow. Do you want to take the Boise State/Kansas State model and load your OOC up with winnable games so that you have the enter conference on a "streak," your team has learned "how to win," and you have started to change the expectations and the culture of the program? Or, do you schedule the best teams available to "fill your stands" but also run the risk of getting beat pretty handily at home, thus driving the customers away?

I would prefer option one with an eye on moving to option two once we have created a winning program, thus reducing the chance of getting beat pretty handily at home.

Edited May 19, 2017 by UNTLifer

TreeFiddy · May 18, 2017

TTech is another that historically has scheduled weakly in order to attempt to be bowl eligible. As a P5 team, they have historically filled their OOC with 1 FCS, 1 G5, and another G5 or an occasional middling P5. No question that their approach for years has been to be undefeated in OOC play and has only recently ticked up a notch by consistently playing 1 P5 in OOC.

The difference with them is that they are in a conference that guarantees them a handful of games against teams their fans care about. Our conference slate does not quite deliver the same punch, although the conference slate is arguably better now than almost any point in our history.

Ben Gooding · May 18, 2017

35 minutes ago, UNTLifer said:

I guess it all depends on how you would like to see the program grow. Do you want to take the Boise State/Kansas State model and load your OOC up with winnable games so that you have the enter conference on a "streak," your team has learned "how to win," and you have started to change the expectations and the culture of the program? Or, do you schedule the best teams available to "fill your stands" but also run the risk of getting beat pretty handily at home, thus driving the customers away?

I would prefer option one with an eye on moving to option two.

I agree. It's better to win than to lose 7 days of the week 365 days of the year.

BeatNavy · May 18, 2017

On 5/16/2017 at 11:35 PM, UNTLifer said:

Just poking the bear

I actually am a Navy fan when they're not playing Army. My parents met in the Navy. My father served 27 years in the Navy and proudly wore his West Point cap & shirt to the Chiefs Club after I decided to attend West Point and for many years afterwards.

As for cut blocking, every team does it. Yes, triple option teams do it more often -- and do it better, but every team does it. The "causes more injuries" thing is crap.

and on the topic of Liberty, it looks like we replaced you with them for 2018

we visit them (and still apparently visit you) in 2021

we then host them in 2025 and visit them in 2026

Edited May 18, 2017 by BeatNavy

UNTLifer · May 18, 2017

9 minutes ago, BeatNavy said:

I actually am a Navy fan when they're not playing Army. My parents met in the Navy. My father served 27 years in the Navy and proudly wore his West Point cap & shirt to the Chiefs Club after I decided to attend West Point and for many years afterwards.

As for cut blocking, every team does it. Yes, triple option teams do it more often -- and do it better, but every team does it. The "causes more injuries" thing is crap.

and on the topic of Liberty, it looks like we replaced you with them for 2018

we visit them (and still apparently visit you) in 2021

we then host them in 2025 and visit them in 2026

Thank you to your family for the years of service to our country. "The causes more injuries" is just from what I have read.

BeatNavy · May 18, 2017

On 5/15/2017 at 4:40 PM, greenminer said:

Couldn't find it looking back to 2008. If it happened, before then or because I overlooked it, I'm assuming this played out because of a bowl matchup.

I think it was supposed to happen, but then NMSU and Idaho became Sun Belt Conference members and their scheduling issues were (temporarily) resolved.

ghost of smith hall · May 19, 2017

I just wanted to weigh in on the upcoming series with Liberty University. It seems there is a ton of hate for LU on the board and that's fine, I just want to share my personal experience. My wife is earning her Masters online from Liberty, and when I say earning it, I mean it. The classes are tough, demanding, and real, they don't just let you swear on a stack of Bibles and hand you a diploma.

Because of her degree program, we have had to travel to Lynchburg three times in the past three years. Each time we have been there the campus has improved and looks better and better. They're football stadium might not be quite as nice as Apogee, but it is close. they have a brand new, multi-million dollar indoor practice facility going in right next door. All of their athletic facilities are actually pretty top notch. There is a real commitment to athletics that you can see (right or wrong).

The town of Lynchburg is small, but beautiful. Lots of cool things to do in the area, I have taken my kids to Appomattox, Thomas Jefferson's Poplar Forest, and the National D-Day Memorial among other things. The town itself is not opposed to partying, lots of places to eat, drink and be merry.

Not everyone that attends Liberty is a right-wing extremist, fundamentalist, conservative white Christian, With the exception of her Christianity, my wife is none of those things. We certainly do not share many of the views credited to the University but so what? I don't think I would agree with everything BYU stands for, or even Notre Dame, but it's about football, isn't it?

Look, you could hate everything about Liberty and I would not blame you, but don't judge every student, or student athlete for that matter, based on the philosophy of the school. Those young men absolutely do NOT deserve to be booed or protested when they come to Denton and I would be ashamed of anyone that did that. Also, if you go to the game in Lynchburg, I think you will have a great time and get treated with great respect. That is all.

GTWT · May 19, 2017

You needn't worry about me booing the Liberty fans. I won't be there.

Aldo · May 19, 2017

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LongJim · May 19, 2017

1 hour ago, ghost of smith hall said:

I just wanted to weigh in on the upcoming series with Liberty University. It seems there is a ton of hate for LU on the board and that's fine, I just want to share my personal experience...

Why don't you go back to haunting the old hallways and quit coming on here and spouting your damnable reason?

Edited May 19, 2017 by LongJim

UNTLifer · May 19, 2017

1 hour ago, GTWT said:

You needn't worry about me booing the Liberty fans. I won't be there.

That's too bad.

Green Mean · May 19, 2017

Don't care for the Liberty and most certainly against the dropping of the series against Army but then again being a fan of UNT sports it just comes with the territory of you just never know what's going to happen and what decisions are going to be made. Only thing we have to do regardless of opponent is win, win and win some more. That will change perception regardless who we play. Beating FCS/SBC schools by 50 far outweighs losing by just 10 or 15 points against a major P5 IMO.

Ben Gooding · May 19, 2017

3 hours ago, ghost of smith hall said:

I just wanted to weigh in on the upcoming series with Liberty University. It seems there is a ton of hate for LU on the board and that's fine, I just want to share my personal experience. My wife is earning her Masters online from Liberty, and when I say earning it, I mean it. The classes are tough, demanding, and real, they don't just let you swear on a stack of Bibles and hand you a diploma.

Because of her degree program, we have had to travel to Lynchburg three times in the past three years. Each time we have been there the campus has improved and looks better and better. They're football stadium might not be quite as nice as Apogee, but it is close. they have a brand new, multi-million dollar indoor practice facility going in right next door. All of their athletic facilities are actually pretty top notch. There is a real commitment to athletics that you can see (right or wrong).

The town of Lynchburg is small, but beautiful. Lots of cool things to do in the area, I have taken my kids to Appomattox, Thomas Jefferson's Poplar Forest, and the National D-Day Memorial among other things. The town itself is not opposed to partying, lots of places to eat, drink and be merry.

Not everyone that attends Liberty is a right-wing extremist, fundamentalist, conservative white Christian, With the exception of her Christianity, my wife is none of those things. We certainly do not share many of the views credited to the University but so what? I don't think I would agree with everything BYU stands for, or even Notre Dame, but it's about football, isn't it?

Look, you could hate everything about Liberty and I would not blame you, but don't judge every student, or student athlete for that matter, based on the philosophy of the school. Those young men absolutely do NOT deserve to be booed or protested when they come to Denton and I would be ashamed of anyone that did that. Also, if you go to the game in Lynchburg, I think you will have a great time and get treated with great respect. That is all.

It's not their point of views I care about. I care about not scheduling home and home series with a current FCS program. Our perception is already substandard. This series doesn't help with that. A home and home series with either BYU or Notre Dame would make the LU series a blip on the radar. The embarrassment of this series announcement would be well worth it. I highly doubt either one of them will be coming to Apogee any time soon, if ever. I'm afraid we will be getting a Tulsa-like program to fill that 2019 void. And it will knowingly be announced in celebratory fashion as if it is some kind of accomplishment.

BeatNavy · May 19, 2017

45 minutes ago, Ben Gooding said:

A home and home series with either BYU or Notre Dame would make the LU series a blip on the radar. The embarrassment of this series announcement would be well worth it. I highly doubt either one of them will be coming to Apogee any time soon, if ever....

Well, given that ND doesn't visit the home stadiums of either Army (38K capacity) or Navy (34K), I think it's safe to say that they aren't coming to Apogee. If you guys were to host them, it would have to be AT&T Stadium. Obviously that short "re-location" would be worth it for the publicity.

Ben Gooding · May 19, 2017

37 minutes ago, BeatNavy said:

Well, given that ND doesn't visit the home stadiums of either Army (38K capacity) or Navy (34K), I think it's safe to say that they aren't coming to Apogee. If you guys were to host them, it would have to be AT&T Stadium. Obviously that short "re-location" would be worth it for the publicity.

Just to be clear, Apogee is 31K.

untjim1995 · May 19, 2017

1 hour ago, Ben Gooding said:

It's not their point of views I care about. I care about not scheduling home and home series with a current FCS program. Our perception is already substandard. This series doesn't help with that. A home and home series with either BYU or Notre Dame would make the LU series a blip on the radar. The embarrassment of this series announcement would be well worth it. I highly doubt either one of them will be coming to Apogee any time soon, if ever. I'm afraid we will be getting a Tulsa-like program to fill that 2019 void. And it will knowingly be announced in celebratory fashion as if it is some kind of accomplishment.

I totally expect this to be the scenario we see.

Again, if we are replacing Army at Apogee with a P5 from the Big XII or SEC team that will bring people here (i.e., not Iowa State, WVU, or Vandy), as well as a team such as UH, then this was a good deal for us. If its Texas State, its a push, just because of attendance and state wide media coverage. If its anyone else, there is no way we get more people at Apogee than we would with Army.